30 réponses à ce sujet

[JobacNoor]

Let me preface: I don't have anything against Cullen, I'm decidedly neutral when it comes to him. 

Most, if not all characters that find even some degree of popularity I can usually understand on some level, but Cullen?

He's not a party member or a major character, at least in terms of screen time. His character model is rather unremarkable and doesn't really seem unique or something that I'd see making the ladies/gents swoon. There's nothing wrong with his voice or the acting, but in terms of the content of what he says and the personality conveyed all I'm getting is run-of-the-mill Templar. Maybe slightly less of a dick than most. All in all just...average.

Is it the mage origin in DA:O that's at the root of all this? Even then I can't really wrap my head around it. You don't see dozens of threads dedicated to hopes/demands/ideas on bringing someone like Tamlen or Fergus back for DA3 as party members with the option of getting in their pants.

[Sylvanpyxie]

Firstly, I love your signature.
Secondly, I really love your signature.

Thirdly: It isn't the character itself that a lot of people like, so much as the potential that the character has. I can agree with you - I'm not particularly fond of Cullen, but I like the fact that he has built up through-out two games and his character has actually developed in that time period, yet stil has the potential to develop further.

A lot of people don't like who he is, so much as what he can become. He has a lot of potential to develop into a good character. (Just like Sebastian Vael... No, i'm still not going to stop doing that)

Modifié par Sylvanpyxie, 21 septembre 2012 - 10:27 .

[LolaLei]

Your best bet is to visit the Cullen thread and see for yourself.

[Minttymint]

Let me put it this way...
Cassandra's popularity, please explain? Why are fans so set on her being a companion despite seeing little of her... Maybe its because she has lots of story potential, is interesting and... Kinda hot.

[Danny Boy 7]

I'd say Cullen is a rather special case because of what we all assume the plot of DAIII: I. Cullen as a Templar has seen the issues with both extremes and has proven to be the one of the few if only source of reason within the templar order. He's been tortured by mages and seen the corruption in the templars and yet follows his conscious as best he can rather than always doing what he's told.

In that respect Cullen opens up the opportunity for a multitude of potential growth he could be a raging witch hunter, a Knight-Commander who rules with an iron fist or even a moderator who tries to display what the templar order should have always been; protectors, strict but compassionate.

As for his appearance/voice that's really subjective. I find his voice rather thoughtful but a bit introverted as if he tends to think out loud. I don't tend to get to excited about appearance but I'd say Cullen is one of the few chars from Origins that transferred to 2 and actually got a better deal.

[berelinde]

BioWare could limit themselves to bringing back former companions again and again and again, but eventually, we'd run out of former companions, and besides, we already know their stories. That leaves trying something new, but the thing is, it's always nice to see a familiar face.

We know a little about Cullen. We know that he has led an interesting life. He has been present peripherally at the events that have shaped an age. Each of our protagonists has interacted with him in some way, so good or bad, he is at least familiar. But what do we really know about him? Practically nothing. He is intriguing.

Politically, he is probably a moderate, as far as templars go. He has seen that it isn't magic or the absence of it that corrupts, it's power. This pragmatism will enable him to work with a diverse range of protagonists. Extremists on one end or the other might make him uneasy, but for the most part, he seems willing to overlook a few things if it means order is restored to Thedas.

[R2s Muse]

I think everyone here has already covered it. Only thing I'll add is that he's a character that has seen both extremes of what the Circle system can be. When he was in Ferelden he used to think that they were too easy on the mages. Then he came to Kirkwall and got to see a Circle that was the opposite. He brings a unique perspective to the mage-templar issue, besides having had to face his own personal demons with it which in some ways have broken him. Having him as a companion will be a unique window on the mage-templar war, plus an opportunity to potentially help "fix" him in some ways.

edit: I just have to add, tho, that I personally do think his character model is extraordinary, but I guess that's just me. And, for some folks, I think it is the star crossed lover thing from DA:O, for others, like me, it's the character evolution he shows in the DA2 from PTSD recoverer to saving your butt by standing up to his superior.

Modifié par R2s Muse, 21 septembre 2012 - 11:43 .

[Wulfram]

I think it started with this

[JobacNoor]

I suppose the part about a lot of the appeal stemming from the potential of what he could become makes sense.

I'll also admit that my personal indifference is probably partially because of the comparatively small sample size. I'd want to compare him to someone like Sebastian, who I do like even if I tend to favor the other rogues you get as party members. I don't know if you'd agree but I see them as very similar characters, and one of the reasons I can come up with why I like Sebastian but Cullen doesn't light my world on fire is that you get much more to work with in Sebastian's case. Whereas Cullen for me personally feels like a bit of a blank slate. Like... I'm not getting enough out of what is presented to really be interested? 

This was never intended to offend anyone who is a big fan of Cullen, btw. Not just really seeing what truly differentiates him from a lot of NPC's of comparable importance and screentime that makes him so popular.

[LolaLei]

I'd also like to add that I find his character model incredibly attractive and was probably one of the only reoccuring characters to actually improve physically between DA:O and DA2. I mean, come on, look at this face:







But anyway, the interesting thing about Cullen, is that he's had a lot of character growth and development over the course of two games, which we've actually witnessed with our own eyes rather than just being told about it. In DA:O in the mage origin (particularly if you play as a female) he is incredibly naive, innocent and a mage sympathiser, but after his torture later in the game he becomes a very scared, bitter and tormented young man.

By DA2 he's leveled out a bit, but when we first meet him again he's still suffering from PTSD and has become a bit of a zealot due to circumstance. However, over the course of 10 years in Kirkwall you'll notice that he begins to realise that his outlook is wrong and extreme, to the extent where he even begins to question Meredith. Finally, at the end of Act 3 he directly ignores orders from his superior to protect Hawke (and protect a group of mages to, if you run a pro-Templar play through) and aids him/her in killing the Knight-Commander.

From a personality stand point, we know little about him, but that's what makes him so intriguing because his personality is a blank enough slate to go in any direction, yet interesting enough to have captured fans attention. Hell, the poor boy has gone from one bad experience after another, got promoted through the ranks of the Kirkwall Templar Order too fast, to the extent that he had to take on ridiculous amounts of responsibility that he was unfamiliar with - not to mention he's Ferelden, so likely got a lot of flack from the native Templars of Kirkwall who weren't keen on taking orders from a dog lord.

Finally, there's the small matter of his PTSD that has likely increased since the events of DA2. Adding to his head mess is the whole Mage/Templar war, with the bulk of the Templars rebelling from the Chantry. Does he stay loyal to the Divine? Or join the rebels in Mage hunting?

Basically, he's a very interesting character.

Modifié par LolaLei, 22 septembre 2012 - 12:43 .

[Sylvanpyxie]

I don't know if you'd agree but I see them as very similar characters

Similar in terms of potential, certainly. (Though I could argue on personality until the cows come home)

Sebastian was actually planned for future content, he was developed specifically so that his story could continue into an expansion pack that never happened, so it's a lot easier to see his potential than it is to see Cullen's.

Cullen has just as much build up as Sebastian. Though it's relatively small in the grander scheme of things - Sebastian is a major political player and Cullen is just a very experienced Templar.

The real difference is that Sebastian was a companion character and we got to learn a lot about him, despite the fact he probably had half the verbal content of all the other companions. We learnt not only about his recent history, but about his childhood, his relationship with his family and his relationship with the Chantry.(All of which was still quite vague -.- Damn you Sebastian.)

Cullen didn't have the luxury of being a companion in Dragon Age 2, so his opportunity to share personal tales of "grandfather's favourite bow" are obviously limited as a result. Not having the ability to learn more about his character is obviously going to be a hindrance to your ability to connect with him.

Regardless of how little he may tug the heart strings though, his recent history and personal development is there. There's just enough information to get people interested, but not so much that there's no potential for growth or development in future games - His potential to develop is undeniably interesting.

Modifié par Sylvanpyxie, 22 septembre 2012 - 12:24 .

[vieralynn]

JobacNoor wrote...

I suppose the part about a lot of the appeal stemming from the potential of what he could become makes sense.

I'll also admit that my personal indifference is probably partially because of the comparatively small sample size. I'd want to compare him to someone like Sebastian, who I do like even if I tend to favor the other rogues you get as party members. I don't know if you'd agree but I see them as very similar characters, and one of the reasons I can come up with why I like Sebastian but Cullen doesn't light my world on fire is that you get much more to work with in Sebastian's case. Whereas Cullen for me personally feels like a bit of a blank slate. Like... I'm not getting enough out of what is presented to really be interested? 

This was never intended to offend anyone who is a big fan of Cullen, btw. Not just really seeing what truly differentiates him from a lot of NPC's of comparable importance and screentime that makes him so popular.

I'd say Cullen is further along that a pure blank slate but much of what defines his personality and his character growth during DA:O and DA2 is very easily missable. As an NPC, Cullen has a lot to say throughout DA2 but you need to make a point of clicking on him whenever you're at the Gallows.

There are two things I find interesting about Cullen. The first is that he is trying to think for himself while he's part of a strict military hierarchy that requires him to follow orders without any questions. He's expected to be an obedient templar who always does what needs to be done, but everything that makes him human keeps getting in the way. This humanness is shown by how he tends to think out loud, blurting out whatever is running through his mind rather than keeping his thoughts entirely to himself. He repeatedly raises questions about what he is expected to do or acts in manners that contradict what he says.  

The second thing is that he goes through an interesting character development arc of his own from the mage origin in DA:O to the end of DA2, especially if Hawke decides to side with the templars in the final battle *not* as a means to support Meredith but as a method for getting matters under control. Pretty early in the side-with-templar ending, a group of mages surrender and Cullen attempts to do something about them (help them) but Meredith shuts him down because she wants everyone killed, and because she believes any mage could be a blood mage and there is know way of knowing. When Hawke gets the chance to speak, Hawke can ask Cullen what he thinks should be done and he decides that he knows what "being a templar is all about" at which point he bluntly defies Meredith, his commanding officer, by saving the surrendering mages and leading all of her squadron of templars *away* from Meredith, which probably cripples Meredith's attempts to continue her annulment. No matter what Hawke does (side with mages, side with templars, support/defy Meredith during the templar ending), once Meredith turns on Hawke at the very end, Cullen always steps in and helps Hawke end Meredith's command. To me, the headspace that Cullen is in during the end of DA2 is a very different place from someone who worries that abominations might be walking through the Ferelden Circle without anyone knowing (Cullen during the male mage origin) and someone who takes absolutely no pleasure in the thought of hunting or killing mages, or being at harrowings (Cullen during the female or male mage origin). He's also come a long way from someone who is painfully frightened of blood mages due to him being tortured by Uldred. 

[LolaLei]

JobacNoor wrote...

I don't know if you'd agree but I see them as very similar characters, and one of the reasons I can come up with why I like Sebastian but Cullen doesn't light my world on fire is that you get much more to work with in Sebastian's case. Whereas Cullen for me personally feels like a bit of a blank slate. Like... I'm not getting enough out of what is presented to really be interested?

Sebastian and Cullen certainly have their similarities, although the only reason we've had more to work with in terms of content with Seb, is simply because he was a companion and Cullen wasn't. If Cullen is a companion in DA3, I'll dare say that he'll probably have more content than Seb simply because DA3 is apparently going to be a bigger game, plus they've taken into account that the fans/players want more interaction with our companions this time round.

However, I'm not gonna deny, a large part of Cullen's appeal is the fact that his character model is very attractive. That being said, even if they hit him with the ugly stick in DA3 he'd still be my number 1 romance choice.

[Sylvanpyxie]

he'll probably have more content than Seb

Depends entirely on if my theory on Sebastian's involvement in Dragon Age is correct or not.

You can never take my faith! *Makes a dramatic escape*

[vieralynn]

I am probably the only hardcore Cullen fan who doesn't find him physically attractive at all.

His personality, character development arc, emotions, and voice (thanks to Greg Ellis) are what makes me interested in him.

(Edited: Which, in turn, makes him attractive, even at a physical level, if that makes any sense at all.)

Modifié par vieralynn, 22 septembre 2012 - 12:42 .

[LolaLei]

Sylvanpyxie wrote...

he'll probably have more content than Seb

Depends entirely on if my theory on Sebastian's involvement in Dragon Age is correct or not.

You can never take my faith! *Makes a dramatic escape*

I'd like Seb to have some extra content in DA3, just because he missed out when they cancelled the last DLC. I could see him playing a big part in a specific quest at some point.

[R2s Muse]

 It's interesting to compare Seb and Cullen, as I also have thought a lot about the similarities. I always imagine that they would be friends, actually, both being devoted to their duty and to the teachings of Andraste. I also have a similar interest in seeing them both in the future as I would love to learn more about each of them. In Seb's case, though, my curiosity is more satisfied. We really got to learn a lot about his past, his conflicts, his hopes. I am now intensely curious about his future and what he did regarding Starkhaven. And my supposed princesshood.. Ahem... With Cullen, we've barely scratched the surface, even for someone like me who, like Lola, took every opportunity to stop by the Gallows  and chat.  So I really want to know more.

Like, what was going on behind the scenes at the Gallows? How in the loop was he regarding Meredith's plans? Did he know about Ser Alrik's depravities? Sending for the Right of Annulment? At what point did he start to wonder if following Meredith and the Order were "no longer one and the same"? Why was he friends with a troublemaker like Hawke? Did he and Meredith discuss arresting the Champion?

Lots of fodder for discussion. He's flawed and yet noble. And of course smokin hot... 

Modifié par R2s Muse, 22 septembre 2012 - 01:17 .

[CuriousArtemis]

I just find him to be an adorable character. He really tugs at my heart strings, and my writerly senses tingle around him, too, because he's just such a great character. To me, Cullen is a guy who is confused about where his loyalties lie, or I should say, confused about whether to listen to his head or his heart. And so he clings to this ideal, The Templar Order. I have a feeling that ideal is going to be severely shaken in DA3.

[Renmiri1]

As an Anders mancer and 100% pro mage you would think I'd hate Cullen but I don't.

His character model is hot, his voice is Greg Ellis which voiced Anders on Awakenings. I prefer the DA2 VA for Anders but Greg Ellis was a reasonable Anders and brings a lot to DA2 Cullen.

But more than that, like everyone said, his character grows through the 2 games. At DAO start he is a wet behind the ears pup templar swooning about a mage girl. At the end of DAO he has been tortured and starved by blood mages and is now quite the zealot. Yet a year later in Kirkwall on DA2 he is still willing to show mercy to mages and does not denounce Hawke to Meredith and shows willingness to help the poor templar apprentice that was kidnapped by blood mages. At the end of DA2 he goes against Meredith and lets Hawke go.

As a character he is very interesting and far from one dimensional. Pretty much every time you talk to him he has changed a little. He overcomes PSTD and wants to be fair. I admire and respect that.

[JellyBean28]

LolaLei wrote...

I'd also like to add that I find his character model incredibly attractive and was probably one of the only reoccuring characters to actually improve physically between DA:O and DA2. I mean, come on, look at this face:







But anyway, the interesting thing about Cullen, is that he's had a lot of character growth and development over the course of two games, which we've actually witnessed with our own eyes rather than just being told about it. In DA:O in the mage origin (particularly if you play as a female) he is incredibly naive, innocent and a mage sympathiser, but after his torture later in the game he becomes a very scared, bitter and tormented young man.

By DA2 he's leveled out a bit, but when we first meet him again he's still suffering from PTSD and has become a bit of a zealot due to circumstance. However, over the course of 10 years in Kirkwall you'll notice that he begins to realise that his outlook is wrong and extreme, to the extent where he even begins to question Meredith. Finally, at the end of Act 3 he directly ignores orders from his superior to protect Hawke (and protect a group of mages to, if you run a pro-Templar play through) and aids him/her in killing the Knight-Commander.

From a personality stand point, we know little about him, but that's what makes him so intriguing because his personality is a blank enough slate to go in any direction, yet interesting enough to have captured fans attention. Hell, the poor boy has gone from one bad experience after another, got promoted through the ranks of the Kirkwall Templar Order too fast, to the extent that he had to take on ridiculous amounts of responsibility that he was unfamiliar with - not to mention he's Ferelden, so likely got a lot of flack from the native Templars of Kirkwall who weren't keen on taking orders from a dog lord.

Finally, there's the small matter of his PTSD that has likely increased since the events of DA2. Adding to his head mess is the whole Mage/Templar war, with the bulk of the Templars rebelling from the Chantry. Does he stay loyal to the Divine? Or join the rebels in Mage hunting?

Basically, he's a very interesting character.

This pretty much explains it all, and it's hard to add to.
However, I will say that although Cullen's model IS very good looking () that is just a cherry on top. His character alone is enough to give him fans (as seen in this thread and the Cullen Thread). I know many people, like myself, are excited to learn more about him and see the potential his character has to offer regardless if he looks great in DA3 or not.
It also helps that he has this "lost puppy" vibe to him, and you know how some ladies are with lost puppies.
I know some will agree with me when I say that if Cullen is an LI in DA3, you can consider that game already pre-ordered

[sylvanaerie]

Yea, same here. A lot of good points brought up in this thread. While I found him translated to DA2 well (unlike poor Alistair, Zevran and Teagan---omg whoever did that to them should be boiled in oil!), it's not his looks or even so much his 'puppy dog' cuteness. It's the fact that he's undergone already a huge amount of character development for such a minor figure in DA. And he has the potential for so much more, esp if the trend is the mage/templar/chantry conflict.

[jackofalltrades456]

Because girls ( and to a lesser extent) guys, believe that he transferred well with the art change in Dragon Age 2. That's really it as it would seem to me. I mean he is an interesting character and I would love to see him develop more in the third game, but he reminds me too much of Alistair..

Modifié par jackofalltrades456, 23 septembre 2012 - 06:43 .

[Dutchess]

Am I the only one who thinks that his "character development" seemed more like a giant retcon? I get that his reactions may be more extreme because had just ended in DAO, but I remember getting an epilogue slide in which Cullen takes over Greagoir's job when Greagoir has to step down due to old age. He rules with fear and is very mistrustful of the mages, as I recall. The wiki doesn't quote the slide but says this:

Cullen might go insane after Uldred's attempt to overthrow the circle, resulting in him slaying several mages before escaping the tower. He becomes a wandering madman, hunting mages wherever he can. He may alternatively replace Greagor as Knight-Commander, watching over the Circle using fear.

Apparently Cullen can also go completely insane. Anybody had that happen? I assume he is suddenly very sane again in DA2 when you import that.

[Battlebloodmage]

renjility wrote...

Am I the only one who thinks that his "character development" seemed more like a giant retcon? I get that his reactions may be more extreme because had just ended in DAO, but I remember getting an epilogue slide in which Cullen takes over Greagoir's job when Greagoir has to step down due to old age. He rules with fear and is very mistrustful of the mages, as I recall. The wiki doesn't quote the slide but says this:

Cullen might go insane after Uldred's attempt to overthrow the circle, resulting in him slaying several mages before escaping the tower. He becomes a wandering madman, hunting mages wherever he can. He may alternatively replace Greagor as Knight-Commander, watching over the Circle using fear.

Apparently Cullen can also go completely insane. Anybody had that happen? I assume he is suddenly very sane again in DA2 when you import that.

Leliana's head was cut off in my game, but she got better.

Since the epilogues in DAO have been revealed as mostly rumors there is a chance that people are exaggerating the truth about him.

[Sylvanpyxie]

Apparently Cullen can also go completely insane. Anybody had that happen?

I get that epilogue a lot, it gets completely ignored, as does Cullen's "Knight-Commander" epilogue.

I'm assuming that neither happened.