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[Jaldaen]

Hello All,

I'm going to be starting work on a Human Commoner Origin Mod next year and I wanted to get an idea of what players might be looking for in this type of origin in terms of starting location and character assumptions.

Right now I'm considering the following starting locations/assumptions

1) Denerim (city guard; you can play a good/corrupt guard dealing with local criminals and stumble upon something that gets you in over your head and leads to your recruitment by Duncan)

2) Lothering (merchant or caravan guard; caravan attacked between Lothering and destination [Redcliff/Denerim]; deliver the goods to a villain of some sort [perhaps helping set up some other terrible event later in the game]; you are a loose end that needs tying up; you're attacked and become a marked man; this leads into your recruitment by Duncan)

3) Lothering (town guard; get over your head with local thugs; track them down and dispatch them; end up accused of a capital offense by a Lothering Noble [who hired the thugs to begin with]; Duncan conscripts you to save you from death)

4) Lothering (married farmer or other commoner profession; your child is found to be a mage [perhaps your spouse is apostate?] and the Templars come for him/her while you are away; when it turns out your family was killed by the Templars, you hunt them down and get in trouble with the Templars/Chantry; Duncan steps in and conscripts you)

5) Gwaren (sheriff, reeve, or other occupation in charge of keeping the peace; Darkspawn attack on outlying farms; you beat back the incursion, but are given a good reason to join the Grey Wardens [probably someone important to you dying in the attack])

6) Highever (guardsman; friends with Ser Gilmore; perhaps the lover of the son/daughter of Cousland; fight your way to the family during the attack on Highever; all are dead except for the wife of Cousland who leads you to the secret passage where you are recruited by Duncan

7) Highever (guardsman; friends with Ser Gilmore; perhaps the lover of the son/daughter of Cousland; the story could happen at the end of the attack with your character escaping Highever with something entrusted to you by Cousland for his son who marched off to war; you track down the son [dead or alive] and face a whole bunch of Darkspawn along the way; you might become infected with the taint and Duncan offers to bring you into the wardens)

8) Lothering (militia man; recruited into the army [along with your brother] to march on Ostagar; combat training followed by meeting Ducan [who is impressed by your abilities, perhaps mentioning that your father/mother/grandparent was once a warden]; ambushed by darkspawn on your way to Ostagar, your brother dies; after surviving the attack you are recruited by Duncan) [Thanks to Maximus741000 for the idea]

9) Lothering (refugee; makes your way toward Lothering; your caravan comes under attack by darkspawns [family is killed]. After beating back the attack, you arrive at Lothering, join up with Cailin's army marching toward Ostagar, your company is attacked by darkspawns (or mercanaries weilding darkspawn weapons), after beating them off and capturing one of the attackers, you discover someone was trying to kill your commander and make it look like a darkspawn attack, Duncan is impressed with your prowess, and recruits you into the Wardens.)

These are just initial ideas. I am more than willing to go in different, more interesting directions if they come up in the following discussion. I could also see mixing and matching some of the locations and assumptions (caravan guard leaving Denerim for Lothering, or city guard in Lothering)

I decided against setting the origin in Redcliff as a starting location since Alistair has a big role to play there. However, Denerim is big enough for two origins (just like Orzammar), Lothering offers a lot of interesting possibilities, and Gwaren (a remote town in Ferelden and seat of Loghain's power, described as being a "rough town full of loggers and fishermen" and connected to the Deep Roads) is a blank slate to work with (but also would require a lot more work/development time). In addition, I decided against the rogue/assassin assumption because I think the Dwarven Commoner origin covers that trope and against the farm-boy turned hero archtype because it didn't feel right for Dragon Age's dark fantasy theme.

So please let me know which of these origins appeals the most to you (or rank them) and/or give suggestions about what you'd like to see included in the Human Commoner origin.

Thanks,
Joseph

PS: If you are interested in this project, you can find the project page here:
http://social.biowar...m/project/1485/

PPS: If you are interested in helping out with this project, you can find the group page here:
http://social.bioware.com/group/941/

Modifié par Jaldaen, 03 janvier 2010 - 05:43 .

[Dahelia]

That be cool I heard there was suppose to be a Human Commoner origin which was a farmer...

[Jaldaen]

There was a Human Commoner origin, but really only in the planning stages (with a little bit of dialogue in Ostagar), but Bioware wasn't satisfied with it's farmer-to-hero storyline and cut it.

Modifié par Jaldaen, 29 décembre 2009 - 03:20 .

[What a Twist]

#1 sounds like a fairly solid idea. Since denerim is already there its less work for you. Perhaps it could have something to do with the alienage slaves, im not sure how you could work that in with the time line though.



I'm not sure what kind of resources you have available, but if you could make something thats near the level of bioware's content i'd even be willing to pay for it.

[fantasypisces]

Jaldaen wrote...

There was a Human Commoner origin, but really only in the planning stages (with a little bit of dialogue in Ostagar), but Bioware wasn't satisfied with it's farmer-to-hero storyline and cut it. I think they were right to do so... that type of story just doesn't sound right for Dragon Age's dark fantasy theme.

Which makes no sense seeing as you can start as a casteless dwarf.
Oh but wait, your casteless dwarf is a crook, that makes all the difference in the world.... <_<

Rather easy, you are a human commoner, some knights come along and try to steal food, whatever, on their march to Ostagar. Could be they rape your family, but that is too similar to city elf.
You get pissed and kill them all, Duncan arrives with the commander to find out what happened and conscripts you so you don't get your head chopped off.

Or, your farm gets overrun by Darkspawn, family is killed. You beat them all back. Duncan was tracking them and finds you.

There are many ways you can do it keeping in line with conscription.

[Jaldaen]

What a Twist,



Thanks for your vote... as for resources... I'm just a writer so I'll probably need a great deal of help from modders... my hope is that if I write a good storyline/solid dialogue option, then there will be enough help from others on this site to get the project put together. So my plan is to storyboard, write out the action/dialogue, and then seek out modders who can bring the story to life. Worse comes to worse, I'll just use the dialogue I come up with as a writing sample for future gaming jobs.

[Jaldaen]

Fantasypisces,

When you put it that way you almost make me want to write up a farmer-to-hero origin... I suppose in a way the Gwaren option is the closest one to that concept.

Another idea I had was to have the Main Character (MC) be a husband/wife and have templars come to take away their child while they are gone... the Templars would end up killing the family and the MC would hunt them down and end up in serious trouble with the Chantry. This would then led into Duncan conscripting the MC to keep them alive... it would certainly offer a lot of tension between Alistair and the MC and make some of the other scenes in the story play out with a different perspective. In fact, I should add that as an option in the first post.

Modifié par Jaldaen, 28 décembre 2009 - 01:03 .

[Killian Kalthorne]

I like No. 4.

[Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien]

Farmer to hero Origin? In that you are forced to leave your life after an attack on your village by the evil Bann Ceorlic and Duncan takes you away to become the new Warden Commander of his Warden group. Yay I like that story idea.

Shame it kinda has been done already, I think part of the reason for the Human Commoner Origin possibly be too much like Loghain's in "The Stolen Throne"

Modifié par Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien, 28 décembre 2009 - 01:29 .

[Jaldaen]

Sir Ulrich,

I hadn't thought of the Stolen Thone connection, but you're right about that possibily being another reason why the strictly farmer-to-hero scenario wasn't working for Bioware. That's why I'm trying to avoid a run-of-the-mill commoner story with a guardsman or other angle that doesn't tread in this area or areas already dealt with in other origins. I want the story to be dark and have interesting implications throughout the game with your companions and your future game choices.

Modifié par Jaldaen, 28 décembre 2009 - 02:18 .

[Inarai]

You'll need:



- Voice actors(Including an close match to Duncan and anyone else from the actual game you plan to include)

- Mapmakers. New textures.

[potemkis]

It wouldn't even have to be a farmer, the Human Commoner could be a shop owner, soldier, town guard, or something. You gotta have more than just one or two origins. It would keep playing as a Human interesting.



I would like to see an expansion of some sort with new Origins for the existing races and maybe even a new race- Halflings! (Kidding). Or maybe even expand on the Elves some (there's some Elves living on an island or in the mountains who were never enslaved and therefore still adhere strictly to the old ways). The player finds that were never enslaved actually split into two factions- one wanted war with humans and the other didn't. These two factions would have distinct origins from each other.



Just a few ideas...

[What a Twist]

Really there are a good 4-5 origin stories that would be very interesting, and some of them may be created for future DLC's from bioware. However even with the toolset players are limited by one simple thing; voice actors. Voice acting is, and always has been, the ultimate brick wall for user made centent. This mainly effects machinima, however as you can see video games are bringing in voice acing full force.



If you can pull off the voice acting, the content itself wouldn't be amazingly hard, since being a human commoner isn't surprising to anyone in the story, except loghane if he were somehow involved with your origin.

[Jaldaen]

Inarai and What a Twist,

Voice acting is one thing I'll definitely need help with. I'm going to need to find out what is kosher and what isn't when creating mods for DA:O. For example, is it okay to take voice files from DA:O, make a "library" of words based off those actually used in the game, and then rearrange/splice them together to create new sentences. I have no idea if that would break copyright or fall under fair use (since this would be a free mod and not tied to anything commercial). If this was okay to do, then it might be a lot easier to make the mod "sound" consistent with the game (at least for those characters with lots of dialogue), but I'm just a writer and don't know much about all the technical and legal aspects of doing a user-content mod.

Best Wishes,
Joseph

PS: Of course before I created such a library, I would seek out Bioware's permission and make sure it was kosher with them to use their voice files in such a manner.

Modifié par Jaldaen, 28 décembre 2009 - 04:51 .

[Jaldaen]

potemkis,

Thanks for your ideas... I definately think that farmer isn't the only option for a commoner origin that's why I'm exploring these alternatives. Also, thanks for your list! I hadn't even thought of the soldier or shopkeeper options... hmmm. I'll ponder them tonight and see what I could come up with for them.

Modifié par Jaldaen, 28 décembre 2009 - 04:45 .

[Jaldaen]

PS: Don't forget to vote for or rank the options mentioned above. It'll help me make a final decision about which one has the most interest. Thanks and good night.

[JKhristian]

I really like No. 5. Gwaren sounds like it could be really cool. I like the idea of your character being a logger or fisherman. Essentially a nobody. Maybe your wife or child dies in an attack. You have few prospects and the only thing you lived for is gone so the Warden's seems like a good option.

[Asante81]

I would rather have something like starting out as an "employee" of the Pearl than being a random guard of a random something or a farmer... That sounds so generic.

There are so many exciting lore-related things you could do as an alternate start for humans. Why not Chasind or Avvar? Or Ash Warrior?

And if you read the "what's your favourite origin threads" you'll see, that origins like the dwarven ones and city elf are favoured by a lot of people. A great part of their appeal is the fact that they pull you right into the lore of Ferelden. They don't feel like a random fantasy novel.

Apart from the farmer part, the templar idea is the only one I would feel like wanting to play to be honest.

[kormesios]

This sounds good. The only one I think wouldn't work is farmer, simply by overdone.



I would lean towards Denerim or Gwaren, as I think Lothering would lead to plot issues when you revisit that would feel unsatisfying without major rework (and loss of existing voice-overs).



I'd also consider a Highever retainer. The place is sealed afterwards, avoiding plot inconsistencies. If you could pull a ground's eye view of the day after Howe's treachery over it could be interesting.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Inarai wrote...

You'll need:

- Voice actors(Including an close match to Duncan and anyone else from the actual game you plan to include)
- Mapmakers. New textures.

What you'll need is a a good audio editing tool, so you can experiment with audio lines from the game. Cut and paste, mix and match.

With some creative writing, you can do amazing stuff.

If all else fails, you can allways write party talk in a rather vauge or confirmatory matter (meaning the player does most of the talking, the party ememebrs mostly agree or disagree or have short comments).

Also, any origin that doesn't have a good explanation as to why the PC is skilled  with weapons is a bad origin.
That's why farmer-turned-hero rarely works. From someone who only held a rake to a master swordsman or archamge in a year?

Modifié par Lotion Soronnar, 28 décembre 2009 - 08:52 .

[wwwwowwww]

i'd like to see a Noble, Merchant and Commoner type starting origin for all the races to tell you the truth.

[Jaldaen]

Asante81,



Thanks for your comments. I love the dwarven noble and city elf (female) origins and I think you're right that part of their appeal is that they draw you into the world of DA:O. I think the other reasons they work so well are because they have compelling storylines (royal intrigue and oppression/revenge), engaging characters (Gorim & Bhelen), and give your character a very good reason to join the Wardens. Whatever approach I decide to take... I'll be trying to include all of these elements. Right now some of the origins mentioned above aren't very spicy because I only just started and need to do a lot of homework on how I might make each of them stand out. However, I much admit that I like #1, 4, and 5 the most because they do have interesting possibilities with introducing lore.

[Jaldaen]

kormesios,



Thanks for your suggestions... I hadn't thought of a commoner's perspective of the Highever attack and/or its aftermath. I'll add that to the list.

[Jaldaen]

Lotion Soronnar,



Thanks for the ideas... I also agree that the main character should have some reason for being trained with weapons. Of course it helps that Ferelden is coming off of a war with Orlais... so there are probably a few farmer's who fought in the war and might still have weapons from their militia days. Some might even train their children with them (ala the City Elf origin). However, I prefer an even stronger background in weapons with the MC been a guard, sheriff, hunter, etc.

[highcastle]

I think a Denerim origin for human commoners would be fairly cool. You have a few options, too. Number one, you could go the city guard route (I liked Sergeant Kylon in Denerim, so it'd be neat to have him as a commanding officer, but then you'd have to take that into account when you meet him again later in the game). What Kylon said about having a "legion of bastards" at his disposal was pretty interesting to me. Perhaps the PC, like Alistair, is a bastard (just, minus the royal part), and joined the guards to prove him/herself. It could be a fascinating concept.



Or, you could also bring Daveth into the mix. He was a cutpurse in Denerim. Perhaps he and the PC ran in a local gang together. It would again require some editing to the Ostargar portion of the game, but it might be cool to go into Wardens with a friend, then promptly lose him to the Joining.