10 réponses à ce sujet

[chrcol]

I had played a previous game with dual swords which I found got very powerful.

This time I am trying dual dagger and it seems incredibly weak.

each str or dex only giving 0.3 damage instead of 0.5, and when I was fighting the revenant in the mage tower it took 30 minutes to kill him as each hit was only 3-5 damage (me and lelliana dual dagger, 2 mages were doing no damage as was immune to magic).

what am I missing as others seem to like dual dagger a lot.  Bear in mind this is not a developed character end game, I have just finished the first major quest on this game.

[Blazomancer]

If you are warrior using lot of activated talents, daggers may seem weak at first, but it's not so. Every weapon class in the game is very much balanced. Each has it's pros and cons.

Daggers offer more crit chance, more AP and often have high critical range bonuses, eg. the rose's thorn. When you increase your crit chance using other factors, and increase your critical range with gears like Red Jenny Seekers/Cailan's Gauntlets, it all turns out to be the same.

So, I'd say develop your character and see for yourself.

Regarding the revenant in the circle tower, it has high armor, it's immune to backstabs, immune to cold elemental attacks. So unless you are damaging it's armor, or probably have telekinetic weapons sustained, or attacking with a rogue who have a high critical chance (which is unlikely early on), or using a staff that doesn't deal cold damage, it's going to take long, no doubt about that.

So, to answer your main question, the things that are going in favour of daggers are that they have a high attack speed, higher base AP and crit chance, and they offer a larger crit range. For example, the crow daggers give a +15% crit range, and the legendary Roses's thorn gives +30%. The most powerful waraxe 'Veshialle' gives +10%, IIRC. So you see the picture, everything is balanced. Full sized weapons have their own benefits which I assume you already know.

[chrcol]

yes, but in all my other playthrus I had longsword warraiors dealing 30-50 dmg per hit vs the 3-5 per hit of the daggers. Thats over 10x the damage an insane difference.

I ended up equipping a non elemental staff to morrigan to get through the fight (forgot to mention thar, shame the best staff's are elemental), normal staff attacks had much higher DPS than the daggers.

Normally I have a tank in my party usually alistiar, so this is the first time I have done this fight without a sword, usually its over fairly quick.
So it would seem dual dagger maybe viable at end of game but poor at start?

[Blazomancer]

I can't imagine how that is possible; I've never come across so much of a difference.

Edit: How are you doing the comparisions of the both warrior? Are they of the same level and have same attributes and gear? Did you use any debuffs on the revenant before?

Modifié par Blazomancer, 25 septembre 2012 - 12:45 .

[cJohnOne]

I thought Knives were .5 per point. I guess you want to pump dexterity for the defense. You shouldn't be able to wield two swords at the beginning of the game anyway. It's sword and dagger. Which uses more Strength to Dex. ratio.

You should have light armor and use a tank with dual daggers. If your using a high armor build than two swords would be better.

I used ancient elven armor.  The wiki says it's .2 damage per dagger. now I can't find it on the wiki.

It might be all Strength on the 360.  I don't know. ha ha.

 i think discobird says you'd get more damage from sword and dagger or was it axe and dagger.  I forget. Then two full swords.

Modifié par cJohnOne, 25 septembre 2012 - 01:41 .

[chrcol]

I dont know the exact differences of the stats, but on all my playthrus (except very first one) I do the circle tower first, so in terms of how far on I am in the game its fairly equal. Usually I do 15 or so damage for daggers and 30 or so from swords, but that revenant seems highly resistant to daggers and the damage is extremely low. My rogue's were only pumped with dex/str, both of which increase damage and it is 0.3 per dex/str on the 360 compared to 0.5 on the pc. Whilst swords get full 1.0 from str.

Modifié par chrcol, 25 septembre 2012 - 04:20 .

[Shadow Fox]

chrcol wrote...

I dont know the exact differences of the stats, but on all my playthrus (except very first one) I do the circle tower first, so in terms of how far on I am in the game its fairly equal. Usually I do 15 or so damage for daggers and 30 or so from swords, but that revenant seems highly resistant to daggers and the damage is extremely low. My rogue's were only pumped with dex/str, both of which increase damage and it is 0.3 per dex/str on the 360 compared to 0.5 on the pc. Whilst swords get full 1.0 from str.

Daggers get ALL their damage from dex. Str is pretty useless for daggers

basicly read this really helped me make a kickass rogue:

dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Forum:Rogues_are_THE_best...imo

[chrcol]

are you sure?

The damage stat goes up on dex and str equally in my game, and there is tons of conflicting info as many people seem to have wrong info, but I do know the damage stat goes up on my game 0.3 equally for both str and dex (and I assume cunning instead of strength with lethality)

from the link you posted.

"daggers get half their damage from dex"

of course it says at lvl20 its great but what about at lvl4

Modifié par chrcol, 25 septembre 2012 - 07:18 .

[Blazomancer]

chrcol wrote...

I dont know the exact differences of the stats, but on all my playthrus (except very first one) I do the circle tower first, so in terms of how far on I am in the game its fairly equal. Usually I do 15 or so damage for daggers and 30 or so from swords, but that revenant seems highly resistant to daggers and the damage is extremely low. My rogue's were only pumped with dex/str, both of which increase damage and it is 0.3 per dex/str on the 360 compared to 0.5 on the pc. Whilst swords get full 1.0 from str.

Oh, okay. I wouldn't know about it, I'm on the PC.
And yes, you're right about the last post that daggers are 0.5 Str and 0.5 Dex, replacing Str with Cunn for rogues with Lethality.

You are a rogue DW, right? So are you backstabbing most of the time? That would at least, make up somewhat for the deficit. And for creatures immune to backstabs like Revenants and other Shield wielding high level warriors, you may try using momentum and dual striking together; deals some nasty amount of DPS.


Edit: Buddy, IIRC, for each point, damage for longsword increases by about 0.7 and not 1,for single wield that is (average 0.625 weapon style multiplier), and the ratio remains same for dual wield as well, weapon style multiplier being 0.375 for each weapon. That would make the equation kind of correct. For daggers, it's like 0.3, 0.4, 0.3, 0.4, and so on. I've checked it on my PC.

It seems a random number between 50 and 75 % is used for the 'Weapon Style Modifier' variable in the 'Attrribute based damage' formula. I assumed the average 0.625  as given in wiki, is used for every calculation.

So, everything is as I expected, at least for me.

Modifié par Blazomancer, 25 septembre 2012 - 09:15 .

[Shadow Fox]

chrcol wrote...

are you sure?

The damage stat goes up on dex and str equally in my game, and there is tons of conflicting info as many people seem to have wrong info, but I do know the damage stat goes up on my game 0.3 equally for both str and dex (and I assume cunning instead of strength with lethality)

from the link you posted.

"daggers get half their damage from dex"

of course it says at lvl20 its great but what about at lvl4

Oh I was wrong.ehh....

Well that's kind of the case in my experiance Warriors are regarded as easy for beginners because they're pretty straightforward builds with a quick payoff and more surviablity but are pretty limited in what they can do wheras a Rogue or a Mage requires more thought to go into building them for them to be good and are pretty weak at the start thus you'll need to be careful or you'll die constantly but have more utility/options at high level.

Modifié par Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke, 25 septembre 2012 - 09:18 .

[chrcol]

yes I will persist with the build and see how it goes end game. But I gave the game a break for now as playing it too much. When I go back to it I have the dual dagger dalish elf rogue to go back to and another noble dwarf rogue started also.