171 réponses à ce sujet

[Shadow Fox]

BrotherWarth wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

So you end up with a cameo of someone who doesn't look, behave or talk like the character.  So why bother?  What satisfaction is watching some genericised figure going to give?

What satisfaction is there in knowing nothing about your Warden's fate?

Fiacre wrote...

Um, no? I was talking about doing the Ultimate Sacrifice.

Could you guys please use some common sense? Obviously this wouldn't apply if your Warden is dead.

Though, yes, as I said multiple times my Warden is more likely to ask Fergus to lop his head off so his family can have his ashes than go on his Calling.

Oh yeah, well my Warden wouldn't have slayed the Archdemon. He would have tamed it and ridden it around Thedas, delivering presents to all the bad boys and girls.
Do you see why your expectations are childish?

Fiacre wrote...
I am, actually. But I've not seen a single idea for a Warden comeback or cameo that I didn't dislike nor have I been able to come up with anything satisfying myself. What works for my Wareden doesn't work for someone else's and vice versa; there's no one size fits all solution here. And while the Warden randomly disappearing is stupid and I don't like it either, I still like it better than any idea that inevitably forces someone's Warden to be OOC.

I would like to know what you've written. If you think nothing is better than something just because it's not 100% perfect I can't imagine you have had much success as a writer.

Hello tiny little kettle meet the big fat pot.

[Wulfram]

BrotherWarth wrote...

What satisfaction is there in knowing nothing about your Warden's fate?

You can tell people what the Warden's fate is without a pointless cameo.  Simply having the Warden's calling mentioned at some point would be better, if that's the route Bioware wishes to go down.  My imagination can do a much better job than some cutscene that strips them of individuality.

Though I don't really want to be told the Warden's fate.  I want the disappearance plot to be resolved because it screws everything up, but their ultimate fate is better left to the player

[Fiacre]

Wulfram wrote...

BrotherWarth wrote...

What satisfaction is there in knowing nothing about your Warden's fate?

You can tell people what the Warden's fate is without a pointless cameo.  Simply having the Warden's calling mentioned at some point would be better, if that's the route Bioware wishes to go down.  My imagination can do a much better job than some cutscene that strips them of individuality.

Though I don't really want to be told the Warden's fate.  I want the disappearance plot to be resolved because it screws everything up, but their ultimate fate is better left to the player

Out of curiosity, do you have any idea how to deal with the disappearance plot that doesn't suffer from the same problems of being OOC and unsatisfactory?

[Jerrybnsn]

Aulis Vaara wrote...

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Way too early for the Warden's calling. It takes thirty years before the need to go on the "Calling". Duncan was in his early 40s when he saved our Warden and only mentioned to Alistair just shortly prior to that that he felt it was close for him to go on his calling. Given the age of your warden when recruited, the Calling won't happen until DA5.

Did I miss something? Do we already know when DA3 is set?

You'll get an origin story for the year 940 DA, and then events will unfold in 941 DA.  I (and many others) assume this, because the novel Asunder and the books with Alistair, Isabella and Varic all end in the year of 939.

[Knight of Dane]

I agree with Wulfram. The character is mine and yours. Bioware can never do it justice without one of us being disapointed, but the Warden simply being gone is simply idiotic and doesn't solve anything.
It would be cool to hear rumors from city banter about where the warden *might* have been spotted, but bioware shouldn't decide on anything specific stating where s/he is.

[Fiacre]

Why is wishing to choose the way he dies childish? I really don't think it is. After everything he's done, I think the least he's earned is being able to decide that he wishes to die at home rather than hopefully dying on his Calling. It simply doesn't work for all Wardens. It's not even true closure, considering that Larius, the poor sod, managed to survive his Calling until Hawke came along.

[Jerrybnsn]

BrotherWarth wrote...

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Way too early for the Warden's calling. It takes thirty years before the need to go on the "Calling". Duncan was in his early 40s when he saved our Warden and only mentioned to Alistair just shortly prior to that that he felt it was close for him to go on his calling. Given the age of your warden when recruited, the Calling won't happen until DA5.

There's no set timeline for the Calling, and your math is very off. Duncan was a young adult when he was made a Warden, he was not 12. And they say in The Calling(the book) that there is no set period of time. It varies for everyone. And considering how different our Warden is, is it really so ludicrous that the Calling would come early?

Duncan is a young twenty year old if not twenty in the book The Calling which was set in the year 910 DA.  Now flash forward twenty years to the even of Origins and that would make Duncan a young 40 if not 40.

And the gap in the differences in the calling depend upon the willpower of the individual warden and my warden has a lot of willpower.

Modifié par Jerrybnsn, 25 septembre 2012 - 08:27 .

[Jerrybnsn]

Fiacre wrote...


Out of curiosity, do you have any idea how to deal with the disappearance plot that doesn't suffer from the same problems of being OOC and unsatisfactory?

Unless you can actually  pick up where your warden left off and simulate choices as they are presented to you, any non-playable aspect of the return of your Warden will be unsatisfactory, whether its cameo, a small blurp by a NPC, or a simple codex entry.  But it seems to come down, which unsatisfactory aspect can they use without upsetting the most fans.

[unbentbuzzkill]

I don't think bioware thought about the plot in da2 i think they just winged it hoping nobody would notice that hey wtf where's the warden

[Jerrybnsn]

BrotherWarth wrote...

Yes, so your math is way off. Either Duncan was made a Warden before he was even a teenager, or it doesn't take 30 years for the taint to take hold and cause the Calling.

I'm sorry, are you saying that Duncan in 910 was...how old? The book treated him as a newly recruited Warden.

[Fiacre]

Ending your life by fulfilling the Calling is what's expected of Wardens.
And
Larius didn't survive the Calling, he surrendered to the taint and is
becoming a Darkspawn. When Warden's don't die they become Darkspawn.

Point is, he didn't end up dying. I assumed the Darkspawn didn't mention to kill him and eventually the taint made him "invisible" to them and him too crazy to do something about it, but I might have missed something, I've only played through Legacy once yet.

And Shea doesn't give a single **** about what is expected of him. Duncan conscripted him while his father was bleeding out on the floor and he still ended the Blight and took care of that mess in Amaranthine. Unless some big emergency threatening Ferelden or one of his friends happens, he's done with it at all and really can't be bothered to care what they might think about that.

Modifié par Fiacre, 25 septembre 2012 - 08:34 .

[M2S SOLID JOSH]

kinda hoping for all the heroes to be in the final battle at the same time. how badass would that be?

[Fiacre]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Fiacre wrote...


Out of curiosity, do you have any idea how to deal with the disappearance plot that doesn't suffer from the same problems of being OOC and unsatisfactory?

Unless you can actually  pick up where your warden left off and simulate choices as they are presented to you, any non-playable aspect of the return of your Warden will be unsatisfactory, whether its cameo, a small blurp by a NPC, or a simple codex entry.  But it seems to come down, which unsatisfactory aspect can they use without upsetting the most fans.

That is the conlcusion I've come to as well (in fact, I've even gone so far as to inlude playable aspects, since I dread to think what the new conversation system would make him into -- it's fine for new characters, but there's too much headcanon for him now) and have decided that the least upsetting idea is leaving him disappeared for me. Just my personal opinion, of course.

[Sejborg]

But the Warden went through the mirror with Morrigan. This do not add up.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Emzamination wrote...

What individual personality? The warden's personality was the player's personality.There was no good/evil meter measuring his/her actions.

The Warden's personality is the one assigned him by the player.  BioWare has no idea what that personality is.

[Fiacre]

BrotherWarth wrote...

Fiacre wrote...

Ending your life by fulfilling the Calling is what's expected of Wardens.
And
Larius didn't survive the Calling, he surrendered to the taint and is
becoming a Darkspawn. When Warden's don't die they become Darkspawn.

Point is, he didn't end up dying. I assumed the Darkspawn didn't mention to kill him and eventually the taint made him "invisible" to them and him too crazy to do something about it, but I might have missed something, I've only played through Legacy once yet.

And Shea doesn't give a single **** about what is expected of him. Duncan conscripted him while his father was bleeding out on the floor and he still ended the Blight and took care of that mess in Amaranthine. Unless some big emergency threatening Ferelden or one of his friends happens, he's done with it at all and really can't be bothered to care what they might think about that.

And Hannu would have tamed the Archdemon, rode him around Thedas and delivered presents to all the bad boys and girls so the ending of Origins was so OOC.

You can epeat that all you like, it doesn't make it a better argument. Unless Bioware can make a cameo that works with all the different personlities a Warden can have developed in the limitations Origin presented us with -- which Shea fits into, your idea does not -- any cameo will be unsatisfactory. I therefore see little point in a cameo. You do not, I get that. But if you want to argue why I'm wrong -- and by all means, do so, I like discussions -- at least make a proper argument for why I'm wrong.

[Palipride47]

What about the end of Witch Hunt, where Morrigan gives you a "gift" as well as Ariane's book back? Couldn't that fit in somehow? There are a lot of people who didn't play it, but I'm thinking it might be something bad enough for the Warden to drop off the face of the Earth (or even abandon his/ her kingdom). But with the timeline screwed up with Alistair (if you are queen) in DA2....it presents a problem.

[Jerrybnsn]

BrotherWarth wrote...

Jerrybnsn wrote...

BrotherWarth wrote...

Yes, so your math is way off. Either Duncan was made a Warden before he was even a teenager, or it doesn't take 30 years for the taint to take hold and cause the Calling.

I'm sorry, are you saying that Duncan in 910 was...how old? The book treated him as a newly recruited Warden.

Duncan was already an adult when he was recruited into the Wardens. If your assertion that it takes 30 years for the taint to cause the Calling were true Duncan would either have to be in his 50s or would have had to have been made a warden when he was 10-12.

Well he wasn't on his calling in Origins....and if he was twenty in 910 that would make him 40 years old in 930.  Do you say this is reasonable?  Remember, Fiona was ten years older than Duncan and she had a child shortly after those events.  And just because Duncan tells Alistair that he's thinking he'll go on his calling soon, doesn't mean he meant that year or the next or the next, which will put him closer to the thirty year mark.

(Side note: That would make Fiona, who everyone is expecting an appearance in DA3, 60 years old!)