339 réponses à ce sujet

[Lord Rosario]

najzere wrote...

Drain evolution is already worthless in my opinion, I would rather kill shielded enemies in one hit than steal some of their shields. If I could change one thing about Shadow right now it would be to make the Electric Damage evolution of Shadow Strike detonate instead of prime tech bursts.

It does detonate tech bursts, even without the Electric Damage evolution. It just doesn't detonate it's self.

[Teratoid]

Air Quotes wrote...

I rarely see a Shadow or Slayer who don't spam ES or BS the WHOLE freaking time. Especially on smaller maps. 

Yeah, I just LOVE when some oaf next to me decides to BS like mad when I'm trying to headshot something down the range.

All the more reason to get rid of ES. Not sold on Phase Disruptor though, but here's what I'm thinking.

Every Infiltrator has a skill that causes some sort of status change in the target/s. Cryo Blast freezes+debuffs+weakens armour, Sabotage overheats or hacks, TacScan illuminates and debuffs, ProxMine damages and weakens or slows, etc.

Shadow doesn't, and "Electric Damage" on Shadow Strike doesn't count. She needs a skill that can weaken and detonate the techburst setup too. Maybe some sort of shotgun blast from her palm (I'm thinking of Ballistic Blade/Submission Net type animation) with area coverage that can set off tech blasts, does meagre damage, and causes enemies to take additional damage or maybe slows them. Sort of a Snap Freeze-like skill in utility, I guess.

[najzere]

Air Quotes wrote...

najzere wrote...
I don't know about my own opinion? o_O

To have an opinion is fine. But to say that Shield Drain is worthless is a bit funny. It's just an ability that makes you much more survivable after SS.

Killing things I Shadow Strike gives me survivability too and I have no problems on Gold.

[najzere]

Lord Rosario wrote...

najzere wrote...
Drain evolution is already worthless in my opinion, I would rather kill shielded enemies in one hit than steal some of their shields. If I could change one thing about Shadow right now it would be to make the Electric Damage evolution of Shadow Strike detonate instead of prime tech bursts.

It does detonate tech bursts, even without the Electric Damage evolution. It just doesn't detonate it's self.

Really? I have tried that with Acolyte and Disruptor ammo and it didn't happen for me. I will test again tonight, thanks for the heads up.

[Lord Rosario]

Air Quotes wrote...

Lord Rosario wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Lord Rosario wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

MacGarrus wrote...

DO NOT WANT.

Shadow is perfect as is: she's a caster Infiltrator, or as close to one as you can get... Shadow Strike and Electric Slash both do what I need them to. Electric Slash thins out spawns and groups too dangerous to Strike, Shadow Strike deals with everything else. Replacing Slash with a laggy, hard to aim, comparatively weak power would be a severe blow to the balance of the class.

Who says PD can't do the same? And better? Do you play the Slayer? PD is awesome. 

And again no one said the Shadow has to have the same PD as the Slayer. 

Ok, perhaps you should change how you are going at this. Saying some sort of Phase Disruptor would lead people to believe that what you mean IS PD. A power that drains  the users shields is not a good idea on an infiltrator that has trouble getting them as it is. SS's evolution to drain shields is not enough to counter that.

Just saying it doesn't have to be like Phase Disrupter in whatever way, but also saying you want the Shadow to have a Phase Disrupter is just silly. Be more specific. What would the difference be exactly? Be more precise or people will assume you mean what you said in your OP, as, we cannot read your mind.

If you've said it somewhere in your replies, it should be added to the OP because very very few people are going to sift through 7 pages of posts to see if you clairified somewhere..

Okay. I want some sort of palm blaster thingy with CC and stagger to help set up SS. Faster than ES, with no dumb animations and sounds. 

Ahh, I think Energy Drain would suit that more. Drain shields first, maybe give a layer of protection, sets up for a tech burst, and stuns weaker targets. Overload would work similarly, but with better stun, can hit more targets, strip more shields, but wouldn't give a layer of armor or drain shields.

I can already imagine multiple builds that would work well off of ED for defense, and/or damage.

ED is old, and It's been done already. 3 characters have it already. It's good, but I would like a palm blaster. Especially since the Shadow IS inspired by the Phantom and she ALREADY has a blaster in her palm. 

Plus ED would make the Drain evolution worhless. 

Wouldn't make it worthless, it would add yet another level of survivability. ED to get shields, then you might get hit between the time you recharge, cloak, then slash, then, you'll get shields up again.

Anyhow, that seems rather unreasonable to me.. First you want something swapped out for an existing power, which has never been done, then you want it to be like another power, only better, then when other powers that are similar are already in the game, you want something that is completely new. Just... Think about that. If you're going to go this far over something like this idea, then make it at least remotely plausible.

[MacGarrus]

Air Quotes wrote...

Lord Rosario wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

MacGarrus wrote...

DO NOT WANT.

Shadow is perfect as is: she's a caster Infiltrator, or as close to one as you can get... Shadow Strike and Electric Slash both do what I need them to. Electric Slash thins out spawns and groups too dangerous to Strike, Shadow Strike deals with everything else. Replacing Slash with a laggy, hard to aim, comparatively weak power would be a severe blow to the balance of the class.

Who says PD can't do the same? And better? Do you play the Slayer? PD is awesome. 

And again no one said the Shadow has to have the same PD as the Slayer. 

Ok, perhaps you should change how you are going at this. Saying some sort of Phase Disruptor would lead people to believe that what you mean IS PD. A power that drains  the users shields is not a good idea on an infiltrator that has trouble getting them as it is. SS's evolution to drain shields is not enough to counter that.

Just saying it doesn't have to be like Phase Disrupter in whatever way, but also saying you want the Shadow to have a Phase Disrupter is just silly. Be more specific. What would the difference be exactly? Be more precise or people will assume you mean what you said in your OP, as, we cannot read your mind.

If you've said it somewhere in your replies, it should be added to the OP because very very few people are going to sift through 7 pages of posts to see if you clairified somewhere..

Okay. I want some sort of palm blaster thingy with CC and stagger to help set up SS. Faster than ES, with no dumb animations and sounds. 

As long as it isnt laggy like PD is and could be used to similar effect as ES then i'd be fine. We could call it Daze Fistruptor or DP for short!

[Sable Dove]

So, instead of a short-range, AoE attack, and a long-range, single-target attack, you want the Shadow to have two long-range, single-target attacks? That is not melee, so you have to choose one to get all the synergies. So now instead of a versatile, well-rounded character with three good powers, we get a character that has no crowd-control, and either a blaster or shadow strike. Because there's no reason to have both.

Electric Slash is perfect for the Phantom. Replacing it with Phase Disruptor is kinda like replacing the Human Engineer's Overload with Carnage. It serves the same purpose as their other main skill, and hurts the class' versatility.

Modifié par Sable Dove, 28 septembre 2012 - 10:38 .

[najzere]

PD is a beast crowd controller though... Do you play Slayer much?

[najzere]

Air Quotes wrote...

najzere wrote...
PD is a beast crowd controller though... Do you play Slayer much?

Who, me? Yeah I do play him quite a bit. Never use BS. Too slow. Too cheap. Looks stupid, annoys other people, especially snipers.

Haha, no I was responding to the post right above mine that said PD wasn't good at crowd control. I think you've said multiple times already that the "palm blaster" power would be crowd control.

[snarf001]

Make the secondary evo line something like a wide arc slash with her sword that hits everything around her. It's an AoE melee attack but with limited range. ES stays the way it it but condensed on the top line to keep ES lovers happy.

I never use ES anyway, I just find that power so disjointed from the Shadow, but it shouldn't be removed because some people, perhaps even a lot actually like it. The only difference between the two would be, ES is a CoE with medium range and Wide Arc is a a 360 degree melee attack but with limited range. Choosing Wide Arc would fit in with the Shadow a lot more because she is essentially melee.

I would like to see PD added but kinda having a hard time how that could be implemented without compromising ES. It would be two completely different powers on the same line.

[ElementDuck]

I'm not going to read this entire thread, since it's getting pretty long.

If you want to give Shadow a palm blaster, I would prefer it wasn't a large area effect move like the Slayer has. It should maybe be a burst fire attack that shoots little pellets like the Phantom. I'd want it to require accuracy on the player's part, which I feel would offset the auto-aim Shadow Strike and provide an additional strategy for one of the most unique characters in the game.

Modifié par ElementDuck, 29 septembre 2012 - 12:18 .

[rmccowen]

Air Quotes wrote...

Shadow needs something fast to help with SS. And a Palm Blaster makes sense.

I'm provisionally okay with the idea of substituting a fast CQC power for the current slow one, but I don't think Phase Disruptor is a good choice.

ES doesn't cut it. It's slow, annoying, unoriginal and overpowered. You get great reward and no risk. That's why it's a fav for campers. I don't believe Bioware envisioned this character to be a wall hugger that is played safely by hiding behind cover.

I think the best solution to the spamming/farming problem is to fix Shockwave, Electric Slash, and Biotic Slash so that they penetrate cover similarly to weapons: only up to a certain depth, and with reduced effectiveness.

But I actually don't find Slash particularly problematic on a Shadow-Strike-focused build (I play 6/4/6/5/5). ES gives me an option to detonate the shock effect of SS from a moderate distance, which can be important against Ravagers and sync-killing enemies. The long animation is irritating, but since I essentially only use it while Cloaked, it's just a problem of inconvenient timing (rather than the potentially deadly delay it might introduce on a non-Infiltrator).

I'm not saying ES is great. I don't really understand how it works lore-wise--I swish my sword through the air slowly, and that makes electricity come out?--and I'd prefer something that made a better panic-button. I'd even be willing to put up with a longer cooldown to get something that had a faster cast and felt more... I don't know, Shadow-y.

But I don't think a Phase Disruptor (or a PD/Nova-type power) is a good choice. Most of my reasons have already been echoed in the thread, but I'm particularly persuaded by the fact that the Shadow has no consistent or convenient way to recharge shields, and is already uncomfortably squishy if you're caught in the open while Cloak is on cooldown.

Moreover, I think there's another power lurking in the wings that makes just as much sense as a "Palm Blaster": Concussive Shot. (I've only skimmed the last couple of pages of this thread, but I'm pretty sure no one else has suggested this.) It has a fast casting animation and a fast cooldown, which is just what the doctor ordered for the Shadow. It actually makes for a decent single-target CC ability, which is also right in line with what she needs. It's currently undervalued, mostly because it has poor synergy on the classes that have it. But on an Infiltrator it could be fun times... with no screen-shake and no potential for wallhack abuse.

[najzere]

I'd be down for Concussive Shot, especially after they fix the Amplification evolution with the patch.

[MaxShine]

Air Quotes wrote...

Who said that PD can't CC?  

You know how enemies frequently melee you of of SS? Or even insta-kill you? Wouldn't it be nice to stagger them and then SS? Woudn't it be nice to stagger them AFTER SS to escape? Then you would have many choices to spec the Palm Blaster and Shadow Strike. 

For example, palm blaster for CC and stagger and SS for damage. Or SS for survivability and palm blaster for damage. The possibilities are there and all of them look more fun than ES. 

SS is true Shadows bread and butter like Biotic Charge and PD to Slayer. And both ES and BS do NOT complement well for these fast dynamic characters that zip around the map. 

^^this... If you take a good weapon you do not need ES, ES just slows everything down.

[rmccowen]

Air Quotes wrote...

najzere wrote...

I'd be down for Concussive Shot, especially after they fix the Amplification evolution with the patch.

Concussive shot doesn't fit the Shadow. AT ALL. It fits even worse than the ES. 

Why?