411 réponses à ce sujet

[TEWR]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Why should the Qunari?

I agree. I'm fine with the Qunari exiling -- for lack of a nicer word -- Vashoth because they're not doing their part in the Qun and hunting the violent ones to protect the populus.

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

I have been abroad for a few months, and havnt had internet

Abroad you say? Where to, if you don't mind my asking?

[EmperorSahlertz]

A tour of duty to Somalia, or rather the sea east of it. Never sat foot on Somali ground.

[Emzamination]

Dave of Canada wrote...

I'd love to have the option to execute or tranquil mages, provided tranquility also carries the risk of the mage being saved and "cured" after Asunder. I wouldn't mind having a tranquil servant who carries around my luggage and gives me my mail, maybe teach it to make sassy remarks in a monotone way.

Come to think of it...a tranquil orana type character would be a nice alternative for pro-templars.Truth be told, I was always a bit envious of meredith having a tranquil assistant.

[Emzamination]

XxDeonxX wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...
Blood magic is a necessity. Fueling
powerful spells with living templars could allow the rebels to
accomplish grandiose spells. Mind control is also an effective way to
make a templar surrender. I'm sure the lyrium withdrawal would be a
factor for their mental health, depending on their access to it, but
blood magic should work regardless.

It's also a very effective way to loose public support, Ferelden for starters. Making the rebel's chances of loosing the war much higher. I approve =D

Right!? Lobsel's demented maleficar rantings just reinforce how insane blood mages are and why every available weapon and rite are conceivable & viable options for pro-templars in this war.

Modifié par Emzamination, 28 septembre 2012 - 11:47 .

[berelinde]

Sure! Give them an "I win" button, too.

Seriously, whatever suits game balance works for me. Mana clash was essentially the same thing, and it was overpowered enough to be game breaking. I'm not really into playing warriors, so I don't really care what they do with the templar specialization. I would not want this ability to be available in PvP if there was a PvP simply because it would be so overpowered, but in single-player mode, what people do in their own games is their own business.

[Emzamination]

berelinde wrote...

Sure! Give them an "I win" button, too.

Seriously, whatever suits game balance works for me. Mana clash was essentially the same thing, and it was overpowered enough to be game breaking. I'm not really into playing warriors, so I don't really care what they do with the templar specialization. I would not want this ability to be available in PvP if there was a PvP simply because it would be so overpowered, but in single-player mode, what people do in their own games is their own business.

What ability?

[Sable Rhapsody]

I kind of want to see this just to watch the forums explode with rage.

But IMO, no. The Rite of Tranquility is meant as a last resort. Things have changed a lot since Kirkwall, but if the templars want to maintain any semblence of the moral high ground, they (and by extension the PC regardless of affiliation) can't just use it whenever.

[Ryzaki]

Yes yes yes.

Do want.

[berelinde]

Emzamination wrote...

berelinde wrote...

Sure! Give them an "I win" button, too.

Seriously, whatever suits game balance works for me. Mana clash was essentially the same thing, and it was overpowered enough to be game breaking. I'm not really into playing warriors, so I don't really care what they do with the templar specialization. I would not want this ability to be available in PvP if there was a PvP simply because it would be so overpowered, but in single-player mode, what people do in their own games is their own business.

What ability?

Neutralizing mages with Tranquility. As an out-of-combat only thing, it wouldn't be terribly useful. Sure, if you're talking about persistent NPCs who are intended to live through more than one encounter, there's a role-playing aspect to it, but I imagine that it might become cumbersome to write (and voice) both tranquil and non-tranquil versions of every mage NPC in the game. That said, if that's how they want to spend their budgets, so be it. It won't effect me any.

Like I said, as long as it isn't something that can be used against the protagonist, and I'm sure it wouldn't be, I don't really care what they do with it.


Edit: Come to think of it, as an in-combat ability, it would be kind of lore-unfriendly since the Rite is supposed to be something that requires preparation and reagents, but it could also be good RP fun for those that get off on that kind of thing. It would be funny to see a mage winding up with a big spell, fizzle out, and then flail around trying to learn how to backstab or whatever on the fly. Or just lose interest in combat entirely.

Modifié par berelinde, 28 septembre 2012 - 12:44 .

[Emzamination]

berelinde wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

berelinde wrote...

Sure! Give them an "I win" button, too.

Seriously, whatever suits game balance works for me. Mana clash was essentially the same thing, and it was overpowered enough to be game breaking. I'm not really into playing warriors, so I don't really care what they do with the templar specialization. I would not want this ability to be available in PvP if there was a PvP simply because it would be so overpowered, but in single-player mode, what people do in their own games is their own business.

What ability?

Neutralizing mages with Tranquility. As an out-of-combat only thing, it wouldn't be terribly useful. Sure, if you're talking about persistent NPCs who are intended to live through more than one encounter, there's a role-playing aspect to it, but I imagine that it might become cumbersome to write (and voice) both tranquil and non-tranquil versions of every mage NPC in the game. That said, if that's how they want to spend their budgets, so be it. It won't effect me any.

Like I said, as long as it isn't something that can be used against the protagonist, and I'm sure it wouldn't be, I don't really care what they do with it.


Edit: Come to think of it, as an in-combat ability, it would be kind of lore-unfriendly since the Rite is supposed to be something that requires preparation and reagents, but it could also be good RP fun for those that get off on that kind of thing. It would be funny to see a mage winding up with a big spell, fizzle out, and then flail around trying to learn how to backstab or whatever on the fly. Or just lose interest in combat entirely.

I wish it were so but the rite of tranquility could never be a combat ability.It could however be implemented with a more cinematic approach.For example: After interrogating a mage, the pc could order the two templars standing at the door to tranquil said mage, wherein the pc would view the mage being dragged off kicking and screaming for mercy into a dark adjacent room or some such.

[Masha Potato]

you forgot the evil laughter

[DPSSOC]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...
I kind of want to see this just to watch the forums explode with rage.

Just have the Templar Order survive the game you'll get the same result.

Sable Rhapsody wrote...
But IMO, no. The Rite of Tranquility is meant as a last resort. Things have changed a lot since Kirkwall, but if the templars want to maintain any semblence of the moral high ground, they (and by extension the PC regardless of affiliation) can't just use it whenever.

Considering there's open war I think we've hit last resort territory.  There's no way to hold a mage POW because no matter how many Templars you have sapping their mana all they have to do is cut themselves (not terribly difficult even without tools) to use their magic, and there's not a whole lot that can be done.  I suppose you could keep them sedated but then you're keeping them in the Fade and they might just make a deal with a demon.  So Tranquility is the only real way to hold them prisoner.

I'm sure they'll have the mages do something equally horrific to Templar POWs, cause why give both sides valid arguments and sensible points when you can just make them both evil bastards,  though they don't have anywhere near the justification.

[berelinde]

Emzamination wrote...

berelinde wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

berelinde wrote...

Sure! Give them an "I win" button, too.

Seriously, whatever suits game balance works for me. Mana clash was essentially the same thing, and it was overpowered enough to be game breaking. I'm not really into playing warriors, so I don't really care what they do with the templar specialization. I would not want this ability to be available in PvP if there was a PvP simply because it would be so overpowered, but in single-player mode, what people do in their own games is their own business.

What ability?

Neutralizing mages with Tranquility. As an out-of-combat only thing, it wouldn't be terribly useful. Sure, if you're talking about persistent NPCs who are intended to live through more than one encounter, there's a role-playing aspect to it, but I imagine that it might become cumbersome to write (and voice) both tranquil and non-tranquil versions of every mage NPC in the game. That said, if that's how they want to spend their budgets, so be it. It won't effect me any.

Like I said, as long as it isn't something that can be used against the protagonist, and I'm sure it wouldn't be, I don't really care what they do with it.


Edit: Come to think of it, as an in-combat ability, it would be kind of lore-unfriendly since the Rite is supposed to be something that requires preparation and reagents, but it could also be good RP fun for those that get off on that kind of thing. It would be funny to see a mage winding up with a big spell, fizzle out, and then flail around trying to learn how to backstab or whatever on the fly. Or just lose interest in combat entirely.

I wish it were so but the rite of tranquility could never be a combat ability.It could however be implemented with a more cinematic approach.For example: After interrogating a mage, the pc could order the two templars standing at the door to tranquil said mage, wherein the pc would view the mage being dragged off kicking and screaming for mercy into a dark adjacent room or some such.

(shrugs) If that's how you get your kicks, and if that's how BioWare wants to use their resources. Assuming that the protagonist is an inquisitor in that sense and assuming that the ability to torture prisoners is offered, it doesn't really matter how.

As an intellectual exercise, I wonder how much coin it would cost the protagonist to conduct the Rite. It is more expensive than a knife across the throat, so I wouldn't expect it to be a freebie.

As another intellectual exercise, it might also be interesting to implement the templar requirement for lyrium to fuel abilities. The stamina bar would start at 0 and would only rise if lyrium were consumed. There should probably be a stat penalty when the lyrium is depleted, but that would probably be cumbersome to implement. This isn't really relevent to the topic, but thinking about realism in one area reminded me of some needed realism in another. It always seemed strange to me that blood mages had an in-game mechanic to support their abilities (casting spells with the sustained turned on does cause the health bar to drop as if the mage were actually injuring himself), but the templar specialization did not. Again, this is just an aside.

[Xilizhra]

To be frank, I've changed my mind. I want this to be explicitly impossible. I also want the templars to automatically be the game's main villains, alongside this mysterious other force, so that the PC will never even think of trying something like this.

[General User]

What exactly is involved in the Rite of Tranquility? I mean, does a mage have to be captive first in order to be made tranquil?

If the techniques involved in making a mage tranquil could be "weaponized" and used on the battlefield they could make for a quite fearsome weapon indeed.

[Ausstig]

ReggarBlane wrote...

And the guilt when finding out that the mage was innocent of whatever "crime"? Yes.

Seriously. This is a great plot device to use just for that alone. All known signs point to the mage, but the player missed some clues and performed the rite on an innocent person.

Mages have no innocence, only degrees of guilt. 


Also I hope blood mages are the big bad/ main enemies. 

I just imagine walking into some town in the middle of nowear  seeing some jumped up BM demading sacrfices. Then you tell them off, or some other witty remake. Then they try to magic the PC, you the Tempslap them (whaty Alistair does that Magister in the first issue of "those who Speak") then the mage goes 

BM: "what are?"

PC: "I am the solution"/ "I am Andraste, like my hair"/ " I am Retrbitution" 

Then you can Tranquil them, or kill them or do something like Tranquil but they still have emotions. 

Modifié par Ausstig, 28 septembre 2012 - 01:36 .

[berelinde]

General User wrote...

If the techniques involved in making a mage tranquil could be "weaponized" and used on the battlefield they could make for a quite fearsome weapon indeed.

I think that's the principle behind templar abilities in general. They disrupt the connection with the Fade to varying degrees. That's why I said that an in-combat "Tranquilize" spell would be the equivalent of Mana Clash. Conceptually possible, but definitely overpowered.

[Ausstig]

berelinde wrote...

General User wrote...

If the techniques involved in making a mage tranquil could be "weaponized" and used on the battlefield they could make for a quite fearsome weapon indeed.

I think that's the principle behind templar abilities in general. They disrupt the connection with the Fade to varying degrees. That's why I said that an in-combat "Tranquilize" spell would be the equivalent of Mana Clash. Conceptually possible, but definitely overpowered.

How abou making it late game and cost a huge amount of manna/Stamina?

[berelinde]

Xilizhra wrote...

To be frank, I've changed my mind. I want this to be explicitly impossible. I also want the templars to automatically be the game's main villains, alongside this mysterious other force, so that the PC will never even think of trying something like this.

To be honest, I would never do this, even if it were offered, but some people would, evidently. If the game was all about being an inquisitor in that sense, it wouldn't matter if it was in because I wouldn't be buying it anyway.

And yeah, I am hoping that the templars/other mysterious force will be the game's main villains, but we'll see, I guess. RP works both ways. I can't ask for the RP freedom to play a rabidly pro-mage protagonist without accepting that the opposite also be offered.

[berelinde]

Ausstig wrote...

berelinde wrote...

General User wrote...

If the techniques involved in making a mage tranquil could be "weaponized" and used on the battlefield they could make for a quite fearsome weapon indeed.

I think that's the principle behind templar abilities in general. They disrupt the connection with the Fade to varying degrees. That's why I said that an in-combat "Tranquilize" spell would be the equivalent of Mana Clash. Conceptually possible, but definitely overpowered.

How abou making it late game and cost a huge amount of manna/Stamina?

Add an instant-kill for mages to use against templars and it's balanced. Seriously, though, the game is probably better off without an "I win" button. Removing the challenge kind of defeats the purpose of playing.

Edit: Then again, enemies might very well have the same abilities the protagonist does. Come up against a boss and you could very well be looking at a full-party wipe.

Modifié par berelinde, 28 septembre 2012 - 01:50 .

[Xilizhra]

berelinde wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

To be frank, I've changed my mind. I want this to be explicitly impossible. I also want the templars to automatically be the game's main villains, alongside this mysterious other force, so that the PC will never even think of trying something like this.

To be honest, I would never do this, even if it were offered, but some people would, evidently. If the game was all about being an inquisitor in that sense, it wouldn't matter if it was in because I wouldn't be buying it anyway.

And yeah, I am hoping that the templars/other mysterious force will be the game's main villains, but we'll see, I guess. RP works both ways. I can't ask for the RP freedom to play a rabidly pro-mage protagonist without accepting that the opposite also be offered.

Of course you can. You can certainly be pro-Council in ME3 and get to kick the hell out of Cerberus without a pro-Cerberus option being offered. I'm after something like that.

[DarkKnightHolmes]

Only if I get the right of blowing chantry's.

[berelinde]

Xilizhra wrote...

berelinde wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

To be frank, I've changed my mind. I want this to be explicitly impossible. I also want the templars to automatically be the game's main villains, alongside this mysterious other force, so that the PC will never even think of trying something like this.

To be honest, I would never do this, even if it were offered, but some people would, evidently. If the game was all about being an inquisitor in that sense, it wouldn't matter if it was in because I wouldn't be buying it anyway.

And yeah, I am hoping that the templars/other mysterious force will be the game's main villains, but we'll see, I guess. RP works both ways. I can't ask for the RP freedom to play a rabidly pro-mage protagonist without accepting that the opposite also be offered.

Of course you can. You can certainly be pro-Council in ME3 and get to kick the hell out of Cerberus without a pro-Cerberus option being offered. I'm after something like that.

A game like that would be like birthday, seasonal holiday of choice, and winning the lottery all rolled up in one, I agree, but I'm not going to hold my breath on that one.

Forgive me, but I'm not really familiar with Mass Effect. Sci-fi games don't hold much interest for me, so in my world, Cerebrus is just a 3-headed dog with serious halitosis.

[Xilizhra]

Basically, Cerberus is a pro-human terrorist organization that made people start complaining about unfair characterization when Cerberus started doing to the player what it had been doing to the rest of the galaxy for the entirety of its existence. Remarkably like the templars in some ways, except not an establishment power.