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[Nixter Shepard]

 I am curious as to what people's current position on the fade's role in Dragon Age 3 is. I have not seen any discussions on the topic and would be interested in knowing where the fanbase stands. 

I know that the fade in DA:O was not very popular, even hated by some (enough to create a mod that completely skips it) and thus played a very small part in DA2. 

Do you guys want to see the fade return, or do you want it to die out forever? Should there be improvements or did DA:O/DA2 get it right?

If it does return, what role (and how important of a role) should it play in the overarching plot?

Modifié par Nixter Shepard, 28 septembre 2012 - 08:28 .

[LPPrince]

I think The Fade could use a re-imagining.

A revamp. Have it remade to be more acceptable. Because holy hell I hate going back there in DAO.

I hated the little bit of it I got in DA2, but that's only because of my initial reaction to it in DAO.

The Fade as is? Eww.

Perhaps if they could make it more vibrant and colorful I'd accept it more.

[SpunkyMonkey]

I didn't realize so many hated the fade! I loved it and thought is was a great departure from the main game.

Graphically I think they'd need to make it a tad less wishy-washy, so maybe imbue the protagonist with some sort of power that lets the fade appear as real as the real world?

Also, if this is to be the final game where the Darkspawn are the main enemy then I think an end-game in the fade revealing "the truth" behind the Maker, darkspawn and subsequent battle would be cool.

A journey to Tevinter to confront the mages who unleashed the darkspawn, only to find that they are actually servants of "The Maker" and that The Maker is constantly unleashing Darkspawn upon the world as penance for Andraste's murder, leading to a confrontation with the Maker himself in the fade.

Or something

[Aulis Vaara]

I never understood why people disliked the fade. It was a great puzzle section in the game and had some great gameplay elements as well. Shapeshifting was extremely poorly done as a specialisation, but the fade version was awesome.

[svenus97]

Liked it in Awakening.

[Plaintiff]

People don't hate the Fade just because it's the Fade. They hate the level in DA:O because it was boring to look at, unnecessarily long, and not very fun to play.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 28 septembre 2012 - 08:54 .

[Nashimura]

svenus97 wrote...

Liked it in Awakening.

Yea, that was a good quest as soon as you hit the fade - i think a lot can be done with the fade...Origins did well at making it feeling like a total inescapable nightmare though. Soooo - well done? I think it can be used better though, just because anything goes, the possibilities are endless for story telling.

Oh, in the second book it was done well too - the dreams they had were more personal and deeper than we got from Origins.

[MichaelStuart]

I liked the fade in Origins, I hope it returns.
I would suggest making it more dream like.

[SpunkyMonkey]

Plaintiff wrote...

People don't hate the Fade just because it's the Fade. They hate the level in DA:O because it was boring to look at, unnecessarily long, and not very fun to play.

It could have done with a bit more variety, but I loved the layering of it  - how there was a fade and then a spirit form fade which used right could boost your stats.

It is a shame they went brown & grey visually though, I can understand why as the fade is meant to be mistakeable for the real world, but if it returns it would be nice if that was like a "level 1" of the fade, with deeper levels more spaced-out in a similar way to The Archon's area in Summoner 2 (not quite as extreme, but you get my meaning)

Modifié par SpunkyMonkey, 28 septembre 2012 - 09:04 .

[Nashimura]

I know im saying this years to late, but i think in origins your Origin should of decided what dream you get - and it should of done a better job at trying to make you stay...missed opportunity i think.

[DarkKnightHolmes]

Bring out the fade, kill all the templars in it.

Oh and Orzammor is 10x more annoying than the fade.

Modifié par DarkKnightHolmes, 28 septembre 2012 - 09:28 .

[Anarya]

I liked the DA:O fade segment well enough, aside from its ugly brown-ness (and that it was way too long), but after going through it twice I never wanted to do it again. I don't recall having strong feelings one way or the other about the fade parts of either Awakening or DA2.

I *would* like to see it get a revamp, at least visually, for DA3. I could see what they were shooting for; a kind of "through the looking glass" sort of place, but I didn't think a few floating items and a weird visual filter was really pushing it far enough in that direction. It felt a little halfhearted.

I think some really crazy lighting effects might help a lot to make it feel surreal. Maybe if they made it have that eerily-lit, washed out effect you get under a very bright full moon? I dunno. I did like how Skyrim and Jade Empire used an unnaturally bright palette to get a surreal effect in their "heaven" segments, but the fade is supposed to have a more sinister feel to it. I have to say, though, Sovngarde's sky was spectacular. 

Modifié par Anarya, 28 septembre 2012 - 09:41 .

[Xewaka]

I loved the purpose of the Fade in Dragon Age Origins. It was, essentially, a puzzle level. A labyrinth. It was a very welcome change of pace from the "fight. talk. fight. talk" core dynamic of the game. In this sense, the Gauntlet of Sacred Ashes plays a similar role: a pace breaker (in the good sense) that challenges the player in a different way from the core game and refreshes his mind before going back to "fight. talk. fight. talk". However, as it happens with most puzzles, once solved it loses its novelty, and thus most of its value, as rather than a fun, clever challenge to be tackled, it becomes a chore. Graphic Adventure games (such as Monkey Island or Grim Fandango) solved this apparent lack of replayability simply by having such a smart, clever, and funny writing around the puzzles and characters that you want to revisit them despite having already solved the game. In that regard, I'd be rather surprised, and perhaps even dissapointed, if the writing team and lead design hasn't already thoroughly researched the graphic adventure genre, considering it's the genre that lives or dies by its writing and the marrying of it with its mechanics.

Among Dragon Age 2 many failings (most in execution), one that stuck out for me was the fact that there was no such pacebreaker in the whole game, save for perhaps Varric's act 2 imagination spot in his personal quest; however, while amusing, it didn't quite serve the same purpose of "resetting" the player mind set and refresh him with a different challenge. The whole game consisted of "fight. talk. fight. talk" with no attempt at breaking that cycle, which in my perspective diminishes the overall quality of the game.

Regarding Dragon Age 3? A Fade level, equivalent to Origins' in purpose would be very welcome. By which I mean, a puzzle level that gives a break in the core dynamic of "fight. talk. fight. talk" and challenges the player in a different way.
As for the looks, I don't care that much either way. Just gimme that puzzles.

Modifié par Xewaka, 28 septembre 2012 - 09:47 .

[LPPrince]

Sovngarde's Sky, damn straight. Let The Fade be colorful and unique instead of washed out and boring.

[nightcobra]

surreal imagery like impossible labyrinths would be fun



the level constantly changing, never staying in one form for long like how the fade is supposed to be.

Modifié par nightcobra8928, 28 septembre 2012 - 09:50 .

[LPPrince]

If only The Fade would look like this.

[TheCharmedOne]

Plaintiff wrote...

People don't hate the Fade just because it's the Fade. They hate the level in DA:O because it was boring to look at, unnecessarily long, and not very fun to play.

This 100%. 

I didnt mind the fade in awakenings, and i enjoyed that it was very short and sweet in DA 2.

[SpunkyMonkey]

Loving the ideas for the fade. Would have it as a "second level" to the fade, one that's unearthed via the brown/grey one (can't just ignore it from previous games)

Xewaka wrote...

I loved the purpose of the Fade in Dragon Age Origins. It was, essentially, a puzzle level. A labyrinth. It was a very welcome change of pace from the "fight. talk. fight. talk" core dynamic of the game. In this sense, the Gauntlet of Sacred Ashes plays a similar role: a pace breaker (in the good sense) that challenges the player in a different way from the core game and refreshes his mind before going back to "fight. talk. fight. talk". However, as it happens with most puzzles, once solved it loses its novelty, and thus most of its value, as rather than a fun, clever challenge to be tackled, it becomes a chore.

Good shout.

Although I'm only on my 3 full playthrough of DA:O (have got halfway through another 2 times, but real life intervened so decided to start over again on my return) but I'm yet to find the fade boring in the least.

I think we need to temper our expectations a bit and realize that we're bound to get bored of something after several hundred hours of play.

Modifié par SpunkyMonkey, 28 septembre 2012 - 09:57 .

[Anarya]

Xewaka wrote...

I loved the purpose of the Fade in Dragon Age Origins. It was, essentially, a puzzle level. A labyrinth. It was a very welcome change of pace from the "fight. talk. fight. talk" core dynamic of the game. In this sense, the Gauntlet of Sacred Ashes plays a similar role: a pace breaker (in the good sense) that challenges the player in a different way from the core game and refreshes his mind before going back to "fight. talk. fight. talk". However, as it happens with most puzzles, once solved it loses its novelty, and thus most of its value, as rather than a fun, clever challenge to be tackled, it becomes a chore. Graphic Adventure games (such as Monkey Island or Grim Fandango) solved this apparent lack of replayability simply by having such a smart, clever, and funny writing around the puzzles and characters that you want to revisit them despite having already solved the game. In that regard, I'd be rather surprised, and perhaps even dissapointed, if the writing team and lead design hasn't already thoroughly researched the graphic adventure genre, considering it's the genre that lives or dies by its writing and the marrying of it with its mechanics.

Among Dragon Age 2 many failings (most in execution), one that stuck out for me was the fact that there was no such pacebreaker in the whole game, save for perhaps Varric's act 2 imagination spot in his personal quest; however, while amusing, it didn't quite serve the same purpose of "resetting" the player mind set and refresh him with a different challenge. The whole game consisted of "fight. talk. fight. talk" with no attempt at breaking that cycle, which in my perspective diminishes the overall quality of the game.

Regarding Dragon Age 3? A Fade level, equivalent to Origins' in purpose would be very welcome. By which I mean, a puzzle level that gives a break in the core dynamic of "fight. talk. fight. talk" and challenges the player in a different way.
As for the looks, I don't care that much either way. Just gimme that puzzles.

Totally agree about the pacing and puzzle aspects. The Sacred Ashes quest was actually my favorite questline in Origins and it didn't feel as tedious to replay, perhaps because I liked the writing for it. 

And re:Sovngarde's sky, I seriously stood there for a couple minutes just staring up at it when I played through that part. 

[LPPrince]

Same with me and Sovngarde. Shame that you'll only see that sky for so long.

But perhaps that's best. That's what makes it special. That's what The Fade needs, something striking, something special.

I didn't feel it had that.

[LPPrince]

Another thing from Sovngarde that should inspire a redesign of The Fade-

A dark theme song

[Anarya]

I do like the upside-down Black City in the Fade. I think that's a really neat, distinctive feature that could be played up more and made to feel more special.

[SpunkyMonkey]

Anarya wrote...

I do like the upside-down Black City in the Fade. I think that's a really neat, distinctive feature that could be played up more and made to feel more special.

I like the faceless people approach too - maybe have companions stuck in the fade alonside demons - all faceless, all voiced by the same actor/actress and you have to decide who to save/kill based on their actions and reactions alone.

Would be tense

Modifié par SpunkyMonkey, 28 septembre 2012 - 10:19 .

[AdmiralDavidAnderson]

I always hated going to the fade in Origins and in 2 as well.