20 réponses à ce sujet

[cJohnOne]

Currently we have diplomatic, Sarcastic , and aggressive which don't have any character motivation.


While good, bad and greedy does have a motive for your character.  Is too much motive too restricting?


What do you think?

[Dhiro]

Can you explain what do you mean by motivation? And how the three tones lack it? It seesm like an interesting subject, but I can't quite get what you mean!

[Ashman1986]

I actually prefer to make dialogue choices based on the context of the material itself rather than a superficial label for the options. I only feel limited when the options presented don't really match the motivation that I have given my character fort he game.

[Samzo77]

I see what you mean. There were some differences from DA:O to DA2 with this.
Example:
NPC Says, "Do you like mages?"
Hawkes choices are,
"I love mages"
"Does the Divine wear a funy hat?"
"I hate mages"
Wardens choices are,
"I love mages"
"Does the Divine wear a funny hat?"
"I hate mages,"
"(lie) I love mages,"
"(intimidate) of course I do, don't you?"

The options in Origins provided more responses, and therefore, more motivations. Additionally, the coercion skill added more depth to your answers. In DA2 it was more of choosing three ways to give the same answer in a lot of situations, or it was abrupt contrasts in each answer.
I think 3 choices does limit your motivations.

[EricHVela]

I haven't thought of it that way, Samzo77. That's a very good point.

I wonder if enough of the DA:O quest/conversation system is still present to have something like that again.

Modifié par ReggarBlane, 28 septembre 2012 - 04:59 .

[Plaintiff]

What counts as "good" and what counts as "bad"?

[Dagr88]

Diplomatic, Sarcastic , and Aggressive (DSA) are not choices. It's there to show PC's character.
Choices we usually have at the end of the dialog: "I'll help you / I won't be a part of this / Pay me / I think I prefer you dead". Your/PC's motivation is reflected by choosing 1 of those.

DSA is also used in some quests. By picking 1 option very often/constantly your character becomes Diplomatic/Sarcastic/Aggressive. D.Hawke can persuade Dalish Elf to let go Human that was previously a werewolf. A.Hawke can get info from Harbormaster without paying him.

Modifié par Dagr88, 28 septembre 2012 - 05:17 .

[nightscrawl]

cJohnOne wrote...

Currently we have diplomatic, Sarcastic , and aggressive which don't have any character motivation.


While good, bad and greedy does have a motive for your character.  Is too much motive too restricting?


What do you think?

As Dagr88 points out, not all dialogue options are choices -- this means they lead to results: accepting a quest, telling a companion to ****** off, starting a romance, etc.

Motivation is all well and good, but there isn't a motivation behind every single thing that comes out of someone's mouth, unless there is an overarching goal of "I have to make this person love/hate me, so I will respond in this way."

If Warden tells Alistair to stop being so whiny about Duncan's death, there is no motive there, it's just him being a ******.

[TheJediSaint]

Character motivation in CRPGs always struck me as something that belongs in the realm of "head cannon", and is best expressed through the player character's actions rather than words.

[cJohnOne]

TheJediSaint wrote...

Character motivation in CRPGs always struck me as something that belongs in the realm of "head cannon", and is best expressed through the player character's actions rather than words.

Yes that was what I was getting at.  Should the Character's motivation be head cannnonned or should they give you more motivation in dialogue.

If my character is being good.  I can roleplay a good character easier if the dialogue relects that.  I'm not quite sure how that connects to my motivation to play but it does.

[cJohnOne]

Maybe it's a personal thing but I find being good to be a postive motivation for playing an cRPG .

[RedWulfi]

If you choose to be diplomatic, sarcastic or a jerk it only really leaves you with 1 option.
I want to be able to pick an option that doesnt effect my character's personality :/

[cJohnOne]

AndersIsLush wrote...

If you choose to be diplomatic, sarcastic or a jerk it only really leaves you with 1 option.
I want to be able to pick an option that doesnt effect my character's personality :/

That's pretty much opposite of what I was proposing ha ha.  Why don't you want them to have personalities given to you?

[Auintus]

I don't think tone should affect your choices. I should be able to sarcastically refuse to help someone or aggressively agree. DA2 was pretty good at that, but had a few spots I didn't like.
Also, I like my persuasion checks to be tied to stats rather than tone.
I'd like a Origins-based dialogue system more, all and all. I felt like I should stick to one personality or another in DA2.

[cJohnOne]

Sure I basically choose one of the Dialogue choices(diplomatic,snarky or aggressive) and stick with it during whole game except on ocassion where another choices made sense to me. That's how I do it.

[Gallimatia]

There's no benefit to sticking to one option in DA2. You always have a dominant trait and all persuasion options tied to that is available. There's no blank Hawke that can't persuade. Even before you pick your first line Hawke is diplomatic.

[cJohnOne]

Gallimatia wrote...

There's no benefit to sticking to one option in DA2. You always have a dominant trait and all persuasion options tied to that is available. There's no blank Hawke that can't persuade. Even before you pick your first line Hawke is diplomatic.

Where do you get that Hawke is diplomatic before you pick him up.  It takes quite a while to get diplomatic persuades.

[Gallimatia]

Battle cries or console command runscript zz_per_debug (check/change/reset trait).

[Auintus]

Gallimatia wrote...

There's no benefit to sticking to one option in DA2. You always have a dominant trait and all persuasion options tied to that is available. There's no blank Hawke that can't persuade. Even before you pick your first line Hawke is diplomatic.

Only a purple hawke can convince the templars in Act of Mercy that you helped them without Varric. A purple Hawke cannot motivate the guards in Raiders on the Cliffs. Only a red Hawke can intimidate the rock wraith, persuade the qunari in blackpowder promise. There are a few other instances too.
I think that's plenty of discrepancy compared to DAO when I put early skill points in coercion and told the Maker to stop breathing.

[cJohnOne]

I was thinking before I started this topic that it was a serious subject and therefore wasn't going to get that many looks. How did it do?

[cJohnOne]

Plaintiff wrote...

What counts as "good" and what counts as "bad"?

I imagine it's kind of random.  Things are just put into the catagory of good or bad or investigate in that type of system.