30 réponses à ce sujet

[Dasher1010]

Seriously. The old gods are the other elven gods. I'm calling it now. Also, he's the villain.

[The Elder King]

I don't care much about it (though it's an interesting theory) but in that case I really want to see Sebastian and Leliana's face after this "revelation" in-game.

Modifié par hhh89, 28 septembre 2012 - 05:30 .

[LPPrince]

And you start seeing Bad Wolf posted everywhere...

I MEAN DREAD WOLF

[EricHVela]

The "Black City" is a rift in the Fade. I'm calling it now. Also, it leads to where the demons and taint originate.

What? This isn't one of those let's make wild theories threads?

[Taboo]

BLAIDD DRWG! BLAIDD DRWG!

[Heimdall]

Nice theory, but I doubt it will ever be confirmed or at all relevant. I'm under the impression that the devs want to keep the truth of the theology ambiguous.

[Plaintiff]

So many games have already used this "surprise" ending that it would actually be more original if Bioware just never confirmed the existence of any deities at all.

[cindercatz]

There are already spirits and demons and the fade. I think the question is less "Do they exist?" and more "Are they really dieties? Who can say? What other stuff is out there?"

Dasher1010 wrote...

Seriously. The old gods are the other elven gods. I'm calling it now. Also, he's the villain.

I think you're correct, except I don't know about the Old Gods part. Weren't they worshipped concurrently by other human tribes at the time?? I also think Arlathan (or whichever name, the Elvhen city where they would sleep for centuries in the fade, live forever, in their mythology) is the Golden City. When the Tevinter Empirium invaded and ransacked it, cutting off the elves trapped in the fade and probably more, that's the origin of the Black City (which is always there in the fade), and the Darkspawn.
Also seriously.

So it's all down to expansionist politics.
Either way, I hope they keep it under wraps with breadcrumb reveals for a while, so that the existing religions can kind of keep challenging each other for another game or two.

Modifié par cindercatz, 28 septembre 2012 - 06:05 .

[Aulis Vaara]

ReggarBlane wrote...

The "Black City" is a rift in the Fade. I'm calling it now. Also, it leads to where the demons and taint originate.

What? This isn't one of those let's make wild theories threads?

The taint is unknown to the demons, so they do not come from the same place.

Other than that, while it's not confirmed there have been hints that the Black City does indeed lie beyond the Fade. The most important of which: Morrigan has opened a portal to beyond the Fade in Witch Hunt.

So, not so much a "wild" theory.

[Dintonta]

ReggarBlane wrote...

The "Black City" is a rift in the Fade. I'm calling it now. Also, it leads to where the demons and taint originate.

What? This isn't one of those let's make wild theories threads?

Exactly!
I also think that Maker = Dread Wolf. I wrote it at the end of this post : Are we ever going to get some answers to these big questions?

With a few helpful posters we were exploring some interesting hypothesis about the secret of the whole DAverse and, to make it short (you wouldn't want it long anyway), we concluded that even kidnapping Mr Gaider would probably not give us any meaningful answer...

Modifié par Dintonta, 28 septembre 2012 - 06:16 .

[Aulis Vaara]

Plaintiff wrote...

So many games have already used this "surprise" ending that it would actually be more original if Bioware just never confirmed the existence of any deities at all.

Such as?

[CELL55]

This again?
The Maker is the Dread Wolf.
The Maker is Flemeth.
The Maker is the Blight.
The Maker is Sandal.
The Maker is the Catalyst.
The Maker is Guybrush Threepwood.

This is all wild speculation, and I've heard it all before.

[Plaintiff]

Aulis Vaara wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

So many games have already used this "surprise" ending that it would actually be more original if Bioware just never confirmed the existence of any deities at all.

Such as?

Here's a list.

Haha, look at that. Dragon Age is already on it.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 28 septembre 2012 - 07:04 .

[WardenWade]

I too sort of like the idea of the different pantheons butting heads. I like to imagine all beliefs are true at this point.  Incidentally this reminds me that Gray Wardens literally hold the wrath of god within them...hm.

Modifié par WardenWade, 28 septembre 2012 - 07:33 .

[cindercatz]

WardenWade wrote...

I too sort of like the idea of the different pantheons butting heads. I like to imagine all beliefs are true at this point.  Incidentally this reminds me that Gray Wardens literally hold the wrath of god within them...hm.

Who says they're not? If this is correct, it just means that all the religions are incorrectly referrencing the same true characters and events. They've just all got the details wrong and personal bias about who's good and evil.

edit: And then once this is resolved, there's the mystery of where they came from and how any surviving entities respond.

I still hope they draw it out though.

Modifié par cindercatz, 28 septembre 2012 - 07:38 .

[WardenWade]

cindercatz wrote...

WardenWade wrote...

I too sort of like the idea of the different pantheons butting heads. I like to imagine all beliefs are true at this point.  Incidentally this reminds me that Gray Wardens literally hold the wrath of god within them...hm.

Who says they're not? If this is correct, it just means that all the religions are incorrectly referrencing the same true characters and events. They've just all got the details wrong and personal bias about who's good and evil.

edit: And then once this is resolved, there's the mystery of where they came from and how any surviving entities respond.

I still hope they draw it out though.

This certainly seems possible to me too, cindercatz, that each group would be willing to see the same events through their own individual lens but not necessarily accept a different interpretation of the same.  What if everyone is right? 

It reminds me of how, for example, if you
*POSSIBLE SPOILER*
bring Leliana with you to rescue Deygan the hunter, she suggests that the Dalish just have a different way to seeing the Maker, by way of the Creators.  She too is putting her own stamp on the experience but it seems to me to be a similar sentiment. 

I too would be both interested to learn more about the various deities in Thedas, and also enjoy the vagueness surrounding religion and spirituality in general in DA

Modifié par WardenWade, 28 septembre 2012 - 07:51 .

[SamaraDraven]

I have said it before and I'll say it again: I think the gods of all the religions are the same group of beings posing as specific gods or groups of gods to various primitive peoples. Then came the day one of them wanted the total adoration of the populations of Thedas. There were nine Evhen gods and three Avvar but seven Old Gods and one Maker. I think there were either three beings or nine beings broken into groups of three and one of them, the "Maker" coveted having greater power than the others. So he tricked the them, as in the Dread Wolf story, and locked seven of them away - one escaped. The others began speaking to the magisters through the Fade, trying to convince the mages to free them. The Maker then booby trapped the golden city and when those magisters arrived, they were cursed. The "Maker", thinking this would take care of any who worshiped the Old Gods used the curse to his advantage and mankind has been waging war in his name ever since. Buuuuut... the tainted ones still search for their gods and in so doing, make them tainted too. Once they're destroyed by the Wardens - and how do you suppose any Thedosian figured out how to do that - the god is gone forever. Flemeth has been working to save her fellows Old Gods, by any means, all the while because she's the only other one who was left on Thedas.

This is my theory. Of course the hypothesis holds up better if there were nine beings instead of only three. I do think Flemeth is one of these beings though and that she's trying to do something. What that is, I'm unsure.

If there were only three beings, my theory is: One was the Maker, who was once posing as the Avvar lords before reinventing himself as a singular god. One was Flemeth, posing as the Dalish pantheon. The last was posing as the nine dragon gods in Tevinter. This god and Flemeth angered the "Maker" when she took the dragon god for a lover and their combined power left the Maker feeling threatened. So he tricked them and locked them away but Flemeth escaped eventually. As a kicker, I posit that Andraste was her daughter and the Maker took advantage of Flemeth's absence to turn her against her in a cruel ploy. What better revenge than to have the child of your enemies destroying their parent's kingdom? Also, the nine Old Gods could have been a form the dragon lord took when corporeal and thus he was vulnerable to being captured and buried as the nine dragons. Flemeth has been trying to free each facet of him but has thus far, failed. Unless Morrigan's OGB plan succeeded. Meanwhile, mankind - tainted and not - have been marching against her. The Maker made the taint as a punishment but once that piece of the dragon god is tainted, it can be destroyed by a warden. Hence why she wanted to help the warden stop the Blight but had Morrigan offer a way to avoid the ultimate sacrifice and in so doing, save a piece of the dragon god. Maybe there is no love triangle and Flemeth just wants the power... but given the legends about her angry husband and what not,I wonder if there's something to it. She did say "after everything the world had done" to her, it should be grateful she cared to help at all. Makes it sound like she's been royally screwed over. doesn't it?

[WardenWade]

sjpelkessjpeler wrote...

WardenWade wrote...

cindercatz wrote...

WardenWade wrote...

I too sort of like the idea of the different pantheons butting heads. I like to imagine all beliefs are true at this point.  Incidentally this reminds me that Gray Wardens literally hold the wrath of god within them...hm.

Who says they're not? If this is correct, it just means that all the religions are incorrectly referrencing the same true characters and events. They've just all got the details wrong and personal bias about who's good and evil.

edit: And then once this is resolved, there's the mystery of where they came from and how any surviving entities respond.

I still hope they draw it out though.

This certainly seems possible to me too, cindercatz, that each group would be willing to see the same events through their own individual lens but not necessarily accept a different interpretation of the same.  What if everyone is right? 

It reminds me of how, for example, if you
*POSSIBLE SPOILER*
bring Leliana with you to rescue Deygan the hunter, she suggests that the Dalish just have a different way to seeing the Maker, by way of the Creators.  She too is putting her own stamp on the experience but it seems to me to be a similar sentiment. 

I too would be both interested to learn more about the various deities in Thedas, and also enjoy the vagueness surrounding religion and spirituality in general in DA

Yup, agree with both of you on that.

A lot of things are the same but told from a different perspective and different names for the same deity. Flemeth is one example for that.

Also the elves where the first inhabitants of Thedas and the humans came much later..If the deities were able to contact them all before they were 'locked away' in their prisons who knows which one approached them and what did s/he tell them?

That's a great point!  It could have been anything.  That reminds me quite a bit of what you hear from...

*SPOILER*

Corypheus regarding Dumat luring the original Tevinter magisters to the Black City.  And in general I got the impression from speaking to the Dalish that the Creators were felt--at least back in the days of Arlathan--to have been very present and in close contact with the lives of the elves. 

Modifié par WardenWade, 28 septembre 2012 - 08:39 .

[whykikyouwhy]

CELL55 wrote...

This again?
The Maker is the Dread Wolf.
The Maker is Flemeth.
The Maker is the Blight.
The Maker is Sandal.
The Maker is the Catalyst.
The Maker is Guybrush Threepwood.

This is all wild speculation, and I've heard it all before.

Don't forget "The Maker is a piñata." :happy:

I'm quite fond of the wild variety of speculation, actually.

[mousestalker]

It's really simple: The Maker is Sandal who is Flemeth who is Schmooples who is the Maker who is a pinata (or pianoforte on Wednesdays)

[joshko]

CELL55 wrote...

This again?
The Maker is the Dread Wolf.
The Maker is Flemeth.
The Maker is the Blight.
The Maker is Sandal.
The Maker is the Catalyst.
The Maker is Guybrush Threepwood.

This is all wild speculation, and I've heard it all before.

Oh my God! I would love it if Guybrush Threepwood were The Maker! I can just imagin meeting him in game...

[Dintonta]

mousestalker wrote...

It's really simple: The Maker is Sandal who is Flemeth who is Schmooples who is the Maker who is a pinata (or pianoforte on Wednesdays)

That, at least, was obvious!