Or how I know DA3 can be good.
Works of art in general are like good interviewers: they pull out from you ideas, feelings and attitudes that perhaps you didn't know were there. A key concept here is that they don't tell you what your attitude or your idea should be: instead, they expose you to a situation that makes those ideas come up. They don't ask you a question - they set things up to make you ask yourself a question. People sometimes say that you're reading too much into a painting or a photograph. . But it isn't only about the explicit content of the painting, but what it says to you, how your mind interacts with it and what comes out as a result. This is the surreptitious way in which great fiction moves us and, imho, its defining characteristic.
The type of questions addressed in the end of Awakening are the traditional "big existential questions" concerning just what we're doing here, our place with respect to God, and our place with respect to others. This tradition goes as far back as biblical times ("am I my brother's keeper?"), and continues throughout history to this day. Let me go into detail...
The Architect has found a way to liberate the darkspawn from the old gods' control, so they can know be free to pursue whatever they want to do with their lives. By giving them free will, the Architect turns the certainty of the darkspawn god into something equivalent to what the Maker is to Andrastians: an article of faith, something you can choose to follow but no longer something you can know. Which is the way it should be because that means you are responsible for your actions and you get to choose your fate.
And this is exactly why the Mother despises the Architect, because he disconnected a people from their god, and therefore from every potentially successful way to find inherent purpose or meaning. This is classic existential angst. They used to exist for a reason, they used to see it just so clearly, and it all made sense. The Mother describes it as beautiful music, and maintains the Architect was blind to its beauty, and wanted to make everybody else blind as well... deny them the chance to have true, inherent meaning to their existence.
Notice how she doesn't go into a boring rant to explain the differences between philosophical stances. Instead, she conveys directly this existential anguish through that heartrending "The silence! The dreadful silence!"
So these are the type of questions posed by the game at the end. Just what is your purpose here? Where do you belong, if anywhere? Are you alone or not? Should you follow a god? What if it's an evil god? If you could have certainty, would you refuse it? etc. It's the opposite viewpoints of the Architect and the Mother, conveyed through their attitudes (not through expository, lenghty explanations - I can't overstate the importance of this!) that leads the gamer to all these ideas.
We have talked on the boards about how to handle maturity and so on. I sustain Awakening is in form and content up there with all the great novels and movies that are commonly considered fine art. For this reason I think despite the blow they took with the last game, the DA3 team, particularly the writing team, should continue being confident and daring because they have it in them to create something great.
The Awakening ending is a great piece of fiction.
Débuté par
Guest_Nyoka_*
, sept. 29 2012 03:59
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#2
Posté 29 septembre 2012 - 04:07
PsychoBlonde
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And here I thought you were going to be complaining that DA2 mostly ignores any of the results you could get in the Awakening epilogues. Which is true.
To date I've only finished Awakening once, and it's interesting conceptually but I wouldn't consider it to be fundamentally any better than the rest of the series. It certainly wasn't anywhere like as good as the big Broodmother encounter in Origins--granted, that came at the end if the Interminable Deep Roads which a lot of people said were "too long". The exposition around Branka's behavior and plans was superb.
There are lots of great moments you can point out in the games. Merrill's confrontation with the Keeper was at least as good--so was Varric's confrontation with his brother.
I'm not sure you've added anything substantial to the discussion, here.
To date I've only finished Awakening once, and it's interesting conceptually but I wouldn't consider it to be fundamentally any better than the rest of the series. It certainly wasn't anywhere like as good as the big Broodmother encounter in Origins--granted, that came at the end if the Interminable Deep Roads which a lot of people said were "too long". The exposition around Branka's behavior and plans was superb.
There are lots of great moments you can point out in the games. Merrill's confrontation with the Keeper was at least as good--so was Varric's confrontation with his brother.
I'm not sure you've added anything substantial to the discussion, here.
#3
Posté 29 septembre 2012 - 07:42
Zjarcal
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Heh, this goes to show how different our opinions can be (ME3 and this).
I find Awakening to be such a weak part of the Dragon Age series overall and I rellay can't say I found anything great about the ending myself. The Architect's plan was nice and all but it wasn't a "oooooh, this is so awesome" moment for me, and the Mother... lol, the Mother was a joke.
I find Awakening to be such a weak part of the Dragon Age series overall and I rellay can't say I found anything great about the ending myself. The Architect's plan was nice and all but it wasn't a "oooooh, this is so awesome" moment for me, and the Mother... lol, the Mother was a joke.
#4
Posté 29 septembre 2012 - 07:45
mousestalker
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I enjoyed the Mother, but I have a fondness for over the top scenery chewing villains. It would be kind of neat if the next big bad we see actually does foam at the mouth. They implied it for Mother, Meredith and Orsino, but a frothy evildoer would be gratifying.
#5
Guest_Cthulhu42_*
Posté 29 septembre 2012 - 07:50
Guest_Cthulhu42_*
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I really liked the Architect, but I found the rest of Awakening pretty "meh".
#6
Posté 29 septembre 2012 - 09:10
TEWR
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Awakening had a good story, but it suffered from not really giving the Architect enough screen time and the very short nature of it. Along with not giving the companions a whole deal of screen time either, though I did enjoy them all the same.
It's definitely a fun expansion for me, but I don't think it was what it could've been. So "meh" is definitely an apt description of it.
It's fun, the storyline is good (though doesn't feel very complete), and the companions are great.
Really, had there been more time devoted to it then it would've been better.
It's definitely a fun expansion for me, but I don't think it was what it could've been. So "meh" is definitely an apt description of it.
It's fun, the storyline is good (though doesn't feel very complete), and the companions are great.
Really, had there been more time devoted to it then it would've been better.
#7
Posté 29 septembre 2012 - 09:21
Dave of Canada
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I loved what Awakening did with the storyline simply because it humanized the monsterous Darkspawn, you could relate to the unrelatable and adding goals and motives to them other than "blightlol" was great.
However, it suffered greatly by the Architect just... being there, not really having much presence in the game's overall story (despite being involved in the majority of it). Being the true "antagonist", The Architect should've had more to say and do with the plot, rather than say... The Mother taking the spotlight of it.
Unlike say, the Archdemon and Loghain in Origins. The Archdemon loomed over the entire storyline but Loghain was the crucial part of it, his involvement in everything was clear and we met with him before the Landsmeet. The Landsmeet was amazing not only because of the content of the scene but the build-up leading to it.
The Architect's meeting scene didn't have the same feel, something I'd like to think is due to the expansion pack nature of Awakening.
However, it suffered greatly by the Architect just... being there, not really having much presence in the game's overall story (despite being involved in the majority of it). Being the true "antagonist", The Architect should've had more to say and do with the plot, rather than say... The Mother taking the spotlight of it.
Unlike say, the Archdemon and Loghain in Origins. The Archdemon loomed over the entire storyline but Loghain was the crucial part of it, his involvement in everything was clear and we met with him before the Landsmeet. The Landsmeet was amazing not only because of the content of the scene but the build-up leading to it.
The Architect's meeting scene didn't have the same feel, something I'd like to think is due to the expansion pack nature of Awakening.
#8
Posté 29 septembre 2012 - 09:27
Darth Death
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A shame it wasn't extended upon other than Awakening.Dave of Canada wrote...
I loved what Awakening did with the storyline simply because it humanized the monsterous Darkspawn, you could relate to the unrelatable and adding goals and motives to them other than "blightlol" was great.
#9
Posté 29 septembre 2012 - 09:31
Bullets McDeath
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OP, you obviously thought alot about this. Way more than me, to be precise... I really enjoy your analysis and explanation of the underlying themes. I also agree with Ethereal Writer, the story would have been better served if the Architect had more screen time. I never felt really caught up enough in the conflict to give it much more thought than "all darkspawn die, the talking ones too, yes."
Your write-up of the Mother though, I think is a bit forgiving. She felt like about as deep as Rita Repulsa. I agree that a "this is why I do what I do" speech from her would have been unacceptable; another reason we needed some more time spent on the Architext to truly understand what their conflict was all about.
Your write-up of the Mother though, I think is a bit forgiving. She felt like about as deep as Rita Repulsa. I agree that a "this is why I do what I do" speech from her would have been unacceptable; another reason we needed some more time spent on the Architext to truly understand what their conflict was all about.
#10
Guest_Nyoka_*
Posté 30 septembre 2012 - 02:02
Guest_Nyoka_*
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I like that the Mother is more than she looks. Yes, she's crazy and evil and has many ******. Nevertheless, that line, "The silence, the dreadful silence!" made it for me. It gave away all the complexity of the situation, triggered the same kinds of questions scholars address after reading The Brothers Karamazov or watching La Strada. That's the level I consider this part of the game is at. Talk about mature themes in videogames... In fact, something like the character of Zampano is what the mother fears they will become as a result of the Architect's plan. Alone and lost.
Thanks for your thoughts everyone
Thanks for your thoughts everyone
Modifié par Nyoka, 30 septembre 2012 - 02:11 .
#11
Posté 30 septembre 2012 - 02:17
GodWood
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I too enjoyed Awakening quite a lot.
