388 réponses à ce sujet

[Maria Caliban]

garrusfan1 wrote...

Godwood I meant Aveline was too much because it seemed they tried to make her a man and it is hard to explain it felt artificial I don't know

Dear BioWare,

Please don't give us adventurous, crude, and overly sexy women like Isabela. Please don't give us practical, tight-ass, and plain looking women like Aveline.

Give us magical dragon women who spend the majority of the game unconscious, who are pretty but virginal, and who don't have enough personality to have any personal flaws or opinions we might not agree with.

[CELL55]

Personally, I think that the clothes should fit the character, the role, and the universe.

Character: Morrigan would have no business regularly wandering around in Chantry robes.
Role: No one who frequently gets into firefights and is planning on going into a suicide mission should be wearing a leather strip as an impromptu bra. (Looking at you, Jack!)
Universe: Merill should not be wearing a spacesuit, and Wrex should not be wearing full plate mail. (Although that would be incredibly awesome )

FURTHER EXAMPLES.:
I think Isabella's outfit was fine, because a pirate whose role is to be agile needs to not be hampered by wearing a whole lot. Granted she took this pretty far, but pants are overrated, so I'll let it slide.

Morrigan's outfit was fine, because if everyone was doing their job, she should never have ended up in melee combat anyway. Also she was raised in the woods, so what clothing she did have was likely scavenged and thus understandably threadbare.

I'm not really sure why Samara bothered showing so much cleavage, there was certainly nothing that I saw in her character that would justify her using her attractiveness offensively.

Miranda's outfit had a bullet-resistant weave or whatever in it, so it granted protection. Not as much as full armor, but she (a) is a caster/techie. and thus should be avoiding the heaviest fire anyway ( would definately use her attractiveness as a weapon, so making it snug in all the right places is justified, IMO.

[KiwiQuiche]

ademska wrote...

M2S SOLID JOSH wrote...

isnt the point to dress like that was to use it as a weapon? forgot the exact qoute but sex whether seeing a girl half naked of actual sex can always be used as a weapon.

i'm sure saskia and every other scantily-clad close-quarters combat fighter appreciates this addition to their arsenal.

i bet it's just as effective as actual weapons.

Oh please, who needs armour, swords and shields when you have sex appeal?

[Lithuasil]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Oh please, who needs armour, swords and shields when you have sex appeal?

Only those people who didn't get the memo that arrows lodged in your flesh disappear after thirty seconds 

[KiwiQuiche]

Lithuasil wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Oh please, who needs armour, swords and shields when you have sex appeal?

Only those people who didn't get the memo that arrows lodged in your flesh disappear after thirty seconds 

The silicon boobs absorb 30% of long ranged attacks! Liposuction reduces physical damage by 10%! Botox causes 15% spirital damage!

Or something along those lines.

[Plaintiff]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

ademska wrote...

M2S SOLID JOSH wrote...

isnt the point to dress like that was to use it as a weapon? forgot the exact qoute but sex whether seeing a girl half naked of actual sex can always be used as a weapon.

i'm sure saskia and every other scantily-clad close-quarters combat fighter appreciates this addition to their arsenal.

i bet it's just as effective as actual weapons.

Oh please, who needs armour, swords and shields when you have sex appeal?

Don't laugh, it worked in Dragon Quest VIII.

[Eveangaline]

garrusfan1 wrote...

Godwood I meant Aveline was too much because it seemed they tried to make her a man and it is hard to explain it felt artificial I don't know

But she acted nothing like a man...

[AtreiyaN7]

*sigh* Why do I even read these threads? And that's a rhetorical question (I'm bored while waiting in a queue).

[Foolsfolly]

Eveangaline wrote...

garrusfan1 wrote...

Godwood I meant Aveline was too much because it seemed they tried to make her a man and it is hard to explain it felt artificial I don't know

But she acted nothing like a man...

I can only guess what garrusfan1 meant.

Implications unpleasant.

[thats1evildude]

We should just have an all-zombie party. No unfortunate implications, just flesh-eating.

[thats1evildude]

Filament wrote...

Until you find out your character's not really a zombie at all, but you already romanced one of the zombies.

And Then John Was Not A Zombie?

Actually, I'm sure that people could find some way to complain about those too. The female zombies not looking as rotted as the male zombies, for example.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 30 septembre 2012 - 06:11 .

[Chromie]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Give us women who don't have enough personality to have any personal flaws or opinions we might not agree with.

They've already been doing that.

[hadrain77]

garrusfan1 wrote...

hadrain77 wrote...

Someone didn't enter the harpy cave or missed Saskia's dream, she may have had armour on but her characterization is nothing compared to Miranda.

Uh what 

If I had to choose from the women of mass effect and Saskia, I'd pick the women of mass effect over a freaky dragon chick who's into gangbangs with dwarves.

[Iron Star]

hadrain77 wrote...

garrusfan1 wrote...

hadrain77 wrote...

Someone didn't enter the harpy cave or missed Saskia's dream, she may have had armour on but her characterization is nothing compared to Miranda.

Uh what 

If I had to choose from the women of mass effect and Saskia, I'd pick the women of mass effect over a freaky dragon chick who's into gangbangs with dwarves.

That one was just a joke by CDPR, not intended to be "official".

[Cyonan]

I think it depends on the character.

They did do a good job of it in DA2. It makes sense for somebody like Isabela to dress a little more suggestively, while it makes sense for Aveline to be in full plate armour.

The character's dress should match their personality. If their personality suggests that they would dress suggestively even in combat, then they should do so.

[Hey]

CELL55 wrote...

Personally, I think that the clothes should fit the character, the role, and the universe.

i agree with this.  I'm certainly not allergic to some skin but it should make sense.  If it does its really a win win for me.

[David Gaider]

I'm personally rather pleased with how the DA Art team approaches our female character design. I couldn't really care less whether someone thinks Aveline is too mannish or Isabela too sexy-- their appearance suited their characters and their roles, and as long as there's a spectrum of representation in what we're showing I'm pretty happy with it.

[Maria Caliban]

Skelter192 wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Give us women who don't have enough personality to have any personal flaws or opinions we might not agree with.

They've already been doing that.

Aveline has a stick up her ****, Isabela is self-centered, Merrill is obsessed with a magical mirror that will magically help her people, Morrigan has serious trust issues, and Leliana thinks God sends her PMs via rosebushes.

We can debate how serious these flaws are or whether the good parts of their personality outweigh them, but they're there.

[jkflipflopDAO]

They've all been really good I think. The only female outfit I can recall that didn't make much sense was Morrigan's default outfits when you first meet her. Sure, she's a mage and doesn't need armor or anything, but she's living in a swamp full of brush and thorns and bugs. . . she should be wearing a flannel shirt not walking around with a tiny bolt of silk over her nips.

[Cyonan]

David Gaider wrote...

I'm personally rather pleased with how the DA Art team approaches our female character design. I couldn't really care less whether someone thinks Aveline is too mannish or Isabela too sexy-- their appearance suited their characters and their roles, and as long as there's a spectrum of representation in what we're showing I'm pretty happy with it.

I'm really glad to hear the DA team is sticking with that approach.

I've always loved how the characters look in Dragon Age. Somebody who is wearing something sexy isn't just doing it to be eye candy, but because their character acts in a way that makes you think someone like that will probably wear something sexy.

Aveline might not win a sex appeal contest against Isabela with how she dresses, but I don't think I could take her seriously if she could =P

[oui_je_danse]

RosaAquafire wrote...

Skelter192 wrote...
I don't venture into the DA forums much  so I wouldn't know and if there is any character that screams "sex object" it's Isabella. 

Because I apparently never get tired of making this point:

I'm 100% anti objectification of women in games and one would probably disdainfully call me a "radical feminist," but I think that Isabela is a HUGE step forward and an extremely progressive character.

1. She's not just busty, she's thick. She has big thighs and a bootlicious, curvy figure that's more in line with plus sized models than with implants. Keep in mind she wears a corset. Different body types is awesome and good.

2. She's sex positive and fiercely independant. A romanced Isabela is never "tamed," and she's possibly the first sexy video game female who's treated primarily as a character. It's extremely empowering to see a female character who loves sex. She has banters where she states that she frequently gets called slurs for it but doesn't give a crap because she knows who she is and loves who she is. That's not sex object, that's fierce.

3. She's a woman of colour, and it's awesome seeing important, plot central, "default love interest" women who aren't white. (Less awesome is how official CG renders and marketting whitewashed her like hell.)

4. ISABELA dresses in a corset and tunic and no pants. What do I mean? I mean that BIOWARE didn't dress Isabela that way, unlike Samara or Miranda or even Morrigan, though that one is debatable. I fully believe that Isabela wakes up in the morning and decides that she's going to wear that and she loves wearing it. She's one of the few "sexy" female characters who I actually BELIEVE chooses to wear those clothes, and that's awesome.

Short version, sexy, sensual, busty women exist in the real world. Unforunately, most sexy, sensual, busty women in games aren't fully formed, well thought out characters, but sex dolls posed and designed for the male gaze. If Bioware writes a sexy, sensual, busty character who is an actual character, where the sexy, sensual, busty stuff comes from somewhere and is a PART of her and then actually explores self-worth and indepedence and sex positivity in dialogue, that's not a sex object. That's awesome.

^^ All of this.

Characters with Isabela's sense of adventure, confidence and independence are almost exclusively men. That Hawke can't "cure" her of being so "****ty" by romancing her, as many people on the internet bemoan, is a huge bonus.

Dragon Age and Mass Effect games are made by two different BioWare studios. Considering how much the Edmonton team improved from DA:O to DA2 in terms of female characters, I'm confident they're on the right trajectory.

I'd like to close with my favorite Isabela dialogue...


Aveline: How are you so successful with men? You're not that pretty.
Isabela: Cast a wide enough net, and you're bound to catch something.
Aveline: (Laughs) At least you're willing to admit it.
Isabela: Trust me. I've heard, "Get away from me, you pirate hag!" more times than I care to count.
Aveline: Doesn't that bother you?

Isabela: Why should it? They don't know me. I know me.

[Patchwork]

RosaAquafire wrote...

4. ISABELA dresses in a corset and tunic and no pants. What do I mean? I mean that BIOWARE didn't dress Isabela that way, unlike Samara or Miranda or even Morrigan, though that one is debatable. I fully believe that Isabela wakes up in the morning and decides that she's going to wear that and she loves wearing it. She's one of the few "sexy" female characters who I actually BELIEVE chooses to wear those clothes, and that's awesome.

I agree with everything you wrote but this bit in particular I wanted to respond to. My own sensibilities want her to wear pants because I have no desire to see her thong every time she does a rogue super jump but Isabela would laugh at my "prudishness". That outfit is something organic to the character Isabela. Contrast it with Ashley's ME3 make-over which is so at odds with how she's written it's obvious she's been sexed up for the sake of T&A.

Jack's visable nipples, EDI's bizarre camel-toe, the sexist remarks from the crew etc have made me weary of a Bioware game despite DA2 doing a good job of writing AND designing a varity of female characters.

[sylvanaerie]

David Gaider wrote...

I'm personally rather pleased with how the DA Art team approaches our female character design. I couldn't really care less whether someone thinks Aveline is too mannish or Isabela too sexy-- their appearance suited their characters and their roles, and as long as there's a spectrum of representation in what we're showing I'm pretty happy with it.

THANK GOD!  I love the approach the DA team takes to their character design!  One of the reasons I enjoy playing it, is that not every female warrior has silicon size DD boobs, and dressed like a hooker on the corner of Bourbon Street!  I liked the vanilla design of the companions (mostly, I still hated Anders' greasy look, but that was more about his face than his attire) enough for a half dozen playthroughs before seeking Nexus mods for a change of pace to freshen up my game.