29 réponses à ce sujet

[xsamplexample]

 i loved how in Fallout and ES:O they let you attack, say, a guard in town, and you could kill him and incite a riot.  any town, at any point in the game.  Added a lot of immersion for me.  

also, DA3 needs:
-large item list, with varying effects.  
-complex skill trees.
-Choices that matter/past choices coming back up

[Nashimura]

If you want to do that then play fallout or Oblivion or another game like that - DA is not that kind of series.

[Hey]

its always funny when you do this and the 80 year old granny selling erbs brandishes a long sword or goes berserk with a sawed off. It's funny but it kind of becomes absurd pretty quick.

[Plaintiff]

You can't have choices that matter AND a world where everyone can be killed. The two are incompatible.

[upsettingshorts]

See.

[BouncyFrag]

This is a vid of all the violence and mayhem you could ever need from DA:O. If this doesn't sate your hunger for death and carnage, then may the Maker have mercy on your soul.
:innocent:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGDL-hXZt5Q

Modifié par BouncyFrag, 30 septembre 2012 - 08:06 .

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Plaintiff wrote...

You can't have choices that matter AND a world where everyone can be killed. The two are incompatible.

Sure you can. It's just not common in RPGs.

Modifié par CrustyBot, 30 septembre 2012 - 08:31 .

[Plaintiff]

CrustyBot wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

You can't have choices that matter AND a world where everyone can be killed. The two are incompatible.

Sure you can. It's just not common in RPGs.

So where in videogames does it happen? What are the plots? How do they work?

[Maria Caliban]

Plaintiff wrote...

You can't have choices that matter AND a world where everyone can be killed. The two are incompatible.

I'm going to disagree. Killing off a quest NPC becomes a 'choice that matters' because it destroys the quest.

Plaintiff wrote...

So where in videogames does it happen? What are the plots? How do they work?

Morrowind. Save the world from evil. You kill Vivec and you doom the island you're living on.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 30 septembre 2012 - 08:39 .

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Plaintiff wrote...

CrustyBot wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

You can't have choices that matter AND a world where everyone can be killed. The two are incompatible.

Sure you can. It's just not common in RPGs.

So where in videogames does it happen? What are the plots? How do they work?

Oh, there are examples in RPGs. I just meant that as a whole, it's not common. Not sure about other genres.

Fallout: New Vegas is but a recent example.

[LilyasAvalon]

Go play Fallout and Oblivion then. =/

Seriously, why in Andraste's name should we be given the ability to kill whomever we please, whenever we please? This isn't an open world game.

[Plaintiff]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

You can't have choices that matter AND a world where everyone can be killed. The two are incompatible.

I'm going to disagree. Killing off a quest NPC becomes a 'choice that matters' because it destroys the quest.

Oh, well sure, but if you kill a character who's absolutely plot-critical, then what? Game Over? Or do you have the freedom to continue on in the world you just doomed?

That could be a feasible option if Dragon Age was an open-world game, where the main plot is short, and not even the point of the game, but that's not the case. The vast majority of the content in Bioware games is in the main story. If you can't continue it, then the game is essentially broken. If players don't want to continue the story, then why the hell are they playing?

[Bfler]

Yes and then people complain that they can't finish the quests, because an important NPC is dead.

[Little Princess Peach]

oblivion became a very empty place after i played it
forget kiling i want to jump off rooftops

[LilyasAvalon]

Tali-vas-normandy wrote...

oblivion became a very empty place after i played it
forget kiling i want to jump off rooftops

Assassin's Creed is a very nice game I hear.

[Maria Caliban]

Plaintiff wrote...

Oh, well sure, but if you kill a character who's absolutely plot-critical, then what? Game Over? Or do you have the freedom to continue on in the world you just doomed?

It depends on the game. Morrowind let you continue playing. IIRC Fallout had 'fail state' endings.

Plaintiff wrote...

That could be a feasible option if Dragon Age was an open-world game, where the main plot is short, and not even the point of the game, but that's not the case. The vast majority of the content in Bioware games is in the main story. If you can't continue it, then the game is essentially broken. If players don't want to continue the story, then why the hell are they playing?

Let me pause for a moment to watch you yank that goalpost up and dash across the field with it.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 30 septembre 2012 - 08:55 .

[Plaintiff]

Maria Caliban wrote...
Let me pause for a moment to watch you yank that goalpost up and dash across the field with it.

I'm not changing the goalposts. I just assumed that the debate was about Dragon Age and similar games.

You're basically saying "Bioware could implement this feature in Dragon Age if they changed every single thing about the series and made it into an Elder Scrolls clone"

If you have to scrap an entire project and rebuild it as a completely different type of game, just to include a feature, then that feature is not a feasible inclusion.

But if it satisfies you, I'll admit that my initial statement was, technically, wrong.

[Matchy Pointy]

If you want to do that, play an elder scrolls game. Dragon age have never been about letting you do anything you want like that, its been about telling a story with you in it, why make one game into another game? Isnt it better games differ from each other so its not like playing one game all the time no matter what it is?

Modifié par Matchy Pointy, 30 septembre 2012 - 09:07 .

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Plaintiff wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...
Let me pause for a moment to watch you yank that goalpost up and dash across the field with it.

I'm not changing the goalposts. I just assumed that the debate was about Dragon Age and similar games.

You're basically saying "Bioware could implement this feature in Dragon Age if they changed every single thing about the series and made it into an Elder Scrolls clone"

If you have to scrap an entire project and rebuild it as a completely different type of game, just to include a feature, then that feature is not a feasible inclusion.

But if it satisfies you, I'll admit that my initial statement was, technically, wrong.

Morrowind has a narrative that takes into account the player killing plot critical NPCs = The only way BioWare could do the same if they made Dragon Age an Elder Scrolls clone?

Modifié par CrustyBot, 30 septembre 2012 - 09:45 .

[sylvanaerie]

NO! The most memorable deaths I've experienced were accidental.

1) clicking on the trainer in Everquest with the wrong button got my character's happy ass slammed into the dirt in 2 seconds.

2) after playing horde for a while, I was in Tanaris and clicked the wrong flight master. My PC was dirtnapping in less time than it took for my EQ character when the flightmaster and 3 wyverns were finished with me.

So put me down for NO for random slaughter! Not that I think Bioware will do this, but still...NO!!

[Xewaka]

Maria Caliban wrote...
It depends on the game. Morrowind let you continue playing. IIRC Fallout had 'fail state' endings.

Actually, Fallout 3 had "critical characters" tagged as such and thus inmortal.

[Plaintiff]

CrustyBot wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...
Let me pause for a moment to watch you yank that goalpost up and dash across the field with it.

I'm not changing the goalposts. I just assumed that the debate was about Dragon Age and similar games.

You're basically saying "Bioware could implement this feature in Dragon Age if they changed every single thing about the series and made it into an Elder Scrolls clone"

If you have to scrap an entire project and rebuild it as a completely different type of game, just to include a feature, then that feature is not a feasible inclusion.

But if it satisfies you, I'll admit that my initial statement was, technically, wrong.

Morrowind has a narrative that takes into account the player killing plot critical NPCs = The only way BioWare could do the same if they made Dragon Age an Elder Scrolls clone?

Pretty much, at least as far as I'm concerned. The point of a Dragon Age game is to experience a lengthy story with some possible deviations. The point of an Elder Scrolls game is to explore a world, the main plot barely matters at all. You have the freedom to ignore it completely, and there's lots of other content to play, so if you kill an NPC and the main plot becomes unaccessible as a result (and I don't consider that "taking character death into account", personally), it's not a big deal. The same cannot be said of Dragon Age. If you kill a plot-critical NPC and can no longer continue the game, then the game ends. There's nothing else to do.

Maybe "clone" was the wrong word, since obviously there would still be differences between the two games, but the core of Dragon Age would be completely altered from its previous installments. It would be a different kind of game entirely.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 30 septembre 2012 - 09:29 .

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

If that's how you feel and that's what you see in BioWare/Bethesda games, fair enough. Just thought your original statement was ridiculous.

Modifié par CrustyBot, 30 septembre 2012 - 09:47 .

[Xewaka]

Upsettingshorts wrote...
See.

Now, to be completely thorough, one must say that Infinity Engine games also allowed this. It's not a case of only Bethesda.

Modifié par Xewaka, 30 septembre 2012 - 10:21 .

[xsamplexample]

it adds to the immersion.... If i hack away at some guy and nothing happens... how realistic is that?