286 réponses à ce sujet

[Aleya]

Do I want them to move on? Sure. But not with another character controlled by me. I'd forever be comparing the relationship to the one they had with the Warden. It wouldn't be fun, it'd be a headache.

Also, it's not going to happen. As Bioware has stated many times, romance is an extra. It's not of any real importance. No way are they going to lock out an entire character based on past romantic relationships.

[Emzamination]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

It's betrayal on her part because she proclaimed the warden the love her life.To move on to another is a blantant betrayal on an emotional level.

Is it a betrayal to the Warden, or a betrayal to Emazmination?

She would be betraying the warden by confessing her love for another as it makes what they shared no longer exclusive to those two characters thus cheapening it in the process.Some may be ok with having their LI passed around but I find it a bit revolting.

Edit: Jimmy makes a very good point - link

Modifié par Emzamination, 01 octobre 2012 - 04:08 .

[Emzamination]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

Should past Love interest be locked out in Da3 for saves with ultimate sacrifice wardens?

No.

Emzamination wrote...

That may no longer be an option.David has inadvertently solidified isabela's return. - Link

Her name is being revealed in the comics.

Pffft Isabela's past has been a mystery factor surrounding her character since origins. I highly doubt davids going to reveal that in a comic book. I request sources.

Modifié par Emzamination, 01 octobre 2012 - 03:40 .

[Emzamination]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

*comes into thread, reads the following*

Emzamination wrote...

Comics are in no way canon.

*facepalms*

They are canon. Just not strictly so. If you have a King Alistair save where Isabela wasn't handed over to the Arishok but she came back with the tome, then everything that happens in the comics is canon for that save.

For others, DA3 will (hopefully) change accordingly to reflect how the comics would've played out on those specific saves.

That's ridiculous.Novels are canon, not comics.

[legbamel]

I'd expect a person to move on after a decade alone but I'd rather they didn't spend the resources including something that's only going to work well for a few and cause massive rage in another few. If I romanced someone already I'd rather have someone new for the new me and if I chose not to romance them before why would I want to now?

The time and money would be better spent on new LIs altogether rather than trying to work around the seventeen different interpretations of any one pre-existing relationship, whether the Warden lived or died.

[Emzamination]

legbamel wrote...

I'd expect a person to move on after a decade alone but I'd rather they didn't spend the resources including something that's only going to work well for a few and cause massive rage in another few. If I romanced someone already I'd rather have someone new for the new me and if I chose not to romance them before why would I want to now?

The time and money would be better spent on new LIs altogether rather than trying to work around the seventeen different interpretations of any one pre-existing relationship, whether the Warden lived or died.

^ I'd rather this as well.Let the relationships be referenced and leave it at that.

[TEWR]

Emzamination wrote...

That's ridiculous.Novels are canon, not comics

The novel Asunder and the comics The Silent Grove/Those Who Speak operate under the same premise: If your save file happens to match up with how the events in the aforementioned DA related media pieces -- written by Gaider himself -- play out, then they are canon for that save.

If they don't match up, then DA3 will (hopefully) have dialogue/events/codexes/whatever else to illustrate how the novel Asunder and the comics would've happened, had the world-state Gaider chose to use been the same as yours -- meaning had Alistair been a Warden or if Shale was never recruited or if Wynne was killed.

So yeah, saying "LOL novels are canon, comics aren't" when the novel Asunder and the comics operate off of the same premise is just you ignoring the facts so it suits your own perceptions of what is canon and what isn't.

Especially when David Gaider has said the same thing, multiple times even.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 02 octobre 2012 - 05:06 .

[Emzamination]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

That's ridiculous.Novels are canon, not comics

The novel Asunder and the comics The Silent Grove/Those Who Speak operate under the same premise: If your save file happens to match up with how the events in the aforementioned DA related media pieces -- written by Gaider himself -- play out, then they are canon for that save.

If they don't match up, then DA3 will (hopefully) have dialogue/events/codexes/whatever else to illustrate how the novel Asunder and the comics would've happened, had the world-state Gaider chose to use been the same as yours -- meaning had Alistair been a Warden or if Shale was never recruited or if Wynne was killed.

So yeah, saying "LOL novels are canon, comics aren't" when the novel Asunder and the comics operate off of the same premise is just you ignoring the facts so it suits your own perceptions of what is canon and what isn't.

Especially when David Gaider has said the same thing, multiple times even.

No. The novels focus on actual events that happened pre Origins and post Da2 such as the orlesian occupation, the templars and circle of magi breaking off from the chantry,wynnes death, ect... These things are acknowledged in the Games. The comics however focus on a alternate universe non-canon quest of Alistair trying to find his father who no dragon age protagonist to date cares about.You're pushing your preconceptions as fact without proof.

Just because Gaider is writing it doesn't mean its going to appear as any type of canon in game.Da comics in the past had nothing to do with the game and this is no different, they never are - Link

Modifié par Emzamination, 02 octobre 2012 - 05:51 .

[Sable Rhapsody]

legbamel wrote...
I'd expect a person to move on after a decade alone but I'd rather they didn't spend the resources including something that's only going to work well for a few and cause massive rage in another few. If I romanced someone already I'd rather have someone new for the new me and if I chose not to romance them before why would I want to now?

This.  While I think it's unrealistic to expect your LI to go on a bender and never love again if your PC dies, it's also a giant can of worms that's just not worth the trouble.

Though having played several BioWare romances that involve dead exes, I would find it very funny to be the ****blocking dead ex for a change rather than the person on the receiving end.

[ThePuppetWithNoStrings]

In my opinion, if you love someone you want them to be happy, no matter what. If you’re dead and they find someone else who makes them happy, why wouldn’t you want that for them? It’s just selfish on your part otherwise. Having said all that, I don’t want any of the LIs – from Origins or 2 – to return. New love interests please (returning NPCs/companions who were not LIs in the previous games are all good though). If the old LIs from the two previous games return for cameos or quests, make sure their relationships with the Warden and Hawke are locked down and acknowledged in some way, dead Warden or no – no more crappy Zevran bugs, please!

[TEWR]

wynnes death

Wynne dies in Asunder only if she wasn't killed in Origins.

So yeah, your save has to match up with how Asunder plays out for that to happen. Otherwise, if she was killed in Origins then what's going to happen then?

Yeah, that'll more then likely be addressed in DA3. What the hell happens in Asunder if Wynne was killed in the Circle or in the Gauntlet?

She's got a built-in failsafe for why she might be there, sure. But that has to be expressly conveyed to us in DA3 as the result of her having had some influence on Asunder's events. Because as of right now, it's speculation/headcanon using what the game provides, but we're unsure of if it would hold true for DA3.

These things are acknowledged in the Games.

So is Maric's disappearance. Lost at sea, rumors of him being held in a prison, etc. The games make a point of mentioning these things... and the comics follow up on them.

Also, take note of how I specifically referred to Asunder in my post. I didn't mention The Calling or The Stolen Throne, nor did I use the word novels. I used the singular. I recognize that the prequel novels are canon. Asunder, however, only works with a certain save in mind -- one where the Circle was A) saved and Wynne wasn't killed at the Gauntlet and C) Shale was recruited.

Just because Gaider is writing it doesn't mean its going to appear as any type of canon in game

It does when he says it's canon for those specific save files. And that if the save file was different, then it would've happened differently and be referenced as such.

You're pushing your preconceptions as fact without proof.

Except for David Gaider's own statements on the matter.

But hey, if you want to say "It's not canon! Lalalalalaala" go ahead.

Da comics in the past had nothing to do with the game and this is no different, they never are

The wiki makes it a point to only include canon material as its main articles.

Are you going to say the Machinima detailing Kristoff's encounters with the Darkspawn during the Thaw of the Fifth Blight isn't canon either?

[Foolsfolly]

I agree with your general point, Writer but...

So is Maric's disappearance. Lost at sea, rumors of him being held in a prison, etc. The games make a point of mentioning these things... and the comics follow up on them.

I'm positive that was Word of God. Someone asked Gaider what happened to Maric and Gaider was like 'Oh, lost at sea. Was that not mentioned?' It had no baring on the story or any of the characters but I'm sure there's never been a reference to what happened to Maric in-game.

[TEWR]

[quote]Foolsfolly wrote...

I'm positive that was Word of God. Someone asked Gaider what happened to Maric and Gaider was like 'Oh, lost at sea. Was that not mentioned?' It had no baring on the story or any of the characters but I'm sure there's never been a reference to what happened to Maric in-game.[/quote]
It was Word of God, yes. However, one of the items from the DAII item packs referenced it. Maric's Helm, I think?

Yup, Maric's Helm.

[quote]King Maric Theirin, widely regarded as a hero by the Fereldan people for liberating the country from Orlesian rule, disappeared at sea while en route to Wycome in 9:25 Dragon. He was to attend a gathering of the Marcher lords in an attempt to forge a union in the north, and when he failed to appear, the Free Marches fell back into the petty squabbling that they are infamous for.

Teyrn Loghain spent almost two years searching for his lost friend, consuming much of the royal treasury and the majority of the Fereldan navy. The search was futile, and when Loghain claimed that Orlais had purposefully sunk King Maric's vessel in order to prevent Marcher unity, he was called off by his daughter, Queen Anora, and a united Bannorn. It was time to mourn the king, they said, and so, in 9:27, a massive state funeral was held in Denerim's chantry.

To this day, rumors insist that Maric is still alive, perhaps held in an Orlesian prison somewhere. The lasting mystique has increased the value of his personal possessions, leading to the theft of several artifacts from the royal palace. Among these was the helmet said to have been worn by a young Maric at the disastrous Battle of West Hill.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 02 octobre 2012 - 09:00 .

[Foolsfolly]

Ah. Never bought the DA2 items.

[KainD]

If past LI is going to be available I will have to go all the way back to DA:O and replay it without romancing them, and then I will have to replay DA2 with that imported save. I've already played both games quite some time knowing them very well, it would be a chore. So I hope that they are not available.

[KainD]

ThePuppetWithNoStrings wrote...

In my opinion, if you love someone you want them to be happy, no matter what. If you’re dead and they find someone else who makes them happy, why wouldn’t you want that for them? It’s just selfish on your part otherwise.

How about this.. I want to romance someone who would be happier alone than with another person. Also there is nothing but selfishness in love. 

[Knight of Dane]

Naive viewpoint. Love is at best non-defineable. If you love someone that means you care for them, if so you want the bast for them. If you don't, then it's obsession.

[Aolbain]

Emzamination wrote...

I'm torn on this subject...On one hand I want my LI to mourn my warden into old age and beyond never being able to love another again but on the other hand...I realize that maybe I'm being selfish and they should be able to possibly move on to find new happiness with the new protagonist should they appear in Da3 seeing as my dead warden can no longer provide the succor for the heart and soul they require.

Lamens terms:  While I want leliana to move on, I can't help but feel she'd still be unfaithful to my warden if she were to potentially get romantically involved with this new girl even tho my warden's dead.

Thoughts?

Well, Its been 10 years. I say **** your warden (no insult intended) and let her move. But I doubt Leliana is going to be a LI.

[Dean_the_Young]

What if Leliana, if romanced in both games, tells the PC of the second game 'you're nice and all, but I was just using you to find my real love the Warden again. K' thanks bye.'?

Would that be some OOC betrayal, if she was just using another extremely powerful person (as PCs always are) in order to reunite with the Warden?

[Nightdragon8]

Emzamination wrote...

DarkKnightHolmes wrote...

Meh, I want no LI to return. All of them have more than enough screen time.

That may no longer be an option.David has inadvertently solidified isabela's return. - Link

You know it would be kind of cool if they make it so her personality is different if she is with Hawk, you know not a total ****. Fun still tells dirty jokes and teases people but doesn't have an intrest in someone else.  (if with a romance with Isy in Da2)

In a way it would a nice way to add another level to her.

[Emzamination]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

wynnes death

Wynne dies in Asunder only if she wasn't killed in Origins.

So yeah, your save has to match up with how Asunder plays out for that to happen. Otherwise, if she was killed in Origins then what's going to happen then?

Yeah, that'll more then likely be addressed in DA3. What the hell happens in Asunder if Wynne was killed in the Circle or in the Gauntlet?

She's got a built-in failsafe for why she might be there, sure. But that has to be expressly conveyed to us in DA3 as the result of her having had some influence on Asunder's events. Because as of right now, it's speculation/headcanon using what the game provides, but we're unsure of if it would hold true for DA3.

These things are acknowledged in the Games.

So is Maric's disappearance. Lost at sea, rumors of him being held in a prison, etc. The games make a point of mentioning these things... and the comics follow up on them.

Also, take note of how I specifically referred to Asunder in my post. I didn't mention The Calling or The Stolen Throne, nor did I use the word novels. I used the singular. I recognize that the prequel novels are canon. Asunder, however, only works with a certain save in mind -- one where the Circle was A) saved and Wynne wasn't killed at the Gauntlet and C) Shale was recruited.

Just because Gaider is writing it doesn't mean its going to appear as any type of canon in game

It does when he says it's canon for those specific save files. And that if the save file was different, then it would've happened differently and be referenced as such.

You're pushing your preconceptions as fact without proof.

Except for David Gaider's own statements on the matter.

But hey, if you want to say "It's not canon! Lalalalalaala" go ahead.

Da comics in the past had nothing to do with the game and this is no different, they never are

The wiki makes it a point to only include canon material as its main articles.

Are you going to say the Machinima detailing Kristoff's encounters with the Darkspawn during the Thaw of the Fifth Blight isn't canon either?

I could bother to correct all your inconsistencies starting with maric being held prisoner in antiva, but then again it would be far quicker to kill your entire argument by asking for sources on David's statements which I know you can't provide because David isn't talking about Da3's story or setting at all. Sources?

Modifié par Emzamination, 02 octobre 2012 - 02:35 .

[brushyourteeth]

Hmm... I don't know.

In real life, I'm 27 and married. If I kick the bucket tomorrow, and a few years from now my husband meets a great girl who can make him happy, I want him to get remarried. I don't want him to feel alone and miserable forever. I know he won't forget me, but he can forget his sorrow and move on. There's nothing cheater-ish about that scenario. He's still young, and has a lot to offer a woman. No need for him to be single and alone for the next 40-60 years of his life.

If I die tomorrow and he's got a girlfriend by next Tuesday, there's something wrong with that.

In the Warden's case, it will have been at least ten years since he/she died to end the Blight. If Morrigan, Leliana, Zevran, or Alistair have moved on, I can't hold that against them. I know they'll honor her in her death. I'd expect Zevran at least to have had a few random tumbles to take the edge off his grief -- he's still Zevran.

[fighterchick]

brushyourteeth wrote...

Hmm... I don't know.

In real life, I'm 27 and married. If I kick the bucket tomorrow, and a few years from now my husband meets a great girl who can make him happy, I want him to get remarried. I don't want him to feel alone and miserable forever. I know he won't forget me, but he can forget his sorrow and move on. There's nothing cheater-ish about that scenario. He's still young, and has a lot to offer a woman. No need for him to be single and alone for the next 40-60 years of his life.

If I die tomorrow and he's got a girlfriend by next Tuesday, there's something wrong with that.

In the Warden's case, it will have been at least ten years since he/she died to end the Blight. If Morrigan, Leliana, Zevran, or Alistair have moved on, I can't hold that against them. I know they'll honor her in her death. I'd expect Zevran at least to have had a few random tumbles to take the edge off his grief -- he's still Zevran.

I completely agree with this.  People can love multiple times in their lives, why would it be so very different for a video game character, particularly if they are trying to make said character realistic?  I can't help but think that the OP is either very selfish or very young. 

[Rpgfantasyplayer]

Here is my question. I have never romanced Zevran but I know that in DA2 he comes back in a side quest. If you have Isabela in your party or even your PC they can have some "fun" time with him. Can that still happen if you romanced him and he stayed with you at the end of DA:O? (That is only if your warden didn't die). I personally would not want to romance old LI's if my other PC's are stil alive.  If they are still alive would that then lock out the romance option?

Modifié par Rpgfantasyplayer, 02 octobre 2012 - 03:23 .

[David Gaider]

I think that we writers would be reluctant to have a character be romanceable in more than one game for one simple fact: revisiting a romance plot would seem incredibly stale, unless the character had transformed into someone else completely. We've already done that story.

And then we'd also get into a situation where a player is angry because they're betraying their old PC, and violating headcanon-- which, quite frankly, would give us all of two seconds hesitation if it weren't for the other point. Why tweak the people who would be all weird about it, when it's not something that would particularly excite us in the first place?