530 réponses à ce sujet

[Eveangaline]

Rojahar wrote...

Its not someone's race which should make them interesting or not.

Nor should someones hair color, face, or gender make them interesting. They should take out all ability to choose those either, locking us in as a mousehaired wrinkly femhawke with a small nose

[Nashimura]

Rojahar wrote...

Its not someone's race which should make them interesting or not.

The races provide different cultures, role play opportunities and look - none of these interest you?

Modifié par Nashimura, 01 octobre 2012 - 07:29 .

[brushyourteeth]

Faerunner wrote...

brushyourteeth wrote...

bleetman wrote...

Faerunner wrote...

You're allowed to insult her, stand up for yourself or your dog, but you aren't allowed to stand up for the elven staff or call her out on her hypocrisy for telling the fable about abusing power when the exact same story can apply to her treatment of the elves. (Heck, you have the option to suggest she beat them.)

I'm sure her treatment of the kitchen staff is due to their race and not because she's a cantankerous old women who heckles everybody, noble and Ser WhateverhisnameisIforget included.

Yep.

She wouldn't call human servants knife-ears (a racial slur, however innocent you want to make it). And doesn't she threaten to send them back to the alienage if they don't get back to work or some such business like that?

Nah, she just threatens to skin them. =)

EDIT: Actually, I don't fully remember. Maybe she threatened that too.

Well, in the first case, we'd have to play through with an all-human kitchen staff before we could definitively determine that she is, in fact, only mildly racist, and not an all-out bigot.

Alas, we'll never have that chance. 

[Mr.House]

Xilizhra wrote...

I find HN repulsive from now on ever since it was confirmed that you're forced to be racist at the beginning. But I personally am for playing elves all the way in any case.

Yet my HN, Joshua Cousland was good friends with Zev, went out of his way to help both the Dalish and werewolfs, gave those elves in Lothering money, helped the elves in the Alliange and was nice to them, never rude.

So ya, my HN was not a racist lol.

[Xilizhra]

Mr.House wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

I find HN repulsive from now on ever since it was confirmed that you're forced to be racist at the beginning. But I personally am for playing elves all the way in any case.

Yet my HN, Joshua Cousland was good friends with Zev, went out of his way to help both the Dalish and werewolfs, gave those elves in Lothering money, helped the elves in the Alliange and was nice to them, never rude.

So ya, my HN was not a racist lol.

You don't have to stay racist, but you do have to start out that way.

[Anarya]

I'd like to be able to play different races again, but I don't know if I really need to see the "origin" segments come back. After two games, we're pretty familiar with Thedas and its major races, so unless the hypothetical future origin segments were really adding something to what I already know about Thedas, I'd rather the resources go to something else.

[LPPrince]

No you don't. You can roleplay your character as racist if you want, but it is in no way set in stone.

My Human Noble was never a racist. Not even at the beginning.

[Mr.House]

Xilizhra wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

I find HN repulsive from now on ever since it was confirmed that you're forced to be racist at the beginning. But I personally am for playing elves all the way in any case.

Yet my HN, Joshua Cousland was good friends with Zev, went out of his way to help both the Dalish and werewolfs, gave those elves in Lothering money, helped the elves in the Alliange and was nice to them, never rude.

So ya, my HN was not a racist lol.

You don't have to stay racist, but you do have to start out that way.

No, as my HN at the start was a selfish git who only cared about himself, his dog and his familly. He would not have jumped in if Nan was acting like a hag to human workers. So no, it's not racist, it's how you rp your character and I can rp that scene as it not being racist for my character on how I made him.

[robertm2]

probably because people would complain if you could only play as an elf or a dwarf. it would be nice if you could be any of them but personally i would rather only have one race and a different origin story for each class if you cant have different origins for each race.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Anarya wrote...

I'd like to be able to play different races again, but I don't know if I really need to see the "origin" segments come back. After two games, we're pretty familiar with Thedas and its major races, so unless the hypothetical future origin segments were really adding something to what I already know about Thedas, I'd rather the resources go to something else.

I'd settle for this, having race selection at the expense of rigin stories. Maybe have what Mass Effect did, where you chose what kind of person your character was. That way it'll have the same effect, but takes up less resources.

[LPPrince]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Anarya wrote...

I'd like to be able to play different races again, but I don't know if I really need to see the "origin" segments come back. After two games, we're pretty familiar with Thedas and its major races, so unless the hypothetical future origin segments were really adding something to what I already know about Thedas, I'd rather the resources go to something else.

I'd settle for this, having race selection at the expense of rigin stories. Maybe have what Mass Effect did, where you chose what kind of person your character was. That way it'll have the same effect, but takes up less resources.

So basically, picking race but having your characters all start out the same way?

Reminds me of Kingdoms of Amalur where you had 4 choices of "race" (really it was two of two, two Human and two Elven), but the game starts the same way regardless.

[Anarya]

LPPrince wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Anarya wrote...

I'd like to be able to play different races again, but I don't know if I really need to see the "origin" segments come back. After two games, we're pretty familiar with Thedas and its major races, so unless the hypothetical future origin segments were really adding something to what I already know about Thedas, I'd rather the resources go to something else.

I'd settle for this, having race selection at the expense of rigin stories. Maybe have what Mass Effect did, where you chose what kind of person your character was. That way it'll have the same effect, but takes up less resources.

So basically, picking race but having your characters all start out the same way?

Reminds me of Kingdoms of Amalur where you had 4 choices of "race" (really it was two of two, two Human and two Elven), but the game starts the same way regardless.

Yes. There could be a few lines that reference your race or background scattered through the game like in Mass Effect or DAO, but yeah, have the same starting point like KoA or Skyrim.

[LPPrince]

^I would not be against that. I typically only play one character anyway, making that one character my canon character. If I play other races/origins, its for achievements later on.

[Sylvius the Mad]

LPPrince wrote...

So basically, picking race but having your characters all start out the same way?

It's BioWare's story.  They can start you wherever they'd like.

Didn't you say something similar just a short while ago?

Reminds me of Kingdoms of Amalur where you had 4 choices of "race" (really it was two of two, two Human and two Elven), but the game starts the same way regardless.

Personally, I don't like origins.  Origins just limits character design by pinning each character to one of just a few backgrounds.  I would always choose a Mysterious Stranger PC over any pre-written origin.

That's what we used to get in BioWare games.  NWN and KotOR both provided it - the player wasn't limited in designing his character's background at all aside from having him start in a specific location.

Amalur did this very well.  You got to decide everything about why your character was dead and how he ended up on that corpse wagon.

[Sylvius the Mad]

LPPrince wrote...

^I would not be against that. I typically only play one character anyway, making that one character my canon character. If I play other races/origins, its for achievements later on.

If the game allows me to create genuinely different characters (in terms of their personalities), I'll create a dozen or more.

A game that doesn't allow this is a poor game in my eyes.

[cindercatz]

Faerunner wrote...

brushyourteeth wrote...

I agree, Faerunner. Getting to see the same world through so many different perspectives really made the lore feel fleshed-out and complete to me.

I honestly feel awful when I talk to players who've only done a human origin playthrough in DA:O and then played DAII. I'm sure they had as much fun as anybody, but they're missing out on so much insight and understanding about Thedas' diverse cultures. Interesting ones. That add new shades to all the others.

Thank you, I feel the same way about this. 

The interactions with elves especially upset me as I felt there was a lot of subtext a person who's only played a human would miss. The motivations behind the words and actions of the kidnapped elven girl's father in the Magister's Orders and the "fanatic elves" in Blackpowder Courtesy and Demands of the Qunari changes dramatically when you've played the City Elf Origin.

To be honest, the inability to see Kirkwall through different perspectives is part of the reason I felt DA2 was not as fleshed out as DA:O. Kirkwall had so many peoples and cultures all in one city and the surrounding area: the City Elves in the Alienage, the Dalish on Sundermound, the Qunari in the Docks, the Tal-Vashoth in the Wounded Coast, the surface dwarves both in the Merchant's Guild and Coteri, the Mages (of three races), the Templas, the human peasants and nobles. All these different people all fighting and ruffling each other's feathers, yet the only conflict we get to explore is the "mage versus templar" and "Andrastian human versus Qunari kossith" conflict because the main character is a human from a mixed mage/non-mage family. That's it.

The Blackpowder Courtesy and Demands of the Qun bothered me especially because, in both instances, unnamed "fanatic elves" hint at a conflict between city elves and Qunari. Many elves converted to the Qun for a better life, yet other elves saw this as abandoning their family and culture (which is paramount in elf society). Knowing what I do about city elf culture, I felt it was a very interesting moral dilemma worth exploring further, but because the protagonist is human, we only see the conflict from an outside perspective and only get to see the human vs kossith part. (Which basically consists of intolerant humans fussing over what they think the Qunari MIGHT do to their society eventually, not what they actually do, as in the case of elves, who have very real, concrette reasons to feel threatened by the Qunari presence long before they sack Kirkwall.)

I can go on forever, but the long and short of it is BioWare made so many interesting peoples and cultures and let us see different conflicts and perspectives from their eyes once, and I feel it's too bad we don't get to do it anymore. 

Exactly. It's all about the changes in perspective.
DA2 was a one track experience that came across as a shallow and one sided, us/them sort of game. It was extremely disappointing, and this was the number one bit of that. The other flaws were primarily technical (issues with the combat system and lack of follower customization; repeating dungeons that everybody complains about were the least of it). Lack of choice/consequence really came down to maybe two three big railroad choices in the game, and only one of those was really personal to the PC, the mage/templar decision.

I play Dragon Age primarily for the great world they created with all the different available perspectives and mostly a lack of 'good guys' and 'bad guys' when you consider their perspectives. DA:O let me fully roleplay every relevant perspective to that story. DA2 shoehorned me into only one, and bumping up against the others without getting to play the game from their side of the story made it generic and homogenous, like a basic fantasy RPG I can get a lot of places, with a neat little character tone system. I pass on most fantasy RPGs nowdays precisely because I'm not interested in repeating the same ol' same ol'.

Being a particularly well written 'fantasy RPG' doesn't set Dragon Age apart very much. Being able to play a story from multiple truly varied perspectives (and actually playing in them, meaning origins) does.

So if Dragon Age is going to live up to its potential, it has to have both origins and race selection. Otherwise, it's not that special.

Modifié par cindercatz, 01 octobre 2012 - 09:14 .

[Zkyire]

FaWa wrote...

 Title. Seriously, lets review 

-Human Noble was the most boring Origin Story. Literally every other Origin was fantastic and I'd put HN as good at best. 
-There isn't any flair to being a human.
-We are humans in our every day life. Why be one in a video game?


Seriously. Why?
This is assuming we are forced into being a human. If thats not the case I will be pleasently surprised, and proceed to jump back on the BioWare train.

I have pointy ears, I'm exciting now.

I'm short, I'm exciting now.

..yaaay.

Only a few % actually play non-human characters. That's why.

Modifié par Zkyire, 01 octobre 2012 - 09:15 .

[nuclearpengu1nn]

Stop saying "we" and assume that "we" all agree with you.

[cindercatz]

Zkyire wrote...

I have pointy ears, I'm exciting now.

I'm short, I'm exciting now.

..yaaay.

Only a few % actually play non-human characters. That's why.

As if that were what people are really talking about..

And even if 20% is really all that played non-humans (and I highly doubt that, more like 20% played non-humans first, and most people don't finish a game twice), 20% is a huge number when you consider just how many people played and are playing Origins. And those 20% are the core audience that actually got everything there was to get out of the game, rather than the casual buy-or-not I-don't-really-care players.

Game companies' statistics (including BioWare's I'm sure) also show that a majority of players never finish any game over a certain amount of hours. Should they therefore just forget about including an ending? Less than half the players will ever see it, so why bother there? Should they shorten the game to 15 hours? It's a poor arguement for exclusion.

Modifié par cindercatz, 01 octobre 2012 - 09:27 .

[MassStorm]

I agree with OP

Elves or Dwarves >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Humans

[MichaelStuart]

I agree that humans are boring.
A lot of people prefer to play as them I'm told.