135 réponses à ce sujet

[Dragoonlordz]

Darth Death wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

I think all games should be judged on their own merits, but they should be open to comparison to other games specially prequels. It can be judged a good game despite not being as good as the one before or as good as the one after etc.

Most things are judged by what came before: Children, adults, cars, graphics cards, movies, games, music, etc. Founding the goodies are humanly instinctive. We recognizes the foundation & increases the expectation. When a game is being reviewed, I want to know every single significant con & pro coexisting with that video game. If the game is a sequel, then I expect no hidden information from its predecessor. I want it all hanging out like a 600lbs woman trying to fit into conventional pantyhose. Everything must be taken into consideration for a healthy,competent opinion or review to have any profound value in my eyes.   

Judging a game on it's own merits is simply did you enjoy it, what did you enjoy and what did you not. Comparing to other games is more like; out of the two which did you enjoy more, why did you enjoy it more. Games are a form of entertainment, their sole purpose is to entertain first and foremost. That is how I judge games. Comparing to other games comes after and is secondary to the enjoyment of the actual title itself.

[Dr. Explosion]

John Epler wrote...

NovaBlastMarketing wrote...

Well if  they don't  listen  we will get  another ending  like ME3. I Guess It  is more of a matter of which  fans do you listen to ?  

 I have made my views clear  and they are contrary to others .

I can not  really answer that question because there are people  on here  that  I hope Bioware listens to  including myself  and there are some  I really wish I  could take the delete button to.

I am sure there are those who feel the same way about me .

On a side  note I don't know why people bash DA2 in some ways  i enjoyed it better than  origins they  are both  good games.

Although  I do think the  writing team needs to watch Return of the Jedi again... that's a Proper way to do an ending.

So what I'm hearing is that you want Ewoks.

I'll put it this way; we're not saying we don't not want no ewoks.

On a completely unrelated topic, the fex haven't made appearance yet .

[TEWR]

Yes, Bioware should listen to the fans for Dragon Age 3.





http://s7d5.scene7.c...tSearchResults$

So Bioware, what do the fans tell you?

John Epler wrote...

So what I'm hearing is that you want Ewoks

Who doesn't want Ewoks?

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 05 octobre 2012 - 12:34 .

[Get Magna Carter]

I don't want Ewoks (unless I have a flamethrower)

Bioware should listen to the fans but not be ruled by them.
The fans will make some good suggestions, but also make bad suggestions, and argue and troll each other..and even good ideas won't all fit together to make a good game..

[unbentbuzzkill]

Ewoks with machine guns equals one word AWESOME! i'll name mine ser douche alot

[ianvillan]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Yes, Bioware should listen to the fans for Dragon Age 3.





http://s7d5.scene7.c...tSearchResults$

So Bioware, what do the fans tell you?

John Epler wrote...

So what I'm hearing is that you want Ewoks

Who doesn't want Ewoks?

But they are all modern fans, what about fans that still like the old style shouldnt they be listened to as well.

[Vicious]

Listen to some, not all. The raging malcontents that continually call out developers/writers by name and obsessively go on about how 'xxx feature/character isn't in' long after the developers/writers themselves justified that the feature was removed/isn't in because it has no place/didn't want it... yeah. They shouldn't listen to those guys.


However articulate folks who are willing to hear 'no' and still care enough to post because want the best Dragon Age 3 possible... yeah, Bioware should listen to them.

[Gabey5]

since they will be buying the game, probably.

*looks at forum page*

Maybe not fully

Modifié par Gabey5, 06 octobre 2012 - 07:53 .

[slimgrin]

Common sense would go a long way in filtering the sh*tstorm of fan requests. The reality is, Bioware usually spins critical feedback and their PR tactics after DA2 and ME3 showed they listen to the bean counters, not the fans. They'll throw a bone to the gay community, or put a helmet toggle in, stuff like that. But they seem to follow the same formula so the same weaknesses show up time and again.

Modifié par slimgrin, 06 octobre 2012 - 08:01 .

[deatharmonic]

I'm guessing they'll listen to the ideas that fit with what they want to produce.

[ianvillan]

slimgrin wrote...

Common sense would go a long way in filtering the sh*tstorm of fan requests. The reality is, Bioware usually spins critical feedback and their PR tactics after DA2 and ME3 showed they listen to the bean counters, not the fans. They'll throw a bone to the gay community, or put a helmet toggle in, stuff like that. But they seem to follow the same formula so the same weaknesses show up time and again.

I actually think Bioware has been one of the best game developers for quite some years in including the gay community, and by saying they throw a bone the the gay community is not fair to Bioware.

[Cultist]

The funny thing with CoD Crowd quote is how fitting it turned out to be.
Devs may intend it to mean something else, but the result forever linked it to DA2.
1. Smash awesum buttanz.
2. Click two or three times at differently coloured "Continue to battle" dialogue icons
3. Repeat 1.
The quote perfectly represented what DA2 was and that's why the phrase took roots at the forums. In action and arcade abdurance of conversations and dialogues is a burden and annoyance- let's reduce it to stone age! You rarely make choices in action or arcades - let's do the same in Dragon age! Third-person view is common with aracde games - remove tactical planning! and so on, and so on.
Sure, there's a lot of people who like action with RPG elements, like Dragon age 2, but as it turned out, they could not compensate for alienated fanbase, who preferred RPGs and did not buy DA2.

[InfinitePaths]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Yes, Bioware should listen to the fans for Dragon Age 3.





http://s7d5.scene7.c...tSearchResults$

So Bioware, what do the fans tell you?

John Epler wrote...

So what I'm hearing is that you want Ewoks

Who doesn't want Ewoks?

You beat me to this

[The Teyrn of Whatever]

II think they should listen to fans... within reason. Only if a large section of fandom is asking that something be implemented in the game, so long as it doesn't mess with continuity or established lore.

[TEWR]

ReggarBlane wrote...

Yet, how do you entice them with something they hasn't yet interested them?

Well... games like CoD have elements of RPGs in them -- usually seen in multiplayer. I think that DAII failed to actually attract that crowd -- due to it being rushed -- but I think Skyrim managed to get the CoD fans attracted to it.

That's not meant to mean I'm saying Skyrim plays like CoD. But I wouldn't be surprised if a crapton of the ten million buyers -- or more -- were in fact also people that played CoD.

Now, it's less about mechanics and more about what seems awesome. Describing mechanics and similarities between two different games won't do much to garner an amount of players on par with the CoD franchise.s

A story and game given care, devotion, money, attention, and even a fair deal of marketing will.

[Fast Jimmy]

Call of Duty isn't just about being good at shooting. Its about tactics (including knowing the area, terrain, enemies you are fighting and the best skills and weapons for the job), its about equipment hoarding, its about upgrades, its about progression...


...essentially, CoD is about all of the parts of an RPG that people who just play RPGs for the story complain about.

[blueumi]

I think it's half and half try to hear what people like about the games that came befor and also what they did not like while still making the game that the company want to make

dragon age 2 went to much with what the developer wanted instead of doing a dragon age game that felt like dragon age they could have done the same story they did but in a dragon age way not a lets make this mass effect way which is what they did

make what people want to buy and they will keep coming back make the game only what the developer wants and that wont do as well

[jkflipflopDAO]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

The important thing to remember is that even if fans are relatively unified in being upset at something, their reasons for feeling that way may not be.

Some of championed the kickstarters of PE and WL2 as being "true RPG experiences" and whatnot, but I stopped frequenting the WL2 forums because of all the bickering over what truly made Wasteland (and to an extent Fallout) a great game and how it should do. I'm seeing it with Project Eternity too.

There's this idea that people have that there's consensus: people want an Infinity Engine style game, and the reasons must be for the same reasons that I want one. Except they often aren't.

I saw this a lot with the Mass Effect 3 endings as well, where people would always state "we want these specific changes" and so forth.

Fan feedback can be useful, but distilling a consensus can be problematic. If you have 50% that think we should have a dialogue wheel and 50% that don't, it's tough to reconcile. (Note that simply providing an option to have both in this case is actually very time intensive for QA, so it's not a cheap/free thing to implement).

More on this later but I'm off to lunch!

Honestly, how hard is it to take the choices associated to a wheel and convert them to a list? Comon dude.

[jkflipflopDAO]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

Call of Duty isn't just about being good at shooting. Its about tactics (including knowing the area, terrain, enemies you are fighting and the best skills and weapons for the job), its about equipment hoarding, its about upgrades, its about progression...


...essentially, CoD is about all of the parts of an RPG that people who just play RPGs for the story complain about.

LOL whut? CoD is about spawning with a rifle and sprinting constantly until you see someone else thats sprinting around and then the first guy to shoot wins. I seriously doubt you've ever played the game. 

[TEWR]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

Call of Duty isn't just about being good at shooting. Its about tactics (including knowing the area, terrain, enemies you are fighting and the best skills and weapons for the job), its about equipment hoarding, its about upgrades, its about progression...


...essentially, CoD is about all of the parts of an RPG that people who just play RPGs for the story complain about.

Exactly. I've said the same thing before.

Didn't take with posters when I said it, but it's still true.

[Shadow Fox]

Cultist wrote...

The funny thing with CoD Crowd quote is how fitting it turned out to be.
Devs may intend it to mean something else, but the result forever linked it to DA2.
1. Smash awesum buttanz.
2. Click two or three times at differently coloured "Continue to battle" dialogue icons
3. Repeat 1.
The quote perfectly represented what DA2 was and that's why the phrase took roots at the forums. In action and arcade abdurance of conversations and dialogues is a burden and annoyance- let's reduce it to stone age! You rarely make choices in action or arcades - let's do the same in Dragon age! Third-person view is common with aracde games - remove tactical planning! and so on, and so on.
Sure, there's a lot of people who like action with RPG elements, like Dragon age 2, but as it turned out, they could not compensate for alienated fanbase, who preferred RPGs and did not buy DA2.

You must have a very narrow view of what makes rpgs rpgs.

Modifié par Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke, 07 octobre 2012 - 04:05 .

[Allan Schumacher]

Honestly, how hard is it to take the choices associated to a wheel and convert them to a list? Comon dude.

Non-trivial. We're not just flipping a switch. It'll require time investment from programming, GUI artists, QA, and even probably even writing (depending on how long the actual, spoken lines can be).

LOL whut? CoD is about spawning with a rifle and sprinting constantly until you see someone else thats sprinting around and then the first guy to shoot wins. I seriously doubt you've ever played the game.

I could say the same for you. I haven't played Call of Duty MP since the first Modern Warfare, but assuming the formula hasn't changed that much Jimmy's assessment isn't that far off. It's no surprise that in COD4 I got better at the game as I played it and learned things like the maps and the weapons. Not to mention the progression elements serve somewhat as a skinner box.

Yeah you can sprint around like mad looking to shoot, but that often gets you killed as much as you do the killing. Better players aren't going to do that.

[TEWR]

Allan, you're correct in that the formula hasn't changed much. Aside from what weapons are available -- dependant on the time of the game -- and minor tweaks, it's essentially the same thing.

[eroeru]

So I take it that the dialogue wheel is in in all its might...

Ok. At least you don't let false hopes thrive. However, now I do see giving feedback as unimportant and meaningless - a subject of real backfiring (that seeing spoken lines in full + possibly an option for silent PC) won't get any treatment it seems. In this light, forums' opinion doesn't seem to matter, no matter how well-explained, rationalized and heated. You won't ever get any other answer than either that of the minority, or that of the minority who agree with you (let's not call them the minority here for comfort's sake, right?).


I don't know. I think you're making a mistake here, yet if you're upfront about it, that's certainly better. Though I think lots of people will feel DA dead... it is certainly your call.

Modifié par eroeru, 07 octobre 2012 - 01:52 .

[Ghost Lightning]

*Reads OP*

No. Never. And I'm not being sarcastic. Make the damn game, forget the idiotic fans. If the game being developed is actually something that these people are putting hard work into (and by that I mean that they are really striving to make a good game, cuz every game takes hard work to make, even the suck ones) the game, then that will show. If they write a great story, and create polished and fun mechanics, that will be the case regardless of whetehr or not they take suggestions and requests from the troglodytes that are spewing them.