102 réponses à ce sujet

[Warrior Craess]

Wotannanow wrote...

Bfler wrote...

A rapier is no medieval weapon and in reality you can't penetrate heavy armor with it. It is a weapon for close combat, when the enemy has passed the range of rifle fire, like a cavalry saber.

There's no weapon except heavy spiked maces and the like that can pierce heavy plate armour. Rapiers are designed to poke through the eye-slits on a heavy helm or the joints in the ememy's armour. in China that was the use of the elegant thin sword -- try to block with that and the blade would snap.

Warhammers were exceptionally good at this. In fact most weapons would penatrate plate armor if used appropriately. Most of the reason Knights survived, was that they were worth ransoming.

And let us not forget that the most fearsome aspect of the knights wasn't their near invulnerablity in foot combat, but rather their mounted charge.  Once off their horse they were still very tough, but much much more manageble. Daggers (of the right type), Great Weapons (axe, maul, sword)  Long swords (of various nature). Arrows/Bolts,  etc.. all had their means of defeating plate armor. 

[Plaintiff]

Screw realism.

The excuses people are using to justify their dislike of unrealistic weapons are insane.

"These weapons could never exist! But it's okay to have dragons because they're explained in the lore."

No. No they aren't. "Magic" is not an explanation, it's an excuse, and if you're going to accept it as adequate reasoning for anything, then you have to accept it for everything.

[Quicksilver26]

Plaintiff wrote...

Screw realism.

The excuses people are using to justify their dislike of unrealistic weapons are insane.

"These weapons could never exist! But it's okay to have dragons because they're explained in the lore."

No. No they aren't. "Magic" is not an explanation, it's an excuse, and if you're going to accept it as adequate reasoning for anything, then you have to accept it for everything.

woot hear hear +100:wizard:

[Warrior Craess]

meh, I liked the DAO weapons much more than most of the anime style weapons of DA2.

[The Hierophant]

Plaintiff wrote....

Some people think that DA's jumbo sized weapons look out of place in comparison to the seemingly normal proportioned human character models, and i see nothing wrong with it. 

[Direwolf0294]

Even DA:O's weapons were a bit over the top. The hilts on the swords and daggers were huge. Personally, I'd prefer more realistic weapons. That's not to say I don't want something that's fancy looking and impractical, but I want it to look like it at least makes sense. Like those blades the Klingon's use in Star Trek. They'd never work in real life, but they still look like they do. With the massive 2h swords in DA2 they didn't look like they belonged. You couldn't fool yourself into think, yeah, I could see this working in real life.

[AntiChri5]

People can accept gigantic fire breathing lizards with metal bones which must weigh several tons but manage to fly with a pair of flimsy bat wings, but they can't accept an item made out of a material which doesn't exist in this world crafted by a species/culture that doesn't exist in this world being a bit wider then our version of it?

[AntiChri5]

If people actually want realism, i strongly suggest they play Mount and Blade. It can be lots of fun.

[Plaintiff]

The Hierophant wrote...

Plaintiff wrote....

Some people think that DA's jumbo sized weapons look out of place in comparison to the seemingly normal proportioned human character models, and i see nothing wrong with it. 

Aside from being inherently illogical and hypocritical you mean?

I pointed out that the argument is flawed... so I must be crying hot tears of impotent rage on my keyboard?

I think somebody is projecting.

[AntiChri5]

The existence of dragons not my argument. In a fantasy world, they can create any creature they want. My argument was that Dragons cannot fly.

Consider birds. Notice how they are rather small? Ever seen their bones? Very fragile, because thy are hollow. In order to achieve flight, birds have evolved to be small aerodynamic and light. Dragons have not. Dragons are massive, their bones are used to create armour and weapons, so seem to be some sort of metal. Dragons have to weigh several tons. There is a very good reason that Elephants are the only land based mammal that cannot jump, they are simply too heavy and i would be surprised if Dragons didn't weigh around as much as Elephants.

How do Dragons fly on such small wings? How do they stay up? It's not physically possible that the creatures we are shown in Dragon Age can fly.

Yet people can accept it, while crying foul when a blade is a few inches wider then it's real world counterpart.

[Nomen Mendax]

Plaintiff wrote...

Screw realism.

The excuses people are using to justify their dislike of unrealistic weapons are insane.

"These weapons could never exist! But it's okay to have dragons because they're explained in the lore."

No. No they aren't. "Magic" is not an explanation, it's an excuse, and if you're going to accept it as adequate reasoning for anything, then you have to accept it for everything.

So by your logic you would be happy if we all fought with fruit?

[AntiChri5]

The thing making the least sense to me right now has nothing to do with Gandalf, and everything to do with your command of the English language. From what i can tell, your argument is based on the common perception defining things in fiction.

Which, if anything is an argument against realism. Most people don't have a very solid idea of what historic weapons realistically look like.

[The Hierophant]

Plaintiff wrote...

The Hierophant wrote...

Plaintiff wrote....
*snip*

Some people think that DA's jumbo sized weapons look out of place in comparison to the seemingly normal proportioned human character models, and i see nothing wrong with it. 

Aside from being inherently illogical and hypocritical you mean?

I pointed out that the argument is flawed... so I must be crying hot tears of impotent rage on my keyboard?

I think somebody is projecting.

1) Nah, your post reeked of straw man so i used a straw man to straw man your straw man while you straw man.  (this is under the assumption that your post is directed towards everyone that want realistically proportioned weapons, but if it's only aimed towards a select few then skip # 2)

2) The op's flawed post aside, there's nothing illogical nor hypocritical about anyone wanting weapons that are proportioned realistically in relation to the pc's height or weight. 

Modifié par The Hierophant, 07 octobre 2012 - 09:07 .

[AntiChri5]

Like my argument in other thread, King Arthur will NOT use an oversized Excalibur with some spikes here and there and crude looking blade, that will be unrealistic. Excalibur is a sword, clean and shiny magical sword. See what i mean? Excalibur is FANTASY weapon, still bound to REALISTIC look and function

King Arthur will use whatever the writer makes him use. He is a fictional entity, he doesn't get to make his own choices. King Arthur using any sword is unrealistic, since he is fictional.

Yes, Excalibur generally looks like an actual sword. That is irrelevant. We aren't talking about Arthurian legend, we are talking about Dragon Age. The Dragon Age team can go with whatever aesthetic it damn well pleases.

[TMZuk]

Well. Playing DA:O I used a mod to get some better looking weapons. DA2 I never had installed on my own rig, but if anything the weapons looked worse than DA:O.

I assume it was in line with the Over the Top combat animations, and the general cartoonish look of the game. Certainly not to my taste. It doesn't have to be realistic, but it has to be believable, and it wasn't. The artstyle in DA2 was, IMO, ugly, ugly, ugly!

Modifié par TMZuk, 07 octobre 2012 - 08:45 .

[AntiChri5]

There are a lot of King Arthur movies, dramas, cartoon and even anime, the King never use overexaggerated Exclabur in any mobvies, dramas, cartoon and anime. Because it is unrealistic

Right, but that doesn't mean it couldn't be done. Any writer could make Excalibur unrealistic if they wanted to. They don't, simply to conform to previous iterations of the series.

why it is irrelevent? Those who want exaggerated weapon and weapon size justfy it by saying "it is fantasy world with magic and dragons", King Arthur is fantasy world with Merlin and lake fairies.

It is irrelevant because it is simply not relevant. Arthurian legend may have created some of the tropes in the setting, but Dragon Age is not Arthurian legend. Their aesthetic is not relevant to Dragon Age.

This thread is a demand and a suggestion from a fan, that is me. And i am not alone, there are who agree with me. If Bioware want to maintain big oversized anime looking giant sword in the next game is not the issue, it is their right.

No one making any demand is ever alone, but those on the forum still only represent about 5% of the people who play the game.

Again trying to blame anime. Would people stop doing that? Anime didn't invent oversized weapons, and don't always use it.

[esper]

Nizaris1 wrote...

People can accept gigantic fire breathing lizards with metal bones which must weigh several tons but manage to fly with a pair of flimsy bat wings, but they can't accept an item made out of a material which doesn't exist in this world crafted by a species/culture that doesn't exist in this world being a bit wider then our version of it?

Fire breathing dragon is acceptable, ice breathing is something odd but still acceptable, lightning breathing dragon is absurd...see even monsters have some set of rule to follow to make it realistic and aceptable.

Minotaur must be big, bull headed, have bull leg, big horn carry axe or war hammer. Minotaur cannot wield sword and armor because that look missmatch.

Another example, Orc in any game will look like "barbarian" race, with barbarian armor, barbarian weapons and their settlement must look barbarian. They cannot have a civilize look cities with castles, shiny armored knight and such thing because that look UNREAL...

Similar with other types of fantasy creatures. They too must follow some set of rule or they become something unacceptable.

Same goes to weapons, armor and many things. A sword must look that can cut things, easy to use, not too big and not too decorative. A sword must have have blade part, pommel, handle and arm guard. If a sword look like an axe then it is not a sword.

In Halo there is a blade weapon we cannot call it a sword because it is not, but it is acceptable for Halo alien environment and Master Chief robotic look.If that blade goes into Dragon Age, it is a miss match, unrealistic. And we CANNOT ACCEPT MASTER CHIEF ARMOR IN DRAGON AGE

And yet I have seen seen games and read books with lightning/poison/darkness (What was the archdemon breathing again, it wasn't fire) breathning dragons which mostly made sense in these books because of what dragons were in that universe.

In a game where we can enchant weapons with magic properties and there exist magical metal such as lyrium which noone in universe completely understand, I am willing to accept oversized and weird looking weapons because their materials clearly aren't ours and when their are they are enchanted by runes and other stuff so I completely believe they don't weight as much.