287 réponses à ce sujet

[GodWood]

M25105 wrote...
With low sales numbers.

Shadow of the Collosus couldn't break the 2 million mark either.

Red Dead sold 13 million, Reach and MGS3 sold close to 5 million.

Not that sales figures are relevant to what I said.

[esper]

I seriously doubt that anyone who says that they don't want a happy ending want a everything and everyone are dead ending.

I want an ending with ups and downs that makes sense in the context of the story.

[Ridwan]

One more thing, the thread is about having the option for a happy ending, yet this forum is filled with crying "NO" what the hell? You keep your crappy ending for yourself, cause it's "realistic" (which is a freaking joke in a game where you shoot fire out of your hands) and we'll have our happy endings at the same time, cause we like feeling like a hero that accomplished something and not some sort of failed tragic hero.

[Ridwan]

GodWood wrote...

M25105 wrote...
With low sales numbers.

Shadow of the Collosus couldn't break the 2 million mark either.

Red Dead sold 13 million, Reach and MGS3 sold close to 5 million.

Not that sales figures are relevant to what I said.

MGS has a large fan base and it's very popular brand in Japan. But it won't ever crack outside its own pool.
Red Dead is a new IP and everyone loves to be a cowboy, considering that it's easy to see why it sold.
Reach, Halo is largely played for MP. You might as well add COD too then since the single player campaigns have a "dark" feel to it, yet no one really cares for the SP everyone buys it for the MP.

[GodWood]

M25105 wrote...
MGS has a large fan base and it's very popular brand in Japan. But it won't ever crack outside its own pool.
Red Dead is a new IP and everyone loves to be a cowboy, considering that it's easy to see why it sold.
Reach, Halo is largely played for MP. You might as well add COD too then since the single player campaigns have a "dark" feel to it, yet no one really cares for the SP everyone buys it for the MP.

So?

[Dave of Canada]

M25105 wrote...

Fallout 2 had a happy ending

Forgot about that one, though Fallout 1/3/NV and Tactics all ended on bittersweet notes.

Warcraft 2

Alliance expedition sealing away their homeworld to protect it, trapping them on a dying world which is slowly ripping itself apart and forcing them to seek refuge on other planets is considered happy to you?

and 3.

The World Tree being destroyed by the Burning Legion and Arthas becoming Lich King isn't anyway good.

Half-Life had an ambigious ending, neither happy or dark, just open for a sequal making the player wondering what happened.

Stopping the Nihilanth (which implies it was being manipulated by G-Man and his "benefactors") and finding yourself trapped with a decision to join G-Man or die doesn't seem too happy to me, least of all when you discover the world has gone to **** while you were gone.

And Metal Gear Solid had a happy ending to my recollection.

Most Metal Gears end with you going "yay, we won" but quickly subverts it when you realize what transpired. For example, Ocelot being a double agent, Snake being infected by FOXDIE or Solidus being the "good guy".

It puts a spin on the ending of the game, either leaving it bittersweet or making the events feel less like "yay" and you realize everything you did was simply manipulating by higher ups.

M25105 wrote...

MGS has a large fan base and it's very popular brand in Japan.But it won't ever crack outside its own pool.

Except it has a pretty significant following outside of Japan?

Red Dead is a new IP and everyone loves to be a cowboy, considering that it's easy to see why it sold.

So you're dismissing the fact that the storytelling (which is pretty much universally praised by people who've played it) in the entire game is bleak... because people enjoy being a cowboy?

Reach, Halo is largely played for MP.

Doesn't stop the story from being dark and the ending being bittersweet as you fight to survive.

You might as well add COD too then since the single player campaigns have a "dark" feel to it, yet no one really cares for the SP everyone buys it for the MP.

But people still touch the single player aspect of the story, the events resonate with people despite the average Call of Duty player not finding storytelling interesting. Soap, Price and others have a following and when bad things happen to them, it's not a drop in the puddle which resonates.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 07 octobre 2012 - 10:18 .

[Ridwan]

GodWood wrote...

M25105 wrote...
MGS has a large fan base and it's very popular brand in Japan. But it won't ever crack outside its own pool.
Red Dead is a new IP and everyone loves to be a cowboy, considering that it's easy to see why it sold.
Reach, Halo is largely played for MP. You might as well add COD too then since the single player campaigns have a "dark" feel to it, yet no one really cares for the SP everyone buys it for the MP.

So?

People like to feel good about ending a game, include an option for a happy ending and get more sales rather than always try to appeal to an audience where you never break the five million mark (that's Bioware games).

[SirGladiator]

I definitely agree that I want a Happy Ending in DA3. Certainly DAO had one, ME and ME2's endings could be very happy. Obviously the original ME3 endings were horrible, the DA2 endings were somewhere in-between I suppose, but the key point is that happy endings are awesome, unhappy endings suck. Obviously there are people who like depressing stuff, and want a bad ending also, and that's fine. Quite frankly, the existance of a bad ending is a good thing, because it means you accomplished something by avoiding it. Its really hard to top what ME2 did, things could go SO wrong or SO right, and it depended entirely on your decision making. You could lose a number of your favorite teammates, or you could save them all, its all on you. That really is the ideal, the ability to have a happy or sad ending. If there is no way to have a happy ending, I wouldn't want to play the game, there would be no point. I also wouldn't mind if the happy ending was even harder to achieve than in ME2, the difficulty would just make it that much sweeter, but I think most everybody wants to have the chance to have a happy ending, I know I sure do.

[GodWood]

M25105 wrote...

GodWood wrote...

M25105 wrote...
MGS has a large fan base and it's very popular brand in Japan. But it won't ever crack outside its own pool.
Red Dead is a new IP and everyone loves to be a cowboy, considering that it's easy to see why it sold.
Reach, Halo is largely played for MP. You might as well add COD too then since the single player campaigns have a "dark" feel to it, yet no one really cares for the SP everyone buys it for the MP.

So?

People like to feel good about ending a game

How is this relevant to your 'rebuttal'? Or you did was offer alternative reasons for why people may have enjoyed the games I listed. 

include an option for a happy ending and get more sales rather than always try to appeal to an audience where you never break the five million mark (that's Bioware games).

Bioware have no chance of breaking the five million mark.

[Ridwan]

GodWood wrote...

M25105 wrote...

GodWood wrote...

M25105 wrote...
MGS has a large fan base and it's very popular brand in Japan. But it won't ever crack outside its own pool.
Red Dead is a new IP and everyone loves to be a cowboy, considering that it's easy to see why it sold.
Reach, Halo is largely played for MP. You might as well add COD too then since the single player campaigns have a "dark" feel to it, yet no one really cares for the SP everyone buys it for the MP.

So?

People like to feel good about ending a game

How is this relevant to your 'rebuttal'? Or you did was offer alternative reasons for why people may have enjoyed the games I listed. 

include an option for a happy ending and get more sales rather than always try to appeal to an audience where you never break the five million mark (that's Bioware games).

Bioware have no chance of breaking the five million mark.

If Skyrim can do it, then so can they.

[GodWood]

M25105 wrote...
If Skyrim can do it, then so can they.

lol.

Trying to reach Skyrim sales figures is beyond foolish. I've always said they should cut costs and stop with all the pointless features like "fully voiced cast", cinematics and so on and instead focus creating the game for the niche audience that appreciates their original RPGs.

I'm confident that although it'd have fewer sales it'd have a far greater profit. 

[TheJediSaint]

I don;t need a happy ending, I just want a "good" one. In my view, a good ending needs to wrap up the main plot and be thematically consistent with the beginning and middle.

Modifié par TheJediSaint, 07 octobre 2012 - 10:28 .

[Seboist]

M25105 wrote...

MGS has a large fan base and it's very popular brand in Japan. But it won't ever crack outside its own pool.
Red Dead is a new IP and everyone loves to be a cowboy, considering that it's easy to see why it sold.
Reach, Halo is largely played for MP. You might as well add COD too then since the single player campaigns have a "dark" feel to it, yet no one really cares for the SP everyone buys it for the MP.

Lol, wut?

[marshalleck]

GodWood wrote...

M25105 wrote...
If Skyrim can do it, then so can they.

lol.

Trying to reach Skyrim sales figures is beyond foolish. I've always said they should cut costs and stop with all the pointless features like "fully voiced cast", cinematics and so on and instead focus creating the game for the niche audience that appreciates their original RPGs.

I'm confident that although it'd have fewer sales it'd have a far greater profit. 

Origins did what, just over 3 million sales? More than that by now, but probably not 5 million. The problem is it took them 5+ years of development. Those sale numbers for such a long period of development make that sort of game 'unfeasible' to bean-counters, who have a lot of sway with how and where funds are allocated.

I'm really interested to see how the new Wasteland and Project Eternity end up doing beyond the scope of Kickstarter investors. 

Modifié par marshalleck, 07 octobre 2012 - 10:38 .

[DreGregoire]

I was just thinking some more about this thread and came to the conclusion that it might be useful to Devs and others if the term "Happy Ending" is better defined. Maybe people can give a list of five things that could happen that would make a happy ending for them. I mean I think there are too many assumptions as to what people mean by that term. I personally don't think a game where so many people/beings (untold numbers) die can have a true happy ending, but that's just my view.

Edit: And Anora and Alistair married is so not a happy ending in my book, at least for the two of them. LOL!
Edit Edit: and I did see the OP's singular definition of what is considered a happy ending for DAO but this isn't going to be DAO so I think it would be nice to expand upon what a person is looking for in this "happy ending."

examples
"The majority of companions live"
"Getting to marry or live on with our LI"
"The problems are solved and everybody lives happily ever after." Not likely to happen this way but it's a nice sentiment.
"The PC survives"
"There is cake for everyone!"

Modifié par DreGregoire, 07 octobre 2012 - 10:45 .

[Ridwan]

GodWood wrote...

M25105 wrote...
If Skyrim can do it, then so can they.

lol.

Trying to reach Skyrim sales figures is beyond foolish. I've always said they should cut costs and stop with all the pointless features like "fully voiced cast", cinematics and so on and instead focus creating the game for the niche audience that appreciates their original RPGs.

I'm confident that although it'd have fewer sales it'd have a far greater profit. 

Nothing is foolish, a person or a company can accomplish anything if they put their minds in to it. Skyrim had voice actors too, though granted they kept using the same 10 people over and over again and they didn't give you an entire monologue.

[CommanderVyse]

There should NOT be a "choose your own ending". No final room choice of A,B, or C. The ending should be be the cumulative result of actions long before the climate. (Ex. Dark Ritual Choice before you march to Denerim vs. ME3)

At least one option for those choices should be happy. An ending that lets you know that you did good. Where the characters you care about are safe and the cause you fight for is won.

Only about 40% of us reach the ending anyways. We are the 40% who care enough to do so, the 40% who start a new game right after. Shouldn't you give a ending that is worth more people striving to achieve?

Modifié par wwinters99, 07 octobre 2012 - 11:18 .

[Knight of Dane]

MillKill wrote...

Tragic endings are far more emotionally powerful and memorable. Bittersweet is the happiest I'd like.

That's entirely up to the presentation and receivers mindset. Happy endings can be just as emotional, it depends on the struggle.

[Fast Jimmy]

GodWood wrote...

M25105 wrote...
If Skyrim can do it, then so can they.

lol.

Trying to reach Skyrim sales figures is beyond foolish. I've always said they should cut costs and stop with all the pointless features like "fully voiced cast", cinematics and so on and instead focus creating the game for the niche audience that appreciates their original RPGs.

I'm confident that although it'd have fewer sales it'd have a far greater profit. 

That is a pretty foolish, if you ask me. DA:O sold almost 5 million by being a game with many old-school mechanics for role playing, such as non-combat skills, attributes, a silent protagonist, etc. ME1 sold four million with similar features. 



ME3 sold four million copies even with the largest outcry over story I've ever seen for a video game. If, instead, the ending had been done really well, with a dozen different endings and all of your choices coming into play (rather than just pigeon hiking everything based on a decision posed in the last ten minutes) and you could go back to ME1 and 2 and have markedly different outcomes of you did your choices over...

I see NO reason why it wouldn't have broken five million in sales. Heck, I wouldn't have been surprised of it had been closer to ten. If the endings had the same care and attention as, say, Rannoch or Thchanka, the game would have been received with tons of praise and tons more sales. 

[Bfler]

GodWood wrote...

Bioware have no chance of breaking the five million mark.

If they squanter their previous reputation with rushed games like DA2 or ME3, then no.

[Dutchess]

I'm not demanding a happy ending. All I want is a true, more or less concrete ending (like DAO), instead of cliffhanger being shoved down my throat.

[septembervirgin]

 I think Thedas should burn and every companion NPC should burn with it.  Hawke should be slain by the Seekers.  The Warden should die in the Deep Roads.

Modifié par septembervirgin, 07 octobre 2012 - 12:28 .

[Veloric Wu]

the ending of DA3 will be:

Control:
The Inquisitioner uses The Crucible Blood Magic to control all darkspawn

or

Synthesis:
Create a synergy between Templars and Magi so everyone becomes mage-plar.....temmage....whatever you want to call it...:wizard:happiness everywhere:wizard: PEACE .....

[SpEcIaLRyAn]

Well who knows how the game will be now, The press release of them announcing the game says they have been working on it for 2 years already. DA2 was out like a year and half later after Origins. Now I am not saying DA3 will be good cause frankly idk. All I do know is that, as many have said, after DA2 and the ME3 ending this is Bioware's last chance at redemption. I am tempted to preorder but after being let down with DA2 and ME3's ending I think I will try and hold out for some reviews first.

[Cimeas]

Games, unlike movies, deserve happy endings, and the reasons are very simple.

1) Movies are almost always less than 2 hours long. A Bioware RPG is usually 30-50 hours. More time invested means more investment in the characters and story.

2) Most importantly, GAMES ARE ACTIVE. If I press 'PLAY' on a movie and leave it for 2 hours, it will be over when I come back. If I press play in a game then I'll be right where I left off.

IN games *we* fight the enemies, *we* make the choices, *we* struggle and conquer and feel success and failure. But after those 50 hours, after I've killed the hardest boss and done the most challenging puzzle and assembled this team of characters that I care about, to fail is ridiculous; It is taking control away from the player.

You're telling me I can do everything right, I can spent dozens of hours of my time and defeat every challenge you throw at me and I still lose?

That is what is ridiculous about game endings. Movies have no challenge and require no skill or thought because they don't depend on the viewer. Games do.