239 réponses à ce sujet

[LobselVith8]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Try rival-romancing her. At least with that she breaks that stupid mirror and rages out.

Merrill will stop her attempts to rebuild the Eluvian on Friendship as well. It's a little strange for Hawke to be telling Merrill that she's wrong about things that he's completely ignorant about as a human who knows absolutely nothing about the Dalish.

[StElmo]

Xilizhra wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

Even if I was inclined to romance Merrill, I wouldn't.

It's one thing to be naive. It's another to still be that way after living in Kirkwall for seven years.

Merrill is so thoroughly detached from reality at times that I'm tempted to think she has some sort of developmental disorder. Most of Hawke's innuendos and flirtations soar clear over her head. I struggle to believe that she even knows what sex is. I could never romance her because I'd feel like a predator.

But I don't think that Bioware is going to just rehash a character they already did, so I think we're fine.

I think a lot of the time, she's kidding, and she sees more than she initially lets on. She certainly she seems knowledgeable enough about sex when she basically pulls Hawke into bed, after all, and when she does things like try to find Anders' dirty spells...
Then again, you're not even attracted to women, are you?

Thats a relief. I still haven't finished the game (never picked up DA2 until recently because of fan reactions etc.)...

Anyway, I was getting the impression from some of these posts that hawke somehow tricked her into doing the sex, which would be really really bad, but that sounds like its not the case.

I think a lot of people on this forum simply didn't give her character any chance or paid any attention, as her maturity is quite clearly a lot higher then on the surface, as you mention above. And we all know she is around hawkes age and definitely an adult (given she is the wardens age in DA:O)

Modifié par StElmo, 08 octobre 2012 - 07:51 .

[StElmo]

NUM13ER wrote...

Must be all the years of having 20 somethings play 16 year olds on television making people forget what actual young people look like. I can't see why anyone think she looks too young. I know women with slender frames like her who would be a bit insulted if you suggest all women are instantly buxom and curvy once they turn 18.

Reason comes to the fore once again. Good point.

[StElmo]

jennamarae wrote...

Seeming childlike doesn't always equate with being a child. With Merrill it has nothing to do with her physical appearance and everything to do with her thought process about some things. That doesn't make her a bad character, or badly written, and it doesn't mean she's a 12 year old. It just means that she hasn't had to grow up yet being as sheltered and secluded as she's been her entire life.

I think some other people on the forum are inferring that romancing her is essentially making your hawke character a predatory creep - which I think, given what I know currently about Merrill, DA2 and what I have witnessed, is pretty absurd.

[StElmo]

randomcheeses wrote...

It wasn't Merrill's young looking face that annoyed me, it was the fact that over seven years of being involved in a range of incredibly dangerous and complicated situations, her mental maturity never seemed to change. She started off immature and head in the clouds, which was fine, but still being that way seven years later made me wonder if she'd sustained a head wound right at the end of year one and never quite recovered.

Because thats her personality, your personality rarely changes much as you get older once you become an adult. All men like to think they become a gandalf wise when they get older, but they dont, most of them are stuck in their ways their whole life and never get "wise".

[Wulfram]

I don't think Merrill is very like Tali. She's more ME1 Liara, if Liara was studying Reaper tech.

[LobselVith8]

Han Shot First wrote...

Agreed.

She looked like a 12 year old boy and acted like one as well. The 'achievement' for her romance should have been called The Sandusky.



Anyone who romanced Merrill is bad and should feel bad.

I don't see why you think Merrill is a child. Is it because she refuses to be passive about the plight of her people? Is it because she studied the lore on the Eluvian and extrapolated information from the shard? Is it because she thought an invaluable piece of technology was worth preserving, when the entire premise of the Dalish is to preserve elven culture, history, and knowledge?

Merrill was an adult, and an ambitious person who wanted to overturn centuries of a dwindling culture to irrevocably change the People for the better.

[StElmo]

FINE HERE wrote...

 I couldn't stand her and rarely took her along...

Hence why you never learned that she has a lot more layers then that.

You can't really criticise a character you clearly didn't give a chance or pay any attention to. She is far more mature then you suggest - which is quite frankly, a disturbing suggestion.

Modifié par StElmo, 08 octobre 2012 - 08:05 .

[TEWR]

John Epler wrote...

Saying 'I wasn't a fan of Merrill' is okay.

Saying 'if you romanced her you're probably a pedophile', or at least heavily implying that - not okay.

So let's not do it.

Oh but you see Mr. Epler, it'll never stop! Anyone that romances Merrill must be one. They can't possibly like her for her intelligence, or her wit that goes unnoticed, or for being a badass adorable. Nope, it's because we're pedophiles.

*Sigh* 

I can't even begin to fathom how many times I've seen posters say such things.

garrusfan19 wrote...

Anyone agree

Yeah... I disagree. Vehemently.

[Orian Tabris]

garrusfan1 wrote...

 I know some people liked her but when she was your LI it felt ..... wrong if you know what I mean because they made her act so young. It may be just me but please don't do that again. Anyone agree

She seems no younger than 18, and people have gotten married at 18 years of age, anyway. I love Merrill, and her romance is one of BW's best romances IMHO. Actually living with the companion makes more sense than the occasional holding hands or (often in Izzy's and Zev's cases) having sex, as part of a romance.

[StElmo]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

John Epler wrote...

Saying 'I wasn't a fan of Merrill' is okay.

Saying 'if you romanced her you're probably a pedophile', or at least heavily implying that - not okay.

So let's not do it.

Oh but you see Mr. Epler, it'll never stop! Anyone that romances Merrill must be one. They can't possibly like her for her intelligence, or her wit that goes unnoticed, or for being a badass adorable. Nope, it's because we're pedophiles.

*Sigh* 

I can't even begin to fathom how many times I've seen posters say such things.

garrusfan19 wrote...

Anyone agree

Yeah... I disagree. Vehemently.

As someone still playing DA2 for the first time (act 2 atm), I wasn't aware so many people were making such absurd claims such as this.

Typical gamers, they'll get all upset if a character isn't a buxom, dirty, sex obsessed pirate - because "that is what all mature women must act like".

Meanwhile, half of them are playing dead or alive and think THAT is okay... because the boobs override the dubiously young character faces.... or they are buying into dubious, creepy "anime" culture because "oh thats okay because it is the culture - we can like that!"

Sometimes I hate the gaming community.

I said it before and I'll say it again, my first impression of Merrill was a 23 year old elf with her head in the clouds, with a layered and endearing personality type - who wasn't "helpless", simply uninformed and could also kick some major ass if she needed to.

Modifié par StElmo, 08 octobre 2012 - 08:20 .

[LobselVith8]

Han Shot First wrote...

Yes, because she does look like one and she continues to act like one even though the events of the game span a decade.

A bad character design combined with lackluster character development, combine to make the Merrill romance creepy.

Merrill doesn't act like a child. It makes little sense to me that people think that simply because Merrill is dealing with culture shock when it comes to human culture, that it means she is a child. People tend to do the exact same thing when they judge people from other cultures, and I think that is a huge mistake. Culture shock doesn't mean someone is childish or stupid.

Also, Merrill tends to be sarcastic a lot[/b], which I think goes over some peoples' heads because of the accent of the VA. She uses the same tone if you return to the clan, and she talks about how "wonderful" the Alienage is. For instance:

Anders: Do the Dalish ever have fancy parties? I always imagined they celebrated most big occasions by eating mushrooms and acorns. And maybe dancing naked around a campfire. 

Merrill: You know, I was wondering when the naked dancing was going to start. And the human sacrifice. I mean, you just can't throw a decent party without kidnapping a human child and offering her entrails to the sky gods. 

Anders: Really? 

Merrill: No.

Even the characters can't tell at times.

[TEWR]

Orian Tabris wrote...

She seems no younger than 18

She's older. In her early twenties in DAO. I think... she was 21 in DAO? So she'd be 21-22 in Act 1, and 28-29 in Act 3.

StElmo wrote...

Sometimes I hate the gaming community

Certainly does make me want to Picard Facepalm most of the time.

[StElmo]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...



She's older. In her early twenties in DAO. I think... she was 21 in DAO? So she'd be 21-22 in Act 1, and 28-29 in Act 3.

StElmo wrote...

Sometimes I hate the gaming community

Certainly does make me want to Picard Facepalm most of the time.

hahahaha,

BioWare rep said she was the age of the warden in DA:O - not sure what that means, but she's def an adult then.

and yep, picard facepalm constantly.

[Knight of Dane]

DarkKnightHolmes wrote...

Knight of Dane wrote...

BouncyFrag wrote...

EpicBoot2daFace wrote...

Merrill is Tali for Dragon Age. She fills the same role, more or less.

But Tali doesn't get her people killed by dabbling in things she shouldn't have (her father did though ). If anything she's the opposite.  During her trial in ME2 she demonstrates that she was extraordinarily careful when dealing with the geth technology she'd sent to her people for research. Merrill liked the pretty, shiny mirror and who knows what dark whispers it seduced her weak mind with.

Haha, can anyone spell to biased?

Do you think Merrill moved away from her clan for giggles? It was her number one safety rule so her people wouldn't suffer if she screwed up.
That follish clan gets themselves killed by not investigating their own corruption properly just like the Quarians can in ME3 by attacking the geth against Shepards words.
Their idiocy can end them by the hands of the geth.
Just the same, the elves can be saved too, but only if Hawke goes out of his/her way to please them.

What are you talking about? Quarians are winning the war in ME3. The fact that Geth have to rely on Reaper technology really shows the real naive side. Plus maybe you're Shepard told them not to go to war but I gladly stood with the quarians as we slaughted all geth.

In a war where they are the bad guys, but that is a talk for ME3 forum, buh-bye.

[Knight of Dane]

Terraforming2154 wrote...

Knight of Dane wrote...

I don't want any romances like in DA:O and 2, I will be happy and impressed if the devs give us new ones.

But not because of Merrill, she was my favorite romance.

Agreed. On both counts.

<3

[Fox In The Box]

StElmo wrote...

As someone still playing DA2 for the first time (act 2 atm), I wasn't aware so many people were making such absurd claims such as this.

Typical gamers, they'll get all upset if a character isn't a buxom, dirty, sex obsessed pirate - because "that is what all mature women must act like".

Is "dirty, sex obsessed pirate" really all you see in Isabela?

Modifié par Fox In The Box, 08 octobre 2012 - 08:35 .

[StElmo]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

 the accent of the VA.

As someone with welsh family members I can also add, that yes, Welsh people have very "innocent" sounding tone, its hard to detect sarcasm etc.

Modifié par StElmo, 08 octobre 2012 - 08:37 .

[mousestalker]

Why must all future companions dislike Merill? She may not even appear in DA3 (although that would be sad). It seems rather silly to insist that there be dialogue involving various characters negative opinion about a companion in another game.

Let DA3 stand on its own.

[jennamarae]

StElmo wrote...

I think some other people on the forum are inferring that romancing her is essentially making your hawke character a predatory creep - which I think, given what I know currently about Merrill, DA2 and what I have witnessed, is pretty absurd.

Others perhaps. That's never been my stance, however. Hawke doesn't turn into a predator in-game. It's my own hangup based on her thought process when it comes to her mirror and demons.

___________________________

LobselVith8 wrote...

Considering Merrill wasn't serious when she told Anders that, and later chastises him for thinking that any spirit is good - because she explicitly points out that all spirits are dangerous - it's disingenuous to say that Merrill is naive about the
denizens of the Fade. She isn't; she knows they are dangerous. The situation with Audacity is unique because he was sundered from the Fade, and is trapped in a totem. It isn't until Marethari decides to let it loose that it endangers anyone. 

Yes, she knows they are dangerous but still chooses to seek ones help because she thinks she knows what she is doing in the same way that social smokers know that cigarettes are dangerous but think they won't get emphesyma from them because they don't smoke ten packs a day. You only discover Marethari has foolishly intervened when taking Merrill to talk to the demon to ask for it's help again. Had Marethari not intervened, Merrill may very well have ended up freeing the demon herself because she is that far gone when it comes to that mirror and thinks of nothing but restoring it in an effort to reclaim the lost history of her people.

Knowing something is dangerous means little if you still believe nothing will happen because you're careful. When you first meet her she tells you that demons are just spirits and that it's not their fault they are what they are. It's only when you take the rivalry path, telling her that she's wrong the entire time, that she finally sees the light as it were but by then it's too late. If that's not being naive, then I don't know what is.

Edit: Fixed formatting.. Weird things going on there.

Modifié par jennamarae, 08 octobre 2012 - 08:38 .

[StElmo]

Fox In The Box wrote...

StElmo wrote...

As someone still playing DA2 for the first time (act 2 atm), I wasn't aware so many people were making such absurd claims such as this.

Typical gamers, they'll get all upset if a character isn't a buxom, dirty, sex obsessed pirate - because "that is what all mature women must act like".

Is "dirty, sex obsessed pirate" really all you see in Isabela?

Still playing the game, but no. However, if people can't see the depth in Merrill, I imagine that is what they see in Isabella - given how shallow they view the game characters.

[LobselVith8]

Plaintiff wrote...

Even if I was inclined to romance Merrill, I wouldn't.

It's one thing to be naive. It's another to still be that way after living in Kirkwall for seven years.

Merrill is so thoroughly detached from reality at times that I'm tempted to think she has some sort of developmental disorder. Most of Hawke's innuendos and flirtations soar clear over her head. I struggle to believe that she even knows what sex is[/b]. I could never romance her because I'd feel like a predator.

But I don't think that Bioware is going to just rehash a character they already did, so I think we're fine.

Merrill is intelligent about a plethora of issues, especially magic. She can identify if a person is possessed, and can distinguish the type of demon inhabiting the Profane Abomination. Sometimes, people think Merrill is naive because of her Dalish views, especially her views about spirits. The conversation between Anders and Merrill makes it clear that the distinction is Andrastian (religious), which is why Merrill doesn't share Anders view:

Anders: Maybe you don't really understand the difference between spirits and demons. 

Merrill: Did I ask you? 

Anders: Spirits were the first children of the Maker, but He turned his back on them to dote on His mortal creations. The ones who resented this became demons, driven to take everything mortals had and gain back the Maker's favor.

Merrill: Your "Maker" is a story you humans use to explain the world. We have our own stories. I don't need to borrow yours. 

Why would Merrill share Anders' view when it's made clear that the distinction between spirits and demons is strictly religious? The Dalish believe in the Creators, not the Maker, so they wouldn't see spirits and demons as the Children of the Maker. In fact, Merrill acknowledges that the denizens of the Fade are different, but doesn't think that means the Chantry is correct in their religious views:

Anders: Do Dalish honestly not recognize the difference between demons and beneficial spirits? 

Merrill: We've never thought of the Fade as the home of our gods. It is another realm, another people's home. No different or more foreign than, say, Orzammar. 

Varric: You can say that again. 

Anders: But have you never studied the types of demons? They break down very clearly into different sins--

Merrill: Spirits differ from each other, just as you and Hawke and Isabela are all human. More or less... 

The fact that Merrill acknowledges that the denizens of the Fade are different, but that the Dalish don't see them as spirits and demons (in Andrastian terms), is a point that many people miss. Merrill deals with culture shock when it comes to human culture, but she's a very intelligent person.


Does this seem like a woman who is ignorant about everything, who doesn't know what sex is? Come on now. I bring up these quotes because Anders also assumes that he knows better than Merrill, but he's wrong. She's clearly an informed, intelligent woman:

Merrill: Are you all right? 

Anders: I nearly killed an innocent girl. How could I be all right? 

Merrill: I'm sorry. 

Anders: You're sorry? For me? This could be you! You could be the next monster threatening helpless girls! 

Merrill: Anders... There's no such thing as a good spirit. There never was. All spirits are dangerous. I understood that. I'm sorry that you didn't.

You may think Merrill is simply ignorant, but you're wrong.

[Wulfram]

Hanz54321 wrote...

You know - the title of this thread says "Love Interest LIKE Merill."

But it occurs to me that all I'm seeing is talk about Merill, not a potential DA3 love interest.

Well, how can you talk about a theoretical LI who is defined only as "like Merrill", except by talking about Merrill?

Modifié par Wulfram, 08 octobre 2012 - 08:40 .