689 réponses à ce sujet

[Ithurael]

Redbelle wrote...

BeefheartSpud wrote...

Reading Blueprotoss' "arguments" is a guilty pleasure of mine.

If Blueprotoss did not exist, we would have to invent him!

I may need to revamp the drinking game...

[BaladasDemnevanni]

Blueprotoss wrote...

Yet you're here being completely off-topic and inslting someone, which means you aren't practicing what you preach about "trolls" since you are in actuality a "troll" yourself.  I'm no "troll" but when someone pulls the "troll" card then they have already lost the discussion and don't care what emotion gets released.

You misunderstand. My post was not intended for your benefit. It was to warn people who, as luck would have it, have never had the displeasure of reading your posts in the past. I think it's important that they know what they're getting themselves into. I lose nothing.

[silverexile17s]

BaladasDemnevanni wrote...

Blueprotoss wrote...

Yet you're here being completely off-topic and inslting someone, which means you aren't practicing what you preach about "trolls" since you are in actuality a "troll" yourself.  I'm no "troll" but when someone pulls the "troll" card then they have already lost the discussion and don't care what emotion gets released.

You misunderstand. My post was not intended for your benefit. It was to warn people who, as luck would have it, have never had the displeasure of reading your posts in the past. I think it's important that they know what they're getting themselves into. I lose nothing.

I could have used that head's up a while ago.
It's hard to take Blueprotoss' posts seriously when he keeps saying that Star Wars is several galaxies. He ACTUALLY said that KotOR, Republic Commando and The Force Unleashed are all is seperate Galaxies across the Star Wars universe, not one galaxy over several time periods.
HOW can he not know that's wrong?!

Modifié par silverexile17s, 25 octobre 2012 - 09:17 .

[Redbelle]

iakus wrote...

Arcian wrote...

iakus wrote...

Bioware half-listened.  They heard complaints, but failed to ask why people were complaining.  Thus we get superfical patchwork "fixes" while the inherent weaknesses remained.

Mass Effect is BioWare's Titanic. Many claimed it was unsinkable, but a single iceberg sank the entire vessel.

One can take the easy road and blame it on the iceberg (the endings), or one can be realistic and realize that it was the ship (the franchise) that was poorly constructed from the very beginning. If the ship was really unsinkable, it would not have sunk no matter how many icebergs you sent its way.

True.  But by the same token, if it hadn't hit the "iceberg" it could have gotten to port relatively intact, despite its flaws

Amoung Titanic's design flaws was that it was a single skinned hull. One hull breach gave access to the ships comartments

Brunnel's ship the SS Great Western was constructed as a hull within a hull. So even on an occaision where it did suffer a hull breach, it was reported that the passenger's didn't notice.

However I bet the captain was thinking... "ohmygodohmygodohmygod! I dinged it!"

[Redbelle]

[quote]silverexile17s wrote...

[quote]iakus wrote...

[quote]silverexile17s wrote...

I think the endings were poorly receved because they were the only endings. If there had been OTHER, brighter endings to COMPLEMENT these endings, and highlight each other, the fan responce would not have been NEARLY as bad. you DON'T have any of those, the overwhelmengly bittersweet endings KILL any desire to replay the game. DA:O had that. with the "Deal" with Morrigen, or letting Alister sacrifice himself in your place. It STUNG, but the OPTION was there. They weren't ALL SOO bittersweet that you never wanted to play more then once.
/quote]

QFT

If the players go "Waitaminute that was one of the good endings?"  You screwed up

[/quote]
Exactally. If the player can't make heads or tails of what happened without some form of extention to it, you KNOW you did something wrong.

[/quote]

On the scale of awesomeness. Games with endings that have the demise of all life the galaxy. Plus an ending where you kill the bad guy, smoke his cigar, drink his sherry and go off into the sunset with your main squeeze on your arm. Plus multiple endings in between those two............ are........... awesome!

The best thing on release day of ME3? We didn't know how it would end. We only knew that ME2 had pulled out a corker of an end mission with flair and pazzazz. So having the guys who developed that develop ME3 should have added up to a humdinger of a finale. Where did the calculations go so soooo wrong?!?

And yes these quotes are messed up. Can't see where the problem is though.

Modifié par Redbelle, 25 octobre 2012 - 10:48 .

[silverexile17s]

...
@Redbelle
I think you mixed up the qoutes on that.

[Redbelle]

silverexile17s wrote...

...
@Redbelle
I think you mixed up the qoutes on that.

Completely. All I did was hit reply. It happens sometimes

[Iakus]

Redbelle wrote...

silverexile17s wrote...

...
@Redbelle
I think you mixed up the qoutes on that.

Completely. All I did was hit reply. It happens sometimes

Was my bad, didn't put a /quote fully in brackets.

corrected

[silverexile17s]

@iakus
Roger.

[drayfish]

Paulomedi wrote...

Ithurael wrote...

Redbelle wrote...

BeefheartSpud wrote...

Reading Blueprotoss' "arguments" is a guilty pleasure of mine.

If Blueprotoss did not exist, we would have to invent him!

I may need to revamp the drinking game...

1 sip for "to be fair"

1 sip for "strawmen"

2 sips for "logic fallacies"

2 sips for "ironic"

chug if he makes a totally nonsensical post. (it's quite often, believe me

I cannot condone this kind of behaviour.


Alcohol poisoning is a real and serious danger.


Particularly if you include:

2 sips for faulty distinctions between 'fact' and 'opinion'

1 sip for accusing others of reducing their argument to insults - at the exact moment that he/she is being needlessly insulting

2 sips for a reference to a completely seperate fiction, while arguing that others should not compare different fictions

Chug if he refuses to believe definitions offered in Dictionaries because language itself is 'subjective'


But again: life is too precious to throw away in such a frivolous manner.  Do not play this game.

Modifié par drayfish, 25 octobre 2012 - 11:10 .

[ld1449]

Can we all just agree he's a moron and move on to something more productive? Like...I don't know...knitting for instance? Watching paint dry? Observing the process of evaporation? Almost anything else that isn't related to him and his "infallible" logic.

[The Spamming Troll]

personally i cant wait to play ME4 and find out WTF happened in ME3.

am i right?

not that i am actually gonna play ME4. im not so sure.

Modifié par The Spamming Troll, 26 octobre 2012 - 12:02 .

[darkway1]

The real reason why people did not like the ending is because people could not believe that a AAA game developer could be responsible for such a plot ridden,pathetic ending to such a ground breaking franchise......mega fail.

[KevShep]

1. The ending was an EXACT copy of Deus Ex, from the four choices to even the consequences of those choices are the EXACT SAME THING!

2. ME3's ending was ok for a stand alone game, it was NOT ok for an ENTIRE series!

3. You NEVER introduce a new villain in the last 10 minutes of the whole seires.

[Grubas]

i didnt like the endgame. plays like multiplaye
r, only boring.

Modifié par Grubas, 26 octobre 2012 - 01:19 .

[Ithurael]

drayfish wrote...

I cannot condone this kind of behaviour.


Alcohol poisoning is a real and serious danger.


Particularly if you include:

2 sips for faulty distinctions between 'fact' and 'opinion'

1 sip for accusing others of reducing their argument to insults - at the exact moment that he/she is being needlessly insulting

2 sips for a reference to a completely seperate fiction, while arguing that others should not compare different fictions

Chug if he refuses to believe definitions offered in Dictionaries because language itself is 'subjective'


But again: life is too precious to throw away in such a frivolous manner.  Do not play this game.

Done and Done!:wizard:

[silverexile17s]

drayfish wrote...

Paulomedi wrote...

Ithurael wrote...

Redbelle wrote...

BeefheartSpud wrote...

Reading Blueprotoss' "arguments" is a guilty pleasure of mine.

If Blueprotoss did not exist, we would have to invent him!

I may need to revamp the drinking game...

1 sip for "to be fair"

1 sip for "strawmen"

2 sips for "logic fallacies"

2 sips for "ironic"

chug if he makes a totally nonsensical post. (it's quite often, believe me

I cannot condone this kind of behaviour.


Alcohol poisoning is a real and serious danger.


Particularly if you include:

2 sips for faulty distinctions between 'fact' and 'opinion'

1 sip for accusing others of reducing their argument to insults - at the exact moment that he/she is being needlessly insulting

2 sips for a reference to a completely seperate fiction, while arguing that others should not compare different fictions

Chug if he refuses to believe definitions offered in Dictionaries because language itself is 'subjective'


But again: life is too precious to throw away in such a frivolous manner.  Do not play this game.

@Drayfish
Okay, so:
1 sip for "To be fair."
1 sip for "Strawmen" (Honestly, WHAT is up with that? Is he/she the Scarecrow?)
1 sip for accusing others of reducing their argument to insults - at the exact moment that he/she is being needlessly insulting.
2 sips for "logic fallacies."
2 sips for "ironic."
2 sips for faulty distinctions between 'fact' and 'opinion.'
2 sips for a reference to a completely seperate fiction (most likely Satr Wars), while arguing that others should not compare different fictions.
chug if he makes a totally nonsensical post. (Like saying Star Wras is multiple galaxies, instead of a single galaxy told from different time periods O_o)
Chug if he refuses to believe definitions offered in Dictionaries because language itself is 'subjective'

.... Yeah, you're right. I'd die LONG before I'd ever finish that game.

[silverexile17s]

The Spamming Troll wrote...

personally i cant wait to play ME4 and find out WTF happened in ME3.

am i right?

not that i am actually gonna play ME4. im not so sure.

In all likelyhood, they WON'T continue from whene ME3 ended. Think about it. They would most likely have to pick and choose one of the ending options to go from if they did that, as I don't think the current tech level can handel that many branching main plots and their accomping stroylines. And picking an ending out of THAT mess to canonize and build on is like tap-dancing Gene Kelly-style on top of an anti-tank mine while juggling armed grenades.
No way in HELL they'll risk that. They're STILL feeling the effects of that mess throughout their fan base. This new game, with a new protagonist, is most likely them trying to BURY Shepard's story, since the endings they picked for it had nowhere NEAR the good reception they apparently thought it would. Abandon ship on that story.

[Ithurael]

silverexile17s wrote...

.... Yeah, you're right. I'd die LONG before I'd ever finish that game.

I did it...

I was reincarnated as a volus...a biotic god

[silverexile17s]

Ithurael wrote...

silverexile17s wrote...

.... Yeah, you're right. I'd die LONG before I'd ever finish that game.

I did it...

I was reincarnated as a volus...a biotic god

So that was YOU sweeping over those Collectors on Glacier like a biotic wind?
...This is a joke.

[ErrorTagUnknown]

arial wrote...

 The real reason the ending(s) were poorly recieved is quite simple.

since the day ME3 was anounced, people started speculating on what features it would have, how the story would progress, etc.

It came to the state where No game could realisticly match what fans expected.

When the game finally came out, and it could not live up to what people were sure it would be, people looked for every possible reason to blame for their dissatisfaction.

this is what i've always said.   you think about somethign to much, nothing will ever live up to your expectations.

[Necrotron]

How many times do I have to one star this thread for the completely wrong generalizations of those disappointed by the ending for it to leave the first page?

[silverexile17s]

@Bathaius.
Right. Back to the matter at hand.
If something is extremely bittersweet, do you WANT it more then once?
That paragraph pretty much sums up my ME3 experience, and what I personally feel is wrong with the endings fundamentally. I mean, you need brighter ending options to BALANCE out that, or it will KILL any desire to replay the game. At least, any desire to FINISH it again.

If I may, I would reference Dragon Age: Origins, in my opinion, set the bar on how to get THE perfect mix of sweet and bittersweet for a game ending. (In MY opinion, at least)
You could take a "Dark Bargain" with Morrigen in order to survive with everyone. You could let Alister sacrifice himself in your place. Or, you could die the classic Hero's Death. Yes, the choices in that could sting, depending on player preferences, but not to the point that they DROVE you away from ever finishing the game again.
In this, the endings, even with the increassed clairaty the Extended Cut brings, are ALL so overwhelemgly bittersweet that it scorns any desire to experence them more then once. That (in my opinion) BS move with the "Refuse" option did little to smooth THAT out, making you feel like you could no longer even deny the choice. Instant lose. They ALL have faults.

Control: You throw away your rights as a living being, and work counter to your intention of freeing the galaxy from the infulence of the Reapers by making them everlastingly DEPENDANT on the existance of these Abominations, after EVERYTHING they have done.

Destroy: Validate the Reapers theory that organics will ALWAYS destroy synthetics over themselves. Acceptible for renegades, but paragons are screwed over hard.

Synthesis: In my opinion, the worst of them all. This is to me, the anti-thesis of everything you fought for in the series. The entire fight against the Reapers was on the premise that we had the right to make our own choices. That we didn't need them literally playing God to all life in the galaxy. The fight that we ALL had the right to adapt and evolve in our own way, and that we would reach our own unique form of perfection, on our OWN terms. Synthesis completely invaladates this, in that it violates the rights of all life in the galaxy, by doing exactally what the Reapers did -Forcing all life down a spicific path, not giving them a choice, either to reach that road on their own terms, or if they even wanted to GO down that road to begin with.

Extending the endings didn't alter the core problems with what was wrong. It just covered it up. And there is still nothing showing what difffinitively happens to the Normandy crew.
These, in my own opinion, are the things that are fundimentally wrong with the endings, and why they were not receeved well among the gamers.

I ALSO think announcing another ME game THIS soon after that fiasco, and after the co-founders left, is a BAD idea, since it makes it look like:

A, they want to get everyone's mind off ME3 by enticing them with a new entry, to make us forget all about the way Shepard's story ended, since the reaction they got was obviously NOT what they expected for what was most likely their crown jewel.

And B, Announcing a game this early is a horrid idea because (since I doubt they can form three seperate main storylines and varianing sub-plots to go with them, and impliment them into one game),
the only option is to either cannonize one of the endings, (which is like Gene Kelly-style dancing on an Anti-Tank mine while juggling active hand-grenades - a bad idea),

do a prequel, (which would be redundant and somewhat pointless, since it's adding on to a story that they have REPATEDLY said they've iron-clad shut),

do a spin-off that runs paralell (Same problem as a prequel -expanding on a story with no impact on it's end),
put it far, far into the future where NONE of what you did has any dicernable effect on what's happened (Too far off from where we were before. It would be disorenting, and not reconizable as what we've come to know. And I doubt they would risk straying that far from what they've formed)

Or (one of Blueprotoss' ideas -ugh), have it be in another, seperate galaxy, with everything thrown out and replaced/redone. (He said this worked with Star Wars. But, that was because he thought Knights of the Old Republic, Republic Commando, and The Force Unleashed all took place in seperate galaxies across a universe, not the same galaxy with different time periods O_o. Besides, same as doing it too far forward - nothing would be reconizable as ME anymore)

And THAT'S everything that, in my opinion, is the real reason that the endings were poorly recieved, and why I'm Not quite looking forward to the next game.

Modifié par silverexile17s, 26 octobre 2012 - 06:13 .

[Redbelle]

At the very least, DA:O prepped you before hand for your choices. All throughout the journey you are told that being a grey warden reduces your life span and that death and grey wardening go hand in hand. As such, when you learn how to kill an old god, well if you drive morrigan away you can die. Or, as I prefer, get the traitor king pretender to do it... Mwaahaha, oh wait he's a hero now? Scratch that.

Going with the Morrigan option though makes her witchhunt DLC make alot of sense. Unless you choose to stab her and watch her body fall through the portal.

Mass Effect, by contrast, was a game with no foreshadowing about the final fate of the hero. You were never told being commander Shepard will get you killed. If those dream sequences had a Babylon 5 style 'If you go to Zarhadoom you will die I would have had time to come to terms with how my Shepards fate would save the galaxy. Instead I was given ten minutes of waffle talk and left with an open mouth staring at the screen thinking "That's it"?

Modifié par Redbelle, 26 octobre 2012 - 07:10 .