689 réponses à ce sujet

[silverexile17s]

Redbelle wrote...

At the very least, DA:O prepped you before hand for your choices. All throughout the journey you are told that being a grey warden reduces your life span and that death and grey wardening go hand in hand. As such, when you learn how to kill an old god, well if you drive morrigan away you can die. Or, as I prefer, get the traitor king pretender to do it... Mwaahaha, oh wait he's a hero now? Scratch that.

Going with the Morrigan option though makes her witchhunt DLC make alot of sense. Unless you choose to stab her and watch her body fall through the portal.

Mass Effect, by contrast, was a game with no foreshadowing about the final fate of the hero. You were never told being commander Shepard will get you killed. If those dream sequences had a Babylon 5 style 'If you go to Zarhadoom you will die I would have had time to come to terms with how my Shepards fate would save the galaxy. Instead I was given ten minutes of waffle talk and left with an open mouth staring at the screen thinking "That's it"?

Yeah. THAT didn't help the situation either.

[Arxduke]

I just hate how you keep telling your team/squad that nobody is dying, that we'll all see another day, and when they try to go all death and depressing on you, you are given the option to tell them not to talk like that. Made me truly believe that the happy ending I wanted was on it's way. The whole time. But NOPE. Screw all the comforting remarks, the promises and reassurances. Shepard is just going to go and die now. The ending was abrupt and made me angry that all of those comforting convo's were void and pretty much false.

[Reorte]

Arxduke wrote...

I just hate how you keep telling your team/squad that nobody is dying, that we'll all see another day, and when they try to go all death and depressing on you, you are given the option to tell them not to talk like that. Made me truly believe that the happy ending I wanted was on it's way. The whole time. But NOPE. Screw all the comforting remarks, the promises and reassurances. Shepard is just going to go and die now. The ending was abrupt and made me angry that all of those comforting convo's were void and pretty much false.

Yep, throughout the series it's been pretty much "We'll achieve the impossible, we'll pull through" then "screw that" at the end. If it had been consistent throughout (e.g. just about everything in The Witcher has turned to crap and I expect it to go downhill from there, and that's a great series) then fine. If it hadn't been accompanied by a load of completely idiotic pseudo-intellectual nonsense but was part of a sensible, intelligent, well-written, well built-up ending? Well, not sure to be honest. It would certainly make it harder to find genuine reasons for complaint (other than the "In an RPG if something bad happens to me or my companions it should be because I screwed up somewhere" line).

[obibenjedi]

I didn't read anything about ME3, just pre orderd game played ME 1 and 2 through loved ME3 till the ending which i hated because all your choices felt so pointless. It felt like it was from a different game. Not so much trying to put a square peg in a round hole, ast trying to squeeze an elephant through the hole.
The EC has helped take edge off but not changed my view of the ending.
LOVE multi player coz you can pretend that if you play it enough the ending might be different! :

[whitefire138]

The real reason the endings were poorly rated from fans in mass effect three in my opinion was, it had huge plotholes after shepard was risen up on that platform , the catalist being an image of the dead child in the beginning to symbolize the people shepard couldn't save, it doesn't really blend into the plot too well. If the catalist looked like a small reaper it would have made more sense than a human child. The three choices mirrored each other almost perfectly. So it didn't give you no real choice at the end.

The catalist is in my opinion is the worst written character in the game. The grandfather scene after the end credits depersonalizes the experiance for me.  Plus not the same character and squad I had during all three games up to the end of three.

With the extended cut, the endings are more barable, fills in most of the badly written ploteholes that the original endings had, and the squad image is restored in my opinion.

Overall the endings were just a product of bad writing that gave us a poorly writen plot twist at the end of the game. If the ending had two renegade and two paragon choices with both paragon and renegade offering the ability to make the ultimate sacrifice, you fighting harbinger at the end, the crucible targeting the reaper indocrination signal, and no star child for the catalist, there would never have been this much of a backlash with endings in the first place. The rest of the game however was a masterpiece of interactive entertainment.

[Necrotron]

Your generalizations are completely wrong.

[silverexile17s]

Bathaius wrote...

Your generalizations are completely wrong.

I don't see how. He makes good points.

[silverexile17s]

You know, Blueprotoss hasn't been active since his last arguement, when I pointed out that he was wrong about Star Wars being multiple galaxies. He said that Knights of the Old Republic, Republic Commando and The Force Unleashed were all in seperate galaxies, and that Star Wars was sucessful because it all took place in seperate galaxies across the universe. When I pointed out that this was nowhere the HELL near the truth, and that Star Wars was entirely based in a single galaxy, with each event taking place at different points on the timeline, in different time periods.... He dissappeared. Hasn't been back for days.
Should I be concerned about this?

[SpamBot2000]

silverexile17s wrote...

You know, Blueprotoss hasn't been active since his last arguement, when I pointed out that he was wrong about Star Wars being multiple galaxies. He said that Knights of the Old Republic, Republic Commando and The Force Unleashed were all in seperate galaxies, and that Star Wars was sucessful because it all took place in seperate galaxies across the universe. When I pointed out that this was nowhere the HELL near the truth, and that Star Wars was entirely based in a single galaxy, with each event taking place at different points on the timeline, in different time periods.... He dissappeared. Hasn't been back for days.
Should I be concerned about this?

I think relief would be the proper response.

[ld1449]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

silverexile17s wrote...

You know, Blueprotoss hasn't been active since his last arguement, when I pointed out that he was wrong about Star Wars being multiple galaxies. He said that Knights of the Old Republic, Republic Commando and The Force Unleashed were all in seperate galaxies, and that Star Wars was sucessful because it all took place in seperate galaxies across the universe. When I pointed out that this was nowhere the HELL near the truth, and that Star Wars was entirely based in a single galaxy, with each event taking place at different points on the timeline, in different time periods.... He dissappeared. Hasn't been back for days.
Should I be concerned about this?

I think relief would be the proper response.

If he jumped under a bus how would that exactly be your problem?

[Ithurael]

silverexile17s wrote...

You know, Blueprotoss hasn't been active since his last arguement, when I pointed out that he was wrong about Star Wars being multiple galaxies. He said that Knights of the Old Republic, Republic Commando and The Force Unleashed were all in seperate galaxies, and that Star Wars was sucessful because it all took place in seperate galaxies across the universe. When I pointed out that this was nowhere the HELL near the truth, and that Star Wars was entirely based in a single galaxy, with each event taking place at different points on the timeline, in different time periods.... He dissappeared. Hasn't been back for days.
Should I be concerned about this?

He is gathering his strength.

Marshalling an army of comebacks.

Be ready...he is coming...

[silverexile17s]

ld1449 wrote...

SpamBot2000 wrote...

silverexile17s wrote...

You know, Blueprotoss hasn't been active since his last arguement, when I pointed out that he was wrong about Star Wars being multiple galaxies. He said that Knights of the Old Republic, Republic Commando and The Force Unleashed were all in seperate galaxies, and that Star Wars was sucessful because it all took place in seperate galaxies across the universe. When I pointed out that this was nowhere the HELL near the truth, and that Star Wars was entirely based in a single galaxy, with each event taking place at different points on the timeline, in different time periods.... He dissappeared. Hasn't been back for days.
Should I be concerned about this?

I think relief would be the proper response.

If he jumped under a bus how would that exactly be your problem?

I just....Did I embarress him, by pointing out how WRONG his knowladge of SW was?

[silverexile17s]

Ithurael wrote...

silverexile17s wrote...

You know, Blueprotoss hasn't been active since his last arguement, when I pointed out that he was wrong about Star Wars being multiple galaxies. He said that Knights of the Old Republic, Republic Commando and The Force Unleashed were all in seperate galaxies, and that Star Wars was sucessful because it all took place in seperate galaxies across the universe. When I pointed out that this was nowhere the HELL near the truth, and that Star Wars was entirely based in a single galaxy, with each event taking place at different points on the timeline, in different time periods.... He dissappeared. Hasn't been back for days.
Should I be concerned about this?

He is gathering his strength.

Marshalling an army of comebacks.

Be ready...he is coming...

....Oh, hell. This isn't going to be pretty, is it?

Modifié par silverexile17s, 28 octobre 2012 - 08:09 .

[silverexile17s]

Also, just for fun.
THIS is how I would have done the ending. (This is gonna be a long post, so brace yourselves)

You are given the chance to fight the Illusive Man's grip and shift the aim of the gun, avoiding shooting Anderson in the gut. As the tow are resting, the cut diolouge between them about life after the Reaper War plays out, (search youtube for "cut final conversation diolouge between Anderson and Shepard" to see what I mean) with Anderson and Shepard hearing the comm from Hackett, Anderson crawling over and trying frantically to wake Shepard back up after Shepard passes out trying to reach the console Then, at the catalyst scene, you get your new choice. Shepard spent the entire series saving everyone, and I figured that it would be that someone saved HIM this time.
Anderson can die in Shepard's place, telling him he has done more then could ever be enough, and that it was time for him to rest.
"Now GO! Live your life! ...
That's an order."
You can either choose to accept Anderson's order, or shove him over and sacrifice yourself.
Anderson, or Shepard, would then give their life by climbing down/taking the one way lift into the machinery of the "Link" between the two structures, and rout the Crucible's power into the Citadel's power grid. The station is unable to handle the vast amounts of raw power, overloading the stations entire grid, frying the Catalyst's A.I core and killing him. Of course, whoever does it has to stay behind, to make sure nothing interfers, and insure the overload kicks in.
This would have a similar effect on the Reapers as what happened to the geth after they were cut off from the Reaper on Rannoch. Or what happens to Soveregin after you destroy his Saren-husk avatar in ME1.
Shepard/Anderson returns to the conduit that leads back to Earth as the Citadel collapses down around him.(I would have written it as still being active in this event) and just barely makes it through, before the station comes apart.
Outside, the Reapers, with the core of their concioussness dead, start to desend into chaos, as the death of the Catalyst has esentally lobotomized them. As they flail, vulnerable,the Allied fleets tear into them. Hackett reconizes the Reapers apperant state as reminecant of the State Soveregin was in when the fleets brought it down, and orders the fleets to seize the opportunity, knowing that Shepard must have done something. Rallied and revitalized by the hope of victiory, the fleets plow into the crippled Reapers, coring the Reaper fleet over Earth.

Across the galaxy, the Reapers become confused and vulnerable, some dying outright from the mental shock. Others slumping down, trying to rise back up. All across the galaxy, their husk armies writhe in pain, suffering insane breakdowns before falling dead, or feebley twitching and convulsing, their masters too mentally injured to retain command of their slaves. Everyone, everywhere, watch as the few Reapers able to somewhat recover from the loss of their galvanizing thought embodyment's death, retreat, leaving others dead, and more in slumped heaps, convulsing, their nation-minds fractured by the "mind-rape" they just receved, unable to restore themselves enough to regain motor function.

Over Earth, the Reapers are dying by the dozens, unable to properly defend themselves. The war assets you recovered come into play here, as the less you have, the harder it is to finish off the Reapers.
(Example) Harbinger, stunned but still fighting, goes against a number of ships chargeing the colapsed Reaper line, including the Normandy. Several shots later, a blast from a dreadnought blows a hole in Harbinger's Hull, prompting it to retaliate by blowing the dreadnought to hell. Joker charges in, intending to end it for good. If the EMS number is low, the Normandy is destroyed in the Charge against Harbinger, hit multiple times by Harbinger's beams, and Joker, unwilling to let Harbinger escape, rams the prow of the ship through a gap in Harbingers armor, impailing it's drive core, destroying them both. If the number is moderate, the Normandy fires the Thanix through the gap, destroying Harbinger, and survives, but is sevearly damaged, as one of Harbinger's shots will connect and, as well as kill some members of the crew, destroy the A.I core, killing EDI. If the number is high, then the Normandy will sucessfuly dodge and weave through Harbingers incresengly frantic shots and core the First Reaper with the Thanix, escaping the dying Reaper's explosion with minimal damage to itself, and no loss of crew.
Regardless, with Harbingers destruction, the remaining Reapers are soon routed, with how many losses sustained depending on how high/low the EMS number was. Also depending on that number, you see celebration on Earth and amongst the fleets, seeing many familiar faces among the survivors:
Khirrahe cheering with his men. Samara giving a smile at the Reapers defeat.
Grunt and Wrex fist-pumping at the victory while standing on respective mountins of dead husk bodies.
Katsumi grinning and laguhing with the other Crucible techs celebrating (While picking up a rather valuable piece of tech when everyone is looking at the screens) with David Archer (and possibly Gavin, showing they are starting to reconcile) in the background.
Jacob happily giving Brynn a kiss over the moment. Miranda smiling at the layout showing the Reaper forces routing, with Kahlee Sanders in the planning room with her.
Zaeed raising his fist in victory in the London streets, a slew of husk corpses in front of him. Jack either at her knees with the bodies of several of her students, or cheering with them as they mop up the few living, albet convulsing husks.
Aria T'Loak smiling as though watching a good movie and downing a drink, from the terminus fleets flagship while everyone else with her cheers and hoo-ahhs. Balak savagely grinning as his ship guts a Reaper trying to run, it's barriers disabled.
Victus grinning and yelling out "For Palaven," galvanizing his troops as he leads a turian counter-attack on the confused Reaper front. Jundam Bau sniping out multiple hostiles and organizing a counter-attack I may or may not have gotten everyone you think should be here. But it's more then enough to get the message through, as the image shows the allies cheering at the defeat of the Reapers, and the re-taking of Earth.

Finally, Back on Earth, amongst the rubble, Either Shepard or Anderson slowly wakes to the sight of Earth's grayed skies, ash falling down, like snow, but with rays of sunlight here and there. The survivor hears someone coming, and depending on war assets, it is either the voice of an Alliance S&R team, or the Normandy crew, headed by whichever love interest you had, who will either be overjoyed to find Shepard still clinging to life, or saddened and heartbroken to learn from Anderson what happened.

At this point, depending on how well you prepared, you will notice either a shuttle, or a battered Normandy can be seen nearby, having landed to look around the conduit for any trace of Shepard and Anderson.
Either Anderson will walk solemnly back to whichever ship has arrived, saying, in thought montage, that war is never fair, but that no matter what the outcome, the price is always too high. This is where we see he is clinging to a charred set of N7 dog tags in one hand.
Or, a male Shepard will limp back, leaning heavily on the LI on one side, with another squad-mate helping prop him up on the other.
Or, a female Shepard will be be picked by the LI and carried back to the Normandy (Unless the LI is Liara)
And for the first time in the series, this would have been a good a time as any to actually see Shepard shed a few tears at the realization that it was finally over, sharing a few words with the LI, or whichever squadmate he was most affilated with if no LI was chosen, glad that for the first time in three years, they can all finally rest easy.
(Also, not trying to be racist with the MaleShep can walk back, FemShep is carried back. That's just how I see a LI treating the different genders. I saw A female Shep would be carried back by either Garrus or Kaiden, because I read too many old stories about the heroine being picked back up by her love after all was said and done)
But you are free to give me other ideas on the scene as well.
Regardless, the scene gradually fades away farther and farther as Shepard/Anderson and the crew return to either the shuttle, or the Normandy, the cam moving up to face the sun poking through the clouds, past the still husk of a dead reaper, before fully fading to black.

Then, credits.

I know, I know, no resolution at this point. But I figured that the slid-show style of the EC scenes would have been played as a backdrop for the credits. That slideshow should have been played against the backdrop of the credits, though in a way that they don't obscure them badly.
Even though this would leave following events of the crew and Shepard up for debate, I had a thought that after the credits roll, you would unlock a profile picture, showing either an image of the LI possibly with a child, or expecting one, depending on who it was, or a marble statue of Shepard (one for each gender, helmet obscuring the face), with a ebony coffin in front, the mark N7 engraved in it, with Anderson standing over it, head bowed, hand placed upon the top of the lid. All of these giving difinative hints as to the following events.

OR

As a secret ending, unlocked by beating the game on Insanity, you are able to talk the Illusive Man down from shooting you, and releasing you from his grip. He then begins to fall again, but before he can pull the trigger and perform the suicide, a new paragon option appears, allowing you to stop him from killing himself. (Either he bull-charges him, knocking him down and out, or shoots the gun out of his hand, or something)

Then, the unconcious Illusive Man, Anderson, and Shepard arrive in the Catalyst chamber. Midway through the conversation, the Illusive Man wakes back up, no longer being directed by the Reapers, as they no longer see any point in it right now. There will be a part where the Illusive Man expresses shock at the fact that he was right about the possibilaty of controlling the Reapers, (As well as excitement about it, if Shepard was Renegade, or doubt in the idea, from talks with a Paragon Shepard) and sadness and anger at the relization that because he had indeed been indoctrinated, he could never have been able to do it himself.

At this point, you get two MORE options: Follow the Illusive Man's suggestion and Control the Reapers (I would have written it so that this option is ONLY unlocked this way, through Renegade playthrough, as it is incentive to replay) or listen to Anderson's veheament objections, saying that there will always be a chance that the Reapers could break free, or "reprogram" Shepard's conciousness. If Shepard was Paragon, however, the Illusive Man will actually doubt that this is right, as Shepard has shaken his beliefs in weather or not this is right for humanity.

In the Final Option, it is the ILLUSIVE MAN who takes the elevator down to the "Link" and overloads the Citadel power grid, allowing both Shepard AND Anderson to survive, in pain due to the Reapers franticlly trying to force their control back on him when they realize what he is doing, the Illusive Man's last words being that he won't be remembered as a monster, and that he wished he could have been more like Shepard had.
A moment of EXTREME IRONY, as in the end, the Illusive Man gets his wish to be the savior of humanity, and the entire galaxy as well.

In this end, the Earth scene plays out differently, as the Normandy crew is overjoyed to find both Shepard and Anderson alive, though still in bad shape. At this point, If Shepard is with the LI, Anderson watches and says that the moment he finds Kahlee, he's going to marry her. Shepard remarks that Anderson said "That ship has sailed." Anderson laughs lightly and says that it "Never stopped YOU before."
They laugh as the crew help them make their way to the Normandy, the LI having a few lines of their own before Shepard remarks that he/she can't believe it's really over, while Anderson says that "With all the **** that's happened, I don't either. But, after all this.. we all deserve a happy ending." here, he looks at Shepard.
"And NO one deserves a happy ending more then you, Shepard."
Shepard smiles, replies "Thank you, sir."
Then, the cam fades out the same as I outlined before, with the sun peeking through the gray clouds as the ash falls like snow, the view fading completely to black.




And DONE. Phew.

-Let me know if any of this is good. And feel free to put your own spin on it, or point out the flaws, if you want.
It's only a rough idea, meant to get people thinking. Let me know your thoughts.

Modifié par silverexile17s, 28 octobre 2012 - 10:01 .

[Blueprotoss]

hornedfrog87 wrote...

Vanilla ending had quite a bit of plotholes. EC helped quite a bit and I'm thankful Bioware made it free and with the expediency they did. However, there's still quite a few plotholes. The feel is a bit different to the story compared to the others, but I think that's from Bioware trying their hardest to please their fans. Hell, they even hired a Garrus fan to pen Garrus in ME3 over Weekes and Walters; they made EDI a squady and gave the fans the Joker/Edi romance; and they inserted fan inside jokes all over the place. In a way, you could say I do hold quite a bit of blame with the fans. Many demanded and petitioned for certain things without clarity as how to improve something and then were dissatisfied with the results. Fans went on a tirade when the original script leaked, then demanded a rewrite of the revised script and even went as far as wanting the original script and/or wondering why the ending felt so rushed. Liara's plot armor, removal of world exploration, attempting to make Leviathan a watery Shadow Broker, all of it reeks of Bioware trying to appease an unruly fanbase on BSN. So yes, I'd agree with you TC: fans did raise their hopes up under the promise the script/ending would be what they predicted and pulled the dissatisfied consumer/betrayed fan cards when the staff's vision didn't align with that of the fans.

To be fair some people will always complain especially when some people were complaining before ME and will still complain after ME.

silverexile17s wrote...

I think the endings were poorly receved because they were the only endings. If there had been OTHER, brighter endings to COMPLEMENT these endings, and highlight each other, the fan responce would not have been NEARLY as bad. you DON'T have any of those, the overwhelmengly bittersweet endings KILL any desire to replay the game. DA:O had that. with the "Deal" with Morrigen, or letting Alister sacrifice himself in your place. It STUNG, but the OPTION was there. They weren't ALL SOO bittersweet that you never wanted to play more then once.

:Also, as a side note, Blueprotoss and I have been fighting, because he thinks that Star Wars is multiple galaxies linked together, not a single galaxy divided into seperate time periods. He says that Kotor, the Force Unleashed, and Republic Commando all take place in different galaxies.
Could SOMEONE explain this to him? He keeps refernceing this, and it's getting a tad comical how he could have missed such a fundimental point of Star Wars lore as the fact that it's all one Galaxy, not several of them linked together.

The endings in ME3 were receieved like the endings in ME1 and ME2 because all 3 had a small uproar from the "fans".

Ironically I don't need to say anything since you contradict yourself, which makes it a lot easier to prove you wrong.

KevShep wrote...

1. The ending was an EXACT copy of Deus Ex, from the four choices to even the consequences of those choices are the EXACT SAME THING!

2. ME3's ending was ok for a stand alone game, it was NOT ok for an ENTIRE series!

3. You NEVER introduce a new villain in the last 10 minutes of the whole seires.

If thats the case then DE would be the originator of those endinds, which in reality they are not.

To be fair every ME game can be played as a stand alone game.

The Reapers aren't a new villian.

Redbelle wrote...

At the very least, DA:O prepped you before hand for your choices. All throughout the journey you are told that being a grey warden reduces your life span and that death and grey wardening go hand in hand. As such, when you learn how to kill an old god, well if you drive morrigan away you can die. Or, as I prefer, get the traitor king pretender to do it... Mwaahaha, oh wait he's a hero now? Scratch that.

Going with the Morrigan option though makes her witchhunt DLC make alot of sense. Unless you choose to stab her and watch her body fall through the portal.

Mass Effect, by contrast, was a game with no foreshadowing about the final fate of the hero. You were never told being commander Shepard will get you killed. If those dream sequences had a Babylon 5 style 'If you go to Zarhadoom you will die I would have had time to come to terms with how my Shepards fate would save the galaxy. Instead I was given ten minutes of waffle talk and left with an open mouth staring at the screen thinking "That's it"?

It sounds like you haven't played Baldur's Gate, KotOR, Jade Empire, or Neverwinter before playing a ME or DA game.

Modifié par Blueprotoss, 29 octobre 2012 - 03:00 .

[Blueprotoss]

BaladasDemnevanni wrote...

Blueprotoss wrote...

Yet you're here being completely off-topic and inslting someone, which means you aren't practicing what you preach about "trolls" since you are in actuality a "troll" yourself.  I'm no "troll" but when someone pulls the "troll" card then they have already lost the discussion and don't care what emotion gets released.

You misunderstand. My post was not intended for your benefit. It was to warn people who, as luck would have it, have never had the displeasure of reading your posts in the past. I think it's important that they know what they're getting themselves into. I lose nothing.

Insulting people still won't work.

silverexile17s wrote...

I could have used that head's up a while ago. 
It's hard to take Blueprotoss' posts seriously when he keeps saying that Star Wars is several galaxies. He ACTUALLY said that KotOR, Republic Commando and The Force Unleashed are all is seperate Galaxies across the Star Wars universe, not one galaxy over several time periods. 
HOW can he not know that's wrong?!

How is that when opinion isn't fact and trying to force opinions into facts still isn't possible.

Modifié par Blueprotoss, 29 octobre 2012 - 02:55 .

[Blueprotoss]

silverexile17s wrote...

Bathaius wrote...

Your generalizations are completely wrong.

I don't see how. He makes good points.

Yet those generalizations are wrong especially when you're looking at the Internet in general.  Also you shouldn't forget that there isn't that much real hatred of ME3 on BSN and Youtube.

silverexile17s wrote...

You know, Blueprotoss hasn't been active since his last arguement, when I pointed out that he was wrong about Star Wars being multiple galaxies. He said that Knights of the Old Republic, Republic Commando and The Force Unleashed were all in seperate galaxies, and that Star Wars was sucessful because it all took place in seperate galaxies across the universe. When I pointed out that this was nowhere the HELL near the truth, and that Star Wars was entirely based in a single galaxy, with each event taking place at different points on the timeline, in different time periods.... He dissappeared. Hasn't been back for days.
Should I be concerned about this?

To be fair some people do have lives other then the Internet.

[silverexile17s]

Blueprotoss wrote...

hornedfrog87 wrote...

Vanilla ending had quite a bit of plotholes. EC helped quite a bit and I'm thankful Bioware made it free and with the expediency they did. However, there's still quite a few plotholes. The feel is a bit different to the story compared to the others, but I think that's from Bioware trying their hardest to please their fans. Hell, they even hired a Garrus fan to pen Garrus in ME3 over Weekes and Walters; they made EDI a squady and gave the fans the Joker/Edi romance; and they inserted fan inside jokes all over the place. In a way, you could say I do hold quite a bit of blame with the fans. Many demanded and petitioned for certain things without clarity as how to improve something and then were dissatisfied with the results. Fans went on a tirade when the original script leaked, then demanded a rewrite of the revised script and even went as far as wanting the original script and/or wondering why the ending felt so rushed. Liara's plot armor, removal of world exploration, attempting to make Leviathan a watery Shadow Broker, all of it reeks of Bioware trying to appease an unruly fanbase on BSN. So yes, I'd agree with you TC: fans did raise their hopes up under the promise the script/ending would be what they predicted and pulled the dissatisfied consumer/betrayed fan cards when the staff's vision didn't align with that of the fans.

To be fair some people will always complain especially when some people were complaining before ME and will still complain after ME.

silverexile17s wrote...

I think the endings were poorly receved because they were the only endings. If there had been OTHER, brighter endings to COMPLEMENT these endings, and highlight each other, the fan responce would not have been NEARLY as bad. you DON'T have any of those, the overwhelmengly bittersweet endings KILL any desire to replay the game. DA:O had that. with the "Deal" with Morrigen, or letting Alister sacrifice himself in your place. It STUNG, but the OPTION was there. They weren't ALL SOO bittersweet that you never wanted to play more then once.

:Also, as a side note, Blueprotoss and I have been fighting, because he thinks that Star Wars is multiple galaxies linked together, not a single galaxy divided into seperate time periods. He says that Kotor, the Force Unleashed, and Republic Commando all take place in different galaxies.
Could SOMEONE explain this to him? He keeps refernceing this, and it's getting a tad comical how he could have missed such a fundimental point of Star Wars lore as the fact that it's all one Galaxy, not several of them linked together.

The endings in ME3 were receieved like the endings in ME1 and ME2 because all 3 had a small uproar from the "fans".

Ironically I don't need to say anything since you contradict yourself, which makes it a lot easier to prove you wrong.

KevShep wrote...

1. The ending was an EXACT copy of Deus Ex, from the four choices to even the consequences of those choices are the EXACT SAME THING!

2. ME3's ending was ok for a stand alone game, it was NOT ok for an ENTIRE series!

3. You NEVER introduce a new villain in the last 10 minutes of the whole seires.

If thats the case then DE would be the originator of those endinds, which in reality they are not.

To be fair every ME game can be played as a stand alone game.

The Reapers aren't a new villian.

Redbelle wrote...

At the very least, DA:O prepped you before hand for your choices. All throughout the journey you are told that being a grey warden reduces your life span and that death and grey wardening go hand in hand. As such, when you learn how to kill an old god, well if you drive morrigan away you can die. Or, as I prefer, get the traitor king pretender to do it... Mwaahaha, oh wait he's a hero now? Scratch that.

Going with the Morrigan option though makes her witchhunt DLC make alot of sense. Unless you choose to stab her and watch her body fall through the portal.

Mass Effect, by contrast, was a game with no foreshadowing about the final fate of the hero. You were never told being commander Shepard will get you killed. If those dream sequences had a Babylon 5 style 'If you go to Zarhadoom you will die I would have had time to come to terms with how my Shepards fate would save the galaxy. Instead I was given ten minutes of waffle talk and left with an open mouth staring at the screen thinking "That's it"?

It sounds like you haven't played Baldur's Gate, KotOR, Jade Empire, or Neverwinter before playing a ME or DA game.

1. I don't think it's possible to complain about a game that didn't exist at the time LOL. Alright, seriously, there IS a difference between fans who gripe because they care, and fans who gripe because they like to. Just because there are SOME people who gripe for the heck of it, doesn't mean that ALL of them are like that. In fact, most people gripe because they DO love a game series, and don't want it to die. And fan ideas and/or gripes lead to great DLCs. We wanted to know what happened to Morrigan in DA:O, and we got the Which Hun DLC. We wanted to get back with Liara in ME2, and we got the "Shadow Broker" DLC. We wanted vehicle exploration/missions in ME2, we got the Hammerhead in the "Firewalker" and "Overlord" DLC's. We wanted the endings of ME3 to actually MAKE SOME SENSE, and we got the Extended Cut DLC. We wanted to re-take Omega in ME3, and we're getting the "Omega" DLC next month. We wanted to see Collectors again after seeing them in "From Ashes," and we get them as Multiplayer enemies in the "Retaliation" Multiplayer DLC. We wanted to be a Volus Biotic God, we get the Volus Adept as a MP class, and a Volus Vanguard coming out soon, along with the Volus Engineer and Sentinel. We wanted protheans, and we got Javik and "From Ashes."
You CAN'T condemn ALL because of a FEW.

2. First off, you are one to talk, Mr "Star Wars is seperate galaxies."
Second, The fans wanted the endings of 3 to BE like 1 & 2 combined. Where it's bittersweet because you made a sacrifice in order to win. Where you KNOW you can't save everyone. It feels like the story was made painfully liner for the sake of plot convenience. I don't necessaraly HATE the Plot of the Crucible, but the excicution needed work. If the dark energy theory could have been worked INTO that, somehow, like say, have it be that the Reapers harvest is every 50,000 years exactally because that's when the dark energy levels are highest, and that they feed on that. Then, the Crucible actually feeds on the massed concentrations of dark energy across the galaxy to kill the Reapers. Similar to what happens already, but the difference. NO starchild Catalyst. THAT'S one thing they could have done. Pont is, it feels like the story was made more and more linear in favor of inproving the combat mechanics.
Third, Again I say, I NEVER saw anyone complain about ME1 & 2's endings like I did ME3s. ME1 was good, because choices like that, one blatently good, the other evil, are something we are used to seeing from BioWare, if you played their RPG's, like Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic.  And I don't recall anyone complaining that loudly about the abality to SAVE EVERYONE on the Normandy from dying during the Suicide Mission. After great, envoking endings like those, combined with what we got in Dragon Age: Origens, Everyone expected them to take all the good things that made those endings great, and use them to create ME3s ending. Not throw all that made the endings to their previous games good out, and make it look like they stole pages from the ending of the Deus Ex series.

3. Yes, the games CAN be played stand-alone, but they are not MEANT to be. Why add the abality to carry over save-files if that's not how they are mant to work? That's the point of MAKING a series with that function. To carry over from the last entry to the next.
And you criticize OTHERS, saying they contridict themselves?

4. I did play KotOR, and I SAW the epilouge for an ending where you ACTUALLY GOT SOME DAMN CLOSURE for your character.  Until the release of The Old Republic's "Foundry" mission for the sith.
They HAD an ending where as a sith, you could have one final act of redemption for a female character, by having Carth arrive aboard the Star Forge and talk the PC back to the light by professing his love for her. You could accept, allowing them to die aboard the Star Forge as it falls into it's sun, it's orbital stabilizers shut down. But that was removed, as it was "too bittersweet." 
And the way Jade Empire ended WAS better for ME3. The endings for THAT were TRUELY diverse, as you got different ones not only for all your choices, but for whoever your romance option was. The endings to Jade Empire -a great blend of triumphent and bittersweet options- was what ME3 SHOULD have taken notes from. Not Deus Ex.

Modifié par silverexile17s, 29 octobre 2012 - 05:06 .

[silverexile17s]

Blueprotoss wrote...

BaladasDemnevanni wrote...

Blueprotoss wrote...

Yet you're here being completely off-topic and inslting someone, which means you aren't practicing what you preach about "trolls" since you are in actuality a "troll" yourself.  I'm no "troll" but when someone pulls the "troll" card then they have already lost the discussion and don't care what emotion gets released.

You misunderstand. My post was not intended for your benefit. It was to warn people who, as luck would have it, have never had the displeasure of reading your posts in the past. I think it's important that they know what they're getting themselves into. I lose nothing.

Insulting people still won't work.

silverexile17s wrote...

I could have used that head's up a while ago. 
It's hard to take Blueprotoss' posts seriously when he keeps saying that Star Wars is several galaxies. He ACTUALLY said that KotOR, Republic Commando and The Force Unleashed are all is seperate Galaxies across the Star Wars universe, not one galaxy over several time periods. 
HOW can he not know that's wrong?!

How is that when opinion isn't fact and trying to force opinions into facts still isn't possible.

1&2. You are seriously one to talk. You are the one who always insults people by comparing them with your apperent love of strawmen. And the fact that you constantly try to force the idea that Star Wars is multiple galaxies will NOT make that into fact. The only strawman here has been, and still is, you.

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

Blue, do you proofread anything you type or do you just blurt it all out? I'm not even talking spelling here.

Modifié par Humanoid_Typhoon, 29 octobre 2012 - 04:00 .

[silverexile17s]

Blueprotoss wrote...

silverexile17s wrote...

Bathaius wrote...

Your generalizations are completely wrong.

I don't see how. He makes good points.

Yet those generalizations are wrong especially when you're looking at the Internet in general.  Also you shouldn't forget that there isn't that much real hatred of ME3 on BSN and Youtube.

silverexile17s wrote...

You know, Blueprotoss hasn't been active since his last arguement, when I pointed out that he was wrong about Star Wars being multiple galaxies. He said that Knights of the Old Republic, Republic Commando and The Force Unleashed were all in seperate galaxies, and that Star Wars was sucessful because it all took place in seperate galaxies across the universe. When I pointed out that this was nowhere the HELL near the truth, and that Star Wars was entirely based in a single galaxy, with each event taking place at different points on the timeline, in different time periods.... He dissappeared. Hasn't been back for days.
Should I be concerned about this?

To be fair some people do have lives other then the Internet.

1. I never said anything about hate. Just dislike. Disliking them with valid reasons, and agreeing with the reasons of others, is no reason to crucify them at the stake like you do with everyone you don't agree with.
2. Well, you never responded. And if you were reading that, you would know from the responce I got from Troxa that I was correct about the structure of Star Wars in that it is a single galaxy, whose lore is spread out across many time periods. Also, that there was general dread from how you tear into everybody. The disscussion I had with @Element Zero? THAT is how one does a disscussion. No name calling, No "Strawmen." Just a civil talk, in which one can properly see good points that BOTH parites have.
What "you" do is tear apart anyone else that has differing opinions, and chastize them for thinking differently then you. You are condesending to them and force them to reply in kind to you.

[silverexile17s]

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

Blue, do you proofread anything you type or do you just blurt it all out? I'm not even talking spelling here.

I know. And he has the nerve to accuse everyone ELSE of cortridicting themselves?

[BSpud]

silverexile17s wrote...

1. I don't think it's possible to complain about a game that didn't exist at the time LOL. Alright, seriously, there IS a difference between fans who gripe because they care, and fans who gripe because they like to. Just because there are SOME people who gripe for the heck of it, doesn't mean that ALL of them are like that. In fact, most people gripe because they DO love a game series, and don't want it to die. And fan ideas and/or gripes lead to great DLCs. We wanted to know what happened to Morrigan in DA:O, and we got the Which Hun DLC. We wanted to get back with Liara in ME2, and we got the "Shadow Broker" DLC. We wanted vehicle exploration/missions in ME2, we got the Hammerhead in the "Firewalker" and "Overlord" DLC's. We wanted the endings of ME3 to actually MAKE SOME SENSE, and we got the Extended Cut DLC. We wanted to re-take Omega in ME3, and we're getting the "Omega" DLC next month. We wanted to see Collectors again after seeing them in "From Ashes," and we get them as Multiplayer enemies in the "Retaliation" Multiplayer DLC. We wanted to be a Volus Biotic God, we get the Volus Adept as a MP class, and a Volus Vanguard coming out soon, along with the Volus Engineer and Sentinel. We wanted protheans, and we got Javik and "From Ashes."
You CAN'T condemn ALL because of a FEW.

How is that when I'm sure you haven't played Wing Commander 4, Maniac Mansion or  Skate Or Die.

silverexile17s wrote...

2. First off, you are one to talk, Mr "Star Wars is seperate galaxies."
Second, The fans wanted the endings of 3 to BE like 1 & 2 combined. Where it's bittersweet because youy made a sacrifice in order to win. Where you KNOW you can't save everyone. It feels like the story was made painfully liner for the sake of plot convenience. I don't necessaraly HATE the Plot of the Crucible, but the excicution needed work. If the dark energy theory could have been worked INTO that, somehow, like say, have it be that the Reapers harvest is every 50,000 years exactally because that's when the dark energy levels are highest, and that they feed on that. Then, the Crucible actually feeds on the massed concentrations of dark energy across the galaxy to kill the Reapers. Similar to what happens already, but the difference. NO starchild Catalyst. THAT'S one thing they could have done. Pont is, it feels like the story was made more and more linear in favor of inproving the combat mechanics.
Third, Again I say, I NEVER saw anyone complain about ME1 & 2's endings like I did ME3s. ME1 was good, because choices like that, one blatently good, the other evil, are something we are used to seeing from BioWare, if you played their RPG's, like Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic.  And I don't recall anyone complaining that loudly about the abality to SAVE EVERYONE on the Normandy from dying during the Suicide Mission. After great, envoking endings like those, combined with what we got in Dragon Age: Origens, Everyone expected them to take all the good things that made those endings great, and use them to create ME3s ending. Not throw all that made the endings to their previous games out, and make it look like they stole pages from the ending of the Deus Ex series.

To be fair haters gonna hate especially when there was a small uproar over skipping the opening scene in ME2.

silverexile17s wrote...

3. Yes, the games CAN be played stand-alone, but they are not MEANT to be. Why add the abality to carry over save-files if that's not how they are mant to work? That's the point of MAKING a series with that function. To carry over from the last entry to the next.
And you criticize OTHERS, saying they contridict themselves?

Yet this is a strawman while red herrings are opinion and logic isn't based on a squid eating dough in a polyethylene bag.

silverexile17s wrote...

4. I did play KotOR, and I SAW the epilouge for an ending where you ACTUALLY GOT SOME DAMN CLOSURE for your character.  Until the release of The Old Republic's "Foundry" mission for the sith.
They HAD an ending where as a sith, you could have one final act of redemption for a female character, by having Carth arrive aboard the Star Forge and talk the PC back to the light by professing his love for her. You could accept, allowing them to die aboard the Star Forge as it falls into it's sun, it's orbital stabilizers shut down. But that was removed, as it was "too bittersweet." 
And the way Jade Empire ended WAS better for ME3. The endings for THAT were TRUELY diverse, as you got different ones not only for all your choices, but for whoever your romance option was. The endings to the first Jade Empire -a great blend of triumphent and bittersweet options- was what ME3 SHOULD have taken notes from. Not Deus Ex.

Mxyzptlk Kltpzyxm

[silverexile17s]

BeefheartSpud wrote...

silverexile17s wrote...

1. I don't think it's possible to complain about a game that didn't exist at the time LOL. Alright, seriously, there IS a difference between fans who gripe because they care, and fans who gripe because they like to. Just because there are SOME people who gripe for the heck of it, doesn't mean that ALL of them are like that. In fact, most people gripe because they DO love a game series, and don't want it to die. And fan ideas and/or gripes lead to great DLCs. We wanted to know what happened to Morrigan in DA:O, and we got the Which Hun DLC. We wanted to get back with Liara in ME2, and we got the "Shadow Broker" DLC. We wanted vehicle exploration/missions in ME2, we got the Hammerhead in the "Firewalker" and "Overlord" DLC's. We wanted the endings of ME3 to actually MAKE SOME SENSE, and we got the Extended Cut DLC. We wanted to re-take Omega in ME3, and we're getting the "Omega" DLC next month. We wanted to see Collectors again after seeing them in "From Ashes," and we get them as Multiplayer enemies in the "Retaliation" Multiplayer DLC. We wanted to be a Volus Biotic God, we get the Volus Adept as a MP class, and a Volus Vanguard coming out soon, along with the Volus Engineer and Sentinel. We wanted protheans, and we got Javik and "From Ashes."
You CAN'T condemn ALL because of a FEW.

How is that when I'm sure you haven't played Wing Commander 4, Maniac Mansion or  Skate Or Die.

silverexile17s wrote...

2. First off, you are one to talk, Mr "Star Wars is seperate galaxies."
Second, The fans wanted the endings of 3 to BE like 1 & 2 combined. Where it's bittersweet because youy made a sacrifice in order to win. Where you KNOW you can't save everyone. It feels like the story was made painfully liner for the sake of plot convenience. I don't necessaraly HATE the Plot of the Crucible, but the excicution needed work. If the dark energy theory could have been worked INTO that, somehow, like say, have it be that the Reapers harvest is every 50,000 years exactally because that's when the dark energy levels are highest, and that they feed on that. Then, the Crucible actually feeds on the massed concentrations of dark energy across the galaxy to kill the Reapers. Similar to what happens already, but the difference. NO starchild Catalyst. THAT'S one thing they could have done. Pont is, it feels like the story was made more and more linear in favor of inproving the combat mechanics.
Third, Again I say, I NEVER saw anyone complain about ME1 & 2's endings like I did ME3s. ME1 was good, because choices like that, one blatently good, the other evil, are something we are used to seeing from BioWare, if you played their RPG's, like Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic.  And I don't recall anyone complaining that loudly about the abality to SAVE EVERYONE on the Normandy from dying during the Suicide Mission. After great, envoking endings like those, combined with what we got in Dragon Age: Origens, Everyone expected them to take all the good things that made those endings great, and use them to create ME3s ending. Not throw all that made the endings to their previous games out, and make it look like they stole pages from the ending of the Deus Ex series.

To be fair haters gonna hate especially when there was a small uproar over skipping the opening scene in ME2.

silverexile17s wrote...

3. Yes, the games CAN be played stand-alone, but they are not MEANT to be. Why add the abality to carry over save-files if that's not how they are mant to work? That's the point of MAKING a series with that function. To carry over from the last entry to the next.
And you criticize OTHERS, saying they contridict themselves?

Yet this is a strawman while red herrings are opinion and logic isn't based on a squid eating dough in a polyethylene bag.

silverexile17s wrote...

4. I did play KotOR, and I SAW the epilouge for an ending where you ACTUALLY GOT SOME DAMN CLOSURE for your character.  Until the release of The Old Republic's "Foundry" mission for the sith.
They HAD an ending where as a sith, you could have one final act of redemption for a female character, by having Carth arrive aboard the Star Forge and talk the PC back to the light by professing his love for her. You could accept, allowing them to die aboard the Star Forge as it falls into it's sun, it's orbital stabilizers shut down. But that was removed, as it was "too bittersweet." 
And the way Jade Empire ended WAS better for ME3. The endings for THAT were TRUELY diverse, as you got different ones not only for all your choices, but for whoever your romance option was. The endings to the first Jade Empire -a great blend of triumphent and bittersweet options- was what ME3 SHOULD have taken notes from. Not Deus Ex.

Mxyzptlk Kltpzyxm

1. What are you talking about? I never said anything about Wing Commander 4, Skate Or Die, or Maniac Mansion in this post. All I said was that fans DO have good ideas. People like @Blurprotoss can't condemn everyone as wrong about the endings just because there ARE a few people that go too far. But people like that exsit on the opposate side as well.

2. Yes, that was an annoying part of the game, But that was a minor gripe. It's nowhere near as bad as screwing up the ending to the game that follows it up. And "Haters gonna Hate"? What are you, Blueprotoss 2.0? Or is this @Blueprotoss with a different username?

3. ....LOL. WHAT did you say? What the HELL does a squid eating dough in  a polyethyene bag have to do with ME3? And "Strawman" and "Red Herring'? You are sounding WAY too much like @Blueprotoss with a different username.

4. LOL.LOL.LOL.
 WHAT DOES A SUPERMAN VILLIAN HAVE TO DO WITH THIS?