35177 réponses à ce sujet

[UpiH]

Aroihkin wrote...

15 hours, 15 minutes

Alley's going to be a pain in the ass to color, haha. I have to make up a whole new skin-tone for her, not to mention the facial scarring.

At least their armor should be relatively easy. *dooms self by saying so*

Glad to see you up and running. Hopefully there weren't any repercussions from the shrubbery fire.

Again, I don't possess any competence to butt in, but what about those fingers? Shouldn't they be just a tad more slender or longer?

[ejoslin]

There is a small lore change in there, but I think it's an acceptable one. I can make a version without it if anyone objects.



When Zevran thanks the warden from freeing him from the Crows, I made the romance starter line (I think of you as more than a friend) only available if not in a romance, and romance able to start. Then I added a line, "I think of you as a friend, and more." This goes to his friendship declaration. It just seems weird that Zevran would be surprised and say "I must admit I feel that way as well, but I never thought you felt the same," (or whatever) AFTER he offers the earring.

[Lady Jess]

ejoslin wrote...

There is a small lore change in there, but I think it's an acceptable one. I can make a version without it if anyone objects.

When Zevran thanks the warden from freeing him from the Crows, I made the romance starter line (I think of you as more than a friend) only available if not in a romance, and romance able to start. Then I added a line, "I think of you as a friend, and more." This goes to his friendship declaration. It just seems weird that Zevran would be surprised and say "I must admit I feel that way as well, but I never thought you felt the same," (or whatever) AFTER he offers the earring.

Downloaded and (hopefully) installed. Can't wait to romance Zev again. If I installed it with DT manual and ZR...I only needed to remove Zevran_main from DT yes?

[Sarah1281]

They think they're misogynistic and OOC.

[ejoslin]

Lady Jess wrote...

Downloaded and (hopefully) installed. Can't wait to romance Zev again. If I installed it with DT manual and ZR...I only needed to remove Zevran_main from DT yes?

If that's where your ZevRing zevran_main.dlg is, yes.  

Elps wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

Now I have to figure out what to do about the party banters.  I'm getting complaints about a couple of the Zevran/Alistair ones.  If I change them, I'll probably either take them out entirely and just leave the Oghren/Shale ones in.  I don't know for sure yet, though.

What on earth are people complaining about???!!!

They feel the ferelden dog banter is out of character for both men, and the wrong order comment is out of character for Alistair.  I've gotten more complaints about the ferelden dog banter, really.  I don't think either is out of character, TBH.  And I am pretty sure they weren't deliberately cut from the game as the trigger is one off from what it should have been, so it looks like someone was rushing through (there are a lot of bugs like that, actually).

So I'm deciding whether to cut those two dialogs, make them for male PCs only as it does sound like guy talk, or just release a version where it's Oghren/Shale only.

Edit: As an optional file change, of course.  I'm leaving them as is in ZDF.

Modifié par ejoslin, 23 mai 2010 - 01:54 .

[Lady Jess]

Elps wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

Now I have to figure out what to do about the party banters.  I'm getting complaints about a couple of the Zevran/Alistair ones.  If I change them, I'll probably either take them out entirely and just leave the Oghren/Shale ones in.  I don't know for sure yet, though.

What on earth are people complaining about???!!!

Good question. I spent like an hour just listening to them with Zev, Alistair, and Morrigan and I thought they were excellent. And besides, if they want to complain they can gripe to the writers. THEY made them, you just made them work properly. The bet banter cracked me up, and Alistair wanting to know Zev's intentions was great, it adds something to the female/Alistair friendship that is seriously lacking. Males get a good friendship with Alistair, girls if they don't romance him get...well..nada. It was especially fitting that I heard it post-breakup.

[Lady Jess]

Sarah1281 wrote...

They think they're misogynistic and OOC.

Riiiiiigh Alistair can talk about Lampposts in winter, watch the PC's rear and discuss it with Wynne, flirt with an old woman during RtO openly, but he can't say he's in the wrong order during a banter with zev because guy talk is OOC. I can see being tweaked by the dog thing maybe, but the other...not so much.

[UpiH]

Methinks, some folks would cut half of the vanilla game dialogues, just because they wouldn't fit into their pompous and eclectic views. Would it be too tedious to make them all available as at least an option?

[Lady Jess]

ejoslin wrote...

If that's where your ZevRing zevran_main.dlg is, yes.  

The only zev_main I have is in ZevRing at the moment. Prior to installing your mod.

[Sarah1281]

Lady Jess wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

They think they're misogynistic and OOC.

Riiiiiigh Alistair can talk about Lampposts in winter, watch the PC's rear and discuss it with Wynne, flirt with an old woman during RtO openly, but he can't say he's in the wrong order during a banter with zev because guy talk is OOC. I can see being tweaked by the dog thing maybe, but the other...not so much.

There was a thread about it a few hours ago.

[Aroihkin]

UpiH wrote...

Aroihkin wrote...

15 hours, 15 minutes

Alley's going to be a pain in the ass to color, haha. I have to make up a whole new skin-tone for her, not to mention the facial scarring.

At least their armor should be relatively easy. *dooms self by saying so*

Glad to see you up and running. Hopefully there weren't any repercussions from the shrubbery fire.

Again, I don't possess any competence to butt in, but what about those fingers? Shouldn't they be just a tad more slender or longer?

Uhh... maybe if he was a girl, and even then not necesarilly.

And lol about the dog banter. I remember several folks were complaining about that one in this very thread until it got put into a mod 500+ pages later. Personally, I've always found it funny.

[ejoslin]

Elps wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

There is a small lore change in there, but I think it's an acceptable one. I can make a version without it if anyone objects.

When Zevran thanks the warden from freeing him from the Crows, I made the romance starter line (I think of you as more than a friend) only available if not in a romance, and romance able to start. Then I added a line, "I think of you as a friend, and more." This goes to his friendship declaration. It just seems weird that Zevran would be surprised and say "I must admit I feel that way as well, but I never thought you felt the same," (or whatever) AFTER he offers the earring.

I'd make the version without the lore change just for consistencies sake. One of the great strengths of your mod is that it doesn't change the lore. People who are playing for the first time will want to get rid of bugs but may be wary about lore changes. I loved what you did with the Alistair change, for example, because having the not-strictly-bug fixes as optional addins means ZDF gives them the game as it should have been if Bioware had put the time in to iron out the bugs. 

Your being able to say ZDF is a bug fix, while having optional files that improve on what Bioware wrote, is what makes your work stand out among the other mods. Just a thought...

That's a good point.  I just hate having the romance starter line available to everyone there, because it is SO weird unless starting a romance.  Zevran has already offered the earring if the romance is on.  He has possibly already told the warden that s/he has been a friend and more (during the conversation about Rinna).  It's even possible that he and the warden have committed to each other if it's a human noble who's engaged to Anora/Alistair and they haven't had that talk yet (royal scandal is higher priority than the friendship speech).  But yeh.  I'll have to reinstall the toolset for the non-DT versions so I may put that off until tomorrow.

It is available as an optional file; I'm not updating ZDF for it.

[Lady Jess]

Elps wrote...

Rock and hard place. The dog banter may well offend some people but its what the Bioware writers wrote. It's not out of character for either of them. The wrong order banter is great. It ties in nicely to Alistair's comment that the Chantry was not a place for rambunctious boys, as well has his lines about the drinking and hijinks in the fellowship of other Grey Wardens. 

I bet the people who are complaining like to view Alistair as being pure as the driven snow. He's not - he's a red-blooded male who is free from the Chantry and newly free from being watched over by senior wardens. He's interested in the opposite sex and enjoying sharing jokes with other men. 

You fixed the bugs but if you add conditions to the dialog, such as play only when the Warden is male, then this goes beyond bug-fixing and imposes opinion. So, I say, don't let other people's opinion sway you (mine included). If its in the game but not triggering due to a bug, then it should be in the game.

This, exactly this. He's not mister goody two shoes, he doesn't have a halo, or a glowing nimbus, he has a sense of humor and the same urges anyone else has, and should have some banter that shows it with another guy, even if the PC is female. Though I may be a bit hardened, when I got to functions with my husband, I'm quite used to hearing comments that could make most females go :blink: but such is life surrounded by soldiers of the male variety.  Pretty similar situation really.

[ejoslin]

Heh, I'm going to make people scream, but I found a bug that I didn't fix in the ran banter, so I think I'll correct it and make a note that it did NOT take those out. There's actually a seventh dialog that was restored. I'll put that up too!

Edit: Actually, I won't.  If I release a new version I'll fix it.  The Alistair asking how to woo a woman is ok if he's still a virgin.  It doesn't HAVE to be directed towards a femwarden he's romancing.

Modifié par ejoslin, 23 mai 2010 - 02:20 .

[Lady Jess]

ejoslin wrote...

Heh, I'm going to make people scream, but I found a bug that I didn't fix in the ran banter, so I think I'll correct it and make a note that it did NOT take those out. There's actually a seventh dialog that was restored. I'll put that up too!

Yay! Man by the time I'm done making these two faces in the toolset, and actually settle down to play I'll have everything I've ever wanted:wizard:

[Sarah1281]

Is it usual for a game to have this many bugs? And then, of course, Awakenings is the buggy one.

[UpiH]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Is it usual for a game to have this many bugs? And then, of course, Awakenings is the buggy one.

Unfortunately, it is and it's become the industry standard to release unfinished games - and as you can see here, with the consent of many customers. Think of Baldur's Gate, think of KotOR I and especially KotOR II (Obsidian).

[Rhys Cordelle]

Well, for a game as detailed as Dragon Age, I can understand how a lot of minor bugs would escape the notice of play testers. In the case of Origins I don't feel that they released an unfinished product. Awakenings on the other hand...

[UpiH]

Rhys Cordelle wrote...

Well, for a game as detailed as Dragon Age, I can understand how a lot of minor bugs would escape the notice of play testers. In the case of Origins I don't feel that they released an unfinished product. Awakenings on the other hand...

Agreed, was just about to add a defensive clausule to Bioware's merit. It's their fault: why on earth do they write so damn good games that many players feel obsessed to search every nook and granny? I remember back in BG times they were surprised by the amount of players who wanted to do every side quest causing the game to run out of memory variables. It's like they've invented a money-making automate but are reluctant to use it to its full potential.

[ejoslin]

Some of these bugs are more than minor and I'm stunned they got through. Others were oversights, probably because they ran out of time. But then there are a lot of minor things as well which really aren't that big a deal. I don't think missing banters make too much of a difference.



I probably will release an update to the party banters that only include the shale/oghren dialogs. I have to agree. And I'll fix a few other things as well.



People do get ideas in their heads about how Alistair and Zevran are that aren't too based upon the characters, but that's ok as well. I really don't want to add anything to the game (hahaha, except that stupid romance starter line interfering with the best dialog from Zevran in the game), but at the same time, I don't want to take anything away from anyone either.

[Creature 1]

Aroihkin wrote...

UpiH wrote...

Aroihkin wrote...

15 hours, 15 minutes

Alley's going to be a pain in the ass to color, haha. I have to make up a whole new skin-tone for her, not to mention the facial scarring.

At least their armor should be relatively easy. *dooms self by saying so*

Glad to see you up and running. Hopefully there weren't any repercussions from the shrubbery fire.

Again, I don't possess any competence to butt in, but what about those fingers? Shouldn't they be just a tad more slender or longer?

Uhh... maybe if he was a girl, and even then not necesarilly.

And lol about the dog banter. I remember several folks were complaining about that one in this very thread until it got put into a mod 500+ pages later. Personally, I've always found it funny.

Yes, I was just thinking, strange, last time I heard about it most people didn't like that conversation and did think it was OoC.  I do think it's OoC for Alistair, and kind of puzzling overall. 

[UpiH]

Has anyone asked the writers, why were they left out, then? Is it an oversight, are they really out of character? I haven't seen/heard them but if they add to a character, I'd like to see them no matter whether I liked them or not or deemed them in-character or not.