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[Sabriana]

I agree, the "Here I am" to the "I am yours" path is long and arduous. But I do believe that he is falling right from the start. My PC tells Wynne that she saw it there, something that told her that he's feeling something right off and it develops.

*hopes that 'ardous' is the right word.*

[jenovan]

AnniLau wrote...

jenovan wrote...
 I do wonder what Leliana has to say, but I haven't had the willpower to romance her yet... 

How have you managed to avoid it? She's constantly insisting that she and my PC have something going when they absolutely don't.

I really have no idea, especially given how she seems to ninja everyone else!  It's Morrigan my CEM had to run away from.

Maybe my boys' ways of answering her are just helpfully non-romantic (one's nice and totally uninterested; the other is a cocky jerk). I have nooo idea.

[Creature 1]

ejoslin wrote...

I don't think running away was an option for Zevran, actually, nor breaking up with her.

That's no fun! 

He wants to be with her (or him), but suddenly realizing his feelings would definitely cause some conflict.

I think he'd feel like ending it.  He let Rhinna get killed because he was getting too attached to her.  MO seems to be:  when emotionally entangled, disentangle.  Just this time he gets so entangled he realizes he doesn't want to get away any more.  

It's ok early on because he can tell himself he's staying for other reasons, the not getting killed, the good food, the company, the sex.  Then he realizes it's way more serious than he thought. 

[Cuddlezarro]

jenovan wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

Hmmmmm, now I know how I'll RP the romance with my latest mage.  She WILL tell Alistair that she's in love with Zev.  Ali has a lot of gifts; he'll be fine.

Heh, I'm a little jealous -- dumping Morrigan for Zevran isn't nearly that satisfying. ;D  I do wonder what Leliana has to say, but I haven't had the willpower to romance her yet... 

heh last time I tried to do a proper Leleina romance playthrough she ended up dead and my character ended up in the arms of antoher man...

that should tell you what i thought of that romance

[Sannox]

I felt a bit guilty about romancing Leliana. My male elf set out to seduce her, and lied about Zevran before sleeping with her then later dumping her for him. Then he took her out to Haven after dumping her solely to get Zevran's boots (because he lied about the lockpicking). She was surprisingly OK about it all, and stayed the second most approving of all the companions.

[Raiynsong]

I think Zevran's confused even in the aftermath of the massage incident. he starts out with the massage because he's attracted and wants sex but my bet is that the warden's reaction during that conversation, the tent scene, and the aftermath have thrown him for a loop---he ends up feeling more than just the pleasure he expected. So when the warden asks him the next time, he's totally floored. So I think "from the beginning" works either way, even if it's the massage that started it.



I don't mind Orzammar that much because after each area I pop back to camp for some squee before I head onward. I pop to the Circle Tower for the dwarf girl. I turn in the Crow quest. so it ends up not feeling like a long slog. Also I don't usually take the same 4 chars through the entire zone. You have to have Oghran at the anvil but I mix up party elsewhere. In fact, this week I ended up leaving Alistair in camp and having Oghran tank until broodmother, then I replaced him by Alistair, then I put Oghran in Zev's spot for the anvil (I know...that was horrid lol but I needed a tank and a healer and Oghran (I'm an archer this goround).



I'm thinking in this next run I might just have Sten tank the entire time and leave Alistair in camp whenever possible--just for the heck of it. Even though I do love Alistair



I'm also one of the people who like Loghain alot, although I admit the books helped me come to that conclusion. I honestly think he really believes that the Orlesians are still a threat, and so Calian and Anora's plan to bring them into Ferelden really bothered him. He admits to believing the "blight" is not real, and it's clear that Cailan really IS a buffoon (I love Duncan's visible reactions to him at Ostagar...). I've only saved him once when I was my one male character. I plan on saving him this time as well and having him do Morrigan's ritual.



Re the photo of Sir Gilmore Oh no!! that's where he ends up ! (I didn't look that closely and figured it was just a stock face). My HN's all loved him (male and female alike...) I tried flirting but oh well... poor man.

[barkingM1]

Sabriana wrote...

I agree, the "Here I am" to the "I am yours" path is long and arduous. But I do believe that he is falling right from the start. My PC tells Wynne that she saw it there, something that told her that he's feeling something right off and it develops.
*hopes that 'ardous' is the right word.*

Arduous as in difficult - yep.
Also Ardourous as in passionate - really yep. 

[Raiynsong]

I was pretty lucky this time with Leliana---she ended up firmly in the warm zone and hasn't budged much. I didn't ooh and ah about shoes, I just said, yeah thanks, or something, about my hair, and I got pissed off at her "elf" comments. My next playthrough tho, I think I will romance her all the way, just so I can get the achievement for it. She and Wynne are much easier to deal with if you just don't talk to them much

I do wish women could romance Morrigan tho---she is a rather nice friend to women characters

[Raiynsong]

lol at Barking yep, both arduous and ardo(u)rous

[Nonvita]

Creature 1 wrote...

It's ok early on because he can tell himself he's staying for other reasons, the not getting killed, the good food, the company, the sex.  Then he realizes it's way more serious than he thought. 

This. His early feelings about being there are rather centered on everything going on, and I don't think he comprehends just how serious a 'future' could be. Although he asks about the future early on, he's very much content to do as the Warden wants. It's not until after Taliesan that he realizes he wants to stay, and that he has the ability to choose to stay. He's never made a decision about his own future before in his life, yet now he's confronted with the fact that he doesn't just want to leave it up to chance. I think his being confused is that he has to do something he's never done before- try to make a future of his own choosing. He doesn't know how to go about it, he doesn't know how to ask such a big thing from someone else, and he's still scared of what he's feeling.

[Raiynsong]

good point. He's so used to just reacting to everything and this time for the first time he gets to have a say in his own future. His "It is entirely up to you" comments throughout the early part of the romance are testatment to that. It's "nice" on the one hand, but it's also frustrating --- sometimes I just want to be wanted.

[barkingM1]

Raiynsong wrote...

I was pretty lucky this time with Leliana---she ended up firmly in the warm zone and hasn't budged much. I didn't ooh and ah about shoes, I just said, yeah thanks, or something, about my hair, and I got pissed off at her "elf" comments. My next playthrough tho, I think I will romance her all the way, just so I can get the achievement for it. She and Wynne are much easier to deal with if you just don't talk to them much
I do wish women could romance Morrigan tho---she is a rather nice friend to women characters

I started my first playthrough fully intending to romance Leliana, & was won over by Allistair instead.  Then Zev edged Al out in my affections.  I'd really like to romance a woman in the game, but Princess Jealous McNeedypants is somehow . .  really offputting to me.  

When you tell her you read about bards in a history book, & she laughs it off?  I know it's supposed to be that she's nervous, but it goes on just that bit too long, & she really sounds insane . . .

[Creature 1]

Cuddlezarro wrote...
heh last time I tried to do a proper Leleina romance playthrough she ended up dead and my character ended up in the arms of antoher man...

that should tell you what i thought of that romance

So, you broke up over religious differences?  :innocent:

[Creature 1]

barkingM1 wrote...
I started my first playthrough fully intending to romance Leliana, & was won over by Allistair instead.

My first playthrough I wasn't sure which to pick, and then I turned off her romance by picking the wrong hair-do discussion response.  She ninja-ed me later, but I couldn't dump Alistair, even though I tried to convince him I could keep them both.  

[sami jo]

ejoslin wrote...

Sannox, the interesting thing about him sharing his final mission, he will share it with a lover at 71+ adore, but he won't share it with a friend until 91+ Friendly (so AFTER Taliesen). It's why I'm convinced, as hard as Zevran tries to keep it casual, he was falling in love the entire time.

Edit: It really is very touching and very telling how soon he trusts a Warden who's his lover.

I'm so far behind, and I probably am way off topic by now but... there is a line when you talk to him about why he is refusing to go to the tent with you in which he says, "Since you asked me to your tent, I have been so confused."  That could be understood to mean the time he refused you or the very first time you were together.  I generally take it to mean the first time given how different his reactions are if you are romantically involved with him versus just friends even at much lower approval. 

Edit:  Yep, seriously late.    I still firmly believe that he was falling for the Warden from the very beginning.  The huge leaps every time you do or say anything nice to him, even when not romantically involved, make it clear just how much it means to him, even if he doesn't have a clue what those emotions are.  I wonder if he wants to leave after Taliesin if he is just a friend because he *does* feel more for the Warden.  

Modifié par sami jo, 10 mars 2010 - 11:12 .

[Raiynsong]

really, Leliana... loves hair, shoes, the chantry, and doesn't read history books.... what's to like ?



@ Sabriana -- THAT'S nightmare worthy right there . but I think I will try to romance her just once... in the interest of Science

[ejoslin]

sami jo wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

Sannox, the interesting thing about him sharing his final mission, he will share it with a lover at 71+ adore, but he won't share it with a friend until 91+ Friendly (so AFTER Taliesen). It's why I'm convinced, as hard as Zevran tries to keep it casual, he was falling in love the entire time.

Edit: It really is very touching and very telling how soon he trusts a Warden who's his lover.

I'm so far behind, and I probably am way off topic by now but... there is a line when you talk to him about why he is refusing to go to the tent with you in which he says, "Since you asked me to your tent, I have been so confused."  That could be understood to mean the time he refused you or the very first time you were together.  I generally take it to mean the first time given how different his reactions are if you are romantically involved with him versus just friends even at much lower approval. 

You're actually very on topic, but maybe unintentionally!

[Addai]

ejoslin wrote...
Zevran asks to leave if not romanced.  He asks to stay if romanced.  If he's romanced and you tell him he can leave, he says something like, "That is not the answer I was hoping for."  Just before he leaves 

Zevran actually has made his decision.

I don't get the feeling on a Friend playthrough that he is asking to leave.  He is suggesting that he could leave, but if you even give him a glimmer of welcome, he jumps at the chance to stay with the Warden.

I was frustrated that at endgame HNF could only tell him a lukewarm "you're welcome to stay," rather than something more positive.  But he reacted so happily, it was really all he needed to hear.

[ejoslin]

Addai67 wrote...

ejoslin wrote...
Zevran asks to leave if not romanced.  He asks to stay if romanced.  If he's romanced and you tell him he can leave, he says something like, "That is not the answer I was hoping for."  Just before he leaves 

Zevran actually has made his decision.

I don't get the feeling on a Friend playthrough that he is asking to leave.  He is suggesting that he could leave, but if you even give him a glimmer of welcome, he jumps at the chance to stay with the Warden.

I was frustrated that at endgame HNF could only tell him a lukewarm "you're welcome to stay," rather than something more positive.  But he reacted so happily, it was really all he needed to hear.

Hmmm, it really did strike me as a friend he was asking to leave.  Maybe that's only if he's been dumped?  When he's romanced, the dialog is very different than when he's dumped.  It was only on my first playthrough that I had him as a friend at that point (didn't turn on the romance until after she was dumped by Ali) and I really don't remember if it was different than the dumped version.

[Nonvita]

Addai67 wrote...

I don't get the feeling on a Friend playthrough that he is asking to leave.  He is suggesting that he could leave, but if you even give him a glimmer of welcome, he jumps at the chance to stay with the Warden.

True, although if you keep telling him he can choose what he wants to do (as a friend, at least if he's lukewarm), he'll end up leaving. I don't think that means he wants to leave, but when given the choice he will choose to do it. But he does seem very happy when you ask him to stay.

[Cuddlezarro]

this is quite possibly the most evil thing some one can do in this game

[ejoslin]

CZ, that's so awful! OMG! I'm still laughing, and getting weird looks from my family.

[Addai]

ejoslin wrote...

Hmmm, it really did strike me as a friend he was asking to leave.  Maybe that's only if he's been dumped?  When he's romanced, the dialog is very different than when he's dumped.  It was only on my first playthrough that I had him as a friend at that point (didn't turn on the romance until after she was dumped by Ali) and I really don't remember if it was different than the dumped version.

I don't remember the conversation after Taliesin so well- I'll run it again later to check.  Because of course, no matter how many times I play that scene, it never gets old...

However I do clearly remember my endgame choices on HNF.
PC: You're welcome to stay.
Zev:  *happy* stays

PC:  You can go if you come back.
Zev: *wistful, talks as if they will never see each other again*

Not terribly satisfying dialgoue choices for the PC there.  The second one sounds like you're putting him on a leash, the other like you could care less what he does.  But if he really wanted to leave, he could take the first as an opening to do so if that's what he wanted.  So maybe I'm glad the writers chose to put it that way, because what it tells me is that given an open choice, he stays.

Modifié par Addai67, 10 mars 2010 - 11:10 .

[sami jo]

Does anyone know what his epilogue is if he leaves after Taleisin?

[ejoslin]

Addai67 wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

Hmmm, it really did strike me as a friend he was asking to leave.  Maybe that's only if he's been dumped?  When he's romanced, the dialog is very different than when he's dumped.  It was only on my first playthrough that I had him as a friend at that point (didn't turn on the romance until after she was dumped by Ali) and I really don't remember if it was different than the dumped version.

I don't remember the conversation after Taliesin so well- I'll run it again later to check.  Because of course, no matter how many times I play that scene, it never gets old...

However I do clearly remember my endgame choices on HNF.
PC: You're welcome to stay.
Zev:  *happy* stays

PC:  You can go if you come back.
Zev: *wistful, talks as if they will never see each other again*

Not terribly satisfying dialgoue choices for the PC there.  The second one sounds like you're putting him on a leash, the other like you could care less what he does.  But if he really wanted to leave, he could take the first as an opening to do so if that's what he wanted.  So maybe I'm glad the writers chose to put it that way, because what it tells me is that given an open choice, he stays.

I'm not talking about then Addai67.  I'm talking about immediately after Taliesen.  Then, if he's not romanced, he asks to go.

Edit: He talks about there being a freedom he's never known and asks to be released.  He will stay if asked, but he definitely asks to go, at least when dumped.  But when he's romanced, he talks about staying, and is very happy when just asked to stay.

Modifié par ejoslin, 10 mars 2010 - 11:20 .