35177 réponses à ce sujet

[ejoslin]

Sylph_14 wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

Carliw wrote...

ejoslin wrote...
Actually, that would be very much in character.  I bet it also stops the romance.

Depends, if you refuse by saying, "We're not exactly alone," you don't even lose approval and the romance stays as it is.

Hmmmm, I'll have to try this.  I normally don't even get to the point where he asks   

At exactly 71 approval he'll offer a sexy massage ;D

Oh trust me, I've gotten that before.  I just normally don't wait!

Edit: Actually, now that I"m on I'm not sure WHAT playthrough, I'm romancing Zevran yet again, but the only gifts he's getting are the gloves and boots -- no gold or silver bars.  No sex either.  And yes, I will get to 71 this way easily, even though I'm not going for maximum approval.  I wanted to see how necessary gifts and sex are -- turns out, they're not necessary at all as long as you aren't a jerk to him.

Modifié par ejoslin, 04 janvier 2010 - 12:30 .

[ejoslin]

If Ali is hardened, he's still fine with not becoming king, though he wants to be king if you ask him. Eamon has him pretty convinced he should be king.

[ejoslin]

Hmmmm, as an interesting side note -- Zevran just hit Love before the Taliesen encounter. I had no clue that was even possible. I wonder if this is going to cause any differences with that encounter, but I doubt it. I'm going to be sad when I've exhausted all romance possibilities with him.

[Sylph_14]

I'm fairly sure it's a bug. I've had it before, and gaining approval actually took it back to adore.



I actually wonder though, since you can turn him down without losing approval or the relationship (the whole 'We're not exactly alone' bit), how do things pan out if you don't actually sleep with him until AFTER the Taliesen encounter? o.O

[ejoslin]

Sylph_14 wrote...

I'm fairly sure it's a bug. I've had it before, and gaining approval actually took it back to adore.

I actually wonder though, since you can turn him down without losing approval or the relationship (the whole 'We're not exactly alone' bit), how do things pan out if you don't actually sleep with him until AFTER the Taliesen encounter? o.O

I figured out why it switched to love, and while I don't think it's a bug, it doesn't seem to make a difference (the way the dialog goes, it makes perfect sense for it to switch to love).  Wynne still disapproves, no comment from Morrigan, though Leliana did have her talk about how attractive he is. And of course, he still says, "you call."  It switched when he was at 88, but since I still had a conversation left, and the boots, I was able to get it up to 100 and it's still at Love.  Using the magic of reload, when you're not at 100, going back to the tent drops it back to adore, but any other way of raising it does not.  Once he's at 100, the tent is ok again; it doesn't go back to adore.

*Grin* I know what happens if you don't sleep with him until after the Taliesen encounter -- it goes along the same lines. 

Hahaha, I am spending far too much time analyzing every angle of this!

Modifié par ejoslin, 04 janvier 2010 - 04:07 .

[Tharissa]

It's a bug. =( There was a post a while back from a dev that none of them are eligible for the love setting until you complete their personal quest. Too bad, having "love" kick in early had my mage all sorts of estatic.

[Namirsolo]

Carliw wrote...

Sylph_14 wrote...

Oh, I know ^.^ I found it interesting because to me it seemed a pretty clear indicator of just how sincere he was about his feelings for the player. It was almost kind of cute, in the sad adorable kicked puppy kindda way :/

I seriouly play around with convo options way to much D:

He seems to be very understanding of the PC's predicament and choices, no matter what those choices are.

There is no such thing as playing too much with convo options. As long as it's fun, it's not too much.

jenovan wrote...
I'm finding the male romance really interesting because of all the
little checks, and Zevran being quite careful about boundaries.

I like it also because a great deal of cheesy compliments never happens.

I think the reason that Zevran is careful of boundaries so much is that the devs were worried about homophobic people being offended by him while playing a male character. I think the dialogue he has with a male or female character is usually no different, it just has gender checks that will change one or two word here and there.

When he offered the massage to my latest character she told him they weren't alone and he kind of chuckled at her but didn't disapprove. You're able to immediately pick up the conversation again if you want. I also think it's sweet.

I think the in character explanation of why he is so accepting of the PC's choices is kind of complicated. First, he's a pragmatist and is not completely concerned with whether a choice is moral but what the results and consequences of the action will be. Second, he has been saved from a life of, well, servitude by the Pc and he feels that he is in their debt (if he is in good standing with them) or that he is stuck with them until the Crows show up again since he'll do better facing them if he has help. I also kind of get the idea that he is intrigued by the pc sexually and just in a general sense. Otherwise, i don't think he would be so quick to talk to them about his past when he won't really talk about it at all with the other party members. 

Like other people here have been saying, he probably feels that he has a connection to the PC. This would probably happen if someone were to look another person who had just attempted to kill them in the eye and decide not to kill them or turn them into the authorities. i kind of think that even Zevran would think that the PC was kind of crazy for doing it. 

[MorningBird]

I actually like how the Zevran romance differs between female and male PCs.  I think I've stated somewhere before that in terms of romance, I'm a sucker for both Lelianna and Zevran.

Regarding their same-sex relationships, I feel that a lot of emphasis is placed on the PC being female during the f/f Lelianna romance, whereas in the m/m Zevran romance, it’s actually quite subdued.  It’s refreshing, how they differentiate from each other, and that despite their differences, both romances seem to put a lot of emphasis on 'camaraderie' over 'gender'.

In the Lelianna romance, she states right away that enjoying someone’s company is what first and foremost appeals to her.  She doesn’t care about whether or not the player is a man or a woman, but who they are as a person, which is a nice thing to stage a relationship around.

Zevran will hit on the female PC straight out of the batting cage, for reasons that have probably been stated several times over in this topic.  However, I believe (at least during your first encounter) that his shameless flirting has more to do with survival than the façade he’s built up over the years.  He thinks he can secure a safe place in the PC’s party if he offers her his ‘behind the counter’ services.  With a male PC, this is drastically different.

He has no idea what the PC’s bedroom interests are.  Thus, offering his services in that particular moment is a risk not worth taking.

It’s only after the PC has built up a friendship with Zevran and a bond of trust is formed that he reveals his ‘other side’, and the male romance can pick up from there, if the player so chooses.

The female PC’s romance with Zevran tends to progress as ‘lust’ turned ‘romance'.  The male PC’s romance, on the other hand, feels more like ‘friendship’ turned ‘romance’, and I love the difference between the two. At least, that’s my take on it.  How you perceive each relationship is always going to come down to character perspective, but… uuuug, so much love for both romance options either way.

EDIT:  also, I hate the formatting on these forums sometimes.

Modifié par MorningBird, 04 janvier 2010 - 07:04 .

[ejoslin]

Tharissa wrote...

It's a bug. =( There was a post a while back from a dev that none of them are eligible for the love setting until you complete their personal quest. Too bad, having "love" kick in early had my mage all sorts of estatic.

I insist that it's an easter egg!  *grin*

[Sabriana]

OK, what does happen if the PC turns the massage down the first time? I want to be spoiled. I'm way past this encounter and don't have any saves, because I accidentally hit 'delete save'. What can I say, it was late and I was tired.

Maybe just a hint? Does he offer it again? Please...

[ejoslin]

Nothing happens, and no, he doesn't offer it again. Next time you have to approach him. I just passed that part.

[Sabriana]

Thanks, Ejoslin. I've got to play again, I guess and see if anything else is different. I've never turned him down. I tried to, honest I did

I have the 'can't say no to Zevran' disease, I guess.

[ejoslin]

Namirsolo wrote...

Like other people here have been saying, he probably feels that he has a connection to the PC. This would probably happen if someone were to look another person who had just attempted to kill them in the eye and decide not to kill them or turn them into the authorities. i kind of think that even Zevran would think that the PC was kind of crazy for doing it. 

The connection is actually part of a dialog you can have with Alistair if he asks you your opinion of your party members after you pick up Zevran.  When he asks you if you trust Zevran and you tell him that you do, he asks you why.  That's when you can tell Alistair that you two have a connection, and Alistair says something like, "Yes, I can see that,"  or something like that.  Of course, you can also tell Alistair you don't trust him and will kill him given half a chance.

I try not to put myself into what I read (that's hard to do) and base my opinions on the actual dialog.  Of course, depending on how you answer things, you can have the PC believing that she and Zevran are completely in love way before that happens (discussion with Wynne or other romantic interest when confronted) OR that the PC is completely clueless that Zevran has feelings for her beyond the physical way after he does (when she can tell Leliana "Zevran is not mine in any stretch of the imagination").

That may be what is the most rich about the romances -- the player really has a way to guide it however they want to.  Well, except for the Alistair and Morrigan endings.  However, with various dialogs, it can be as casual or as intense as the player sees it, and still have it be correct.

Edit: To further expand on this -- a good example is when people speculate why Zevran won't say he loves the PC in those actual words.  I've seen all sorts of reasoning, and while interesting, a lot of times it's not based on what Zevran says about it (I was raised by people who sold the illusion of love, and trained to make my heart cold in favor of the kill. Everything I was taught says how I feel is wrong, but I cannot help it.  Etc. Etc.). Would you really expect someone who was taught all that about love to say the words or be surprised that he doesn't want to hear them?  It is fun to read what people have to say about it, but what I have to say about it I try to keep based on what the characters actually say.  It's surprisingly rich and varied no matter what.

Modifié par ejoslin, 04 janvier 2010 - 01:53 .

[ejoslin]

Sabriana wrote...

Thanks, Ejoslin. I've got to play again, I guess and see if anything else is different. I've never turned him down. I tried to, honest I did
I have the 'can't say no to Zevran' disease, I guess.

Yeh, that seems really common around here. I know I caught it my second play through 

[Rhinna]

I'm on my second romance with Zevran - this time with an elf mage (first time with a Dalish elf) - my only complaint is no more dialogue LOL...



I love Zevran - he's a take charge sorta guy, flirty, yet loyal *sighs* what more could a girl want? (oh, and he gives a mean massage! *winks*) now if only he could cook....



The first go round I romanced Alastair, but the second time it was Zev, and it really got me thinking...Alastair really is a little twit. Here my noble human's family was murdered by a supposed "friend" - she was forced to leave her mortally wounded father and her mother behind in order to save herself (at their request) and who knows what happened to her brother, and her cute little nephew and sister in law are lying in a pool of blood, and all Alastair can do is whine about Duncan, Duncan, Duncan. The boy needs to man up! My poor PC didn't get a shoulder to cry on - geeze...a hint of compassion might have been nice, other than the "Oh, did you ever lose anyone close to you?" well "DUH!!!! HOW DO YOU THINK I GOT HERE NUMNUTS???" And then his response is something to the effect of "oops my bad...forgot about your family getting slaughtered, and you losing your title and lands...right...let's get going shall we?"

[ejoslin]

Rhinna wrote...

I'm on my second romance with Zevran - this time with an elf mage (first time with a Dalish elf) - my only complaint is no more dialogue LOL...

I love Zevran - he's a take charge sorta guy, flirty, yet loyal *sighs* what more could a girl want? (oh, and he gives a mean massage! *winks*) now if only he could cook....

The first go round I romanced Alastair, but the second time it was Zev, and it really got me thinking...Alastair really is a little twit. Here my noble human's family was murdered by a supposed "friend" - she was forced to leave her mortally wounded father and her mother behind in order to save herself (at their request) and who knows what happened to her brother, and her cute little nephew and sister in law are lying in a pool of blood, and all Alastair can do is whine about Duncan, Duncan, Duncan. The boy needs to man up! My poor PC didn't get a shoulder to cry on - geeze...a hint of compassion might have been nice, other than the "Oh, did you ever lose anyone close to you?" well "DUH!!!! HOW DO YOU THINK I GOT HERE NUMNUTS???" And then his response is something to the effect of "oops my bad...forgot about your family getting slaughtered, and you losing your title and lands...right...let's get going shall we?"

And you didn't seek to get revenge?  I've done Alistair/Cousland a couple of times.  My favorite one he was never romanced, but the PC was nice to him; best friends so to say. He was very self centered and weak, but she couldn't do this alone.  She romanced Zevran (which I do in all my games for now), and when the landsmeet came, I chose her to be queen, and stay with Zevran.  I also told Alistair that the PC would try to have a baby with someone else (he minds it far less if he's never been romanced). I'm actually doing another Cousland play through right now, Alistair fell in love and my PC didn't so she broke it off with him.  I haven't decided if she'll be queen or not.  Zevran will stick around, but it's not something he's that crazy about.  He says something like how he loves a royal scandal.  Then he goes on to say that they'll have to talk about it later, but for now there's still a good chance that one or both of them will die and if so, problem solved!  

[Rhinna]

I did, but it seemed sort of...hollow. No one said "hey, now! You feel better?" or even ASKED about MY grief *sniffs*



As an aside...Just got the funniest line from Zevran - I put it up there with "Pirate Zevran" LOL:



(In the Brecilian Forest by the hermit, inspecting the treestump. My PC puts her hand into the cubbyhole, but can't find anything)



Zevran: "No offense, but might I try? I've a quick hand after all..."



PC: "Go ahead. Show off"



Zevran: "Ha! Let's see...when was the last time I slipped my hand into some dark hole?...."



LOL

[jenovan]

ROFL! That's horrible!! And I passed up on checking out that cubby, too...



On the subject of Pirate Zevran, sort of, is there a particular instance where he might say that? Or is it random what he might say if you invite him back to your tent?



The first time my PC invited him, he had just turned down the "massage" (accidentally, via the "We're not exactly alone" reply). Zevran comes back with "Does something in your tent need assassinating?" The second time he gave the "I'm not even drunk yet!" quip. I kinda want to hear what the pirate line sounds like, in terms of Zevran's voice. ;D

[Sabriana]

You think that's bad? How about me clicking on his little portrait for no other reason then hearing him say to my PC "Si Amore" and "I am yours". Among other things. I guess when you even love his little blurbs ("we are ridiculously awesome", and "they should run away more"), then you are quite far gone.

Or getting all melty and getting the awww's" when he tentatively asks my mage if it's true that mages can turn people into toads.

[ejoslin]

Sabriana wrote...

You think that's bad? How about me clicking on his little portrait for no other reason then hearing him say to my PC "Si Amore" and "I am yours". Among other things. I guess when you even love his little blurbs ("we are ridiculously awesome", and "they should run away more"), then you are quite far gone.
Or getting all melty and getting the awww's" when he tentatively asks my mage if it's true that mages can turn people into toads.

Oh no!  There's additional dialog if you play a mage?  AAAAHHHHH!  I hate playing casters!  Ok, next play through, arcane warrior or crowd controller it is!  The fade ought to be fun when wearing robes . . . 

[Sialater]

The fade is a cakewalk as a mage, especially if you have Heal.

[ejoslin]

Sialater wrote...

The fade is a cakewalk as a mage, especially if you have Heal.

I've always just gone through in burning man form and wacked things down with my weapons, switching to golem to heal and spirit against the demons.  *grin* I like to keep it simple.  But mage it is!  In fact, I may give up poor Elissa since I've done this before.  

I did play a male mage to unlock blood magic, but I don't remember if the fade was easy or difficult.  I normally think of it as something painful to get through!  

[BlastedLands]

ejoslin wrote...

 I normally think of it as something painful to get through!  

aww, you know what you're doing it for, be brave!

[ejoslin]

Wow, if you break up with Zevran just after you sleep with him but before he hits adore, he is incredibly relieved. He looks like he just dodged a bullet! I suppose that he does develop feelings at that point, not further down the line.



Oh, old save games . . . Gotta love them.

[ejoslin]

Haerja wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

 I normally think of it as something painful to get through!  

aww, you know what you're doing it for, be brave!

*grin*  Now I have to figure out how to build a mage.  Healing is boring, controlling won't help with the fade part, and I'm not going to the tower without Zevran so she'll be higher level . . .   lalala, off to move to a different part of the forums!