493 réponses à ce sujet

[rak72]

sylvanaerie wrote...

Physically I think he would have (Since she was pregnant). Emotionally I think its more akin to rape. I hate asking him to do it but its the only way I can get a "happy" ending with my games. Loghain is always dead and Riordan isn't an option. The one time I played a Cousland boy, I spared Alistair of ever hearing about the ritual and did it myself.

Oddly that's also the only time I could refuse her and get two of the other endings too.

NEVER EVER EVER going to do a Warden Commander ending again. SUCKIEST ending ever!!

Imagin if the situation was reversed and Zev came up to Al and proposed having Lady Cousland sleep with him to save their lives??  Al would punch him out, never say a word about it, and take the death blow himself.  Just because Al is a guy does not make the proposition cool.

[rak72]

Zev probably smells like Drakar Noir, while Mo probably had a fishy swamp witch smell. Who would you rather

[Addai]

imported_beer wrote...

SurelyForth wrote...

How would agreeing to sleep with Morrigan throw doubt on his love for the Warden? 

According to my husband's theory it is because he will do it even if the PC says it will concieve the demon baby.

I have no idea if this is true because I never played that part.

Yes, he'll still do it, but the more information he has on what the ritual actually does, the more he hates it. It is more difficult to convince him if you tell him a) it will produce a child, and Morrigan is seeking an Old God.  At that last bit, he goes into complete brain fry.

When he does finally agree to it, he says, "Alright, alright, if it will spare you or Riordan, then against my better judgement I will do this thing."  (emphasis is Alistair's)  Under certain dialogue circumstances, he will say that he would rather take the blow himself than go through with the DR.  His agreement is evidence of his trust in the Warden, not evidence that he doesn't care about her!

I keep posting these screenshots on various threads, but it's because I keep coming across people questioning the fact that Alistair really doesn't want to do the DR.  He doesn't.  He really, really doesn't. 

[ejoslin]

rak72 wrote...

Imagin if the situation was reversed and Zev came up to Al and proposed having Lady Cousland sleep with him to save their lives??  Al would punch him out, never say a word about it, and take the death blow himself.  Just because Al is a guy does not make the proposition cool.

Are you sure about that?  Alistair does not mind the fempc having sex with Zevran even if he's at 100 love as long as Zevran's approval is low enough.

Edit: *grin* I know I'm stirring the pot here in a completely irrelevant way 

Modifié par ejoslin, 02 avril 2010 - 07:37 .

[nos_astra]

ejoslin wrote...

rak72 wrote...

Imagin if the situation was reversed and Zev came up to Al and proposed having Lady Cousland sleep with him to save their lives??  Al would punch him out, never say a word about it, and take the death blow himself.  Just because Al is a guy does not make the proposition cool.

Are you sure about that?  Alistair does not mind the fempc having sex with Zevran even if he's at 100 love as long as Zevran's approval is low enough.

Edit: *grin* I know I'm stirring the pot here in a completely irrelevant way 

And you're having a great time doing so, I bet.

You asked for it! Two words: game mechanics.

Edit: I love the Team Zevran badges. We need to have new ones for Team Alistair.

Modifié par klarabella, 02 avril 2010 - 07:39 .

[rak72]

ejoslin wrote...

rak72 wrote...

Imagin if the situation was reversed and Zev came up to Al and proposed having Lady Cousland sleep with him to save their lives??  Al would punch him out, never say a word about it, and take the death blow himself.  Just because Al is a guy does not make the proposition cool.

Are you sure about that?  Alistair does not mind the fempc having sex with Zevran even if he's at 100 love as long as Zevran's approval is low enough.

Edit: *grin* I know I'm stirring the pot here in a completely irrelevant way 

No way he would ask you to do that.  Even if your banging Zev with low approval, that is by your choice. But he would  never pimp you out

Modifié par rak72, 02 avril 2010 - 07:40 .

[ejoslin]

edit: Deleted this post because it made no sense, even to me, which means it wasn't as funny as I thought it was when I first typed it.

Modifié par ejoslin, 02 avril 2010 - 07:41 .

[rak72]

ejoslin wrote...

klarabella wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

rak72 wrote...

Imagin if the situation was reversed and Zev came up to Al and proposed having Lady Cousland sleep with him to save their lives??  Al would punch him out, never say a word about it, and take the death blow himself.  Just because Al is a guy does not make the proposition cool.

Are you sure about that?  Alistair does not mind the fempc having sex with Zevran even if he's at 100 love as long as Zevran's approval is low enough.

Edit: *grin* I know I'm stirring the pot here in a completely irrelevant way 

And you're having a great time doing so, I bet.

You asked for it! Two words: game mechanics.

Yeh, but explain CAMMEN!  Heh, imagine the fuss if Cammen were the one who could do the magical impregnate the warden ritual.

Ok, maybe I've had a bit too much coffee today...

DAMN, why cant we go back to the Dalish camp and have him do the joining!!!!!!!!   That would be PERFECT.  Imagin how impressed Ghayna would be if he slew an Arch Demon!

[ejoslin]

I actually wonder. I could see Alistair telling the Warden about it, but not pressuring her to do it. He's never willing to JUST take the death blow; there's always that discussion first if the ritual hasn't been done. Of course, that is game mechanics as well -- the conversation makes the most sense if the warden is not Alistair's love interest.

Edit: ARGH! I knew I didn't delete that post quickly enough!  *grin*

Modifié par ejoslin, 02 avril 2010 - 07:44 .

[SurelyForth]

imported_beer wrote...
It is not about loving her less LadyDamodred. It is about what type of love it is. Some people fight, some people cave in, some people do the noble thing instead, some people stand firm...His theory just states that Alistair's love is not abiding.  He values too many things above it, and he is willing to stake too many things against it.

You know, the more I think about his theory, the more plausible it seems to me. Then again, I am sitting in an airport eating a granola bar which is the first thing I have eaten all day. Tomorrow I might think differently.

Then again, *shrug*, no one but Maker Gaider knows for sure.

If Alistair did not remain in love with the Warden after he ends their relationship, I might be more inclined to agree that his love is shallow. However, he does not forget about her as soon as he walks away. The emotions are there for him, even after the archdemon is slain he is still heartbroken over the end of the relationship. At some point, he might move on but it's clear from his dialogue that he doesn't see that happening.

[nos_astra]

ejoslin wrote...

edit: Deleted this post because it made no sense, even to me, which means it wasn't as funny as I thought it was when I first typed it.

Oh, but it was funny! I even wanted to answer:

[smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/w00t.png[/smilie] Damn, I forgot Cammen. Oh, I have to admit, I secretly think under the innocent chantry boy surface are darker and naughtier sides to discover. That's part of Alistair's charm.

Modifié par klarabella, 02 avril 2010 - 07:47 .

[Addai]

Fereldans seem to have a pretty, shall we say, pragmatic attitude towards casual sex. Correct me if I'm wrong, but none of the LIs object to the PC "schooling" Cammen, for instance. It is only when there is emotional commitment that the LIs get territorial. Morrigan, ironically, is pretty territorial with a romanced PC, and I'm sure that's partly why she is depicted in the comic as agonizing over putting her only friend in the position of having to "share."



I guess I'm of the mind, despite being pretty traditional IRL, that if the Warden herself puts Alistair up to doing the DR, you can hardly fault him for agreeing to do it. If he doesn't agree, he puts her life in danger. Does it really show more caring for him to refuse out of prudish scruple, knowing that it could mean her death?

[Axekix]

rak72 wrote...

Zev probably smells like Drakar Noir, while Mo probably had a fishy swamp witch smell. Who would you rather

What?  No way!  Morrigan cares way too much about her image to walk around all funky.

If anything I'd bet she smells like wild flowers... and the male PC.

The only party members I remember being called out for stinking were Dog and Alistair.

[rak72]

ejoslin wrote...

I actually wonder. I could see Alistair telling the Warden about it, but not pressuring her to do it. He's never willing to JUST take the death blow; there's always that discussion first if the ritual hasn't been done. Of course, that is game mechanics as well -- the conversation makes the most sense if the warden is not Alistair's love interest.

Edit: ARGH! I knew I didn't delete that post quickly enough!  *grin*

I think Al ALWAYS takes the deathblow, if he's ever been in love with the PC.  No??  Unless you leave him at the gates.

[ejoslin]

LOL, it was immortalized anyway!

[ejoslin]

rak72 wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

I actually wonder. I could see Alistair telling the Warden about it, but not pressuring her to do it. He's never willing to JUST take the death blow; there's always that discussion first if the ritual hasn't been done. Of course, that is game mechanics as well -- the conversation makes the most sense if the warden is not Alistair's love interest.

Edit: ARGH! I knew I didn't delete that post quickly enough!  *grin*

I think Al ALWAYS takes the deathblow, if he's ever been in love with the PC.  No??  Unless you leave him at the gates.

Not always, no.  Only if he's flagged still in love.  If you dump him for someone else, it's the friendship ending. 

[LadyDamodred]

imported_beer wrote...

LadyDamodred wrote...
  I see no conflict in it, or that him going through with the DR to save the woman he loves means he somehow loves her less.

It is not about loving her less LadyDamodred. It is about what type of love it is. Some people fight, some people cave in, some people do the noble thing instead, some people stand firm...His theory just states that Alistair's love is not abiding.  He values too many things above it, and he is willing to stake too many things against it.

You know, the more I think about his theory, the more plausible it seems to me. Then again, I am sitting in an airport eating a granola bar which is the first thing I have eaten all day. Tomorrow I might think differently.

Then again, *shrug*, no one but Maker Gaider knows for sure.

Well, loving her less as in he values other things more than it, which I don't think it true.  But he has a duty, and his character demands that he do it, regardless of the consequences to himself.  He says that if he doesn't end it now, he'll never be able to.  He's doing it now with all the harsh reality firmly in his face, when he feels he's strong enough to do it.

Unless you show him that he and your love are worth fighting for.  Like I said earlier, he's never had anyone do that.  If you just cave and agree with him, then what you had wasn't strong enough to last.  But if you fight, he will, too.  Giving you up is the last thing he wants to do, and with just a little bit of encouragement, he'll never do it.  Ever.  I find that kind of abiding. 

[ejoslin]

LadyDamodred wrote...

Well, loving her less as in he values other things more than it, which I don't think it true.  But he has a duty, and his character demands that he do it, regardless of the consequences to himself.  He says that if he doesn't end it now, he'll never be able to.  He's doing it now with all the harsh reality firmly in his face, when he feels he's strong enough to do it.

Unless you show him that he and your love are worth fighting for.  Like I said earlier, he's never had anyone do that.  If you just cave and agree with him, then what you had wasn't strong enough to last.  But if you fight, he will, too.  Giving you up is the last thing he wants to do, and with just a little bit of encouragement, he'll never do it.  Ever.  I find that kind of abiding. 

Well, only if he's hardened.  If he's not hardened, you can't fight for it.  Maybe one way to roleplay it is if he's not hardened he did not want to be king, and you making him king makes him love the warden less.

[rak72]

Axekix wrote...

rak72 wrote...

Zev probably smells like Drakar Noir, while Mo probably had a fishy swamp witch smell. Who would you rather

What?  No way!  Morrigan cares way too much about her image to walk around all funky.

If anything I'd bet she smells like wild flowers... and the male PC.

The only party members I remember being called out for stinking were Dog and Alistair.

I don't know, she just look greasy and scanky to me, plus, what is up with those rags she wears??

[Addai]

LadyDamodred wrote...

Unless you show him that he and your love are worth fighting for.  Like I said earlier, he's never had anyone do that.  If you just cave and agree with him, then what you had wasn't strong enough to last.  But if you fight, he will, too.  Giving you up is the last thing he wants to do, and with just a little bit of encouragement, he'll never do it.  Ever.  I find that kind of abiding. 

Agreed.  In a couple instances, Alistair will comment that he doesn't believe he deserves to be happy.  He also never believed he would find love.  I think he has a bit of a martyr complex and is thus too willing to believe that losing the PC is what he deserves and is almost a foregone conclusion.  When you tell him "being king is not a punishment," the look on his face is like a light bulb going on.

[LadyDamodred]

ejoslin wrote...

LadyDamodred wrote...

Well, loving her less as in he values other things more than it, which I don't think it true.  But he has a duty, and his character demands that he do it, regardless of the consequences to himself.  He says that if he doesn't end it now, he'll never be able to.  He's doing it now with all the harsh reality firmly in his face, when he feels he's strong enough to do it.

Unless you show him that he and your love are worth fighting for.  Like I said earlier, he's never had anyone do that.  If you just cave and agree with him, then what you had wasn't strong enough to last.  But if you fight, he will, too.  Giving you up is the last thing he wants to do, and with just a little bit of encouragement, he'll never do it.  Ever.  I find that kind of abiding. 

Well, only if he's hardened.  If he's not hardened, you can't fight for it.  Maybe one way to roleplay it is if he's not hardened he did not want to be king, and you making him king makes him love the warden less.

That could be.  You can also look at it that Alistair's never learned to make his own happiness, and so when he is faced with the choice, he chooses what he's always known: duty.

[Cuddlezarro]

Alistair will comment that he doesn't believe he deserves to be happy.

one of those instances is if you execute him in love status~

[Addai]

rak72 wrote...

I don't know, she just look greasy and scanky to me, plus, what is up with those rags she wears??

Morrigan's codex specficially mentions that she's meticulous about her appearance.  Hence why a lot of her gifts are jewelry.  Her robe, well, that is just her style and probably not far off from what Chasind women wear.

[Axekix]

Addai67 wrote...

rak72 wrote...

I don't know, she just look greasy and scanky to me, plus, what is up with those rags she wears??

Morrigan's codex specficially mentions that she's meticulous about her appearance.  Hence why a lot of her gifts are jewelry.  Her robe, well, that is just her style and probably not far off from what Chasind women wear.

This^

Not to mention Flemeth has groomed her to be a seductress after all.

Modifié par Axekix, 02 avril 2010 - 07:57 .

[LadyDamodred]

Addai67 wrote...

LadyDamodred wrote...

Unless you show him that he and your love are worth fighting for.  Like I said earlier, he's never had anyone do that.  If you just cave and agree with him, then what you had wasn't strong enough to last.  But if you fight, he will, too.  Giving you up is the last thing he wants to do, and with just a little bit of encouragement, he'll never do it.  Ever.  I find that kind of abiding. 

Agreed.  In a couple instances, Alistair will comment that he doesn't believe he deserves to be happy.  He also never believed he would find love.  I think he has a bit of a martyr complex and is thus too willing to believe that losing the PC is what he deserves and is almost a foregone conclusion.  When you tell him "being king is not a punishment," the look on his face is like a light bulb going on.

Exactly.  I won't say martyr complex, but he's never had anyone just want *him*.  Maric, Eamon, the Chantry....  Even Duncan, for all that I think he truly did care about Alistair, only takes him as a Grey Warden.  Your PC is the first person to be all 'I don't care about anything else except YOU'.  Pretty powerful stuff.