431 réponses à ce sujet

[CronoDragoon]

wymm666 wrote...

Oh wow you're relentless, 9 pages all for you. Anyway, of course I can discount that. It's like chosing between, hamburger, hotdog and chicking wings, you buy the hotdog but getting a handful of charred bread crumps instead. Not the same. I'm pretty sure we were promised "endless possibilities for an ending, since it's the last game, there's no restriction blah blah blah" by bioware back in the day. This is just not good enough for all the hype they put us through.

I'm pretty sure you were not promised that. They said they were more free to branch off at the endgame without a follow-up game coming. Which they absolutely did, considering the vastly different states of the universe in each of the endings.

The problem with the endings is not choice; people got enough choice. The choices were just....not what I was looking for.

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 12 octobre 2012 - 04:49 .

[AlanC9]

sharkboy421 wrote...
Way late but I have always considered Lovecraft's writings to be part of sci-fi.  Or rather, his weird fiction writings were some of the foundations for sci-fi.  Kind of how blues is the ancestor of punk rock.  The style of music that was blues lead to rock and roll which spawned the massive genre of music that is "rock"; everything from bubble gum pop to hair metal to hardcore punk. 

Just as blues and punk are related but are very distinct from each other, Lovecraft's weird fiction is related to sci-fi but is still rather distinct.  However, the same way certain guitar riffs fit in both punk and blues, the idea of cosmicism and a Cthuhlu-like being can fit in both Lovecraft's work and sci-fi. 

I agree that fantasy and sci-fi are parts of a larger whole.

I just don't see how Reapers with incomprehensible motives can work in sci-fi. If they're advanced enough to be incomprehensible, they're advanced enough to be invincible. In fantasy you can handwave this stuff.

Modifié par AlanC9, 12 octobre 2012 - 04:54 .

[Mathias]

No I don't agree with that comment. With the exception of Ultima IX, I don't think there's been a video game franchise that had such a cataclysmic fall from grace as Mass Effect.


Stricly speaking, the ending to Mass Effect 3 is one of the finest examples of how much you can ruin an entire franchise in 10 minutes. Even though ME3 had some issues before the ending, the entire trilogy was superb and some even called it "The Star Wars" of our generation. But all that came to an abrupt halt towards the end. It went from the best to the absolute worst, and it's one of the most glorious and spectacular literary suicides, i think a gaming franchise has ever endured.

Nowadays whenever gamers think of really bad video game endings, ME3 is one of the first that comes to mind.

[dreman9999]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

No I don't agree with that comment. With the exception of Ultima IX, I don't think there's been a video game franchise that had such a cataclysmic fall from grace as Mass Effect.


Stricly speaking, the ending to Mass Effect 3 is one of the finest examples of how much you can ruin an entire franchise in 10 minutes. Even though ME3 had some issues before the ending, the entire trilogy was superb and some even called it "The Star Wars" of our generation. But all that came to an abrupt halt towards the end. It went from the best to the absolute worst, and it's one of the most glorious and spectacular literary suicides, i think a gaming franchise has ever endured.

Nowadays whenever gamers think of really bad video game endings, ME3 is one of the first that comes to mind.

Sorry, no one thinks ME3 is a bad game because of the ending. And you have yet to say why the ending is  not a bout sacrifice.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

Yes.

[CronoDragoon]

dreman9999 wrote...
Sorry, no one thinks ME3 is a bad game because of the ending. 

A lot of people think that. Just look at Metacritic. Regardless of whether or not they are correct in thinking this, they clearly think this.

[Blueprotoss]

C9316 wrote...

At this point I think we the players understood 'sacrifice' pretty damn well; we didn't need genocide, totalitarianism, or whatever synthesis is presented in such a way that made nearly everything you did pointless.

If thats really the case then some people shouldn't be complaining about the hours of playtime with ME series just like any other video game series.

darthoptimus003 wrote...

sorry didnt spend money on a bs deep meaning i spent money to be entertained
and i wasnt thanks to the ending

Entertainment is subjective whether its a movie, tv show, comic, novel, or video game.

crimzontearz wrote...

I would GLADLY sacrifice earth, the geth, the quarians, the Normandy's crew and half the sentient life of the galaxy to have a Shepard lives + reunion ending. That enough sacrifice to be approved by you? Enough to pass the test of maturity?

According to the polls that is what a lot odlf people wanted but all we got was more speculation and apparently the reaffirmation that we paid for a lesson in the darkness of life and whatever other grimdark mature theme they wanted to school us on.  That's fine, you are right we were never promised a happy ending...I never promised them to buy another new game from them, hopefully enough will so the same do  Bioware will actually be dissolved and their manpower repurposed.

If polls were that accurate then less people would have played ME1 and ME2 based on the morality that the ME series always had present.

Storin wrote...

Empirical evidence suggests you do not. You said that those who disagree with you "can't see the big picture", and you began this thread with a quote by someone utterly dismissing the intelligence of those who dislike the ending. These are not the actions of someone who respects differences of opinion.

To be fair this works both ways and a bunch of people didn't want to see the big picture based on Shepard alone.

AlanC9 wrote...

I'm a big fan of going OT, but this Odyssey stuff is getting silly.

Agreed and it seems the best way for some people to avoid the topic is to create strawmen and to use ad hominems, which the logcal fallacy part isn't directed at you.

inko1nsiderate wrote...

Come on people, we're seven months in. The chances of convincing someone to even listen to your viewpoint on the BSN are strictly zero.

I'm surprised this is still going on as well.

Ratimir wrote...

Really? Where did the Xenomorphs of the Alien series come from? What's their motivation?

They come from a virus while their movtivation is to infest just like what the Flood, Zerg, and Tyrannid do.

CronoDragoon wrote...

A lot of people think that. Just look at Metacritic. Regardless of whether or not they are correct in thinking this, they clearly think this.

If thats the case then most video games would be bad wheb random people filled with rage create 0 reviews.

Modifié par Blueprotoss, 12 octobre 2012 - 05:37 .

[Mathias]

dreman9999 wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

No I don't agree with that comment. With the exception of Ultima IX, I don't think there's been a video game franchise that had such a cataclysmic fall from grace as Mass Effect.


Stricly speaking, the ending to Mass Effect 3 is one of the finest examples of how much you can ruin an entire franchise in 10 minutes. Even though ME3 had some issues before the ending, the entire trilogy was superb and some even called it "The Star Wars" of our generation. But all that came to an abrupt halt towards the end. It went from the best to the absolute worst, and it's one of the most glorious and spectacular literary suicides, i think a gaming franchise has ever endured.

Nowadays whenever gamers think of really bad video game endings, ME3 is one of the first that comes to mind.

Sorry, no one thinks ME3 is a bad game because of the ending. And you have yet to say why the ending is  not a bout sacrifice.

Wow, that's hardcore denial if i've ever seen it.

Also i don't recall saying i would attempt to explain why the ending is not about sacrifice, nor did the OP ask us to.

[drayfish]

dreman9999 wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

No I don't agree with that comment. With the exception of Ultima IX, I don't think there's been a video game franchise that had such a cataclysmic fall from grace as Mass Effect.


Stricly speaking, the ending to Mass Effect 3 is one of the finest examples of how much you can ruin an entire franchise in 10 minutes. Even though ME3 had some issues before the ending, the entire trilogy was superb and some even called it "The Star Wars" of our generation. But all that came to an abrupt halt towards the end. It went from the best to the absolute worst, and it's one of the most glorious and spectacular literary suicides, i think a gaming franchise has ever endured.

Nowadays whenever gamers think of really bad video game endings, ME3 is one of the first that comes to mind.

Sorry, no one thinks ME3 is a bad game because of the ending. And you have yet to say why the ending is  not a bout sacrifice.

Are you just attempting to be contrarian?

Many people say that ME3 is a bad game because of the ending - sadly I'm one of them.  That doesn't make those people definitively right, just as your opinion does not make anyone definitively wrong.  I'm not sure why exactly you have such a narrow and self-righteous perspective upon how the game must be perceived and how only your vision is valid, but it is unjustified and extremely unhelpful.

As for your notion of sacrifice, how would this fit in if I were an amoral, racist meglomaniac?  I could play the ending quite happily, sacrifice none of my morals, and have the game tell me several different ways that I'm great.  How then does this speak in any way to the nature of sacrifice?

Indeed, by that logic it is rather a lesson in not having morals in the first place - that way you don't have to bother to feel bad when they get tested.

Modifié par drayfish, 12 octobre 2012 - 05:21 .

[Blueprotoss]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

No I don't agree with that comment. With the exception of Ultima IX, I don't think there's been a video game franchise that had such a cataclysmic fall from grace as Mass Effect.


Stricly speaking, the ending to Mass Effect 3 is one of the finest examples of how much you can ruin an entire franchise in 10 minutes. Even though ME3 had some issues before the ending, the entire trilogy was superb and some even called it "The Star Wars" of our generation. But all that came to an abrupt halt towards the end. It went from the best to the absolute worst, and it's one of the most glorious and spectacular literary suicides, i think a gaming franchise has ever endured.

Nowadays whenever gamers think of really bad video game endings, ME3 is one of the first that comes to mind.

Sorry, no one thinks ME3 is a bad game because of the ending. And you have yet to say why the ending is  not a bout sacrifice.

Wow, that's hardcore denial if i've ever seen it.

Also i don't recall saying i would attempt to explain why the ending is not about sacrifice, nor did the OP ask us to.

To be fair the denial would be coming from you since ME3 being good or bad is opinion just like any other video game.  Also its bad to resort to ad hominems.

Modifié par Blueprotoss, 12 octobre 2012 - 05:39 .

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

Mike1220 wrote...

A man on Youtube posted this to counter what someone said about the ending being bad.
"Then you completely missed the ending. The point of the
ending is not to make you feel like you won everything, but to make you
understand the meaning of sacrifice. Yeah, decisions in ME1 or ME2 may
not seem like a huge impact in the end, but ME3 makes you remember
everything that you did, your experience, your struggles, your
victories. In the end, you save the galaxy and let all beings be as they
have always been.
You pick how you want to live and be remembered by."

I 100% agree with him. What do you guys think?

What?

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

No I don't agree with that comment. With the exception of Ultima IX, I don't think there's been a video game franchise that had such a cataclysmic fall from grace as Mass Effect.


Stricly speaking, the ending to Mass Effect 3 is one of the finest examples of how much you can ruin an entire franchise in 10 minutes. Even though ME3 had some issues before the ending, the entire trilogy was superb and some even called it "The Star Wars" of our generation. But all that came to an abrupt halt towards the end. It went from the best to the absolute worst, and it's one of the most glorious and spectacular literary suicides, i think a gaming franchise has ever endured.

Nowadays whenever gamers think of really bad video game endings, ME3 is one of the first that comes to mind.

+1

You could so make a Star Wars referrence about how ME should have been the greatest trilogy ever, not one of the as you so eloquently put it one of the most glorious and spectacular literary suicides a gaming franchise has ever endured.

[Grubas]

the payoff to conrad verner storyarch is bigger than to the entire trilogy.
Ending was unsatisfying pre EC and just ok in a classic rpg- videogamey kind of way.
sorry mike

Modifié par Grubas, 12 octobre 2012 - 06:12 .

[Reth Shepherd]

Quick question, OP. Have you read the Marauder Shields comic? And if so, what is your impression of it compared to Bioware's endings?

[grey_wind]

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

No I don't agree with that comment. With the exception of Ultima IX, I don't think there's been a video game franchise that had such a cataclysmic fall from grace as Mass Effect.


Stricly speaking, the ending to Mass Effect 3 is one of the finest examples of how much you can ruin an entire franchise in 10 minutes. Even though ME3 had some issues before the ending, the entire trilogy was superb and some even called it "The Star Wars" of our generation. But all that came to an abrupt halt towards the end. It went from the best to the absolute worst, and it's one of the most glorious and spectacular literary suicides, i think a gaming franchise has ever endured.

Nowadays whenever gamers think of really bad video game endings, ME3 is one of the first that comes to mind.

+1

You could so make a Star Wars referrence about how ME should have been the greatest trilogy ever, not one of the as you so eloquently put it one of the most glorious and spectacular literary suicides a gaming franchise has ever endured.

Forget videogaming. It's one of the most spectacular literary suicides in any fictional medium. Ever.

[magneticpolarshift]

The EC helped a lot, the kid was superfluous for sure, but in Sci-fi everything is made up. Sure it's based on theories but we can't fly in space and we have no utter idea what is out there. You can make anything up I was happy with Harbi being the main antagonist. No need for any overlord AI or anything.

The original ending was terrible, way to much to speculate on and figure out, leaves you hanging with no satisfaction. The EC helps a lot and explains some things like how your squadmates get on the normandy etc., but the ending was quite simply boring, I was expecting a big battle of some sort after the arms opened up and Anderson died, but the last thing we fight is a maruder. I really hope an EC about Harbi is done, he definitely deserved more limelight in the game. I really wish we could taken out a capital ship too, destroyers are cool but shep should have gotten in at least one capital kill.

[Applepie_Svk]

Mike1220 wrote...

"Then you completely missed the ending. The point of the
ending is not to make you feel like you won everything, but to make you
understand the meaning of sacrifice.

LOLOLOL.... there was no sacrifice, only slaughter - and series itself wasn´t just about sacrifice despite that Mass Effect 3 was pushing hard for sacrifice on each corner...

And about sacrifice ? You need to make biggest leap of faith of the whole game series where you are supposed rule on galaxy... this is not sacrifice this is leap of faith or stupidity, when main protagonist went full retard mode in last 10 minutes of game and should blindly believe to unkown entity.

Modifié par Applepie_Svk, 12 octobre 2012 - 06:53 .

[hukbum]

Applepie_Svk wrote...

And about sacrifice ? You need to make biggest leap of faith of the whole game series where you are supposed rule on galaxy... this is not sacrifice this is leap of faith or stupidity, when main protagonist went full retard mode in last 10 minutes of game and should blindly believe to unkown entity.

So you where stuck on moron-island too, while BW tried to teach us the meaning and feel of "sacrafice"?

[Applepie_Svk]

hukbum wrote...

Applepie_Svk wrote...

And about sacrifice ? You need to make biggest leap of faith of the whole game series where you are supposed rule on galaxy... this is not sacrifice this is leap of faith or stupidity, when main protagonist went full retard mode in last 10 minutes of game and should blindly believe to unkown entity.

So you where stuck on moron-island too, while BW tried to teach us the meaning and feel of "sacrafice"?

Yeah since 6 march... otherwise so many celebrating EC as well of wisdom or greater achievment, but instead of that they have recieved more questions than answers - and these answers for these questions will be filled in more paid DLCs, already happened with Leviathan, there is still lot of empty slots for Crucible, Keepers, Citadel....

[Nicksta92]

1st page of comments:

GOOD OL' BSN!!!

[Maxster_]

ME3 is story about crushing defeat, abandoning all hope, and unconditional surrender to a insane entity's whim.
Ending is not about sacrifice, it is about necessity, appeal to insanity, and trying to end this nightmare with less horrific consequences.

Incosistent and very badly written.

[hukbum]

Applepie_Svk wrote...

hukbum wrote...

Applepie_Svk wrote...

And about sacrifice ? You need to make biggest leap of faith of the whole game series where you are supposed rule on galaxy... this is not sacrifice this is leap of faith or stupidity, when main protagonist went full retard mode in last 10 minutes of game and should blindly believe to unkown entity.

So you where stuck on moron-island too, while BW tried to teach us the meaning and feel of "sacrafice"?

Yeah since 6 march... otherwise so many celebrating EC as well of wisdom or greater achievment, but instead of that they have recieved more questions than answers - and these answers for these questions will be filled in more paid DLCs, already happened with Leviathan, there is still lot of empty slots for Crucible, Keepers, Citadel....

And we will go out there and buy it, because we still have hope to escape moron-island or at least learn how to speak idiot, so that we - maybe - one day can learn our lessn of sacrafice ^^

Modifié par hukbum, 12 octobre 2012 - 07:08 .

[Iakus]

 No.  I play video games to be a hero and feel good about it.  Not to feel guilty over a war crime a glitchy AI makes me commit to avoid galactic annihilation.

Forced sacrifice isn't.

But then maybe I'm just too stupid to "get it"

[Obadiah]

Mike1220 wrote...

A man on Youtube posted this to counter what someone said about the ending being bad.
"Then you completely missed the ending. The point of the ending is not to make you feel like you won everything, but to make you understand the meaning of sacrifice. Yeah, decisions in ME1 or ME2 may not seem like a huge impact in the end, but ME3 makes you remember everything that you did, your experience, your struggles, your victories. In the end, you save the galaxy and let all beings be as they have always been. You pick how you want to live and be remembered by."

I 100% agree with him. What do you guys think?

Agreed. Once you have to chose, you really get a sense that "this is it", and everything that Shepard has done has led to this unexpected climactic moment. Trying to make that decision brought back all of Shep's experiences in game. Of course, the callateral damage from the Destroy option made me remember all of the "greater good" arguments of The Illusive Man and Saren, as well as the interactions with EDI, Legion, and the Geth.

In addition, because Shepard turns into this legendary figure, all of his decisions and interactions sort of guide the ethos of the surviving and rebuilt civilzation.That happens much more explicitly with Control.

Modifié par Obadiah, 12 octobre 2012 - 07:13 .

[Vigilant111]

Oh, OP, how condescending of you, "BIG picture", if it is THAT big, people would have picked it up

Now responding to your original post: Yeah well, so is real life, but we are not playing real life in ME3 are we?

Lessons about sacrifice? What do you make of Mordin's death? What do you make of Legion's death? What do you make of Ashley/Kaidan's death?