697 réponses à ce sujet

[cgj]

Farosyrn wrote...

cgj wrote...

Farosyrn wrote...

Thanks, but...whatever it is, something is seriously wrong. I'm used to playing squishy classes, but lately I've been hitting the ground faster than I can even curse "f***!"...

so now that gates are out of the way
will people when i'll tell them that maybe it's coming from all the new enemies ?

Don't think so. I just played Reapers, which are, after all, still the same - my team died on me at the beginning of wave 7, I believe, and I went on to merrily solo the rest of it. SI, that is. I started burning through gel and ops packs right away, and I have soloed Reapers before on that character. It was outright ridiculous, and when I hit the ground for the 7th (!) time, I was just terribly sorry to have wasted my teammates time. Seriously, you go down way, way faster than before.

you could have been on a bad day, sometimes i can go rampage, jump into spawns and survive, and sometimes i die to a lone trooper (generally marauders, always was and always will be the strongest mook in the game)
because if gates are fine
what can it possibly be other than new enemies you're not used to fight
recent changes with stomps and such may also influence people's view in a bad way

[Shakespeare212]

Again, guys, isn't just possible that the more aggressive, faster-moving enemies are upping the death count?

Your feedback that the game feels different after the game is out there. Obviously, Bioware has heard it. Give them the necessary time to investigate what the real reason is - like they always do.

[Zxypher]

I have to agree, I never really knew what the shieldgate was in full context and specifics but I did know it saved my a**...a lot. Now something is wrong, I don't know what it is but I know I'm spending more time dead than ever before.

I wish I had the HDD space to record videos of all the games I've been playing as proof but sadly I do not. Maybe some others can help record and show that things are FUBAR.

[stysiaq]

I think we all played enough of this game to feel the difference between a bad day and a genuine change in characters survivability.

[Lord Rosario]

stysiaq wrote...

cgj wrote...

Megadawg169 wrote...


Then isn't this misleading to the players? The pictures shows that "Okay, I can take one more bullet, then gates kick in giving me enought time to get to cover" but if the shield is already gone and gate is in effect or over then that could explain why so many people are dying so easily

this isn't misleading, this is picture, the delay is so small that you can't see it in game

And somehow, the delay was noticeable  a few days back.

Actually, the picture above on this page makes it quite clear to me that the shields are indeed down. Look at the character, not the bars at the bottom. You can clearly see the animation for shields dropping and I'm sure that you could hear the sound as well.

Still, I do recall that even on platinum I could hear my shields drop and if I was quick enough, that invulnerability was long enough to let me back into cover if I was right next to it, even being shot at by a full auto weapon. My reaction time is not that of a god.. I could never pull that off in under 0.02 seconds, which is what the two gates are supposed to be.

[Shakespeare212]

Bioware made wave changes to account for new enemy classes. I think it's far more likely that these account for the recent change in feel that everyone's talking about.

[stysiaq]

Shakespeare212 wrote...

Again, guys, isn't just possible that the more aggressive, faster-moving enemies are upping the death count?

Your feedback that the game feels different after the game is out there. Obviously, Bioware has heard it. Give them the necessary time to investigate what the real reason is - like they always do.

false. Reapers didn't change besides Marauders and Cannibals getting an execution move and they are 'harder' as well.

[Zero132132]

The invulnerability duration on the gates used to be substantially longer on higher difficulties. It must have been. A gold turret couldn't kill my fitness-less Asari Adept while it was firing from full shields/health to death in the brief time you lean out of cover when casting warp. Now it absolutely can.

[JSLfromBx]

thanks for the all people who quoted me, my reasoning is simple:

On one hand Mr Fragman data says the gates are working exactly as they were designed to work.
On the other hand everyone feel that the gates are working quite differently after the patch.

The only logical conclusion is that the gates were not working as designed before the patch.I think we'll find our answer by taking a look at the data from the previous build of the game. Do continue to quote my first post if you feel I am right, we'll get to the bottom of this mistery , somehow .

Modifié par JSLfromBx, 12 octobre 2012 - 09:11 .

[B.Shep]

Funny thing. I was playing until a few minutes ago and i did five gold extractions (2 collectors/1 reapers/1 geth/1 cerberus). And the game was running very nice.

Hmm, maybe i just wasn't accustomed to the new enemies...

Modifié par B.Shep, 12 octobre 2012 - 09:12 .

[cgj]

Megadawg169 wrote...

cgj wrote...

Megadawg169 wrote...


Then isn't this misleading to the players? The pictures shows that "Okay, I can take one more bullet, then gates kick in giving me enought time to get to cover" but if the shield is already gone and gate is in effect or over then that could explain why so many people are dying so easily

this isn't misleading, this is picture, the delay is so small that you can't see it in game

not necessairly. I've had just that sliver of sheilds before. If he is saying that the sheild bar doesn't accurately show your real sheild level all the time, then that could lead to alot people dying. The gate is suppose to kick in when our sheilds are gone, but if your screen still shows sheilds up but gate is already in effect, that at least on silver, which i mainly play, would explain the seeming lack of gate. Since it would techinally be kicking in while the game shows your sheilds up for a half second before switching over to the health bar.

no the silver of shield thing is another issue that have always's been there for me
and i agree this one is misleading, cause you don't even get the bloody screen warning you off when it happens

things may not have changed with reapers
but other factions' changes made you realize and pay attention to the lethality of troopers, reapers included

marauders have always been priority targets, they always pretty much killed you if the whole burst hit you
check out their numbers and you'll freak out

i believe on gold, not sure and requires verification, they do about 100 damage per bullets , PER BULLETS
and i think i don't need to tell you about their ROF and accuracy

Marauders are the deadliest enemies of th reaper faction, ravagers come in second only

people die to marauders 5000x more than they die to banshees

[MaKTaiL]

I guess what really changed here wasn't the gate, but the rate at which the enemies fire.
I remember very clearly that once your shield was down the enemies stopped shooting at you for a brief second.
That + the gate were enough for a quick scape, even on platinum.

Modifié par MaKTaiL, 12 octobre 2012 - 09:29 .

[Grunt_Platform]

.

That is not just someone having a bad day. That is not new and more aggressive enemies. That did not happen prior to the DLC.

Yes, you would be cut down quick for standing like an idiot in front of a bunch of Cannibals, but there would be two pronounced breaks in the onslaught, where the damage gates kicked in allowing you to retreat to safety. Those pauses are noticeably either absent, or too short to matter in this video.

They clearly still work against single large hits, like the blasts of an Atlas, but they are doing nothing to basic trooper level fire. This means the game is actually easier the further into a mission you get, not harder.

Modifié par EvanKester, 12 octobre 2012 - 09:25 .

[Daihannya]

The gates are there. I definitely am still abusing them with the Fury. But something has changed on it after the patch last week before the DLC. It "feels" different. Given the number of hours I played according to N7 HQ, whatever the cause of the change it was noticeable to me and a number of other players. Maybe the death animation being slower just makes it feel like it is lagging a little more who knows.

[Shampoohorn]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

Shampoohorn wrote...


Thanks for the explanation, Eric.

Are the cooldowns the reason why my drellguards frequently die at the end of a charge?  Or are there some other issues at play, like a lack of invulnerability during charge or no post-charge damage resistance?

I'm not a multiplayer programmer, but I believe the Vanguard charge issues are related to our fixes to the Vanguard glitch. To ensure we fixed the glitch, I believe our programmers changed the way Biotic Charge works so that the host is responsible for more of the checks rather the clients having more authority over the move, and like someone said earlier clients may be allowed to do the move even though on the host they died. This does make the power feel less responsive but it does seem to have fixed the glitches. I can't give more details since I didn't work on that fix.

This was something that also existed before the patch.  I had asked Thomas Abram the question about 3 months ago and he said is was an issue you guys were aware of with respect to the drell and other vanguard kits like the Phoenix. 

I always host as drellguard and the issue seems to be with taking damage at the end of the charge, not the beginning.  So I don't think it was something introduced with the patch.

[jcamdenlane]

JSLfromBx wrote...

I know what happened Mr Fragman, please hear me out.

I think the problem is not how the shield gates works nows, the problem is how the gates worked BEFORE the patch.

You say that gold gates only last 0.1 sec and yet everyone who played the game extensively saw the gates in actions and 0.1 s is just too short a time for the human brain to notice, furthermore, I don't remember anyone ever noticing a different behavior betwen the gates on bronze and gold.

My theory is this:  BEFORE the patch, the gates were actually buged, bronze, silver and gold, all setting had a gates lasting 0.5 sec of invulnerability and that's the way we played the game for 6 month. Apparently someone fixed it the the changed somehow sneaked past your own internal documentation of changes.

It explain everything very clearly ,that's why your data say the gates are working fine while every player tell you something changed drastically, well going from 0;5 sec of invulnerability to 0.1 sec certainly makes a tons of different versus ennemies with auto weapon.

If anyone else feel my theory is correct, please do quote me to bring it to Mr Fragman attention, I am sure he has means of testing the old buid of the game on an internal server. And then we can get the final word on this.

Makes a good bit of sense.  This, if true, would explain the difference that I feel.  

[stysiaq]

Daihannya wrote...

The gates are there. I definitely am still abusing them with the Fury. But something has changed on it after the patch last week before the DLC. It "feels" different. Given the number of hours I played according to N7 HQ, whatever the cause of the change it was noticeable to me and a number of other players. Maybe the death animation being slower just makes it feel like it is lagging a little more who knows.

the game was fine when the patch was up. It's the last tuesday when the massive floor naps began.

[Megadawg169]

well then do you guys support a increase in the time of the gates and see how that will work out?

[MinatheBrat]

Dama733 wrote...

JSLfromBx wrote...

I know what happened Mr Fragman, please hear me out.

I think the problem is not how the shield gates works nows, the problem is how the gates worked BEFORE the patch.

You say that gold gates only last 0.1 sec and yet everyone who played the game extensively saw the gates in actions and 0.1 s is just too short a time for the human brain to notice, furthermore, I don't remember anyone ever noticing a different behavior betwen the gates on bronze and gold.

My theory is this:  BEFORE the patch, the gates were actually buged, bronze, silver and gold, all setting had a gates lasting 0.5 sec of invulnerability and that's the way we played the game for 6 month. Apparently someone fixed it the the changed somehow sneaked past your own internal documentation of changes.

It explain everything very clearly ,that's why your data say the gates are working fine while every player tell you something changed drastically, well going from 0;5 sec of invulnerability to 0.1 sec certainly makes a tons of different versus ennemies with auto weapon.

If anyone else feel my theory is correct, please do quote me to bring it to Mr Fragman attention, I am sure he has means of testing the old buid of the game on an internal server. And then we can get the final word on this.

That... may explain quite alot if its true.

This makes alot of sense.

[nick91_99]

If they are now working as designed, then make them NOT work again like it used to be.

[cgj]

EvanKester wrote...

.

That is not just someone having a bad day. That is not new and more aggressive enemies. That did not happen prior to the DLC.

Yes, you would be cut down quick for standing like an idiot in front of a bunch of Cannibals, but there would be two pronounced breaks in the onslaught, where the damage gates kicked in allowing you to retreat to safety. Those pauses are noticeably either absent, or too short to matter in this video.

They clearly still work against single large hits, like the blasts of an Atlas, but they are doing nothing to basic trooper level fire. This means the game is actually easier the further into a mission you get, not harder.

haha, i know this video
the guy made the video to use it against me at first, i'mma tell you the same thing i did tell him (and he's insulted me for this ...), gates never helped against high ROF enemies, even more so against 3 high ROF enemies

i don't know what made all of you guys notice this only now (i'm still standing for the new enemies and stomps)

search for old videos , you'll see that it was like this all along

Modifié par cgj, 12 octobre 2012 - 09:34 .

[Chobbly]

That would explain a lot. Maybe now they are working 'correctly'. Proving it either way might be difficult. Great to get a response though.

[winelanv44]

Question about the Reapers/Glacier video: where is the health gate?

[SimJoseph7]

Bottom line for me:

I (and many others from what I have observed), are dropping at a much faster now. I don't know why (shield/health gate, new enemies or just a plain tweak to the A.I.). It is across all 4 difficulty levels (i.e. Bronze feels like Silver, Silver feels like Gold etc.) that this "issue" is present.

There are great players out there that welcome it but for ***me***, I am starting to dislike this game (and I have a lot of hours in it, over 650).

It also doesn't make me feel good when I've also invested over $180 in a 6 month period (I supported this game with every new DLC as it benefited both myself and BioWare).

Please don't get me wrong, I love the new additions to the game (especially with the challenges and new HQ pages).

All I really wanted to do was max my manifest first and then play the game using the cornucopia of combinations (races, classes, weapons, and tech/biotic options) available to me.

That has all changed now. Getting credits has become painfully slow. Many characters (and weapons to some extent) are no long viable.

This is all my opinion of course. I had fun before the changes. I should have more fun with them in theory (there is some great stuff that has been added to the game).

Once again, my bottom line: something has radically changed that has diminished the fun for ***me***. Please bring it back, OK?

Joseph

N.B. I still am playing with the hope that issues (to me) will be rectified.

[JSLfromBx]

Megadawg169 wrote...

well then do you guys support a increase in the time of the gates and see how that will work out?

Well I see 3 ways of testing if the gates used to last longer:

1: Bioware plug some 3 months old build of the game somewhere and Mr Fragman test the gates duration there

2: we find some old video of someone standing in front of a cerberus turret, with their high damage and super fast firing rate we can do a frame by frame analysis to determine the actual lenght of the shield gates on gold before the DLC patch.It should be impossible to miss a difference betwen 0.1 sec of invulnerability and 0.5 sec under that kind of firepower. Probably the easiest methode, provided the footage exist somewhere.

3: they changes the gates duration to 0.5 sec on gold on the live build we're currently playing and they let us , the player, try it for one week end, good dev/gamer cooperation and it should tell us if things feel normal again. Probabl not very pratical and/or risky to do for weekly balance team.