442 réponses à ce sujet

[MissFish]

Just so everyone's clear, in the OP I asked if farming was bad enough to need ALL of the action Bioware took against it.

This isn't an anti- FBW thread. I actually like it. I mearly wanted to know if changing the geth and the map was needed that bad.

[Lord Rosario]

MissFish wrote...

CronicleChicken wrote...

Fox-snipe wrote...

Lord Rosario wrote...

I don't understand this concept that sitting in one place isn't a fair tactic but forcing enemies to spawn in a single specific place...isn't.

You realize that the old White abused that same exact thing, right?  And it also exploited the pathing of enemies so they'd always enter two choke points (ultimately combining into a single choke), never exploring flanking routes?

This is where you are wrong. There are three areas and the fact that you didn't mention it makes me wonder...

The AI never took the back pathway. They're not smart enough to go around.

Phantoms and Rocket Troompers would go around if they were not killed  while trying to survive around the doorway. Banshees would often go through the side wall. Two of those enemies were the most dangerous things you could come across on Platinum.

Also, FBW wasn't the only camping point, Glacier was one too, hence why the room was closed off. Forcing enemies into an area so players can focus fire isn't ok, but apparently forcing enemies to spawn in an area and doing the same thing is fine? Yeah no..

Edit: Also will point out that Banshees were upgraded for better pathfinding and two cover busting enemies were added. Apparently camping was a bigger issue than several glitches that didn't get touched too.

Modifié par Lord Rosario, 14 octobre 2012 - 07:34 .

[Fox-snipe]

ReverendBeast wrote...

The statements you made "you no longer have to put in an adequate amount of effort to earn them" and "(what could be called a higher level of "skill") are really very subjective.  It assumes that the RGL way to play this game is "better", "higher skill" etc... I hate speed runs.  I think players that do are people who suffer from ADHD....  See that's a subjective point of view...  How can anyone say home much time is enough to "earn them"???  Nope the whole my RGL is superior to the "room of shame" is just a non sequetor, sorry...

Hypothetical question time...

If rocket glitching were acceptable and the Krysae remained at its OMGWTF destruction level, so much so that those are the only things people ever used in a match and almost never wiped as a result, would you then say that players who do only those things exhibit the same amount of effort/skill as those who did not?

MissFish wrote...

Just so everyone's clear, in the OP I asked if farming was bad enough to need ALL of the action Bioware took against it.

This isn't an anti- FBW thread. I actually like it. I mearly wanted to know if changing the geth and the map was needed that bad.

Well, hopefully the changes to the Geth means that faction will get a serious hit by the nerf/correction bat.  I'm fearful that it won't happen soon enough though since a lot of the cheapness with the Geth appears to be bugs.

Modifié par Fox-snipe, 14 octobre 2012 - 07:34 .

[ReverendBeast]

MissFish wrote...

Just so everyone's clear, in the OP I asked if farming was bad enough to need ALL of the action Bioware took against it.

This isn't an anti- FBW thread. I actually like it. I mearly wanted to know if changing the geth and the map was needed that bad.

OP I got that

I say the answer is NO the changes weren't really needed that bad

[Antagony]

Lord Rosario wrote...

Antagony wrote...

Reegar Carbine + Flamer destroys bombers fairly quick, and pretty much everything else, so FBWGG is still relatively easy.

I had to chuckle at this.. You do know they fixed the glitch that allowed you to use both at once, right? Personally, I find Phasic rounds on a single shot sniper or shield drain/overload and a strong gun to work quite well.

Yes, and it's still super effective. Firing flamer and then reegar is a lot less effective then doing it the other way around. I was just the top scorer today using them in a PUG FBWGG, so I know what I'm talking about.

[Uh Cold]

MissFish wrote...

Just so everyone's clear, in the OP I asked if farming was bad enough to need ALL of the action Bioware took against it.

This isn't an anti- FBW thread. I actually like it. I mearly wanted to know if changing the geth and the map was needed that bad.

The map change? Yes, stop rewarding cheap tactics.
The geth new unit? Yes, gives us more variety.
The Pyro? Yes, I agree that armored units shouldn't be grabbable.

They devs even said they intentionally wanted pyros not to be grabbale and with the patch they were able to implement it.

Modifié par Uh Cold, 14 octobre 2012 - 07:40 .

[Lord Rosario]

Antagony wrote...

Lord Rosario wrote...

Antagony wrote...

Reegar Carbine + Flamer destroys bombers fairly quick, and pretty much everything else, so FBWGG is still relatively easy.

I had to chuckle at this.. You do know they fixed the glitch that allowed you to use both at once, right? Personally, I find Phasic rounds on a single shot sniper or shield drain/overload and a strong gun to work quite well.

Yes, and it's still super effective. Firing flamer and then reegar is a lot less effective then doing it the other way around. I was just the top scorer today using them in a PUG FBWGG, so I know what I'm talking about.

That's a given as the Reegar is weak against armor and the flamer is strong against it.
I also used the sniper with overload/shield drain tactic through a lot of today, just not on FBW.

[ReverendBeast]

Fox-snipe wrote...

ReverendBeast wrote...

The statements you made "you no longer have to put in an adequate amount of effort to earn them" and "(what could be called a higher level of "skill") are really very subjective.  It assumes that the RGL way to play this game is "better", "higher skill" etc... I hate speed runs.  I think players that do are people who suffer from ADHD....  See that's a subjective point of view...  How can anyone say home much time is enough to "earn them"???  Nope the whole my RGL is superior to the "room of shame" is just a non sequetor, sorry...

Hypothetical question time...

If rocket glitching were acceptable and the Krysae remained at its OMGWTF destruction level, so much so that those are the only things people ever used in a match and almost never wiped as a result, would you then say that players who do only those things exhibit the same amount of effort/skill as those who did not?

MissFish wrote...

Just so everyone's clear, in the OP I asked if farming was bad enough to need ALL of the action Bioware took against it.

This isn't an anti- FBW thread. I actually like it. I mearly wanted to know if changing the geth and the map was needed that bad.

Well, hopefully the changes to the Geth means that faction will get a serious hit by the nerf/correction bat.  I'm fearful that it won't happen soon enough though since a lot of the cheapness with the Geth appears to be bugs.

First and fore most, comparing camping on FBW to rocket glithching and over powered weapons???  I fail to see the connection...
How is working a legit strategy and using cover effectively remotely the same as those two???
And to your question about those players who would only play that way. If they find they enjoy the game playing it that way than why should I care??? How does it affect me???  I don't really care if they've done noithing but glitch runs...  Again, how does hat affect me???  More importantly why should they play the game to my standards???  They did buy it right???   Would you complain if your neighbor used briquets in his gas grill??? 

Modifié par ReverendBeast, 14 octobre 2012 - 07:44 .

[Gunboat Diplomat]

ReverendBeast wrote...

Schachmatt wrote...

There is a difference between camping and just sitting around with no skill at all and take out the enemy with little to no effort. FBW had this issue that it could be exploited with no effort at all.

Glad BW sorted this out. If you don't have the skill you don't deserve better equipment compared to someone who earned his manifest with competence and dedication. It's as easy as that.

Was it really so hard to start your own room and invite your friends?  I think the real issue is a bit of the elitist mentality breaking through

You know...  "I am an awesome player and me and my buds can whip through a Plat run in 14:30!!!  Why should some mook who sits in the "room of shame" finish a Plat match like me???"

or if they didn't want to host, look for a map other than fbw? Or a different faction? Yes, I think there's some elitism involved

[staindgrey]

MissFish wrote...

So, has camping ruined the game for everyone else that much? Or is Bioware listening to the loudest players, and not necessarily the majority?

I spent more time bouncing in and out of FBW farming lobbies than I did actually playing the game.

FBW and FBG pretty much killed the game for me for a month or two. Good riddance.

[ReverendBeast]

staindgrey wrote...

MissFish wrote...

So, has camping ruined the game for everyone else that much? Or is Bioware listening to the loudest players, and not necessarily the majority?

I spent more time bouncing in and out of FBW farming lobbies than I did actually playing the game.

FBW and FBG pretty much killed the game for me for a month or two. Good riddance.

Ya know I keep hearing that but never experienced it myself.  Are you on xbox? I think the PC and PS3 minorities may be the one's complaining?  I could always make a room and fill it pretty quick other than FBWGP.

Modifié par ReverendBeast, 14 octobre 2012 - 08:02 .

[ReverendBeast]

Sorry...

Modifié par ReverendBeast, 14 octobre 2012 - 08:01 .

[StiffiJimi]

Please, look at the bigger problem other than this farming/camping issue. The damn missile launcher glitch has yet to be fixed. It seems more Platinum and Gold matches I play now, more people have figured out how to do the glitch and just takes over the whole game and stealing all the kills.

[HusarX]

MissFish wrote...

So, has camping ruined the game for everyone else that much? Or is Bioware listening to the loudest players, and not necessarily the majority?

I didn't have any problem in finding a gold non-FBW Geth game before the patch. I just set the enemy to Cerberus/Reapers.
There were more threads about Geth cheapness than about farming , so I don't know HOW Bioware is listening...

[kaotician]

ReverendBeast wrote...

staindgrey wrote...

MissFish wrote...

So, has camping ruined the game for everyone else that much? Or is Bioware listening to the loudest players, and not necessarily the majority?

I spent more time bouncing in and out of FBW farming lobbies than I did actually playing the game.

FBW and FBG pretty much killed the game for me for a month or two. Good riddance.

Ya know I keep hearing that but never experienced it myself.  Are you on xbox? I think the PC and PS3 minorities may be the one's complaining?  I could always make a room and fill it pretty quick other than FBWGP.

I'm on xbox, and this was exactly my experience too. Time after time, when looking for a gold match, it'd be FBW/G/G that came up, and as others have pointed out, the stats for FBW ran something ludicrous like 30% of all maps played. If you consider that stat, and then the fact that not all games would be Gold, the proportion of these types of farming setups must have been massive - likely, something like 1 in 2 Gold games were FBW/G/G ones.

Personally, I'm delighted with the changes. FBW is now a pleasure to play on again.

Modifié par kaotician, 14 octobre 2012 - 08:22 .

[N7-RedFox]

The changes to FBW layout and the Geth Bomber were enough to prevent camping. Giving Prime's Cannon a RoF buff for mass stunlock + giving him a long-range stunlocking drone + Rocket Troopers which fire around walls and stunlock players before they can act, this was just retarded.

[Lacboi86]

CaptainTeabag wrote...

The changes to FBW layout and the Geth Bomber were enough to prevent camping. Giving Prime's Cannon a RoF buff for mass stunlock + giving him a long-range stunlocking drone + Rocket Troopers which fire around walls and stunlock players before they can act, this was just retarded.

I'm with him with the stun lock, makes no sense.

[Andreadg89]

Me and some friends of mine found that firebase dagger still offers a good place to camp, after patch we often play here in the great control room, two of us controlling the long corridor that leads to an ammo crate, one of us controlling the opposite entrance and the last one goes here and there if one of the minisquads needs help. We also do tactical retreats if enemies overwhelm us in the control room, going out through the back entrance. With this tactic we can win almost 95% of our gold games. Anyway I must say that I like the changes because now players are "forced" to explore other maps other than firebase white, and it adds a lot in terms of game variety, but I still think the changes are too much against players that likes to play defensively. Maybe reducing the dragoon's speed and bombers agility can bring new balance in the metagame?

Modifié par Andreadg89, 14 octobre 2012 - 08:50 .

[ReverendBeast]

kaotician wrote...

ReverendBeast wrote...

staindgrey wrote...

MissFish wrote...

So, has camping ruined the game for everyone else that much? Or is Bioware listening to the loudest players, and not necessarily the majority?

I spent more time bouncing in and out of FBW farming lobbies than I did actually playing the game.

FBW and FBG pretty much killed the game for me for a month or two. Good riddance.

Ya know I keep hearing that but never experienced it myself.  Are you on xbox? I think the PC and PS3 minorities may be the one's complaining?  I could always make a room and fill it pretty quick other than FBWGP.

I'm on xbox, and this was exactly my experience too. Time after time, when looking for a gold match, it'd be FBW/G/G that came up, and as others have pointed out, the stats for FBW ran something ludicrous like 30% of all maps played. If you consider that stat, and then the fact that not all games would be Gold, the proportion of these types of farming setups must have been massive - likely, something like 1 in 2 Gold games were FBW/G/G ones.

Personally, I'm delighted with the changes. FBW is now a pleasure to play on again.

Sorry but I have to drill deeper... So if I understand, when you searched UUG it  came up FBW more than 1 in 2?  If 30% of the games played were FBW then would you have a 1 in 3 chance of landing in the lobby??? I mean I never searched UUB or UUS and ran into a group of campers...  So by my experience it would mean most of that 30% was played in gold or higher levels which would support the 1 in 3 number...  What happend if you started your own room and searched UUG? I just don't get it...  If 30% of the players chose to play FBW why is that a bad thing and how did it affect your ability to fill a UUG room?  I mean doesn't the player base get smaller as you go up in difficulty??  I think 60% of the player base plays S or B if I remeber right. 

So if the S and B players played FBW as non campers and probably because it was a good map to hone your skills on, that is ludricous? 

Sorry, I don't see your reasoning or numbers on this as valid. 

  

Modifié par ReverendBeast, 14 octobre 2012 - 08:59 .

[TrveOmegaSlayer]

I decided to farm White/Platinum completing wave 6.
Fast and very doable for a team of farmers.
I can play Platinums but in the Fall with full work I can play only 2-3 hours in the week end and matches have become too long and credits too few.
So, since I want to unlock everything I need to optimize time.
The biggest error that Bioware made is considering all the farmers low level players.
They're not, there is people that want to unlock everything (to enjoy the game 100%) and have few time.

[LoonySpectre]

Firebase Hydra's control room and balcony are also good place for camping with a good team. Though of course not as easy as White and Glacier.

[78stonewobble]

Whether farming was bad enough?

Perhaps to bioware's/EA's bottomline so I understand their motivation.

Playerbase's reaction to farming was more saddening. Rather akin to wanting to not allow people with yellow cars on the roads because: They take up space and dared pick a yellow car....

To other people the white farming was at most an inconvenience that made them search again or make their own game (basically it cost them some time). Heck I am inconvenienced by old and slow people quite often. Lets make it nigh impossible for them to shop and make side walks slippery... *sigh*

It's not like I can, post dlc, still be guaranteed an u/u game or specific team composition just by searching. So you're still forced to do more searches anyway.

I also don't think that farming was any more exploitative than any of the other playstyles. Imho it was less exploitative.



Now I do like more content. So new enemies, new enemy faction, new guns and new maps is ALL cool.

I'd have paid for stuff like that and would much rather have preferred to pay for small dlc packs and then cut out all the RNG unlocking. Leaving any grinding to weapon/equipment levels dependent on usage. Because everyone likes that their favorite stuff gets a little better.

Coincidentally allmost removing any farming "problem" and, imho, being a more fair way to sell product to customer.

In any case this is just my oppinion and people don't have to see it the same way.

Modifié par 78stonewobble, 14 octobre 2012 - 10:02 .

[Googleness]

what's wrong with new FBW? it's better now as you got 3 more ways to run away from the hordes of mobs.
Also it's very predictable to guess where they will be spawn, 90% of the time is from the spaceship landing pad 1 at a time so you can gain some headshot challenge points along the way

[jrm_ayun]

CronicleChicken wrote...

jrm_ayun wrote...

I know I'm not the only one who goes into a U/U/G in progress and see it's FBW and gives out a deep felt "SIGH"

When you see the Striker/GPS loadout or what have you, right?

I don't get what you mean. If that's for the missle glitchers I'm on pc so non of them there

[Astronaughte]

Was it farming that bad? Yes.
But fbw was also terrible about dead ends. How often did you avoid the cat walk of death up to ladder? How often were you pinned in the mid level control room?
I like changes but I wish there were boxes or other cover in them they look bland and lazy...