269 réponses à ce sujet

[The Spamming Troll]

ive never seen a valid reason why the reapers are this all powerful enemy. its already been discussed that their numbers arent exactly overwhelming. its shown their war strategy is totally idiotic, more so in ME3. benny hill music plays when they chase me around while im planet scanning.

the sole reason why we cant beat the reapers? its their shields.

we cant beat the reapers cuz their shields have too many hit points.

and we got starchild because of it.

[ATiBotka]

Ratimir wrote...

arial wrote...

Ratimir wrote...

No link?

How about a quote? A name? Anything?

go play through ME3, they mention about ever 15minutes "you know we can not win this conventionally"

Oh, I see, you mean "Hackett said so".

And Liara...

[Aaleel]

ATiBotka wrote...

Ratimir wrote...

arial wrote...

Ratimir wrote...

No link?

How about a quote? A name? Anything?

go play through ME3, they mention about ever 15minutes "you know we can not win this conventionally"

Oh, I see, you mean "Hackett said so".

And Liara...

And Victus and Garrus.

[Ratimir]

The real reason we can beat the Reapers:

There are no Reapers. BioWare said so.

Well, Sparatus said so, and apparently a character saying it means BioWare said it.

[ATiBotka]

Aaleel wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

Ratimir wrote...

arial wrote...

Ratimir wrote...

No link?

How about a quote? A name? Anything?

go play through ME3, they mention about ever 15minutes "you know we can not win this conventionally"

Oh, I see, you mean "Hackett said so".

And Liara...

And Victus and Garrus.

And pretty much everyone in the game.

[Aaleel]

A Bethesda Fan wrote...

You won't come back, it is a suicide mission

>comes back

You didn't even know what was on the other side of the Omega 4 relay so how can anyone say what's possible and what's not?  What exactly made it a suicide mission?

You know the parameters here and people (Military leaders) have accesed the situation based on what they've seen and decided that conventional victory isn't possible.

Huge difference.

[Samtheman63]

Ratimir wrote...

The real reason we can beat the Reapers:

There are no Reapers. BioWare said so.

Well, Sparatus said so, and apparently a character saying it means BioWare said it.

you realise bioware created hackett and wrote the script right?  fictional characters in video games cant say things by themselves

[DrGunjah]

You answered your own question. The mere fact that there are Reaper capital ships and destroyers still engaged with Turian and Krogan units means that the Reaper forces are still divided around the Galaxy so a strike against one place with all your units at your disposal could give you a conventional victory at THAT spot. 

I'm not advocating that you can beat all of the reapers in the same spot at the same time, but previous cycles have inflicted conventional losses to the reaper fleet, therefore going by what the game gave you and that the nature of the enemy is not to be concentrated in one spot a conventional victory at Earth would indeed seem possible. Though you'd be right royally screwed at the end of it as although you'd have won that battle it would be difficult to win the war.

Maybe a better statement might be, a conventional victory at Earth should be possible, but an overall conventional victory would not be without the use of the crucible.

uhm no, I did not answer my own question.
Reapers are still engaged with humans on earth and we don't have krogans, so how does that make sense?
The reapers also could just do world by world but they seem to be so many and feel so confident so they just branch out for greater efficiency.
Besides that my question was more about "how exactly does infantry help against 2km ships that pulverize anything in one hit?". A whole fleet has problems to even damage them, so how can krogan infantry do anything against them?

I'm also not sure if a conventional victory on earth could eventually be possible because we don't see enough from the battle around earth. IIRC we only see 2 or 3 reapers getting damaged but a lot more ships from our fleet get pulverized.

[GreyLycanTrope]

ATiBotka wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

Ratimir wrote...
Oh, I see, you mean "Hackett said so".

And Liara...

And Victus and Garrus.

And pretty much everyone in the game.

Yup, just like they kept stressing that ME2 was a suicide mission and there was likely no coming back from it.
To quote Garrus: "An unmapped area, advanced technology, and the Collectors. We're going to lose people. No way around that."

Anyone besides me who found a way around that and didn't lose anyone?

Modifié par Greylycantrope, 14 octobre 2012 - 04:00 .

[AngryFrozenWater]

arial wrote...

people here always seem to argue that conventional victory is possible when infact it is not.

Reason conventional victory is impossible is simple, Bioware says so.

The Mass Effect universe Is Biowares, not yours. as such Bioware decides what happens, what is possible, and what is impossible.

And if BW presents us with nonsense then we can tell them so. But, to be more polite, it seems that BW wants our feedback to improve their products. So, it makes sense to do that in the best way we can.

[The Spamming Troll]

Aaleel wrote...

A Bethesda Fan wrote...

You won't come back, it is a suicide mission

>comes back

You didn't even know what was on the other side of the Omega 4 relay so how can anyone say what's possible and what's not?  What exactly made it a suicide mission?

You know the parameters here and people (Military leaders) have accesed the situation based on what they've seen and decided that conventional victory isn't possible.

Huge difference.

what?

the missions is called "THE SUICIDE MISSION"

what more do you need to know???!!?!?!??

[The Spamming Troll]

Samtheman63 wrote...

Ratimir wrote...

The real reason we can beat the Reapers:

There are no Reapers. BioWare said so.

Well, Sparatus said so, and apparently a character saying it means BioWare said it.

you realise bioware created hackett and wrote the script right?  fictional characters in video games cant say things by themselves

niftu cal says hes a biotic god.

doesnt make it true.

what im saying is you missed the point.

[wantedman dan]

The Spamming Troll wrote...

Samtheman63 wrote...

Ratimir wrote...

The real reason we can beat the Reapers:

There are no Reapers. BioWare said so.

Well, Sparatus said so, and apparently a character saying it means BioWare said it.

you realise bioware created hackett and wrote the script right?  fictional characters in video games cant say things by themselves

niftu cal says hes a biotic god.

doesnt make it true.

what im saying is you missed the point.

Just curious, where are you going with this argument?

[Aaleel]

The Spamming Troll wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

A Bethesda Fan wrote...

You won't come back, it is a suicide mission

>comes back

You didn't even know what was on the other side of the Omega 4 relay so how can anyone say what's possible and what's not?  What exactly made it a suicide mission?

You know the parameters here and people (Military leaders) have accesed the situation based on what they've seen and decided that conventional victory isn't possible.

Huge difference.

what?

the missions is called "THE SUICIDE MISSION"

what more do you need to know???!!?!?!??

Based on what?  If you don't know exactly know what you're going to face how can you call it impossible or a suicide mission?

There's a huge difference between knowing exactly what you're facing and saying we can't do this, and not knowing exactly what you're facing and saying I don't think this is possible, but you're basically assuming the worst.

[Samtheman63]

The Spamming Troll wrote...

Samtheman63 wrote...

Ratimir wrote...

The real reason we can beat the Reapers:

There are no Reapers. BioWare said so.

Well, Sparatus said so, and apparently a character saying it means BioWare said it.

you realise bioware created hackett and wrote the script right?  fictional characters in video games cant say things by themselves

niftu cal says hes a biotic god.

doesnt make it true.

what im saying is you missed the point.

Niftu is off his ******

Hackett is an alliance commander leading the war effort

[wantedman dan]

Aaleel wrote...

Based on what?  If you don't know exactly know what you're going to face how can you call it impossible or a suicide mission?

There's a huge difference between knowing exactly what you're facing and saying we can't do this, and not knowing exactly what you're facing and saying I don't think this is possible, but you're basically assuming the worst.

Your argument isn't as black-and-white as you're trying to make it seem.

[Aaleel]

wantedman dan wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

Based on what?  If you don't know exactly know what you're going to face how can you call it impossible or a suicide mission?

There's a huge difference between knowing exactly what you're facing and saying we can't do this, and not knowing exactly what you're facing and saying I don't think this is possible, but you're basically assuming the worst.

Your argument isn't as black-and-white as you're trying to make it seem.

So decisions made with intelligence and knowledge will be just as accurate as those made made without it?

You have no idea what is on the other side of the Omega 4 relay, so what exactly makes it an impossible task before you go through the relay?

Modifié par Aaleel, 14 octobre 2012 - 04:22 .

[hiraeth]

Aaleel wrote...

The Spamming Troll wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

A Bethesda Fan wrote...

You won't come back, it is a suicide mission

>comes back

You didn't even know what was on the other side of the Omega 4 relay so how can anyone say what's possible and what's not?  What exactly made it a suicide mission?

You know the parameters here and people (Military leaders) have accesed the situation based on what they've seen and decided that conventional victory isn't possible.

Huge difference.

what?

the missions is called "THE SUICIDE MISSION"

what more do you need to know???!!?!?!??

Based on what?  If you don't know exactly know what you're going to face how can you call it impossible or a suicide mission?

There's a huge difference between knowing exactly what you're facing and saying we can't do this, and not knowing exactly what you're facing and saying I don't think this is possible, but you're basically assuming the worst.

Well, we didn't know exactly what we were facing when we entered the Omega-4 relay, but we knew some things for sure (e.g., no ship that has ever passed the Omega 4 relay has returned). Sure maybe they just bought some land in there and sipped martinis til they died, but given the hostile nature of the Collectors, my money would be on them not living long once they entered the relay.

Similarly, you could argue that since the entire ME3 game we're led to believe that the Crucible was our only real weapon (so much that we diverted forces just to keep it safe), we also didn't know exactly what our odds of success with the Crucible were actually going to be, so how it that any different than how blinded you were in ME2? Sure, you know your enemy better in ME3 because you can see the reapers dominating all over the galaxy, whereas the Collectors were more mysterious, but in terms of predicting your odds of success, how could you have ever known that the Crucible was going to work for certain?

For myself, I went through the whole game assuming that the Crucible was going to fart at the end and not work and that I'd have to come up with a quick alternative. This is partially because the whole idea of the Crucible seemed contrived and delicate (I mean nobody has ever gotten it to work in the past or tested it, so....) and partially because I was hoping there wouldn't be a reaper-off-switch ending. But alas.

[wantedman dan]

Aaleel wrote...

So decisions made with intelligence and knowledge will be just as accurate as those made made without it?

You have no idea what is on the other side of the Omega 4 relay, so what exactly makes it an impossible task before you go through the relay?

Your first consideration should be that no ships, before the Normandy (excluding the Collector ships), have ever returned. You aren't even sure that, despite your supercomputer's analysis, the IFF is going to work.

Modifié par wantedman dan, 14 octobre 2012 - 04:24 .

[Aaleel]

MassEffectFShep wrote...

Well, we didn't know exactly what we were facing when we entered the Omega-4 relay, but we knew some things for sure (e.g., no ship that has ever passed the Omega 4 relay has returned). Sure maybe they just bought some land in there and sipped martinis til they died, but given the hostile nature of the Collectors, my money would be on them not living long once they entered the relay.

Similarly, you could argue that since the entire ME3 game we're led to believe that the Crucible was our only real weapon (so much that we diverted forces just to keep it safe), we also didn't know exactly what our odds of success with the Crucible were actually going to be, so how it that any different than how blinded you were in ME2? Sure, you know your enemy better in ME3 because you can see the reapers dominating all over the galaxy, whereas the Collectors were more mysterious, but in terms of predicting your odds of success, how could you have ever known that the Crucible was going to work for certain?

For myself, I went through the whole game assuming that the Crucible was going to fart at the end and not work and that I'd have to come up with a quick alternative. This is partially because the whole idea of the Crucible seemed contrived and delicate (I mean nobody has ever gotten it to work in the past or tested it, so....) and partially because I was hoping there wouldn't be a reaper-off-switch ending. But alas.

How many prior ships had an IFF?

Yeah you didn't know if the crucible was going to work, but it had been decided by virtually anyone who had a vote that it was the only way to win, and this did not change during the game.  It's irrelevent if they thought it would work or not.  In fact their intent to use it without knowing what it would do shows just how much they thought it was the only means to salvation.  It was a last resort after trying conventionally it was the ONLY resort.

[wantedman dan]

Aaleel wrote...

How many prior ships had an IFF?

Yeah you didn't know if the crucible was going to work, but it had been decided by virtually anyone who had a vote that it was the only way to win, and this did not change during the game.  It's irrelevent if they thought it would work or not.  In fact their intent to use it without knowing what it would do shows just how much they thought it was the only means to salvation.  It was a last resort after trying conventionally it was the ONLY resort.

I wasn't aware science was subject to ad populum reasoning.

[Aaleel]

wantedman dan wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

So decisions made with intelligence and knowledge will be just as accurate as those made made without it?

You have no idea what is on the other side of the Omega 4 relay, so what exactly makes it an impossible task before you go through the relay?

Your first consideration should be that no ships, before the Normandy (excluding the Collector ships), have ever returned. You aren't even sure that, despite your supercomputer's analysis, the IFF is going to work.

And why did collector ships pass because they had an IFF, so I wouldn't think it was suicide flying through.  A risk yes, suicide, no. 

[wantedman dan]

Aaleel wrote...

And why did collector ships pass because they had an IFF, so I wouldn't think it was suicide flying through.  A risk yes, suicide, no. 

You're splitting hairs at this point.

[hiraeth]

wantedman dan wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

How many prior ships had an IFF?

Yeah you didn't know if the crucible was going to work, but it had been decided by virtually anyone who had a vote that it was the only way to win, and this did not change during the game.  It's irrelevent if they thought it would work or not.  In fact their intent to use it without knowing what it would do shows just how much they thought it was the only means to salvation.  It was a last resort after trying conventionally it was the ONLY resort.

I wasn't aware science was subject to ad populum reasoning.

in terms of the reaper IFF: yeah, not even EDI was sure it would work so why would i be. also, the normandy was attacked soon after passing through the relay, even with a reaper IFF on board, and in theory the same attack that made the normandy crash-land could have killed everyone.

also yes, agreed with dan on the ad populum reasoning here.

Modifié par MassEffectFShep, 14 octobre 2012 - 04:35 .