175 réponses à ce sujet

[Jay Leon Hart]

Rokayt wrote...
How many failed to bring him to us?

How many cycles did it take for someone to "defeat" the Reapers?

[Rokayt]

Jay Leon Hart wrote...

Rokayt wrote...
How many failed to bring him to us?

How many cycles did it take for someone to "defeat" the Reapers?

What? I remember galactic extinction.

[Giantdeathrobot]

YOu and everyother "individual" that believes that all the collectors
are destroyed....well...BW has said otherwise HAVENT THEY!  

My ''snide and douchy'' comment was merely pointing out you can have a discussion on the internet without resorting to allcaps and exclamation points spam because it's annoying to read and makes you look like an hyperactive kid who have never used a computer before. If you choose to take it the wrong way, more power to you.

Also, Bioware has clumsily added Thermal clips HAVENT THEY. They have made ME2 largely irrelevant in the grand scheme of things HAVENT THEY. They have introduuced us to this debacle of an ending HAVENT THEY. Doesn't make all that any less stupid.

What I want to say is that, at this point, the lore matters less and less. Some of the new evolutions are just made  to add ''cool'' things in the setting, the Star Wars school of expanding the universe if you will. That's bad because after some time the universe is inconsistent and cannot be taken seriously anymore. I was OK with Javik because he had a unique perspective on things, albeit the DLC aspect was bollocks. If they pull more Protheans in stasis from their asses, it's just going to be an obvious attempt to please the Javik fanbase and nothing else. Plus, Javik's whole deal is that he's the last of his kind, having fellow Protty the Protheans dance around with their Volus and Hanar friends would be just... bizzare and would make him completely irrelevant.

[Learn To Love Yourself]

I am against Protheans in MP, but there is one aspect which would make it fun over other characters: the dialogue. The classy charm which Javik oozed in SP would add great character to the MP experience. Of course, you wouldn't be able to get this from a clone, and I would still be against the addition, but you can't deny that the things that would come out of a Javik-like Prothean's mouth wouldn't be greatly appreciated.

[Maker MEDA]

Bioware did a pretty good job realizing the Volus into a player character class. I'm excited about what new things they have to come up with. Prothean would be nice. How about Protheans pulling a Halo 4 Forerunner gone bad? We could use another enemy! Although I don't think that make much sense.

[Rokayt]

Jack Crapper wrote...

I am against Protheans in MP, but there is one aspect which would make it fun over other characters: the dialogue. The classy charm which Javik oozed in SP would add great character to the MP experience. Of course, you wouldn't be able to get this from a clone, and I would still be against the addition, but you can't deny that the things that would come out of a Javik-like Prothean's mouth wouldn't be greatly appreciated.

'

The only way this would be fine is if the prothean characters were exclusive to people who buy that 350$ Sovergn statue.

It would actually allow for them to be suitably rare (Nonexistant.)

[Rudest]

corporal doody wrote...

Rudest wrote...

Rudest wrote...


In short, to bring Protheans back and it to be acceptable is just a matter of good believable writing. A writer can write his way out of any situation in a tasteful manner if he/she puts his/her mind, creativity, and talent to it! Anyone who doesn't believe that is narrowmined and lacks faith in artistic ingenuity.

With Protheans, it's just a very narrow window; We either end up with baggage that cheapen's Javik's worth----or we get a masterpiece that makes him grow as a character. There is hardly room for anything inbetween, which makes it a daunting dangerous endeavor for Bioware to even touch!

-cough-

The introduction of ONE....with a emphasis on ONE AND ONLY AND LAST.  AN introduction of MANY...retcon...and would be ONE HELL OF A "WRITE JOB"

possible? sure BUT highly unlikely.

so do not believe THIS particular matter can (or should) be done for ME3MP and the protheans.

Not likely, but possible. It's all about presentation. Lore? It isn't set in stone; it's polymorphic. It's just a matter of that morphasis being presented to us in a tasteful manner.

Modifié par Rudest, 15 octobre 2012 - 11:16 .

[Learn To Love Yourself]

Rokayt wrote...

Jack Crapper wrote...

I am against Protheans in MP, but there is one aspect which would make it fun over other characters: the dialogue. The classy charm which Javik oozed in SP would add great character to the MP experience. Of course, you wouldn't be able to get this from a clone, and I would still be against the addition, but you can't deny that the things that would come out of a Javik-like Prothean's mouth wouldn't be greatly appreciated.

'

The only way this would be fine is if the prothean characters were exclusive to people who buy that 350$ Sovergn statue.

It would actually allow for them to be suitably rare (Nonexistant.)

I'd rather, even in that case, for a Prothean to not be added.  It would take too much away from the SP and would trivialize Javik's existence in the game.  But you asked for a point, so I gave one. 

Rarity has nothing to do with the fun factor.

Modifié par Jack Crapper, 15 octobre 2012 - 11:16 .

[Jslk]

Jack Crapper wrote...

I am against Protheans in MP, but there is one aspect which would make it fun over other characters: the dialogue. The classy charm which Javik oozed in SP would add great character to the MP experience. Of course, you wouldn't be able to get this from a clone, and I would still be against the addition, but you can't deny that the things that would come out of a Javik-like Prothean's mouth wouldn't be greatly appreciated.

That would be hilarious. Against Cerberus he can simply yell out "Primitives!" to troopers and centurians, or "Primitive Machine!" to Atlas's, or "Primitive Hunter!" to a Phantom. 

I say to go completely over the top with his rez quote. Like, "To the airlock with you!" or, "Dying was punishable by death in the Empire!" or something ridiculous like that. 

Modifié par Jslk, 16 octobre 2012 - 01:25 .

[Learn To Love Yourself]

Jslk wrote...

Jack Crapper wrote...

I am against Protheans in MP, but there is one aspect which would make it fun over other characters: the dialogue. The classy charm which Javik oozed in SP would add great character to the MP experience. Of course, you wouldn't be able to get this from a clone, and I would still be against the addition, but you can't deny that the things that would come out of a Javik-like Prothean's mouth wouldn't be greatly appreciated.

That would be hilarious. Against Cerberus he can simply yell out "Primitives!" to troopers and centurians, or "Primitive Machine!" to Atlas's, or "Primitive Hunter!" to a Phantom. 

I say to go completely over the top with his rez quote. Like, "To the airlock with you!" or, "Dying was punishable by death in the Empire!" or something ridiculous like that. 

Or when you get rez'd, you might say, "If there is a next time, please refrain from direct contact.  It will take some time to wash this stench off from me"

[ufc345]

Malanek999 wrote...

It is for lore based and aesthetic reasons. Anything can be done with a different character race. That doesn't stop people wanting kits based on Asari, Turians, Salarians, Krogan etc.

All that needs to happen is they find another pod with 4 or more Protheans and it doesn't break lore. When you consider
a) the Protheans made an effort in two cases to do the stasis thing,
b)it was actually successful in one case
It would actually not make sense to assume that they did not try it on other worlds given the size of their empire. It isn't even a stretch in terms of the lore. My only concern is that they need to bring it in via single player first via dlc and that would require changing the From the Ashes DLC slightly.

However the Volus broke lore in a much greater way, from a biomechanics point of view there is no way they should be able to move as fast as do.

Technically it was successful both times the others just woke up at a diffrent time then Javik.

[Jslk]

Jack Crapper wrote...

Jslk wrote...

Jack Crapper wrote...

I am against Protheans in MP, but there is one aspect which would make it fun over other characters: the dialogue. The classy charm which Javik oozed in SP would add great character to the MP experience. Of course, you wouldn't be able to get this from a clone, and I would still be against the addition, but you can't deny that the things that would come out of a Javik-like Prothean's mouth wouldn't be greatly appreciated.

That would be hilarious. Against Cerberus he can simply yell out "Primitives!" to troopers and centurians, or "Primitive Machine!" to Atlas's, or "Primitive Hunter!" to a Phantom. 

I say to go completely over the top with his rez quote. Like, "To the airlock with you!" or, "Dying was punishable by death in the Empire!" or something ridiculous like that. 

Or when you get rez'd, you might say, "If there is a next time, please refrain from direct contact.  It will take some time to wash this stench off from me"

I kinda liked those jokey type of quotes from something like Starcraft. I know it's not feasible, but imagine if they even had species specific rez quotes:

Human: "Still living in caves..."
Asari: "I'm glad you finally learned to read."
Turian: "Hmmm... slave viable potential." 
Salarian: "You used to eat flies," or every once in a while, "Did I mention you used to lick your eyes?"
Krogan: "Remnants of a failed species."

and of course:

Geth: "Throw it out the airlock!"

Modifié par Jslk, 16 octobre 2012 - 02:07 .

[Kazztore]

I want to play a yahg. Why can't we have yahgs? The reapers are leaving them alone, that's reason enough for them to joint the army. They're the new krogans! They could go toe to toe with Brutes because the reapers were so scared of them they mutated the krogan husks to look just like them. The Salarians had several on surkesh. Plenty of loreable reasons to have them. Especially if you play on that salarian level, jade or whatever.
And Rachni too. If the enemy can have collectors I want Rachni soldiers and engineers, with a sync-kill ability to use on mooks. I saved that Queen, but she hasn't been having her spawn pull their weight in the war. Plenty of Ravagers, but no corrosive spitting rachni soldiers with heavy melee claws. No ability to spit a group of swarmers grenade count-style at phantoms?

The Yahgs can also have sync-killings, like ripping mooks in half. Just imagine it, leaping into a spawn to stagger them while getting shot by staggered hunters and grabbing a rocket trooper, it double taps you in the face while it's gripped in giant hands and you just roar and tear it in half, tossing them in different directions while the upper half fires a last rocket mid flight that finishes off with the double-tap during grab started. It'd be beautiful and fit perfectly into multiplayer. There could be Yahg soldiers and yahg engineers and there is evidence they're very intelligent. They could be an engineer power using class capable of wielding heavy weapons without cooldown penalties because of how physically strong they are. paladin shield-like heavy melee like the shadowbroker. Large Sentry Guns maybe? or Shield Pylons. They could totally be carrying around sentry guns and shield pylons on their backs. So could Elcor. Elcor would have massive health and shields, invulnerability to sync-killing, vi-assisted heavy weapons. Or perhaps deployable sentry guns or mines or shield walls like the collector's barrier wall things. And sayings like "With unquientable bloodlust, bring it on", "With Obvious Scorn, Big Machines can not beat Elcor." and "With Sacrificial Determination, None shall pass." There's plenty of gameplay reasons to have Yahg, Elcor and Rachni.



Can't think of one for Protheans though. If they make Protheans a playable MP class I am going to aggressively demand Leviathan Adepts capable of using Dominate, Deep Voiced Monologue, and bad problem solving skills.

[Rickochet101]

Is it too late for this:



or this...

[N7 Mickey]

I think they should give the Protheans powers on the level that you have in ME2.
Remember how pull, singularity, and slam worked on Geth Prime and Atlas once their
first level of health was shed. Thats what I think the Prothean should be. Stronger Biotics
then the other players but not over whelming strong.

[DJ Airsurfer]

Ravenmyste wrote...

Battlepope190 wrote...

No Protheans. Ever.

Wall of Text

So Ilos was the only planet inhabited by Protheans, EVER?

[mrcanada]

DJ Airsurfer wrote...

Ravenmyste wrote...

Battlepope190 wrote...

No Protheans. Ever.

Wall of Text

So Ilos was the only planet inhabited by Protheans, EVER?

[Kazztore]

corporal doody wrote...

Jay Leon Hart wrote...

corporal doody wrote...

Apl_J wrote...

Problem is, this can be said of literally every kit in the game.

Why did people want Volus? No one cared about playing support; they just wanted to be Volus. While I'm glad they worked out, the Volus kits could've worked with any race. So if we look at that example, what's the problem surrounding Protheans?

extinction

Javik.

Next?

Javik introduction was farfetched and cring worthy...but he worked...only cuz they hammered home the fact THAT HE WAS THE LAST!

End!

Yeah, far fetched and cringe worthy...there was never any prescendent for protheans having advanced stasis pods designed to survive a reaper war. Or for shepard having being able to understand spoken prothean.  That whole thing just made no sense! Totally cringeage.

[Kazztore]

OK, here's a possibility for protheans being around...Dunno if this has already been spoken or though of, There's supposedly a bunch of dormant mass relays that they never activate because of the rachni. There could be star systems where the protheans locked down the mass relays(as they were getting to the point of truly understanding them when the reapers attacked) and went into hiding they could have survived similarly to the ilos scientists. But you think they'd have gone back to expanding their empire to prepare for the reapers, unless they're all locked in stasis.

The problem would be, what would lead to them showing themselves and why didn't they just come back to rule the galaxy, did they damage the mass relay when they shut it down? Or if they're locked in stasis, what prompted the unlocking of a dormant relay that lead to the discovery of the system with stasis-locked protheans?

[Kazztore]

Kamyczek wrote...

Lore?
If i had to explain protheans on battlefield, i would say, that we've got Javiks full DNA. We could make dozens of his clones, but this would be not so smart as long, as the race will not survive. Single prothean is also dead end, but if Alliance use some resources, Protheans race could be saved. New Prothean Race is not only battle resource - this is also symbol of Reapers imperfection. So Salarians cooperating with exCerb Scientist*, using Okeers data* used to clone Javik, but using also Collectors* DNA to differentiate gene pool* and make prothean race able to reproduce and reborn. Also, there are Protheans Capsules*

*ExCerb Scientists are alliance resource, if you don't remember. They wan't to help Alliance, because cerberus path is wrong. In ME1 they were able to clone beings. You could met some of those creatures in side missions.

*Okeers Data - Okeer was master of cloning. He made perfect krogan soldier.

*Collectors are genetically modified protheans. Their gene pool is reduced, but scientists should be able to use their genes to mix it with Javiks and differentiate DNA.

*Gene pool - every being is holding also active and recessive genes, so from Javik scientists could make a few different living protheans.

*Prothean Capsules - This funny thing, were protheans were hiding. The only one that survived hibernation was Javik, but if capsules were sterile, scientists should be able to receive a lot of protheans DNA and once more, differentiate new prothean gene pool.

Also, maybe a bit more space magic?

If cloning complex sentient beings were that easy, why would they not being cloning vast armies of turians, humans, and asari? They'd be far more valuable to the war effort than going through an overly complicated process of taking dna from a single prothean, risking building a clone army for the reapers by using tissue from a bioengineered indoctrinated husk version of protheans, and the likely very different dna construct of the protheans. It'd be far simpler to just clone a bunch of soldiery turians, biotically powerful asari, and soldiery bioitically powerful humans. They have plentiful samples and a far better understanding of the genetic make up of thos races than that of the protheans. I don't mention krogan because it would likely be slaraians doing the cloning and they aren't fond of krogan.

OKEER was not a master of cloning. He cloned a bunch of insane krogan screw ups. There was only one that you meet that isn't completely insane outside of Grunt. He wasn't a master, he brute forced his way to results the same way cerberus did on sanctuary. Yeah his data could be useful, but it could also be corrupt as it came from the collectors. 

Cloning things like creepers and the mindless rachni soldiers is a lot different than cloning a complex sentient species effectively. The only times it's been shown that I can remember was Saren, likely backed by Reaper knowledge and tech, and OKEER, backed by collector(aka reaper) tech and knowledge. 

[Kazztore]

Rich_tea wrote...

Because playing a Prothean would be fun and Bioware should drop any pretense of lore/canon and concentrate on what would make a fun video game. They shpuld do this despite the inevitable backlash from robotic nerds who write long posts on BSN showing a total inability to grasp the concept of fun being subjective. Besides, they added volus and did well with them too despite the wailing and gnashing of teeth so they have a good track record in making characters fit into their established lore anyway.

there's a pretty big difference between pulling of adding a race that's not front-linesy by making them not-front linesy but still combat capable, and suddenly having an influx of a species that has exactly 1 member left in existence. 

[Versidious]

Rudest wrote...

corporal doody wrote...

Rudest wrote...

Rudest wrote...


In short, to bring Protheans back and it to be acceptable is just a matter of good believable writing. A writer can write his way out of any situation in a tasteful manner if he/she puts his/her mind, creativity, and talent to it! Anyone who doesn't believe that is narrowmined and lacks faith in artistic ingenuity.

With Protheans, it's just a very narrow window; We either end up with baggage that cheapen's Javik's worth----or we get a masterpiece that makes him grow as a character. There is hardly room for anything inbetween, which makes it a daunting dangerous endeavor for Bioware to even touch!

-cough-

The introduction of ONE....with a emphasis on ONE AND ONLY AND LAST.  AN introduction of MANY...retcon...and would be ONE HELL OF A "WRITE JOB"

possible? sure BUT highly unlikely.

so do not believe THIS particular matter can (or should) be done for ME3MP and the protheans.

Not likely, but possible. It's all about presentation. Lore? It isn't set in stone; it's polymorphic. It's just a matter of that morphasis being presented to us in a tasteful manner.

An example of how to do it: DLC where Javik has to decide whether to save some more Protheans (Call it almost a hundred, and make the Characters UR), or, as the Avatar of vengeance, kill some more Reapers. It challenges his universal view and gives him an emotional and philosophical dilemma - whether to be ruthless and focus on destroying the Reapers, or whether to show compassion and risk everything for his people. Which better emphasises his beliefs? Obviously Shepard can discuss it with him, but still, it could really work for him as a character.

I'm still not sure I'm in favour of it, but I will agree with everyone else that they could say some brilliant, cruel things in MP; "Not bad for primitives!" "Help your betters!" "The Reapers have made Turians/Humans even uglier!"  "Reaper Asari! Kill it before it mates with you!"

[DJ Airsurfer]

It's not that hard to come up with a good explanation for more Protheans, after all, their pre-Reaper empire was over the entire Galaxy if I'm not mistaken, so I'm pretty sure there are more Protheans out there, forgotten colony, in stasis, what have you.

The Leviathans survived all this time, so why couldn't some Protheans do the same thing?

[DJ Airsurfer]

I'm not going to let this go, I want my Prothean!

[oO Stryfe Oo]

This. OP, thank you for posting this.

A Prothean kit would bring nothing more than new aesthetics to gameplay. I'm not saying kit diversity is not important to gameplay, because it is, especially to me (Retaliation was a disappointment in this regard...). I'm just saying that most, if not all, of the pro-Prothean arguments I've read keep saying they'd bring something new to the table, when BW could literally create a character of any existing race with the same abilities they'd give the Protheans and no one would bat an eyelash.

They are an extinct race, revealed to us in the single player story as an example for what could happen to the current cycle were we (Shepard) to fail. Reviving them would further cheapen the Reapers' threat, and Javik's story as the last. It would also be the only MP dlc to make alterations to the SP lore of this magnitude (i.e. Collectors were already an obscure presence in the war, nothing in the lore says Volus are unable to wield guns, Samara said Justicars were few in number but we never get her definition of "few", etc. vs. Reviving an extinct race).

Besides, I'm more curious to see what BW could do with existing races now that they are running out of more obvious options. What could they possibly do to spice things up a little? Will we finally get a Geth Prime kit? How will they make new Salarians that play differently to the OG Salarians? It should be noted that they created Turians with jetpacks when left to their own devices. I want to see more creativity like that.

Tbh, I'm tired of arguing over this (whether Protheans should be added or not). According to OTS, BW has already got another Dlc underway. If they don't add them, great. If they do, oh well. It won't stop me from playing.