214 réponses à ce sujet

[spirosz]

JohnShepard12 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

JohnShepard12 wrote...

Still counts as a sh*tty prequel. Would never buy.

How would you know it would be ****ty?

Prequels are sh*t by default. No suspense possible.

I happen to love Deus Ex: Human Revolution and Halo Reach wasn't so bad, so I guess they're not "****ty" by default, well maybe for you, haha. 

[Spectre Impersonator]

spirosz wrote...

JohnShepard12 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

JohnShepard12 wrote...

Still counts as a sh*tty prequel. Would never buy.

How would you know it would be ****ty?

Prequels are sh*t by default. No suspense possible.

I happen to love Deus Ex: Human Revolution and Halo Reach wasn't so bad, so I guess they're not "****ty" by default, well maybe for you, haha. 

I thought Reach was utter trash. Never played Deus Ex, only know that ME3 ripped off it's ending.

[3DandBeyond]

JamesFaith wrote...


Deus Ex: Human revolution I'm playing now telling something different and X-Men: First class is my favourite part of series.

BTW, what Dreman was suggesting isn't sequel, it's called inquel or midquel, because it is situated in frame of existing series.

But it exists within the story world created and uses some of the same characters and institutions already in existence, during a current conflict that would be uppermost on everyone's mind. 

You can call it whatever you like but since it takes place before the final act of a story that has ended already it is essentially a prequel to that ending. 

And the terms are generally interquel or midquel.

From Tv tropes:

"Also called a Midquel, this is, quite simply, when a new entry in a series is a sequel to one existing entry, and a prequel to another, or alternatively takes place during a Time Skip in an earlier entry rather than continuing the story. This device is often used to expand a portion of the story only touched upon in other entries, or if more story is desired but there's no logical place for it either before the beginning or after the end. Happens a lot in Video Games, since story has only recently become a major part of design. A more cynical creator might use it to cash in on a franchise without having to advance the Story Arc."

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 19 octobre 2012 - 04:54 .

[JamesFaith]

JohnShepard12 wrote...

JamesFaith wrote...

JohnShepard12 wrote...

Prequels are sh*t by default. No suspense possible.

Deus Ex: Human revolution I'm playing now telling something different and X-Men: First class is my favourite part of series.

BTW, what Dreman was suggesting isn't sequel, it's called inquel or midquel, because it is situated in frame of existing series.

Doesn't matter the technical term you call it, it will still inevitably lack suspense and be a waste of time and money.

Oh, sure, story with no connection to Reapers, with its own plot and new characters never mentioned in original series would inevitably lack suspence, because you would certainly know who died and how it would end.

Can I borrow you crystal ball, please? There will be lottery on Sunday. 

[KENNY4753]

dreman9999 wrote...
"I've explained why it would impact it because the player would still be considering what all this has to do with Shepard's story and events going on at the time in this galaxy. "

It's a side story...It won't have any effect on Shepard's story at all. Why? Because Shepard story has already been told and no more can be added to it before ME3.

3d, this is a side story with new characters. It would be involved with Shepards story as Much as the books are involve with Shepard story.

That means it will have nothing to do with the end of ME3. AND NO,THINKING ABOUT THE GETH ATTACK ON THE CITADEL WILL INVOLVE THE ENDING, THAT IS JUST FALLOWING THE LORE.

Dreman, let me give you my thoughts on what 3D is saying.

Mass Effect is Shepard's story, is it not? She is not saying that this prequel, yes it is a prequel to ME3 and technically most of ME2 (due to the fact that that 2 year gap takes place before all but the opening part of ME2), will not directly effect the ME3 endings but the player will be thinking about how it could effect. The player knows how it all ends so that is why6 they will be thinking about how this prequel would affect the ending.

Modifié par KENNY4753, 19 octobre 2012 - 04:56 .

[KENNY4753]

Any prequel is a bad idea and this is the reason why...

We already know how everything turns out. Whether it be the First Contact War or the Krogan Rebellions, we know how everything turns out

[JamesFaith]

3DandBeyond wrote...

But it exists within the story world created and uses some of the same characters and institutions already in existence, during a current conflict that would be uppermost on everyone's mind. 

You can call it whatever you like but since it takes place before the final act of a story that has ended already it is essentially a prequel to that ending. 

It would be prequel only with one condition - if story would be tied with Shepard story.

And don't forget that hypothetical new ME trilogy should end before ending of original series, or maybe even before ME3. So your claim about "current conflict that would be uppermost on everyone's mind" wouldn't be valid, because only few people in galaxy knew true about Reapers before ME3.

[3DandBeyond]

JamesFaith wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

But it exists within the story world created and uses some of the same characters and institutions already in existence, during a current conflict that would be uppermost on everyone's mind. 

You can call it whatever you like but since it takes place before the final act of a story that has ended already it is essentially a prequel to that ending. 

It would be prequel only with one condition - if story would be tied with Shepard story.

And don't forget that hypothetical new ME trilogy should end before ending of original series, or maybe even before ME3. So your claim about "current conflict that would be uppermost on everyone's mind" wouldn't be valid, because only few people in galaxy knew true about Reapers before ME3.

The player knows about the reapers.
It doesn't have to be tied to Shepard's story to be a prequel.  A story about the people that planted time capsules on Joab wouldn't be about Shepard, but would be a prequel.  If it takes place in the Milky Way prior to the ending of ME3, it is a prequel.

So far all of you and the OP have come up with are things related to people we all know-Cerberus, Spectres, geth, Maelon, Jacob, and so on-we know the end of their stories already.  They end with green eyes, Shepard in control, or dead geth and EDI, or a cycle sometime in the future defeating reapers.

If it doesn't have anything to do at all with any of this then the time period is irrelevant-why put it specifically in those two years when Shepard is dead if it's unrelated to Shepard or any of the people Shepard knows?  If it's random spectres, Cerberus operatives (gee we need more of them), Kasumi, or the Drell and Hanar or anything like that it will be the player thinking of what their fates will be at the end of ME3. 

And it would be ridiculous for spectres, csec, mercs, or Drell or anyone not to ever reference damage to the citadel (especially if they are on council missions), or any of these events if this takes place during Shepard's two missing years. 

If they don't refer to that, then it could take place at any time, so the timeframe is meaningless.


From Wikipedia:

"A prequel is a literary, dramatic, or filmic work whose story precedes that of a previous work, by focusing on events that occur before the original narrative.  If Y is a prequel to X, then Y's storyline precedes X's, yet Y is released at a later date than X. Therefore, a prequel is a work that forms part of a back-story to the preceding work. Like sequels,prequels may or may not concern the same plot as the work from which they are derived. Often, they explain the background which led to the events in the original, but sometimes the connections are not as explicit."

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 19 octobre 2012 - 05:20 .

[dreman9999]

KENNY4753 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
"I've explained why it would impact it because the player would still be considering what all this has to do with Shepard's story and events going on at the time in this galaxy. "

It's a side story...It won't have any effect on Shepard's story at all. Why? Because Shepard story has already been told and no more can be added to it before ME3.

3d, this is a side story with new characters. It would be involved with Shepards story as Much as the books are involve with Shepard story.

That means it will have nothing to do with the end of ME3. AND NO,THINKING ABOUT THE GETH ATTACK ON THE CITADEL WILL INVOLVE THE ENDING, THAT IS JUST FALLOWING THE LORE.

Dreman, let me give you my thoughts on what 3D is saying.

Mass Effect is Shepard's story, is it not? She is not saying that this prequel, yes it is a prequel to ME3 and technically most of ME2 (due to the fact that that 2 year gap takes place before all but the opening part of ME2), will not directly effect the ME3 endings but the player will be thinking about how it could effect. The player knows how it all ends so that is why6 they will be thinking about how this prequel would affect the ending.

1. Shepard story is over.
2.A side story would not be Shepard story...It would be someone eles.
3.Being that Shepard's story is over, bw can't add anything to the story before ME3. In betwwen ME1 AND 2 will not relate at all.

[3DandBeyond]

KENNY4753 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
"I've explained why it would impact it because the player would still be considering what all this has to do with Shepard's story and events going on at the time in this galaxy. "

It's a side story...It won't have any effect on Shepard's story at all. Why? Because Shepard story has already been told and no more can be added to it before ME3.

3d, this is a side story with new characters. It would be involved with Shepards story as Much as the books are involve with Shepard story.

That means it will have nothing to do with the end of ME3. AND NO,THINKING ABOUT THE GETH ATTACK ON THE CITADEL WILL INVOLVE THE ENDING, THAT IS JUST FALLOWING THE LORE.

Dreman, let me give you my thoughts on what 3D is saying.

Mass Effect is Shepard's story, is it not? She is not saying that this prequel, yes it is a prequel to ME3 and technically most of ME2 (due to the fact that that 2 year gap takes place before all but the opening part of ME2), will not directly effect the ME3 endings but the player will be thinking about how it could effect. The player knows how it all ends so that is why6 they will be thinking about how this prequel would affect the ending.

That's exactly it.  ME as it now is is Shepard's story.  ME3 ended that.  Going back before that ending within the ME universe and using certain known characters or types (Cerberus, Spectres, the council, the citadel, or known races) sets things in Shepard's universe.  But since you are relating this to a specific time period (during Shepard's two missing years) even unknown characters and types would end up funneled into ME3's endings.  How would you indicate this time period was during Shepard's two missing years?  You'd have to say something to point that out.

If you liked the endings, anything may be open to you, but especially if you didn't, then anything before and up to ME3's ending that happens in the Milky Way, is an integral part of Shepard's story and won't end well.

Star Wars could be taken as an example-the entirety of the story ends well, the galaxy is saved and evil is defeated.  So, there can be infinite variations on the idea of different Jedi roaming the galaxy on different adventures even when they take place before the events of Return of the Jedi.  Ultimately their story will end well, so relating all of it to Obi Wan and Darth Vader and Luke doesn't hurt things.

In ME, the natural thing for players to do is to consider what happens or what will happen to characters you care about.  If it's about the Protheans-they end up with only Javik surviving.  The Contact Wars, end up with ME3.  Omega ends up with ME3. 

Every event in the Milky Way that takes place before ME3, ends up with the same endings and so it's all tied together.

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 19 octobre 2012 - 06:44 .

[Spectre Impersonator]

JamesFaith wrote...

JohnShepard12 wrote...

JamesFaith wrote...

JohnShepard12 wrote...

Prequels are sh*t by default. No suspense possible.

Deus Ex: Human revolution I'm playing now telling something different and X-Men: First class is my favourite part of series.

BTW, what Dreman was suggesting isn't sequel, it's called inquel or midquel, because it is situated in frame of existing series.

Doesn't matter the technical term you call it, it will still inevitably lack suspense and be a waste of time and money.

Oh, sure, story with no connection to Reapers, with its own plot and new characters never mentioned in original series would inevitably lack suspence, because you would certainly know who died and how it would end.

Can I borrow you crystal ball, please? There will be lottery on Sunday. 

How is it going to have no connection to the Reapers? Everything involves the Reapers. And obviously it would involved the characters the we KNOW will not die because that's what this thread is about. And we know they can't develop too far, because Shepard witnesses their development throughout Mass Effect 2. 

[KENNY4753]

dreman9999 wrote...

KENNY4753 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
"I've explained why it would impact it because the player would still be considering what all this has to do with Shepard's story and events going on at the time in this galaxy. "

It's a side story...It won't have any effect on Shepard's story at all. Why? Because Shepard story has already been told and no more can be added to it before ME3.

3d, this is a side story with new characters. It would be involved with Shepards story as Much as the books are involve with Shepard story.

That means it will have nothing to do with the end of ME3. AND NO,THINKING ABOUT THE GETH ATTACK ON THE CITADEL WILL INVOLVE THE ENDING, THAT IS JUST FALLOWING THE LORE.

Dreman, let me give you my thoughts on what 3D is saying.

Mass Effect is Shepard's story, is it not? She is not saying that this prequel, yes it is a prequel to ME3 and technically most of ME2 (due to the fact that that 2 year gap takes place before all but the opening part of ME2), will not directly effect the ME3 endings but the player will be thinking about how it could effect. The player knows how it all ends so that is why6 they will be thinking about how this prequel would affect the ending.

1. Shepard story is over.
2.A side story would not be Shepard story...It would be someone eles.
3.Being that Shepard's story is over, bw can't add anything to the story before ME3. In betwwen ME1 AND 2 will not relate at all.

Why did you put 3 points. All 3 of your points say the same thing.
"Shepard's story is over"

Yes Shepard's story is over. But Mass Effect was Shepard's story. I am pretty sure the writers even have said that. Therefore it wouldn't really be Mass Effect without Shepard. It would be the same galaxy sure but it wouldn't really be Mass Effect.

BW can add stuff wherever they please, they own the franchise after all but my point was that since we know how everything plays out a prequel would be a waste of time. We know how the First Contact War ended, we know about how the Krogan Rebellions ended, we know how the Prothean's cycle ended.

Sure your idea is between the Normandy attack at the start of ME2 until Shepard wakes up. There is 2 years missing there, but we stil know how it all played out. Cerberus rebuilt Shepard and the Normandy, the Council dismissed the claim Sovereign was a Reaper, and the Collectors started abducting colonies. Everything else that happened in that span is not truely important in the grand scheme of things. No matter what happened in that time the Reapers still attacked. Everything else is insignificant because once again WE ALREADY KNOW HOW EVERYTHING ENDS.

[Rovay]

JohnShepard12 wrote...

JamesFaith wrote...

JohnShepard12 wrote...

JamesFaith wrote...

JohnShepard12 wrote...

Prequels are sh*t by default. No suspense possible.

Deus Ex: Human revolution I'm playing now telling something different and X-Men: First class is my favourite part of series.

BTW, what Dreman was suggesting isn't sequel, it's called inquel or midquel, because it is situated in frame of existing series.

Doesn't matter the technical term you call it, it will still inevitably lack suspense and be a waste of time and money.

Oh, sure, story with no connection to Reapers, with its own plot and new characters never mentioned in original series would inevitably lack suspence, because you would certainly know who died and how it would end.

Can I borrow you crystal ball, please? There will be lottery on Sunday. 

How is it going to have no connection to the Reapers? Everything involves the Reapers. And obviously it would involved the characters the we KNOW will not die because that's what this thread is about. And we know they can't develop too far, because Shepard witnesses their development throughout Mass Effect 2. 

Simple. Place it and end it before ME 3 begins, make different protagonist for us to play and give him or her a completely different squad involved in a seperate plot. Not everything in ME universe has to be connected to 'Shepard fights the Reapers' plot.

[3DandBeyond]

JohnShepard12 wrote...

JamesFaith wrote...


Oh, sure, story with no connection to Reapers, with its own plot and new characters never mentioned in original series would inevitably lack suspence, because you would certainly know who died and how it would end.

Can I borrow you crystal ball, please? There will be lottery on Sunday. 

How is it going to have no connection to the Reapers? Everything involves the Reapers. And obviously it would involved the characters the we KNOW will not die because that's what this thread is about. And we know they can't develop too far, because Shepard witnesses their development throughout Mass Effect 2. 

Exactly.  You know ultimately what happens though to everyone generally in the galaxy, because you've played ME3.  Unless this is a new entry point for people to get in on the action.

Why relate it at all to a time period in Shepard's life if it has nothing to do with Shepard?  It can't help but have something to do with everything that happens.

It's like saying that if there was a WW3 on Earth today, that 2 people living in 2 separate countries would have nothing in common.  They would because of a big war that's going on.  And if it meant that the world was ultimately destroyed, then both of their stories intersect.  If it meant that peace was eventually achieved that lasted for a thousand years, that still means both of their stories intersect, though they live different lives.  They'd both be aware of the war going on.

[3DandBeyond]

Rovay wrote...


Simple. Place it and end it before ME 3 begins, make different protagonist for us to play and give him or her a completely different squad involved in a seperate plot. Not everything in ME universe has to be connected to 'Shepard fights the Reapers' plot.

The reality of that time period would be that the reapers are coming, the collectors are here and killing people and trying to obtain Shepard's body.

How would you start such a game-
Narrator:
"These events take place during the two years Commander Shepard was missing.  But forget all that, this isn't about reapers or Commander Shepard or the Collectors that kill him/her.  Yes, the reapers are coming, but this is a totally different story.  This is a story of bigger problems that no one knew anything about so all they were worried about was reapers.  Well, the council knew about it and some Spectres, just not Shepard and well maybe Cerberus, but they were still after reaper tech."

"This is the story of Captain Zon, a Spectre looking for um, big aliens to fight.  Aliens that make reapers look like kittens.  So, forget about reapers.  Sure these bigger aliens might want to fight reapers, like Predator Vs. Aliens, but this is not about reapers."

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 19 octobre 2012 - 07:09 .

[KENNY4753]

3DandBeyond wrote...

KENNY4753 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
"I've explained why it would impact it because the player would still be considering what all this has to do with Shepard's story and events going on at the time in this galaxy. "

It's a side story...It won't have any effect on Shepard's story at all. Why? Because Shepard story has already been told and no more can be added to it before ME3.

3d, this is a side story with new characters. It would be involved with Shepards story as Much as the books are involve with Shepard story.

That means it will have nothing to do with the end of ME3. AND NO,THINKING ABOUT THE GETH ATTACK ON THE CITADEL WILL INVOLVE THE ENDING, THAT IS JUST FALLOWING THE LORE.

Dreman, let me give you my thoughts on what 3D is saying.

Mass Effect is Shepard's story, is it not? She is not saying that this prequel, yes it is a prequel to ME3 and technically most of ME2 (due to the fact that that 2 year gap takes place before all but the opening part of ME2), will not directly effect the ME3 endings but the player will be thinking about how it could effect. The player knows how it all ends so that is why6 they will be thinking about how this prequel would affect the ending.

That's exactly it.  ME as it now is is Shepard's story.  ME3 ended that.  Going back before that ending within the ME universe and using certain known characters or types (Cerberus, Spectres, the council, the citadel, or known races) sets things in Shepard's universe.  But since you are relating this to a specific time period (during Shepard's two missing years) even unknown characters and types would end up funneled into ME3's endings.  How would you indicate this time period was during Shepard's two missing years?  You'd have to say something to point that out.

If you liked the endings, anything may be open to you, but especially if you didn't, then anything before and up to ME3's ending that happens in the Milky Way, is an integral part of Shepard's story and won't end well.

Star Wars could be taken as an example-the entirety of the story ends well, the galaxy is saved and evil is defeated.  So, there can be infinite variations on the idea of different Jedi roaming the galaxy on different adventures even when they take place before the events of Return of the Jedi.  Ultimately their story will end well, so relating all of it to Obi Wan and Darth Vader and Luke doesn't hurt things.

In ME, the natural thing for players to do is to consider what happens or what will happen to characters you care about.  If it's about the Protheans-they end up with only Javik surviving.  The Contact Wars, end up with ME3.  Omega ends up with ME3. 

Every event in the Milky Way that takes place before ME3, ends up with the same endings and so it's all tied together.

Exactly. Thatis what Dreman is not understanding. We know already how every major event ends (First Contact, Rachni Wars, etc) and we know how they impact Shepard's story making it isignificant to tell that story.

[Rovay]

3DandBeyond wrote...

Rovay wrote...


Simple. Place it and end it before ME 3 begins, make different protagonist for us to play and give him or her a completely different squad involved in a seperate plot. Not everything in ME universe has to be connected to 'Shepard fights the Reapers' plot.

The reality of that time period would be that the reapers are coming, the collectors are here and killing people and trying to obtain Shepard's body.

How would you start such a game-
Narrator:
"These events take place during the two years Commander Shepard was missing.  But forget all that, this isn't about reapers or Commander Shepard or the Collectors that kill him/her.  Yes, the reapers are coming, but this is a totally different story.  This is a story of bigger problems that no one knew anything about so all they were worried about was reapers.  Well, the council knew about it and some Spectres, just not Shepard and well maybe Cerberus, but they were still after reaper tech."

"This is the story of Captain Zon, a Spectre looking for um, big aliens to fight.  Aliens that make reapers look like kittens.  So, forget about reapers.  Sure these bigger aliens might want to fight reapers, like Predator Vs. Aliens, but this is not about reapers."

And our characters woudn't know it or believe it. And why does it have to be about something bigger than the Reapers? It can be smaller scale story, maybe more personal. I just don't get why suddenly everything ME related must have 'OMG REAPERS!' in it or stampped somewhere on the box for it to be entertaining. A properly structured and executed story/game that has no Reapers in it can also be entertaing. 
 
Let's say, a story about the war with the heretic Geth that happened during the time skip, the one that Anderson briefly summarises. The protagonist would be a Corsair or a merc or a simple solider that gets somehow involed in the conflict and proves to be an important asset in it (Ever seen/heard the Republic Trooper storyline in SW:TOR? I'm thinking something like that). Or perhaps something akin to what ME: Galaxy and Infiltrator are. I for one, would love to see an Alpha Protocol type of game in the ME universe. Just because it doesn't openly deal with Reapers or 'I already know how it's going to end and I don't like it', it doesn't make it any less entertaining or turns it into crap that I will never ever touch with a 10 foot pole.

[JamesFaith]

Rovay wrote...

And our characters woudn't know it or believe it. And why does it have to be about something bigger than the Reapers? It can be smaller scale story, maybe more personal. I just don't get why suddenly everything ME related must have 'OMG REAPERS!' in it or stampped somewhere on the box for it to be entertaining. A properly structured and executed story/game that has no Reapers in it can also be entertaing. 
 
Let's say, a story about the war with the heretic Geth that happened during the time skip, the one that Anderson briefly summarises. The protagonist would be a Corsair or a merc or a simple solider that gets somehow involed in the conflict and proves to be an important asset in it (Ever seen/heard the Republic Trooper storyline in SW:TOR? I'm thinking something like that). Or perhaps something akin to what ME: Galaxy and Infiltrator are. I for one, would love to see an Alpha Protocol type of game in the ME universe. Just because it doesn't openly deal with Reapers or 'I already know how it's going to end and I don't like it', it doesn't make it any less entertaining or turns it into crap that I will never ever touch with a 10 foot pole.

Yeap, many people are thinking only in galactic (Reaper) scale, when they are many other smaller possibilities for good antagonists and connected story.

Batarians slaver or their goverment, biotic extremist, turian nationalists, mercs bands, all those dictators from Terminus systems and many others, 99% of galaxy have no idea about Reapers and there are still plenty other crimes and conspiracies.

[dreman9999]

KENNY4753 wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

KENNY4753 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
"I've explained why it would impact it because the player would still be considering what all this has to do with Shepard's story and events going on at the time in this galaxy. "

It's a side story...It won't have any effect on Shepard's story at all. Why? Because Shepard story has already been told and no more can be added to it before ME3.

3d, this is a side story with new characters. It would be involved with Shepards story as Much as the books are involve with Shepard story.

That means it will have nothing to do with the end of ME3. AND NO,THINKING ABOUT THE GETH ATTACK ON THE CITADEL WILL INVOLVE THE ENDING, THAT IS JUST FALLOWING THE LORE.

Dreman, let me give you my thoughts on what 3D is saying.

Mass Effect is Shepard's story, is it not? She is not saying that this prequel, yes it is a prequel to ME3 and technically most of ME2 (due to the fact that that 2 year gap takes place before all but the opening part of ME2), will not directly effect the ME3 endings but the player will be thinking about how it could effect. The player knows how it all ends so that is why6 they will be thinking about how this prequel would affect the ending.

That's exactly it.  ME as it now is is Shepard's story.  ME3 ended that.  Going back before that ending within the ME universe and using certain known characters or types (Cerberus, Spectres, the council, the citadel, or known races) sets things in Shepard's universe.  But since you are relating this to a specific time period (during Shepard's two missing years) even unknown characters and types would end up funneled into ME3's endings.  How would you indicate this time period was during Shepard's two missing years?  You'd have to say something to point that out.

If you liked the endings, anything may be open to you, but especially if you didn't, then anything before and up to ME3's ending that happens in the Milky Way, is an integral part of Shepard's story and won't end well.

Star Wars could be taken as an example-the entirety of the story ends well, the galaxy is saved and evil is defeated.  So, there can be infinite variations on the idea of different Jedi roaming the galaxy on different adventures even when they take place before the events of Return of the Jedi.  Ultimately their story will end well, so relating all of it to Obi Wan and Darth Vader and Luke doesn't hurt things.

In ME, the natural thing for players to do is to consider what happens or what will happen to characters you care about.  If it's about the Protheans-they end up with only Javik surviving.  The Contact Wars, end up with ME3.  Omega ends up with ME3. 

Every event in the Milky Way that takes place before ME3, ends up with the same endings and so it's all tied together.

Exactly. Thatis what Dreman is not understanding. We know already how every major event ends (First Contact, Rachni Wars, etc) and we know how they impact Shepard's story making it isignificant to tell that story.

You cleary don't undererstand. ME as a whole is not just Shepard story. We are not tided to just Shepard's perspective.  Look at the books and the comics to see what I mean. This is a big universe and we can see it in more then one perspective. You 2 just don't understand this and are locked in only one perspective. ME. a series about replayablity and different view is no about looking at things only one way. Yet you to insist it is.

A side story does not have to be in any way connected to Shepards story...Efected yes, but not connected. That is why a aside story will not be related to the ending.

[3DandBeyond]

JamesFaith wrote...

Rovay wrote...

And our characters woudn't know it or believe it. And why does it have to be about something bigger than the Reapers? It can be smaller scale story, maybe more personal. I just don't get why suddenly everything ME related must have 'OMG REAPERS!' in it or stampped somewhere on the box for it to be entertaining. A properly structured and executed story/game that has no Reapers in it can also be entertaing. 
 
Let's say, a story about the war with the heretic Geth that happened during the time skip, the one that Anderson briefly summarises. The protagonist would be a Corsair or a merc or a simple solider that gets somehow involed in the conflict and proves to be an important asset in it (Ever seen/heard the Republic Trooper storyline in SW:TOR? I'm thinking something like that). Or perhaps something akin to what ME: Galaxy and Infiltrator are. I for one, would love to see an Alpha Protocol type of game in the ME universe. Just because it doesn't openly deal with Reapers or 'I already know how it's going to end and I don't like it', it doesn't make it any less entertaining or turns it into crap that I will never ever touch with a 10 foot pole.

Yeap, many people are thinking only in galactic (Reaper) scale, when they are many other smaller possibilities for good antagonists and connected story.

Batarians slaver or their goverment, biotic extremist, turian nationalists, mercs bands, all those dictators from Terminus systems and many others, 99% of galaxy have no idea about Reapers and there are still plenty other crimes and conspiracies.

But the player knows about the reapers. 

And why would any such tale have to be told in those two years when Shepard is missing.  The only point of doing that that would have been interesting would have been as ME2 DLC, looking for Shepard's body instead of the incredibly bad comic.

The whole thing is that you can't metagame at all in order to play such a game and most people would be metagaming.  We know what happens to the galaxy already.  And these people live in it.  We also know what happens to a lot of Batarians in the Arrival.

I'm not saying it's got to be OMG reapers, that is really super silly, but the fact is in that time period that is the biggest foe faced.  What you all are talking about is playing some mini-quest game that would have been more like a mission in ME2.  A game like that would not be worth it, because it has nowhere to go.

There is no way you can set a story in that time period and not have the player form some kind of connection to Shepard or the reapers.  They don't have to be in it, but why then set such a game during that time.  Why cares about that time if not for the fact, Shepard is missing?

[KENNY4753]

dreman9999 wrote...

KENNY4753 wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

KENNY4753 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
"I've explained why it would impact it because the player would still be considering what all this has to do with Shepard's story and events going on at the time in this galaxy. "

It's a side story...It won't have any effect on Shepard's story at all. Why? Because Shepard story has already been told and no more can be added to it before ME3.

3d, this is a side story with new characters. It would be involved with Shepards story as Much as the books are involve with Shepard story.

That means it will have nothing to do with the end of ME3. AND NO,THINKING ABOUT THE GETH ATTACK ON THE CITADEL WILL INVOLVE THE ENDING, THAT IS JUST FALLOWING THE LORE.

Dreman, let me give you my thoughts on what 3D is saying.

Mass Effect is Shepard's story, is it not? She is not saying that this prequel, yes it is a prequel to ME3 and technically most of ME2 (due to the fact that that 2 year gap takes place before all but the opening part of ME2), will not directly effect the ME3 endings but the player will be thinking about how it could effect. The player knows how it all ends so that is why6 they will be thinking about how this prequel would affect the ending.

That's exactly it.  ME as it now is is Shepard's story.  ME3 ended that.  Going back before that ending within the ME universe and using certain known characters or types (Cerberus, Spectres, the council, the citadel, or known races) sets things in Shepard's universe.  But since you are relating this to a specific time period (during Shepard's two missing years) even unknown characters and types would end up funneled into ME3's endings.  How would you indicate this time period was during Shepard's two missing years?  You'd have to say something to point that out.

If you liked the endings, anything may be open to you, but especially if you didn't, then anything before and up to ME3's ending that happens in the Milky Way, is an integral part of Shepard's story and won't end well.

Star Wars could be taken as an example-the entirety of the story ends well, the galaxy is saved and evil is defeated.  So, there can be infinite variations on the idea of different Jedi roaming the galaxy on different adventures even when they take place before the events of Return of the Jedi.  Ultimately their story will end well, so relating all of it to Obi Wan and Darth Vader and Luke doesn't hurt things.

In ME, the natural thing for players to do is to consider what happens or what will happen to characters you care about.  If it's about the Protheans-they end up with only Javik surviving.  The Contact Wars, end up with ME3.  Omega ends up with ME3. 

Every event in the Milky Way that takes place before ME3, ends up with the same endings and so it's all tied together.

Exactly. Thatis what Dreman is not understanding. We know already how every major event ends (First Contact, Rachni Wars, etc) and we know how they impact Shepard's story making it isignificant to tell that story.

You cleary don't undererstand. ME as a whole is not just Shepard story. We are not tided to just Shepard's perspective.  Look at the books and the comics to see what I mean. This is a big universe and we can see it in more then one perspective. You 2 just don't understand this and are locked in only one perspective. ME. a series about replayablity and different view is no about looking at things only one way. Yet you to insist it is.

A side story does not have to be in any way connected to Shepards story...Efected yes, but not connected. That is why a aside story will not be related to the ending.

Yes ME is not just Shepards story but everything in the time from Eden Prime to the Starbrat is Shepard's story.

I'm sorry maybe you misunderstood me. What I meant was since we know how everything ends a prequel would not work. Whether it would effect the ending or not. We know how it ends and we already know how major historical events happened. We know the Turians used the Genophage to end the Krogan Rebellions just like we know the Quarians lost their homeworld in The Morning War. I am not saying a prequel cannot be done, I am saying that it would not be smart of BW to do.

[dreman9999]

3DandBeyond wrote...

JamesFaith wrote...

Rovay wrote...

And our characters woudn't know it or believe it. And why does it have to be about something bigger than the Reapers? It can be smaller scale story, maybe more personal. I just don't get why suddenly everything ME related must have 'OMG REAPERS!' in it or stampped somewhere on the box for it to be entertaining. A properly structured and executed story/game that has no Reapers in it can also be entertaing. 
 
Let's say, a story about the war with the heretic Geth that happened during the time skip, the one that Anderson briefly summarises. The protagonist would be a Corsair or a merc or a simple solider that gets somehow involed in the conflict and proves to be an important asset in it (Ever seen/heard the Republic Trooper storyline in SW:TOR? I'm thinking something like that). Or perhaps something akin to what ME: Galaxy and Infiltrator are. I for one, would love to see an Alpha Protocol type of game in the ME universe. Just because it doesn't openly deal with Reapers or 'I already know how it's going to end and I don't like it', it doesn't make it any less entertaining or turns it into crap that I will never ever touch with a 10 foot pole.

Yeap, many people are thinking only in galactic (Reaper) scale, when they are many other smaller possibilities for good antagonists and connected story.

Batarians slaver or their goverment, biotic extremist, turian nationalists, mercs bands, all those dictators from Terminus systems and many others, 99% of galaxy have no idea about Reapers and there are still plenty other crimes and conspiracies.

But the player knows about the reapers. 

And why would any such tale have to be told in those two years when Shepard is missing.  The only point of doing that that would have been interesting would have been as ME2 DLC, looking for Shepard's body instead of the incredibly bad comic.

The whole thing is that you can't metagame at all in order to play such a game and most people would be metagaming.  We know what happens to the galaxy already.  And these people live in it.  We also know what happens to a lot of Batarians in the Arrival.

I'm not saying it's got to be OMG reapers, that is really super silly, but the fact is in that time period that is the biggest foe faced.  What you all are talking about is playing some mini-quest game that would have been more like a mission in ME2.  A game like that would not be worth it, because it has nowhere to go.

There is no way you can set a story in that time period and not have the player form some kind of connection to Shepard or the reapers.  They don't have to be in it, but why then set such a game during that time.  Why cares about that time if not for the fact, Shepard is missing?

So what if the player knows about the reapers. That does not mean anything if the story is not directly about them.
I may be effected bythe results of ME1 but it has nothing to do with the ending.

[dreman9999]

KENNY4753 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

KENNY4753 wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

KENNY4753 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
"I've explained why it would impact it because the player would still be considering what all this has to do with Shepard's story and events going on at the time in this galaxy. "

It's a side story...It won't have any effect on Shepard's story at all. Why? Because Shepard story has already been told and no more can be added to it before ME3.

3d, this is a side story with new characters. It would be involved with Shepards story as Much as the books are involve with Shepard story.

That means it will have nothing to do with the end of ME3. AND NO,THINKING ABOUT THE GETH ATTACK ON THE CITADEL WILL INVOLVE THE ENDING, THAT IS JUST FALLOWING THE LORE.

Dreman, let me give you my thoughts on what 3D is saying.

Mass Effect is Shepard's story, is it not? She is not saying that this prequel, yes it is a prequel to ME3 and technically most of ME2 (due to the fact that that 2 year gap takes place before all but the opening part of ME2), will not directly effect the ME3 endings but the player will be thinking about how it could effect. The player knows how it all ends so that is why6 they will be thinking about how this prequel would affect the ending.

That's exactly it.  ME as it now is is Shepard's story.  ME3 ended that.  Going back before that ending within the ME universe and using certain known characters or types (Cerberus, Spectres, the council, the citadel, or known races) sets things in Shepard's universe.  But since you are relating this to a specific time period (during Shepard's two missing years) even unknown characters and types would end up funneled into ME3's endings.  How would you indicate this time period was during Shepard's two missing years?  You'd have to say something to point that out.

If you liked the endings, anything may be open to you, but especially if you didn't, then anything before and up to ME3's ending that happens in the Milky Way, is an integral part of Shepard's story and won't end well.

Star Wars could be taken as an example-the entirety of the story ends well, the galaxy is saved and evil is defeated.  So, there can be infinite variations on the idea of different Jedi roaming the galaxy on different adventures even when they take place before the events of Return of the Jedi.  Ultimately their story will end well, so relating all of it to Obi Wan and Darth Vader and Luke doesn't hurt things.

In ME, the natural thing for players to do is to consider what happens or what will happen to characters you care about.  If it's about the Protheans-they end up with only Javik surviving.  The Contact Wars, end up with ME3.  Omega ends up with ME3. 

Every event in the Milky Way that takes place before ME3, ends up with the same endings and so it's all tied together.

Exactly. Thatis what Dreman is not understanding. We know already how every major event ends (First Contact, Rachni Wars, etc) and we know how they impact Shepard's story making it isignificant to tell that story.

You cleary don't undererstand. ME as a whole is not just Shepard story. We are not tided to just Shepard's perspective.  Look at the books and the comics to see what I mean. This is a big universe and we can see it in more then one perspective. You 2 just don't understand this and are locked in only one perspective. ME. a series about replayablity and different view is no about looking at things only one way. Yet you to insist it is.

A side story does not have to be in any way connected to Shepards story...Efected yes, but not connected. That is why a aside story will not be related to the ending.

Yes ME is not just Shepards story but everything in the time from Eden Prime to the Starbrat is Shepard's story.

I'm sorry maybe you misunderstood me. What I meant was since we know how everything ends a prequel would not work. Whether it would effect the ending or not. We know how it ends and we already know how major historical events happened. We know the Turians used the Genophage to end the Krogan Rebellions just like we know the Quarians lost their homeworld in The Morning War. I am not saying a prequel cannot be done, I am saying that it would not be smart of BW to do.

1. No matter how you cut it everything in ME will have some relation to the reaper because of the tech on hand in the series.
2.That also does not mean a story that does not involve the reaper directly can't be made.
3.Shepard story is about his/perspective, not the place he/she goes. Other perspective can exsist during that time of other events. That's why it's called a side story. Remeber, ME :Assensionis an example of these type of stories that have nothing to do with Shepard in his/her time frame as well as ME:galexy.
4. This also means it has nothing to do with Shepards story and the ending.

[3DandBeyond]

KENNY4753 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...


You cleary don't undererstand. ME as a whole is not just Shepard story. We are not tided to just Shepard's perspective.  Look at the books and the comics to see what I mean. This is a big universe and we can see it in more then one perspective. You 2 just don't understand this and are locked in only one perspective. ME. a series about replayablity and different view is no about looking at things only one way. Yet you to insist it is.

A side story does not have to be in any way connected to Shepards story...Efected yes, but not connected. That is why a aside story will not be related to the ending.

Yes ME is not just Shepards story but everything in the time from Eden Prime to the Starbrat is Shepard's story.

I'm sorry maybe you misunderstood me. What I meant was since we know how everything ends a prequel would not work. Whether it would effect the ending or not. We know how it ends and we already know how major historical events happened. We know the Turians used the Genophage to end the Krogan Rebellions just like we know the Quarians lost their homeworld in The Morning War. I am not saying a prequel cannot be done, I am saying that it would not be smart of BW to do.

That's it and I'm not saying it's only the story of the reapers, either.  But it's just that Shepard meeting the reapers and the kid happens and it's the future of any prequel.  If it turns out well, then the galaxy could be explored forever.  Dreman if you had read anything before writing in that  plea thread I created you would have understood this is what people felt.  Without an adequate ending, it's just pointless for many to consider anything else in the galaxy matters.

I even suggested post-ME3 content that could have been Spectre missions, that were bigger than just plain side quests and I said that the codex is huge and they could create mini-games pre-ME4, but that without a specific decent ending to tie off ME3 most of us in that thread and a heck of a lot of people elsewhere think prequels especially are pointless.  We know how it will end. 

Setting a game in the Milky Way during the events of the current ME series leads to 3 choices/endings based off of these ultimately.  It would be fun if the endings were, but even then a lot of people would think it was pointless.  Prequels are very hard to do well and it's why they aren't done that often. 

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 19 octobre 2012 - 10:18 .

[3DandBeyond]

dreman9999 wrote...
1. No matter how you cut it everything in ME will have some relation to the reaper because of the tech on hand in the series.
2.That also does not mean a story that does not involve the reaper directly can't be made.
3.Shepard story is about his/perspective, not the place he/she goes. Other perspective can exsist during that time of other events. That's why it's called a side story. Remeber, ME :Assensionis an example of these type of stories that have nothing to do with Shepard in his/her time frame as well as ME:galexy.
4. This also means it has nothing to do with Shepards story and the ending.

You're actually making the case for why it would have something to do with the ending or rather why the ending would effect feelings about such a supposed game.

It would be impossible to create a game that used similar people and places and have it take place while Shepard's in cold storage and the reapers are an impending threat and not have the player think about it and wonder about the impact on current characters they are playing.

I made the case that the game is about the characters, which means it's also about feelings you develop for them-that was what made the games great up until the end when it feels like Shepard was dumped out with the trash.

A great many people would not want to care about people that they know if a few short game years will be green eyed, controlled by Shepard AI and reaper pals, or scooping up geth parts off the pavement.  Or, they might even be digesting in goo pots inside reapers.  If you formed any kind of emotional connection (what an RPG and what stories want you to do) with the characters in ME, then you'd realize that the fates of such people do matter.

In this game you'd have them create, how do you envision it ending?  Do the characters go on to ignore the impending reaper threat forever.  The reapers don't just attack Earth, Palaven, Thessia, and so on.  Someone posted that 90% of the galaxy doesn't know about the reapers, but they will and they'll either die by them, be in a fight not against them but variants, or waiting to see what Shepard does with the Crucible.  That's how it ends for the whole galaxy.  Every single organic being within it, except maybe for some Leviathans since they're hiding out even after they promised to help.