16 réponses à ce sujet

[KefkaGestahl]

In Origins, it seemed abundantly clear that the templars were loved and the mages were feared.  If you were a mage, you even got special dialogue options because few wanted to mess with a mage.  In Dragon Age II, that seemed to change.  Cullen said that the image of the imprisoned apprentace was a powerful one, and that people were more likely to slam their doors in the templars faces.

First, what happened to change perceptions so much?  Is it just a Fereldan vs. Free Marches thing?  Second, who wll have the support of the masses in Dragon Age III?  Wouldn't the assassination of the divine grand cleric all but lock up support for the templars?  It seems like the average joes would have very little reason to side with the mages.

Modifié par KefkaGestahl, 16 octobre 2012 - 08:09 .

[KENNY4753]

well I don't believe the divine has been assassinated. Elthina was killed but not the Divine.

plus I believe Divine Justinia is secretly a mage

[KefkaGestahl]

KENNY4753 wrote...

well I don't believe the divine has been assassinated. Elthina was killed but not the Divine.

plus I believe Divine Justinia is secretly a mage

Eh, I get their titles mixed up.  Grand Cleric, then.

[SeptimusMagistos]

KefkaGestahl wrote...

In Origins, it seemed abundantly clear that the templars were loved and the mages were feared.

Never really got the impression that Templars were loved.

[JCAP]

Well, in the movie "Dawn of the Seeker", a mage tried to kill the Devine with a dragon.

[KENNY4753]

JCAP wrote...

Well, in the movie "Dawn of the Seeker", a mage tried to kill the Devine with a dragon.

but the Templar Knight-Commander was in on it too.

[KefkaGestahl]

SeptimusMagistos wrote...

Never really got the impression that Templars were loved.

They didn't get much of an opportunity to show it, but the codex in Origins made it clear.

"While mages often resent the templars as symbols of the Chantry's control over magic, the people of Thedas see them as saviors and holy warriors, champions of all that is good, armed with piety enough to protect the world from the ravages of foul magic."

[JCAP]

KENNY4753 wrote...

JCAP wrote...

Well, in the movie "Dawn of the Seeker", a mage tried to kill the Devine with a dragon.

but the Templar Knight-Commander was in on it too.

True, but for the people of Thedas, that part of the story will be under the stage. (I think)
I do not know if people saw the mage summon the dragon, but if they have not seen, or the Chantry will say it was just an unusual dragon attack, or that guilt has been of the mage. (because of the war mages vs templars (yes, I know that the war only happens later))

Modifié par JCAP, 16 octobre 2012 - 08:34 .

[KENNY4753]

JCAP wrote...

KENNY4753 wrote...

JCAP wrote...

Well, in the movie "Dawn of the Seeker", a mage tried to kill the Devine with a dragon.

but the Templar Knight-Commander was in on it too.

True, but for the people of Thedas, that part of the story will be under the stage. (I think)
I do not know if people saw the mage summon the dragon, but if they have not seen, or the Chantry will say it was just an unusual dragon attack, or that guilt has been of the mage. (because of the war mages vs templars (yes, I know that the war only happens later))

The Chantry will probably just lay blame on the mages

or say it was just a random dragon attack

Modifié par KENNY4753, 16 octobre 2012 - 08:37 .

[Terrorize69]

KefkaGestahl wrote...

In Origins, it seemed abundantly clear that the templars were loved and the mages were feared.  If you were a mage, you even got special dialogue options because few wanted to mess with a mage.  In Dragon Age II, that seemed to change.  Cullen said that the image of the imprisoned apprentace was a powerful one, and that people were more likely to slam their doors in the templars faces.

First, what happened to change perceptions so much?  Is it just a Fereldan vs. Free Marches thing?  Second, who wll have the support of the masses in Dragon Age III?  Wouldn't the assassination of the divine grand cleric all but lock up support for the templars?  It seems like the average joes would have very little reason to side with the mages.

Mages helped end the blight, while Templars stood back (unless the circle is elminated). But mages help regardless. If the Warden was a mage, if not, still had Wynne and Morrigan.

Kirkwall is also tainted by the history of slavery, in which Mages are imprisoned in the Gallows. Bringing back unwanted history for the locals.

IMO anyway. That and the Templars are more heavy handed in the area to both mages and non-mages alike.

[Maria Caliban]

KefkaGestahl wrote...

In Origins, it seemed abundantly clear that the templars were loved and the mages were feared.  If you were a mage, you even got special dialogue options because few wanted to mess with a mage.  In Dragon Age II, that seemed to change.  Cullen said that the image of the imprisoned apprentace was a powerful one, and that people were more likely to slam their doors in the templars faces.

First, what happened to change perceptions so much?  Is it just a Fereldan vs. Free Marches thing?

1. Kirkwall is a city, Ferelden is a country. City dwellers tend to be more aware of larger issues than country dwellers.

2. Kirkwall has a city guard. Ferelden has no national police. In many localities, Templars are the ones who show up and deal with scary trouble.

3. Kirkwall's tower was infamous for its harshness and Meredith herself was a presence in city politics. I doubt the average person in Fereldan could name the Templar-Commander.

[mousestalker]

Between the Blight and the civil war, most people in ferelden probably reckoned they had more than enough to deal with. If the mass of templars were like those at Lothering, then they would be respected and admired.

[thats1evildude]

Maria Caliban wrote...

1. Kirkwall is a city, Ferelden is a country. City dwellers tend to be more aware of larger issues than country dwellers.

2. Kirkwall has a city guard. Ferelden has no national police. In many localities, Templars are the ones who show up and deal with scary trouble.

3. Kirkwall's tower was infamous for its harshness and Meredith herself was a presence in city politics. I doubt the average person in Fereldan could name the Templar-Commander.

Pretty much. Kirkwall's relationship with its templars was simply far different than in Ferelden.

Even though the mages were obviously discontent, the templar order in Ferelden was fairly lenient and no one outside of the Circle had any reason to take issue with their sacred duty. What's more, Ferelden had recently emerged from an oppressive regime under Orlesian rule and was in the midst of dealing with the Blight; there were far bigger fish to fry than worrying about the plight of mages.

In Kirkwall, the templars were THE power in the city and their treatment of mages was far more brutal.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 16 octobre 2012 - 10:46 .

[ImperatorMortis]

In Kirkwall the Templars were up in everyone's faces. As opposed to Ferelden where there was some distance between them.

Instead of just being a symbol, the Kirkwallers got to deal with Templars up close, and it seems a lot of them didn't like what they saw. 

Modifié par ImperatorMortis, 16 octobre 2012 - 10:55 .

[Withidread]

thats1evildude wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

1. Kirkwall is a city, Ferelden is a country. City dwellers tend to be more aware of larger issues than country dwellers.

2. Kirkwall has a city guard. Ferelden has no national police. In many localities, Templars are the ones who show up and deal with scary trouble.

3. Kirkwall's tower was infamous for its harshness and Meredith herself was a presence in city politics. I doubt the average person in Fereldan could name the Templar-Commander.

Pretty much. Kirkwall's relationship with its templars was simply far different than in Ferelden.

Even though the mages were obviously discontent, the templar order in Ferelden was fairly lenient and no one outside of the Circle had any reason to take issue with their sacred duty. What's more, Ferelden had recently emerged from an oppressive regime under Orlesian rule and was in the midst of dealing with the Blight; there were far bigger fish to fry than worrying about the plight of mages.

In Kirkwall, the templars were THE power in the city and their treatment of mages was far more brutal.

Also, the circle in Ferelden is very remote in comparison. People are aware of it, but for the most part they don't see it on a regular basis, if at all. Any templar abuses or other incidents taking place there would not have the same impact that they would in Kirkwall. In fact, it's far more likely that the incident in Kirkwall would have a greater impact on perceptions of templars in Ferelden than would the same event if it had taken place at Ferelden's circle simply because of the disconnect in Ferelden.

[Eveangaline]

KefkaGestahl wrote...
First, what happened to change perceptions so much?  Is it just a Fereldan vs. Free Marches thing?  Second, who wll have the support of the masses in Dragon Age III?  Wouldn't the assassination of the divine grand cleric all but lock up support for the templars?  It seems like the average joes would have very little reason to side with the mages.

Because fereldan has a much more relaxed circle, whereas Kirkwall had a very harsh one known for causing problems with mages and anyone even suspected of helping one.

And average joes may believe in freedom, or be related to a mage, but it is true that outside of kirkwall where the templars were freaking nuts, and the religion that says mages scared god away is the major one, mages probably aren't as well liked.

[Massakkolia]

KefkaGestahl wrote...

They didn't get much of an opportunity to show it, but the codex in Origins made it clear.

"While mages often resent the templars as symbols of the Chantry's control over magic, the people of Thedas see them as saviors and holy warriors, champions of all that is good, armed with piety enough to protect the world from the ravages of foul magic."

I agree with Maria but I'd also like to point out that the codices are not the most reliable source of information. The codices in Dragon Age are cleverly portrayed as genuine historical accounts by different people and thus they come with biases.

Most of them are written from someone's point of view. I just checked Dragon Age Wiki for this and that particular one was written by Halden who was a First Enchanter of Starkhaven. It is his view of Thedas and not necessarily the absolute truth. 

In any case, it's likely that attitudes regarding the templar order differ quite radically around Thedas. 

Modifié par Ria, 16 octobre 2012 - 11:27 .