176 réponses à ce sujet

[Jay Leon Hart]

I'm not bothered by Dragoons - they're easy enough to avoid, even mid-jump.
I agree the Bomber needs to lose the stun. Sure, grenades work for flushing you out of cover and that's a decent change, but a single Bomber's grenade spam + stagger gets me more often that a Pyro + Hunter duo atm.

[CmnDwnWrkn]

The Geth now have approximately 970546895723589057 different stun attacks now. It's ridiculous. Is there no other way to make this enemy more challenging without resorting to even more stun?

[oO Stryfe Oo]

Lmao, I'm pretty sure that's exactly how the conversation regarding the Geth Bomber went down. Love the mantra, btw.

Anyway, I like the concepts of both characters. The Dragoon could've been way more badass. For one, slow him down! He looks really silly zooming across the map at such a high speed. If not that, at the very least tweak his A.I., so he doesn't suicide charge all the time. I thought he'd work in conjunction with other units, flushing players out after an engineer places a turret or when an Atlas spawns, providing backup for a phantom (like an entourage), or maybe even charging players through Centurion smoke. There's so many better things BW could have done with him. If any of the above strategies were implemented, it'd be awesome if he were equipped with a Harrier instead of the Hornet. I mean, why does no Cerberus unit use this awesome weapon?

The Geth Bomber, while it sounds cool on paper, is kind of annoying to play against. Although I guess the same could be said of the entire faction. Anyway, it staggers constantly, is difficult to hit at close ranges, and sometimes shield stripping/staggering powers like overload have absolutely no effect on it. Especially overload. I don't know why, but nearly 50% of the time I use this power against it, it takes no damage at all.

[The Renegade Fem-Shep]

 I have no problem with either. My problem is both set you up for failure by combining too well with other troops. Dragoons plus phantoms means somebody is garunteed to be instakilled. Bombers rape your shields so that prime or flamer can down you in a heartbeat.

Modifié par Morugatu, 17 octobre 2012 - 04:19 .

[121andrew]

The Geth Bombers mean you can't take cover very often, and therefore are a right pain the ass because of that. I guess they do help stop farmers/campers, though I don't think they were an issue to begin with. The Dragoons are pretty okay though. They tend to attack in herds for some reason, which can be very annoying. Overall I like the new enemies.

[VilyaEleni]

My only problem with the Dragoons after getting used to them is how they move like they are on some really intense speed. It's... disturbing.

I got used to the Bombers as well, the only thing I'd really change is for them to lose the ability to stagger as well as drop tons of bombs on you. Dropping bombs on you seems to be enough.

[codename2o2]

Having to face an entire offensive line of dragoons with the speed of drells on adrenaline II mods wielding gold whips isn't exactly my idea of a good time.

Geth bombers = "MOARSTUNLOCK!!!11!" Seriously. It's getting old. I'm actually starting to want the geth removed from MP until bioware can think of a way to make them not completely broken and cheap.

[golyoscsapagy]

Dragoons is just the new way of BW making enemies - extremely fast, hits hard, so you'll never notice just how stupid his AI is. This game had great AI in the beginning, now it just decayed to Rage levels - retarded AI retardedly doing the same retarded stuff over and over again.

For example try Firebase Vancouver, and camp inside to the ladder upstairs (between the two ramps) - Upper Rooftops I think? Whatever, I just sat there with a freaking disciple and killed 9 dragoons one by one without moving my gun the least bit - they jump down the exact same location one by one, you kill them, reload, rinse and repeat ad infinitum.

Difficulty should come from the AI not from the sheer number of troops, their speed and them breaking game rules we players must abide to.

[Seerezaro]

I like the dragoons they aren't durable enough to really equal a great threat. Yeah they can pounce on you in a second but I'd rather deal with them, then the phantoms(w/o stasis).

Bombers are ridiculous and I refuse to play geth. Yeah they die easily, its not the bomber itself thats a pain its that geth are stunmongers and the only real reprieve was good cover. Bomber is a stunmongering cover flusher.

[Djarknaein]

Geth gold hack objectives impossible seriously grenades all over hack circle.

Hidden dragoon and crouching phamtom not so bad.

[Schneidend]

Pugz82 wrote...

It's a cover based game...neither of them should been added. Would you of liked them raining hell bombs on you during your insanity run while two primes are shooting at you. It is silly and was only added thanks to camping FBW. ME3 is no longer a cover based game.

Part of the skillset and strategy of cover-based games is getting from one coverpoint to another efficiently and at the right time. ME3 has never promised to allow you to camp. The fact that husks jump right over cover, Phantoms try their best to flank, and that cannibals and Cerberus throw grenades proves the idea of bunker buster enemies was intended from inception. Period.

As for the enemies in question, I like them, but that isn't to say they're perfect. For one thing, Dragoons seem to have weird hitboxes. I've shot them point-blank with a Katana and managed to not actually land a hit. This isn't a lag issue, I'm usually hosting and the Katana is a hit-scan weapon. Another issue is that their newness makes players act foolishly. Obviously, something that can be on top of you in groups of three or more in seconds, or can hover amongst you happily dropping bombs, should be a priority target. PUGs don't seem to agree. This happens a lot with Possessed Scions, as well, pretty much the most dangerous of all Collector units, and people ignore them for some reason.

[Sihmm]

tetsutsuru wrote...

I'm trying to understand your perspective to get a better picture.

The Dragoons are aggressive, CQC units, just like the Phantoms. And that's what they do. Just without sync-kill.  From what I've noticed, they even run in the same mob as the Phantoms. What makes that characteristic break from how the Cerberus faction used to operate?

Mainly it's the reaper-like mindless aggression that's causes them to run straight at you no matter what.  If you watch a phantom rush, they'll often run from side to side, getting near cover and ducking into it at times, or attempting to flank the player.  Dragoons just come straight at you then spam an easily avoidable melee attack until they're dead, no matter what you do to them.  I don't hate the concept, but in practice it feels really off.

I was once playing Glacier/Gold/Cerberus as a human soldier when two of my teammates disconnected, so it was just me and a friend.  We got to one of the late Dragoon spawning waves and I went to the LZ to get some ammo, when a Dragoon came around the corner.  I shot him in the head, but his friend was right behind, so I shot him too.  Then immediately another one, and another one, and another one.  By the time I finished headshotting Dragoons coming around the corner the rest of the wave had stopped spawning, and all I'd seen was Dragoons.

Phantoms are sometimes like that but even they're not so fast or aggressive, and it's possible to actually run away from them and thus encounter the rest of the Cerberus pincer movement.

oO Stryfe Oo wrote...

Anyway, I like the concepts of both characters. The Dragoon could've been way more badass. For one, slow him down! He looks really silly zooming across the map at such a high speed. If not that, at the very least tweak his A.I., so he doesn't suicide charge all the time. I thought he'd work in conjunction with other units, flushing players out after an engineer places a turret or when an Atlas spawns, providing backup for a phantom (like an entourage), or maybe even charging players through Centurion smoke. There's so many better things BW could have done with him.

Yeah, I agree, that's a nice concept but for some reason that just isn't how it works out in-game.

Modifié par Sihmm, 17 octobre 2012 - 08:47 .

[AlienSpaceBats]

On higher difficulties, both are a pain in the ass, get more than two surrounding you (say for example you're doing a hack objective solo) and the spam attack, trapping you in a stagger lock which is just infuriating.

I don't call Geth 'Geth' anymore, I call them Staggerers. Staggery bast**ds

[EvoSigma]

I can live with the dragoons. The geth bombers however are another story. They add nothing to the geth that already hasn't been eshtablished by the other units. They say they're cover busters but this is a third person, cover based shooter and they just neutered FBW where camping isn't so common anymore.

With pyros being immune to grabs they already serve the close range cover buster role along with the INVISIBLE STAGGER RESISTANT HUNTERS THAT WILL SHOOT THROUGH EVERYTHING. I don't even want to talk about primes and they're stupid stun drones....

[Nightmare137]

Do I like this? Bomber yes. Dragoon no. Dragoon is pure stupidity of an enemy seeing as every single one of them does nothing but bum rush people. They have a tendency to have a few follow the same target and leave them almost no time to get out of their stagger. Combine this with how fast they move for an armored target and they just get annoying.

Bomber on the other hand are relatively weak and easily predictable. You get warnings for the bombs just like you do for grenades and as long as you have some form of attention span they are easy to keep track of. Their one track mind of dropping bombs in a row is easy to avoid by side stepping/dodging.

[hostaman]

I thought the game was meant to be a "cover based shooter". Both the Dragoons and Bombers are anoying.

You can only recognize a Dragoon when it's virtually on top of you.

The Dragoons could do with standing out from the crowd, and the Geth Bombers just make the unplayable Geth - more unplayable.

[synapsefire]

Bombers are fine for the most part, Dragoons need a big overhaul imo.

[Kenadian]

Dragoon just feels plain annoying. Device objectives are next to impossible between them and phantoms unless you have your whole team covering you. Bombers are atleast kinda cute.

[DullahansXMark]

Dragoons: I like 'em. They're really dangerous. Yes, they move a bit too fast, but that's it. The only two tweaks I would make are: reduce their movement speed, and make them actually have to recover from the Smash animation before being allowed to shoot (that's the most annoying thing about them, which... still isn't THAT bad)

Geth Bomber: I'd be fine with them if Geth weren't stagger-spam. In my personal opinion, only melee attacks and Drone fireballs should stagger; melee because, every other faction has staggering melee, and Drone fireballs because they don't do that much damage anyway, and it would make them a bit more unique. The Bomber, without stagger, would be fine. It's the annoyingness of the Geth in general that makes me hate this enemy type.

EDIT: Less of them need to spawn per wave, as Cerberus and Geth are oversaturated with them at the moment.

Modifié par DullahansXMark, 17 octobre 2012 - 09:21 .

[Lee80]

My thoughts on the 2 new units are this: Mass effect was (as far as I can tell) built to be a cover shooter/RPG. Now cover is completely useless. Every faction has enemy types that makes cover not a good option. Sure you can use it (if you are lucky) long enough to recover shields, but I miss being able to fight from cover, and only having to move when things get too hot. Now you have to move constantly, and honestly you still die more often then not cause every single attack kills you in 2 hits regardless of your shield/barrier stats. (which makes me wonder why they have so many points set aside for health and such when the numbers just don't seem to matter).

Still love the game, but I really don't think it's what it used to be at all-and for me that's not a good thing. I feel sorry for any people that are coming into the game now or later on. The learning curve will be rather hellish.

[xeniskull]

I disagree with some part except frequency of Dragoon spawns. Bombers are not a big deal. Learn to play. As for Dragoons, I agree with you. Sometimes an army of Dragoons spawns. Its quite annoying

[Uchimura]

They should really spread them out, I agree. These are/should be specialized units and they feel cheap and silly when a whole bunch of them come out at the same time.

[Chi_Mangetsu]

Oh I like them so much...

For me to shoot on!

But in all seriousness, both new units are far too quiet and the Dragoon's absurd speed and complete disregard for Tactical Cloak make Soloing Cerberus nothing short of a pain in the ass.

Modifié par Chi_Mangetsu, 17 octobre 2012 - 09:55 .

[JaimasOfRaxis]

Air Quotes wrote...

+1 on everything you said.

Both Dragoons and Bombers are cheap and overused.

Cerberus might as well be renamed to Dragoons and CO.

Anti-camping measures are good, but they went too extreme on this one.  

[MittelBienchen2]

I like both of them, especially when I am playing the Shadow, one shadow strike and they are gone :happy: