I coudn't begin to tell you how many times I have played through this game and done pretty much everything there is to do, except for one thing. I have yet to play through it as a rogue! I loved the rogue in DA2 but in Origins I feel a bit lost. I had a dual weild warrior before, so far being my favorite build but what about dual wielding rogues?
I think it would be fun to explore a more tactical aspect of the game but I'm not entierly sure how to build a dual wielding rogue without wasting points. I know you need to go for backstabs for the most dps but doesn't it ever get boring? Last time I played a rogue it just felt like the same attack animation the whole fight so is there any variation to backstabs. Can you get the death blows with them?
In a nutshell tell me what your favorite dual weilding rogue build is and how you go about using it. Show me what the rave is about this class.
Making a Rogue.
Débuté par
TacoHero
, oct. 18 2012 04:07
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#2
Posté 18 octobre 2012 - 01:41
Blazomancer
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Some people believe that a Dual-dagger wielding Warrior surpasses marginally a Dual-dagger wielding Rogue in terms of DPS, which may or may not be true, but the thing is a rogue has a lot of utility; and in tactical combat utility always shines.
In the beginning of the game, when a rogue is backstabbing for little damage, it often seems how can one put up with it the whole game. But believe me, you'll see those damage numbers for each backstab rise very high in time, and you'll probably enjoy it. That said, as the game progresses, one can even give up backstabbing, but that would be sub-optimal. And yes, deathblow animations do play out for backstabs every now and then; as far as I remember, there are four distinct animations, may be more, but don't seem to remember right now. But personally I really get annoyed when they trigger, I mean, by the time the animation ends, you would most probably have killed another one of your foe.
My favourite rogue build is a Cunning based rogue, as I like taking full advantage of Bard songs, assassin talents, and Tainted Blade. One can also go for a Dexterity build. and get a very high attack and defense rating, useful very much so, while soloing.
The build is pretty much simple, put 30 points in Dex for Whirlwind, and everything else into Cunning. The Fade bonuses and gear will take care of everyhting else. A backstabber don't really need much Willpower, and when a creation based mage like Wynne is constantly casting rejuvanate, spellbloom, & mass rejuvenation, it becomes even more unnecessary.
For your first specialization, Assassin is the obvious choice, and for the second you can choose between Duelist and Bard. Bard will provide better bonuses with a high Cunn score.
Go straight for 'momentum' at first, then 'combat movement' and 'deadly strike'. Then fill out Lethality and Coup De Grace as soon as they are available. Take Assassin at level 7 and learn 'Mark of Death' if you wish; then fill out the complete stealth tree. You don't need a single point in the Deft Hands tree. With cunning over 70, you'll be able to pick every lock in the game. At the initial levels, Leliana can take care of lockpicking. And yes, I'm suggesting to bring another rogue with you, not just to provide utility at early levels, but mainly to boost your attack and crit chance through song of Courage. So, make sure you take Song of Courage for Leliana as soon as possible. After stealth, start filling out the Dual weapon tree. If you can spare a few gold, buy a few tomes, and get Riposte, a very valuabe talent for taking out a single target. The moment you hit level 12, select 'exploit weakness' and watch your backstab damage rise. Then fill out any dual weapon talent you want till you hit level 14. At 14, select 'lacerate' and Bard for your next specialization. Over the next three levels, complete upto 'Song of Courage' and you're done. You may choose anything you wish for the later levels.
There is a catch for stacking 'song of courage'. First activate 'SoC' on your warden, then on 'Leliana'; doing it other way round will stack the effect on everyone else but you.
The Power of Blood talent 'tainted blade' is an awesome talent. It'll provide a large boost to your damage output based on your cunning score when sustained. It depletes 10 health per 2 seconds, nothing a competent healer can't take care of. But don't use it while you're using stealth, or it'll break your stealth sooner or later even with Master Stealth. It just has a 5 second cooldown, so no problem with that. I hope if you're playing on the PC, you have the unofficial fixpack installed. Without it, dual weapon expert starts self DoT whenever 'tainted blade' is on. Not much of a problem, but still it's a bug, and why shouldn't you get the fix when it's out there.
'Feign death' and 'Evasion' are pretty much useless, the latter actually playing out an animation, that is another no in my book. But it's upto you, it's just my opinion, that's all.
A cunning rogue will have a low attack rating in the beginning, but as the bard songs kick in, and Wynne casting 'Heroic Offense' on you during combat and from backstabbing bonuses, it's not really an issue.
Regarding gear, i guess you probably know by now the best gear out there. Helm of Honnleath, Felon's coat/Battledress, Red Jenny Seekers, Cadash Stompers, are all awesome. You may use Andruil's Blessing, High regard of house Dace, Harvest Fest Ring, Key 2 the City as accessories. For daggers, obviously the Rose's thorn on the main hand. The off hand dagger is upto you, Thorn of Dead Gods and Edge are great throughout the game. However, at later levels, when your cunn and crit chance are high, probably 'Duncan's dagger' and the 'Crow's Dagger (with 3 rune slots)' will provide marginally better dividends with the crit range bonus. Fang is a killer dagger available to City elves, but you have to do a bit of bug fixing for full bonus. For runes, whatever you like. Personally, i like to fill all 6 slots with Paralyzing runes. I remember i got the High Dragon to paralyze three times once, and that brief time can give you a lot of uninterrupted backstabs.
You can use a rogue however you like; may be you'll use stealth and assassinate high priority targets like mages and those pesky archers to begin with, while your party hangs back, and then your tank rushes in to draw aggro. Then you turn on tainted blade and start backstabbing. A straggler may come towards you, stun it and backstab away. Mark of death on a elite target makes it akin to a normal level enemy. If your tank is doing good, no one will actually bother you. Rogues generate comparatively less damage based threat.
So, the rave about dual dagger wielding rogues is quite justified. It has the highest possible auto attack speed, and can kill things crazy fast, more so, while backstabbing, not to speak of the utility. Assassinating mages is a cakewalk. You can even fool around with traps if you are game. Towards the end game you'll probably end up with around 70% crit chance, so you can even face enemies head on. But believe me, backstabbing is fun. Shadow striking in awakening provides even more crazy bonuses while backstabbing.
So to say, backstabbing rogues are highly efficient killing machines with no sense of fairness, and are fun to play. Just my opinion, that is.
In the beginning of the game, when a rogue is backstabbing for little damage, it often seems how can one put up with it the whole game. But believe me, you'll see those damage numbers for each backstab rise very high in time, and you'll probably enjoy it. That said, as the game progresses, one can even give up backstabbing, but that would be sub-optimal. And yes, deathblow animations do play out for backstabs every now and then; as far as I remember, there are four distinct animations, may be more, but don't seem to remember right now. But personally I really get annoyed when they trigger, I mean, by the time the animation ends, you would most probably have killed another one of your foe.
My favourite rogue build is a Cunning based rogue, as I like taking full advantage of Bard songs, assassin talents, and Tainted Blade. One can also go for a Dexterity build. and get a very high attack and defense rating, useful very much so, while soloing.
The build is pretty much simple, put 30 points in Dex for Whirlwind, and everything else into Cunning. The Fade bonuses and gear will take care of everyhting else. A backstabber don't really need much Willpower, and when a creation based mage like Wynne is constantly casting rejuvanate, spellbloom, & mass rejuvenation, it becomes even more unnecessary.
For your first specialization, Assassin is the obvious choice, and for the second you can choose between Duelist and Bard. Bard will provide better bonuses with a high Cunn score.
Go straight for 'momentum' at first, then 'combat movement' and 'deadly strike'. Then fill out Lethality and Coup De Grace as soon as they are available. Take Assassin at level 7 and learn 'Mark of Death' if you wish; then fill out the complete stealth tree. You don't need a single point in the Deft Hands tree. With cunning over 70, you'll be able to pick every lock in the game. At the initial levels, Leliana can take care of lockpicking. And yes, I'm suggesting to bring another rogue with you, not just to provide utility at early levels, but mainly to boost your attack and crit chance through song of Courage. So, make sure you take Song of Courage for Leliana as soon as possible. After stealth, start filling out the Dual weapon tree. If you can spare a few gold, buy a few tomes, and get Riposte, a very valuabe talent for taking out a single target. The moment you hit level 12, select 'exploit weakness' and watch your backstab damage rise. Then fill out any dual weapon talent you want till you hit level 14. At 14, select 'lacerate' and Bard for your next specialization. Over the next three levels, complete upto 'Song of Courage' and you're done. You may choose anything you wish for the later levels.
There is a catch for stacking 'song of courage'. First activate 'SoC' on your warden, then on 'Leliana'; doing it other way round will stack the effect on everyone else but you.
The Power of Blood talent 'tainted blade' is an awesome talent. It'll provide a large boost to your damage output based on your cunning score when sustained. It depletes 10 health per 2 seconds, nothing a competent healer can't take care of. But don't use it while you're using stealth, or it'll break your stealth sooner or later even with Master Stealth. It just has a 5 second cooldown, so no problem with that. I hope if you're playing on the PC, you have the unofficial fixpack installed. Without it, dual weapon expert starts self DoT whenever 'tainted blade' is on. Not much of a problem, but still it's a bug, and why shouldn't you get the fix when it's out there.
'Feign death' and 'Evasion' are pretty much useless, the latter actually playing out an animation, that is another no in my book. But it's upto you, it's just my opinion, that's all.
A cunning rogue will have a low attack rating in the beginning, but as the bard songs kick in, and Wynne casting 'Heroic Offense' on you during combat and from backstabbing bonuses, it's not really an issue.
Regarding gear, i guess you probably know by now the best gear out there. Helm of Honnleath, Felon's coat/Battledress, Red Jenny Seekers, Cadash Stompers, are all awesome. You may use Andruil's Blessing, High regard of house Dace, Harvest Fest Ring, Key 2 the City as accessories. For daggers, obviously the Rose's thorn on the main hand. The off hand dagger is upto you, Thorn of Dead Gods and Edge are great throughout the game. However, at later levels, when your cunn and crit chance are high, probably 'Duncan's dagger' and the 'Crow's Dagger (with 3 rune slots)' will provide marginally better dividends with the crit range bonus. Fang is a killer dagger available to City elves, but you have to do a bit of bug fixing for full bonus. For runes, whatever you like. Personally, i like to fill all 6 slots with Paralyzing runes. I remember i got the High Dragon to paralyze three times once, and that brief time can give you a lot of uninterrupted backstabs.
You can use a rogue however you like; may be you'll use stealth and assassinate high priority targets like mages and those pesky archers to begin with, while your party hangs back, and then your tank rushes in to draw aggro. Then you turn on tainted blade and start backstabbing. A straggler may come towards you, stun it and backstab away. Mark of death on a elite target makes it akin to a normal level enemy. If your tank is doing good, no one will actually bother you. Rogues generate comparatively less damage based threat.
So, the rave about dual dagger wielding rogues is quite justified. It has the highest possible auto attack speed, and can kill things crazy fast, more so, while backstabbing, not to speak of the utility. Assassinating mages is a cakewalk. You can even fool around with traps if you are game. Towards the end game you'll probably end up with around 70% crit chance, so you can even face enemies head on. But believe me, backstabbing is fun. Shadow striking in awakening provides even more crazy bonuses while backstabbing.
So to say, backstabbing rogues are highly efficient killing machines with no sense of fairness, and are fun to play. Just my opinion, that is.
#3
Posté 19 octobre 2012 - 02:34
TacoHero
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- Members
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That's really interesting. Thank you for offering your opinion in a post that didn't take up three pages full of crazy mathematical reason why a rogue is the best dps in the game. I'll give your ideas a try while mixing a few of mine and see how we turn out.
