475 réponses à ce sujet

[EnvyTB075]

Wow, so because its convention that means its perfectly ok.






NO.

[JeffZero]

Hey now. That's her home down there.

She was born on Thessia, you know.

Even you are part Thessian.

[David7204]

Third, this really seems to be a complaint about a fundamental fact of all fiction. All storytelling.

Stories have characters. Sometimes you're not going to like those characters. That's really just the end of it.

Just because Mass Effect is a video game doesn't mean it's somehow obligated to try and (pointlessly) avoid that fact.

[grey_wind]

David7204 wrote...

Second of all, characters lightly reviewing the events of previous installments is practically ubiquitous to sequels. So if you think that's uncommon, I guess maybe you've just never read a sequel before or something.

And if it was handled well, nobody would be complaining. Thinking about it, Javik was actually the perfect excuse they needed when they had to rehash plot points, because actually explaining them to Javik fits the narrative. Too bad he was DLC....
Vega's ignorance is mind-numbingly absurd for an Alliance Marine being considered for the N7 programme, and the in-your-face way the crew keeps bringing up plot points is cringe-worthy most of the time. ME3 does an awful job of "lightly" reviewing events.

Modifié par grey_wind, 18 octobre 2012 - 05:44 .

[UrgentArchengel]

Liara aparrently believes that the Asari are the best race in the galaxy.

[MegaSovereign]

xMellowhype wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

Liara caring about her home planet which, unlike Shepard, she actually grew up in?

SHE IS SOO ANNOYING.

Garrus cares about Palaven.  Did he complain for one second? Did Wrex? Or Tali? Hell even Joker mentions his family being surrounded by Reapers and he doens't even let his frustrations and sadness be let known for more than 15 seconds.

What's she expecting?  That Thessia isn't going to burn like Earth, Sur'Kesh, Palaven or Tuchanka?

 

.
She is.
.
When a character in the Normandy, I expect the
best. I expect him to be focused in the battles. Which is something
Liara clearly wasn't. I don't know if all squadmates does this, but EDI
and Javik clearly try to make Liara focus on the battle.
.
They are like "Stop it Liara, we're in a fraking battle zone, put yourself together!"

She's not a soldier, she's a scientist/information broker. You guys are trying to put characteristics that only a hardened soldier would realistically have.

And I don't know what game you guys were playing. Both Wrex and Garrus wouldn't shut up about how their people were suffering. Wrex especially since he put the Genophage issue ahead of the Reapers which should have been our main priority.

[SNascimento]

MegaSovereign wrote...

She's not a soldier, she's a scientist/information broker. You guys are trying to put characteristics that only a hardened soldier would realistically have. 

.
I agree, I said it on the OP. You should read it. 

[Argolas]

UrgentArchengel wrote...

Liara aparrently believes that the Asari are the best race in the galaxy.

Before ME1, maybe. The development of her character is one of the strongest I ever saw in a game.

[Hey]

Argolas wrote...

UrgentArchengel wrote...

Liara aparrently believes that the Asari are the best race in the galaxy.

Before ME1, maybe. The development of her character is one of the strongest I ever saw in a game.

Nice call.  She comes a long ways 

[EnvyTB075]

Argolas wrote...

UrgentArchengel wrote...

Liara aparrently believes that the Asari are the best race in the galaxy.

Before ME1, maybe. The development of her character is one of the strongest I ever saw in a game.

...yeah

[Argolas]

EnvyTB075 wrote...

Argolas wrote...

UrgentArchengel wrote...

Liara aparrently believes that the Asari are the best race in the galaxy.

Before ME1, maybe. The development of her character is one of the strongest I ever saw in a game.

...yeah

I do not think that this is the point, but if you like it, why not? You can make the development of about any character in any game, film or even book that simple if you reduce it that much.

I do know that not everyone likes the character, but if you do not like her, don´t bring her. I know this is not possible in some ME3 missions, but she is only locked in 1 story mission, so the problem is the general lack of squaddies in ME3 and not the Liara character.

[bboynexus]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

Interesting fact: the only main plot missions where you have full control of which squadmates come are Sanctuary and Earth.

Yeah, it's kind of ridiculous.

You poor soul.

Sur'Kesh?

Tuchanka?

'The Citadel II'?

Modifié par bboynexus, 18 octobre 2012 - 06:13 .

[bboynexus]

You're ****ing kidding me....

Hell, in that case, you only have ONE main mission and TWO loyalty missions in all of ME2 you can have the full roster with.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

SNascimento wrote...

 I was replaying the mission just now and damn, having that Asari with me is really irritating. The whole mission she is whinning like this:
.
Oh my goddess, my planet is burning!
Oh my goddess, my people are dying!
Oh my goddess, my city is being destroyed!
Oh my goddess, the reapers are evil!
Oh my goddess, my government lied!
Oh my goddess, my past is false!
.
And on top of all this, TIM humiliates her throwing in her face how bad a Shadow Broker she is. This makes my Shepard feels bad. Not to mention maybe if I had two soldiers in my team, I could've stopped Kai Leng.
.
And what is the point in all this? This is not a problem.  It's not. This response totally matches Liara's personality, at least from the first game. So, what am I complaining about? The lack of the choice of not bringing her to that particular mission. I wish my Shepard could just say:
.

.
Actually, the point really is that there are multiple times in ME3 that I wished my Shepard could do something that he can't. I saw a topic earlier about someone saying how he wished he could agree with some Joker's joke, like in the first game. This is another example.
.
I think ME's team lost a little the balance between giving you freedom and auto-dialogue. The latter is not bad by itself, for the most time it's ok. But there are key points where ME3 feels like it's restraining your Shepard from being your own. 

1) regarding her Shadow Broker operation. TIM knew where the original one was. He wanted that SB dead and that's why Liara got the info. Once that was done, the base wasn't safe. That ship wasn't space worthy. They were sitting ducks. Once TIM knew the location, Cerberus had infiltrated the ship and placed bugs around and learned the locations of the operatives.

2) Later Cerberus attacked the ship. Liara and Feron got away with what ever equipment on a couple of shuttles that they could fit on there. She set up on the Normandy. She basically was using what she had left.

3) When the reapers hit her network was shattered. A lot of operatives went missing.

* You must take Tali on the Rannoch missions.
* You must take Garrus on the Palaven mission.
* You must take Liara on the Thessia mission.
* There is no way you could have stopped Kai Leng -- he had plot armor and it was scripted. You could have had Javik, Shepard (Infiltrator), Vega (soldier). and your entire team and Leng would have escaped. I had Javik (dark channel maxed) with Shepard and Javik both using the prothean beam weapon V on him and it would knock his shields down, with Liara spamming warp for biotic explosions, and I had his health bar to zero and the cutscene kicked in and he got away. Give me a break. There was no way to defeat Kai Leng.

Actually the point is that they wouldn't let Shepard be angry or sad about earth, but they let Shepard be angry about Thessia. I think this is more what this is about. They didn't let you blast Hackett, the Council, Anderson, or anyone on the defense panel for sitting on their goddamned asses for three years doing nothing despite all the warnings you gave them. The writers didn't allow you to have anyone on your team record the conversations with Sovereign or Vigil.

They allowed Primarch Victus to be upset. They allowed Liara to be upset. They allowed Wreav to be vindictive. They allowed Wrex to be upset. They allowed Legion to protect his people. They allowed Shepard to speak for the Quarians. Did they allow Shepard to speak for Earth? No.

That's what this is really about. Don't hate Liara. She still essentially had faith in her government. It's also what happens when everything you believed all your life turns out to be a lie. Hate the way Shepard was written in several places. There was a lot of shoddy writing in several places.

I think what would have given a lot more gravitas to the mood is if they'd killed Anderson during the Earth evac: I honestly don't know how he escaped unless he swam for a mile or so in full gear. Then your non-earth born Shepard would have been a hell of a lot more shaken by the whole thing. Hell maybe have Sgt. Toombs (formerly corporal Toombs) leading a resistance cell - resistance cells just need competent leaders -- he heard you saved those colonists now and brought that ship to the Alliance and screwed over Cerberus but good, and he contacts you via vidcom.

Modifié par sH0tgUn jUliA, 18 octobre 2012 - 06:28 .

[Seboist]

EnvyTB075 wrote...

Argolas wrote...

UrgentArchengel wrote...

Liara aparrently believes that the Asari are the best race in the galaxy.

Before ME1, maybe. The development of her character is one of the strongest I ever saw in a game.

...yeah

QFT

She was a constantly retconned mess much like other players like Derperus,Reapers,Geth,etc.

[d-boy15]

hey... it help them to save time, instead of recording and scripting the other characters to do
her job(pull shepard up), they put only liara to do that.

anyway I still prefer how they handle it like tuchunka mission, rescue victus? take garrus and
you got extra dialog about turian culture.

[4stringwizard]

 I'm surprised nobody's brought up her robotic voice during the entire mission:

 "Oh no, my homeworld is burning."   

 "Oh no, we've lost." 

 "Oh no, my entire planet's history is a lie." 

[Seboist]

4stringwizard wrote...

 "Oh no, my entire planet's history is a lie." 

Too bad her existence isn't a lie.

[BonFire5]

SNascimento wrote...

Talking about Javik, he saves the day in the end. He is all like:
.

.
He destroying Liara's beliefs and then crushing her aboard the Normandy are pretty awesome moments that kind make the annoyance worth it.

One of the greatest pictures i've ever seen...