iakus wrote...
You're treading awfully close to "I'm happy so STFU"
Mr.House wrote...
DAO did a mucxh better job then ME3, by far. You had many choices on how to end the blight, you did not fel like biggest choice in the game was taken away from you nor forced.Biotic Sage wrote...
I don't know what to tell ya. Some people draw the line at being "railroaded into joining Cerberus," others draw the line at being "railroaded into caring about the fate of the galaxy at all." You, iakus, draw the line at being "railroaded into making a sacrifice with the player character's life." I don't happen to draw the line at any of those places, even the last one, so we will agree to disagree. It wasn't your cup of tea.
iakus wrote...
Not every ending needs to be happy. But forcing Shepard's death defeats the entire point of giving us choices. Might as well have called it Red Dead Redemption in Space.
iakus wrote...
Bioware has never Kobyashi Maru-ed the player character before. Ever. There was always a way out.
Much better. Go work for BioWare.Lizardviking wrote...
iakus wrote...
Bioware has never Kobyashi Maru-ed the player character before. Ever. There was always a way out.
I wonder how people would feel about the trilogy if the suicide mission in ME2 was a Kobyashi-Maru situation where you would get your ass kicked regardless, then in ME3 give you the option to get a "golden" ending or where Shepard flies off in the sunset with the LI in their arms.
I wonder if it would be better to give the player a no-win scenario in the middle, since it still allows the player to walk away with a victory in the end.
GT Zazzerka wrote...
Much better. Go work for BioWare.Lizardviking wrote...
iakus wrote...
Bioware has never Kobyashi Maru-ed the player character before. Ever. There was always a way out.
I wonder how people would feel about the trilogy if the suicide mission in ME2 was a Kobyashi-Maru situation where you would get your ass kicked regardless, then in ME3 give you the option to get a "golden" ending or where Shepard flies off in the sunset with the LI in their arms.
I wonder if it would be better to give the player a no-win scenario in the middle, since it still allows the player to walk away with a victory in the end.
Now.
AlanC9 wrote...
iakus wrote...
Not every ending needs to be happy. But forcing Shepard's death defeats the entire point of giving us choices. Might as well have called it Red Dead Redemption in Space.
You say that like it's a bad thing.
It's as if post-ME2, they felt there wasn't enough sadness and despair in it, so they decided to cram as much depressing crap into the third as possible.Lizardviking wrote...
But really, I still do not get Bioware's decisions or ideas behind the trilogy. Judging by ME1/2 it seems they were going for a heroic sci-fi (which there is nothing wrong with), but then they start doing this "You can't escape fate" thing in ME3. If anything, ME2 should have kicked our asses constantly through the game culminating with the suicide mission. Then ME3 should be the game where we can have our hero rise from the ashes and in the end get their happy ending. It is the reason why I personally found the ending of the third Nolan-Batman movie so great.
As it is, the moods and themes of the two first endings feels out of sync with the third.
It's outright putrid in how restrictive it is. I would greatly recommend against reading it.DeinonSlayer wrote...
Ever read "Renegade Reinterpretations," Viking? It proposes a Suicide Mission in which you will lose no less than four squadmates. "Minimized Casualties" is the achievement you can get, not "No Man Left Behind."
Ooookay...Xilizhra wrote...
It's outright putrid in how restrictive it is. I would greatly recommend against reading it.DeinonSlayer wrote...
Ever read "Renegade Reinterpretations," Viking? It proposes a Suicide Mission in which you will lose no less than four squadmates. "Minimized Casualties" is the achievement you can get, not "No Man Left Behind."
Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 22 octobre 2012 - 01:44 .
I more meant the whole story. Eliminating any possibility of Paragon outcomes and then still forcing you to play as a human? Who the hell wrote this?DeinonSlayer wrote...
Ooookay...Xilizhra wrote...
It's outright putrid in how restrictive it is. I would greatly recommend against reading it.DeinonSlayer wrote...
Ever read "Renegade Reinterpretations," Viking? It proposes a Suicide Mission in which you will lose no less than four squadmates. "Minimized Casualties" is the achievement you can get, not "No Man Left Behind."
Viking was just suggesting the Suicide Mission do something like this. There a problem with reading it as it could have been?
No idea. I linked specifically to the Suicide Mission chapter.Xilizhra wrote...
I more meant the whole story. Eliminating any possibility of Paragon outcomes and then still forcing you to play as a human? Who the hell wrote this?DeinonSlayer wrote...
Ooookay...Xilizhra wrote...
It's outright putrid in how restrictive it is. I would greatly recommend against reading it.DeinonSlayer wrote...
Ever read "Renegade Reinterpretations," Viking? It proposes a Suicide Mission in which you will lose no less than four squadmates. "Minimized Casualties" is the achievement you can get, not "No Man Left Behind."
Viking was just suggesting the Suicide Mission do something like this. There a problem with reading it as it could have been?
GT Zazzerka wrote...
It'sLizardviking wrote...
But
really, I still do not get Bioware's decisions or ideas behind the
trilogy. Judging by ME1/2 it seems they were going for a heroic sci-fi
(which there is nothing wrong with), but then they start doing this "You
can't escape fate" thing in ME3. If anything, ME2 should have kicked
our asses constantly through the game culminating with the suicide
mission. Then ME3 should be the game where we can have our hero rise
from the ashes and in the end get their happy ending. It is the reason
why I personally found the ending of the third Nolan-Batman movie so
great.
As it is, the moods and themes of the two first endings feels out of sync with the third.
as if post-ME2, they felt there wasn't enough sadness and despair in
it, so they decided to cram as much depressing crap into the third as
possible.
We should've dealt with all the bleak sh*t in ME2, then ended on a high, happy, heroic note in ME3.
I thought that was kind of a rule of thumb for stories like this.
It seems they got the system backwards.
Xilizhra wrote...
It's outright putrid in how restrictive it is. I would greatly recommend against reading it.DeinonSlayer wrote...
Ever read "Renegade Reinterpretations," Viking? It proposes a Suicide Mission in which you will lose no less than four squadmates. "Minimized Casualties" is the achievement you can get, not "No Man Left Behind."
Such a thing would be incredibly restrictive and downright idiotic were it implemented into any actual game. Who wants no option to ever be a genuinely good person at all?How so? I am not suprised hearing you say that given how paragon you usually are.
Xilizhra wrote...
Such a thing would be incredibly restrictive and downright idiotic were it implemented into any actual game. Who wants no option to ever be a genuinely good person at all?How so? I am not suprised hearing you say that given how paragon you usually are.
That's what I thought. My canon loses Legion and Jack, cures the Genophage and kills the Geth. Secondary loses Mordin, Zaeed, Thane (lost Kirrahe and Wrex in ME1), sells Legion, convinces Padok Wiks to back down, shoots Ashley, kills the Geth and loses Miranda to Kai Leng. Tertiary loses Wrex in ME1, gets No One Left Behind in ME2, makes peace with the Quarians and Geth, but has to shoot Mordin.jtav wrote...
At least two people--player's choice--should have died on the SM for believability's sake. I thought the final trilemma was reasonably well balanced. You can live--if you pay the price.
Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 22 octobre 2012 - 02:41 .
They were. Renegades could get Mordin alive and krogan working with salarians, for instance, as well as having higher EMS for saving the Collevctor base. Actually, ME3 was by far the most Renegade-friendly game in the series.Lizardviking wrote...
Xilizhra wrote...
Such a thing would be incredibly restrictive and downright idiotic were it implemented into any actual game. Who wants no option to ever be a genuinely good person at all?How so? I am not suprised hearing you say that given how paragon you usually are.
I am not going to read it nor do I have any intentions about arguing about this specific subject right now, I will just say that I believe that both moral paths should be rewarded and viable in their own way.
We're going to have to disagree, here. My canon Shep does everything (or at least mostly everything) right. Wrex lives, Council saved, everyone survives the SM, genophage cured, Quarian-Geth peace secured etc.DeinonSlayer wrote...
"Perfect" playthroughs are boring.
DeinonSlayer wrote...
Ever read "Renegade Reinterpretations," Viking? It proposes a Suicide Mission in which you will lose no less than four squadmates. "Minimized Casualties" is the achievement you can get, not "No Man Left Behind."
Canon Shep does that with Tali.GT Zazzerka wrote...
We're going to have to disagree, here. My canon Shep does everything (or at least mostly everything) right. Wrex lives, Council saved, everyone survives the SM, genophage cured, Quarian-Geth peace secured etc.DeinonSlayer wrote...
"Perfect" playthroughs are boring.
At the end, he even does one of these with Liara.
*snip*
'Everyone dies' playthroughs are fun in their own right, however.
Fair enough. I haven't read the whole story, I just thought the "mandatory casualties" thing would lead to a lot more variety.Lizardviking wrote...
DeinonSlayer wrote...
Ever read "Renegade Reinterpretations," Viking? It proposes a Suicide Mission in which you will lose no less than four squadmates. "Minimized Casualties" is the achievement you can get, not "No Man Left Behind."
I read the SM part, and while I can approve of unavoidable casualties, I must admit I find this one way too extreme.
Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 22 octobre 2012 - 02:27 .
DeinonSlayer wrote...
That's what I thought. My canon loses Legion and Jack, cures the Genophage and kills the Geth. Secondary loses Mordin, Zaeed, Thane (lost Kirrahe and Wrex in ME1), sells Legion, convinces Padok Wiks to back down, shoots Ashley, kills the Geth and loses Miranda to Kai Leng. Tertiary loses Wrex in ME1, gets No One Left Behind in ME2, makes peace with the Quarians and Geth, but has to shoot Mordin.jtav wrote...
At least two people--player's choice--should have died on the SM for believability's sake. I thought the final trilemma was reasonably well balanced. You can live--if you pay the price.
"Perfect" playthroughs are boring.
Retour en haut