3855 réponses à ce sujet

[The Hierophant]

Emzamination wrote...

wsandista wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

So my reading comprehension didn't fail me? I just failed to pick up on his humour, yes? Now I have to wonder to what end, you decided to annoy me with your trivial nitpicking... *sigh*

If you failed to realize that he was being humorous, that is a reading comprehension problem.

No.

Who cares, a mascara wearing pirate stole Mr.Gold's wife!

[Jerrybnsn]

Maybe if they hadn't used the "Dragon Age" name, expectations wouldn't have been so high for DA2 and 3. Origins set the bar for any sequel that would have followed after that, and it's just not fair for the other games to follow in their footsteps because they are hindered with a more ME formula in an rpg.

[WhiteThunder]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

WhiteThunder wrote...

Teddie Sage wrote...

wsandista wrote...

No it isn't.  The price of a AAA deteriorating that quickly is not a good sign. Skyrim has only fallen to $50 and it is 4 months older.

Believe what you want, I'll stick to my own beliefs. Thank you.

Fact is not a matter of opinion.  I learned that in philosophy class.

And it's a FACT that I want to play as an elf, and played as an elf in all three of my DAO playthroughs, so I'm very annoyed by Bioware's decision to ignore what I want in the Dragon Age franchise.

Boom!  Staying on topic.

Staying on topic... what's that like? 

I'm not quite sure, I've heard stories about it though.

[wsandista]

The Hierophant wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

wsandista wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

So my reading comprehension didn't fail me? I just failed to pick up on his humour, yes? Now I have to wonder to what end, you decided to annoy me with your trivial nitpicking... *sigh*

If you failed to realize that he was being humorous, that is a reading comprehension problem.

No.

Who cares, a mascara wearing pirate stole Mr.Gold's wife!

Ahh now you I missed.

[upsettingshorts]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

I wouldn't trust EA's marketing team to come near any game of mine with a 39 and 1/2 foot long pole with their juvenile, ineffective and sophmoric attempts, but having someone with sales experience (and not marketing) addressing the fans may be a better route. Companies forget all too often they sell ideas just as often as they sell products, there just isn't a crystal clear sticker price.

Just popping back in here to note that any time this thread or any other wants to go off topic into a "David Silverman made me roll my eyes on a regular basis" thread, I'd be all for that.

[MorningBird]

LobselVith8 wrote...
Considering my Surana Warden was raised in a society that worships only one god: no.

No atheism? Yet there are options to express atheist views in Origins and Awakening, as I pointed out.

Only, I would argue that they're not actually Atheist views.  You could certainly choose to take it that way, but the distinction is hardly black and white, and DG has specified that they were never intended to be interpreted as 'Atheist' dialogue options.  At least, that's what I gathered from my reading of that post! XD

Your Surana wasn't Andrastian, but they did believe in the Creators, so this point... doesn't really support Atheism? (Unless I misread your post! XD)

As an elf, your Surana can resent the Chantry for what they did to their people and culture (I'm assuming, correct me if I'm wrong!)  From the perspective of my CE (who was barely Andrastian) the Chantry could be condemnable for the same reasons.  Neither seem to be acting out of Atheism.

Telling Leliana that Andraste was only a woman isn't really a sound arguement for the presence of Atheism either.  You can believe in the Maker while still maintaining that Andraste was just a woman (or mage.)

As for the line about Justice, I'll have to take your word on that one.  I've only ever played Origins (and Awakening) as an elf, so I have no idea if that's a race-specific option or present for humans as well! XD

LobselVith8 wrote...
Let's address the problem here: Hawke is religiously Andrastian, without giving me a choice in the matter.

Fair enough!

LobselVith8 wrote...
Re: Feynriel, What are you talking about? He can't believe in the Creators because he wants a relationship with his father, despite his dialogue confirming he believes in the Dalish gods? And he doesn't surrender his religious views when he heads to Tevinter.

Sorry, I admit the way I worded that was probably confusing. XD

I wasn't arguing that Feynriel couldn't believe in the Creators, I merely questioned how 'devote' he was in his beliefs, considering where he was raised and how troubling his upbringing was.  Personally, I think Feynriel was a confused young boy trying to find a place of belonging, and that his desire to put his faith in the Creators stemmed from a need to assimilate/belong/survive amongst the Dalish rather than sincere belief in their existence (thus the comparison to Pol.)

However, as interesting as Feynriel is as a character, I think this is a bit OT. XD Feel free to add/comment, but I think I'm going to leave this part behind if I post in here again.

Modifié par MorningBird, 22 octobre 2012 - 12:27 .

[LobselVith8]

Given the plot of Inquisition, I think it would have been interesting to explore the world though the eyes of a Dalish mage. How would a Dalish protagonist see Tevinter, what would he think about Orlais, how would he react to the Mage-Templar War, what would his response be to the possible Dalish Boon? Could the Dalish protagonist be kwitatch haderach of the People?

I can imagine the replay value with the addition of Origins for the Elves, the Dwarves, and the Kossith. Opportunities to see Thedas though the lens of another culture. I don't think the same range will be available with the "human only" approach.

[Tarathelion]

LinksOcarina wrote...

Tarathelion wrote...

Yes thay have talent but they don't seem to have resources to make games they would like to make. They usually just do games for other developers/publishers like Bethesda with Fallout. Project Eternity is hopefully gonna be a good game but not necessarly a commercial success. Its not gonna be a Triple A game, its more like a niche game. They got over 4 milions to do it. The Witcher 2 cost around 10 milions to do in Poland where work cost are significantly cheaper. A bioware game is probably much more expensive to make. So we need to sdjust our expectations

Obsidian is almost bankrupt, honestly. A while ago they had to cancel a game for future release and delayed the
South Park title because they cou;dn't afford it.

Project Eternity may turn them into Double Fine in some ways, a private company making small games, which they should do. That doesn't make them good games, but that does keep them alive.

Hell, I did number crunching on this. A really good new IP, if its lucky, can get around 500,000 copies sold. With 72,000+ confirmed for project eternity, that is roughly 12% of the average that good  B-games make, like Kingdoms of Amalur, Dishonored, Binary Domain, and so forth. Now I say B-games because they are not AAA titles  that are untested, not bad games of course.

The reason I bring this up, is because the gaming world is facing a big change, where the second alternative for "big budget indie games" has shown itself. Make no mistake, Kickstarter is good but it is moving forward by looking back. If you pitched an isometric POV game for $2 million dollars, no publisher will take it on because there is such small return on investment for them it's pointless to do so. 

Much like the movie industry, publishers need to learn one thing, and that is to take a risk on games that won't be a major hit. Ironically EA is one of the few to do that so far with their partners program (and I would argue that Mass Effect 3 is less mainstream than people give credit, but thats another debate) and other companies,like Valve, Atlus, Aksys, NIS, and so forth have done a lot to push that as well. Of course, smaller dev teams like Obsidian need to realize that sometimes, you need to work with the publishers and realize that they are valuable in this industry.

It will eventually right itself, but publishers and developers need to work in harmony and need to work independently, so Kickstarter will help that relationship improve, if they both allow it.

And this ties into a human protagonist, because you got to remember how BioWare is story driven like most Light RPGs. You can't control everything the character is or else it would be Skyrim, would be Fallout. People need to realize that BioWare has done this since Baldurs Gate, to varying degrees. So if its a human you play as, the reason is for the story. Origins worked the way it did because the Origin stories made the beginning of the game, and small details in the middle, to shape a narrative as a blank slate. It wouldn't work in Hawke's story, and we shall see if it works in the Inquisitor story. But in the end, BioWare has made it clear that they want to tell a story, and they have the backing to do so. 


that does not make it more or less of an RPG,it just makes it a differently focused RPG over what Project Eternity is planning to be. 

I actually agrree with you mostly. Project Eternity, like i said, will be most likely a niche game.   Its gonna be a good game though (in my opinion). Having said that i doubt  it will be a commercial success, (i don't think it will be a huge hit.) Its not gonna be product easy to sell to new people becouse of its old school look People like me who played old rpg like baldurs and ID will enjoy them. That element of nostalgia assiosated with old hits has been captured by obsidian project and cos of that it was a massive success on kick starter. Will it allow  them to join the likes of bioware or bethesda or even a cd projekt? (small comapany but independent one with resonable budged). Don't think so. As you said, doing a games like that is a bit of step back and i don't advocate that for bioware. For the record i actually enyoy Bioware games and i'm on board with the direction they are taking.

[The Hierophant]

wsandista wrote...

The Hierophant wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

wsandista wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

So my reading comprehension didn't fail me? I just failed to pick up on his humour, yes? Now I have to wonder to what end, you decided to annoy me with your trivial nitpicking... *sigh*

If you failed to realize that he was being humorous, that is a reading comprehension problem.

No.

Who cares, a mascara wearing pirate stole Mr.Gold's wife!

Ahh now you I missed.

It's fascinating how people can't pick up on obvious wit though.

[Palipride47]

Palipride47 wrote...

 


We've got atheism and Bioware sales figures going on in this thread, and both are totally off topic. I helped start it, and I'm trying to end it before the thread gets locked (again!). Bioware created this thread specifically for people to talk about a human only protag, and I'd like to keep it for them. Let us rage somewhere else. 

Might have to keep using this.....

[Wifflebottom]

Multiple races isn't the reason I play Dragon Age, most people that played Origins played human anyways, less played elf, and even fewer played dwarf. I like the decision to go with only human because I feel that putting in race choice and making it matter enough would be kind of a double edged sword, you could feel very unique and be acknowledged as a different race but that's content that players who decide to play only one of the races would miss out on. I care more about companions and story decisions rather than race choice.

[The Hierophant]

My goodness Mr.Gold's wife is a treacherous w****?

[Emzamination]

The Hierophant wrote...

It's fascinating how people can't pick up on obvious wit though.

Ikr? I Blame Diversity.

Modifié par Emzamination, 22 octobre 2012 - 12:35 .

[Palipride47]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Given the plot of Inquisition, I think it would have been interesting to explore the world though the eyes of a Dalish mage. How would a Dalish protagonist see Tevinter, what would he think about Orlais, how would he react to the Mage-Templar War, what would his response be to the possible Dalish Boon? Could the Dalish protagonist be kwitatch haderach of the People? 

I can imagine the replay value with the addition of Origins for the Elves, the Dwarves, and the Kossith. Opportunities to see Thedas though the lens of another culture. I don't think the same range will be available with the "human only" approach.

I think that is why they brought in backgrounds, as sort of a compromise.

I want people who see me use blood magic to freak. I want people who know me as a Templar to either be hostile or nice (depending on how they feel about me). I want it to have MORE reactivity than even the race thing did. Because only then will that do some justice to the people who chose elves and dwarves to play (even if they were few, they shouldn't be dismissed as not-noteworthy)

[MorningBird]

Palipride47 wrote...

Palipride47 wrote...

 *snip*


We've got atheism and Bioware sales figures going on in this thread, and both are totally off topic. I helped start it, and I'm trying to end it before the thread gets locked (again!). Bioware created this thread specifically for people to talk about a human only protag, and I'd like to keep it for them. Let us rage somewhere else. 

Might have to keep using this.....

I wouldn't bother.

I mean, I didn't see you post this until I finished writing my long-arse post above because I was typing. :x  I think you've made your point.

Modifié par MorningBird, 22 octobre 2012 - 12:37 .

[LobselVith8]

MorningBird,

Gaider didn't even remember the atheist dialogue options. He conceded the dialogue options mentioned were atheist options. He admitted the fans remembered better than he did because of the time gap. Andrastian society believes in only one god: the Maker. Alienage elves have almost no knowledge of the Creators. Instead of you trying to tell me who my Surana Warden is, let's try to stay on topic.

Back on topic, I really don't like how the Andrastian Human protagonists have been written. I don't see the entertainment value. Cousland was intended to start off as a racist (according to the developers, when they addressed the elven scene in the pantry), and Hawke was tiresome. I prefer the non-Andrastian protagonists, who I felt were much more interesting and intriguing over their human counterparts.

[WhiteThunder]

Wifflebottom wrote...

Multiple races isn't the reason I play Dragon Age, most people that played Origins played human anyways, less played elf, and even fewer played dwarf. I like the decision to go with only human because I feel that putting in race choice and making it matter enough would be kind of a double edged sword, you could feel very unique and be acknowledged as a different race but that's content that players who decide to play only one of the races would miss out on. I care more about companions and story decisions rather than race choice.

You know, it seems a bit of a double edged sword to have the player's choices affect the story, because that's content that players who decide to play only one of the paths would miss out on.

We all saw how well it worked when they streamlined that unnecessary aspect of the game in Dragon Age 2!

[Morroian]

Wifflebottom wrote...

Multiple races isn't the reason I play Dragon Age, most people that played Origins played human anyways, less played elf, and even fewer played dwarf. I like the decision to go with only human because I feel that putting in race choice and making it matter enough would be kind of a double edged sword, you could feel very unique and be acknowledged as a different race but that's content that players who decide to play only one of the races would miss out on. I care more about companions and story decisions rather than race choice.

There is definitely the potential that story depth would be sacrificed for breadth by having racial choice. 

[Palipride47]

MorningBird wrote...

Palipride47 wrote...

Palipride47 wrote...

 *snip*


We've got atheism and Bioware sales figures going on in this thread, and both are totally off topic. I helped start it, and I'm trying to end it before the thread gets locked (again!). Bioware created this thread specifically for people to talk about a human only protag, and I'd like to keep it for them. Let us rage somewhere else. 

Might have to keep using this.....

I wouldn't bother.

I mean, I didn't see you post this until I finished my long-arse post above because I was typing. :x  I think you've made your point.

Yeah, other people finishing and posting while I'm still writing, story of my life on the BSN.....

[wsandista]

The Hierophant wrote...

It's fascinating how people can't pick up on obvious wit though.

Agreed, just like Namor can't accept the fact that he sucks.

[Palipride47]

LobselVith8 wrote...

MorningBird,

Gaider didn't even remember the atheist dialogue options. He conceded the dialogue options mentioned were atheist options. He admitted the fans remembered better than he did because of the time gap. Andrastian society believes in only one god: the Maker. Alienage elves have almost no knowledge of the Creators. Instead of you trying to tell me who my Surana Warden is, let's try to stay on topic.

Back on topic, I really don't like how the Andrastian Human protagonists have been written. I don't see the entertainment value. Cousland was intended to start off as a racist (according to the developers, when they addressed the elven scene in the pantry), and Hawke was tiresome. I prefer the non-Andrastian protagonists, who I felt were much more interesting and intriguing over their human counterparts.  

Cousland was supposed to be racist? Why? WHY WOULD THEY DO THAT?!

Also, yes, the bolded is why I was initially disappointed. However, if they can make my protag Andrastian but interesting, I'll live. 

Modifié par Palipride47, 22 octobre 2012 - 12:39 .

[Teddie Sage]

@Lobssel: I do recall telling Mother Mallol that my character didn't believe in the Maker. So this makes him an atheist in some ways. Anyways, my Hawke sounded atheist to me since I never selected the kind or diplomatic options. The only time he expressed "Maker" or "Andraste" was through curses.

Modifié par Teddie Sage, 22 octobre 2012 - 12:39 .

[wsandista]

Palipride47 wrote...

Palipride47 wrote...

 


We've got atheism and Bioware sales figures going on in this thread, and both are totally off topic. I helped start it, and I'm trying to end it before the thread gets locked (again!). Bioware created this thread specifically for people to talk about a human only protag, and I'd like to keep it for them. Let us rage somewhere else. 

Might have to keep using this.....

You should probably post it every 2.4569 minutes for good measure.

[Palipride47]

wsandista wrote...

You should probably post it every 2.4569 minutes for good measure.

Yeah, got it. <_< Thanks for including the picture too. 

Modifié par Palipride47, 22 octobre 2012 - 12:43 .

[Teddie Sage]

Off topic, but could people stop quoting each other when we can read stuff on the same page?