328 réponses à ce sujet

[Hatchetman77]

I liked sword and board warrior in DA2.  It was a sped up version of DA:O without being too over the top.     

[Malsumis]

Best case scenario, look at everything you did with combat in DA2...

And don't do that.

Not necessarily go back DA:O(which I prefer), just don't do anything like what we got in DA2.

[johndud0]

Hatchetman77 wrote...

I liked sword and board warrior in DA2.  It was a sped up version of DA:O without being too over the top.     

Sword and board? You play Torchlight 2 don't you?

[Pauravi]

TurianFrigate wrote...

Please Bioware give us a combat system that looks real like in DAO.

Hahah, this gave me a really good LOL.

Combat in DAO wasn't realistic, it was just slow.  The 2 slowly executed animations were the opposite side of the unrealistic spectrum as DA2's whirling-dervish action, but at least DA2 was exciting.

I don't want DA2's combat back, but I certainly don't want what DAO brought.

Aulis Vaara wrote...

How? DA2's combat was way more
boring, in my humble opinion. There was no thinking involved, no
planning, just trying to do as much damage as you can, especially for
mages, who should just specialise in area of effect spells to kill
everything in seconds.

That's funny, that's how I'd describe DAO's combat.  Cone of Cold, shatter shatter shatter, rinse, repeat.
I found the battles much more repetitive in Origins, personally.

Bfler wrote...

If you look at the guys at medieval performances or spectacles it looks similar to Origins speed wise.

Hahaha, you're kidding, right?
In DAO they swung 2-Handers as if they weighed 25 lbs, instead of the 7-9 lbs they actually weighed.

Modifié par Pauravi, 24 octobre 2012 - 07:21 .

[DaringMoosejaw]

johndud0 wrote...

Hatchetman77 wrote...

I liked sword and board warrior in DA2.  It was a sped up version of DA:O without being too over the top.     

Sword and board? You play Torchlight 2 don't you?

First heard that nomenclature on WoW, myself.

I'm fond of the sword & board myself. It's always refreshing when they let you do damage instead of forcing you to be a tank.

As for the combat - I agree, DA:O's combat got excruciantingly slow at times - the SHUFFLING, sitting there as each second felt like an eternity while your character tried and failed to find your opponent's hitbox like a teenager with his first girlfriend. DA2, however, got repetitive - mindlessly smashing A got old pretty damn quick, especially when you had people rappelling off of rooftops every time you went to the store.

Modifié par DaringMoosejaw, 24 octobre 2012 - 06:58 .

[Pauravi]

azerSheppard wrote...

You must mean the other way around, as DA][ felt like i was not hitting at all, just swinging like a madman without impact, as opposed to DA:O, where every attack counted, EVEN as a rogue.

Which game did you play first if I may ask, imo people who played DAII first often didn't enjoy DA:O at all, expecting an action game like DAII.

I played Origins first, practically the day it came out, and I liked the DA2 combat better.  DAO feels boring now; I don't think the weapon swings feel weighty in Origins, just slow.  And DA2 is not an action game, nor did it feel like one to me.  All the same combat mechanics are there as in Origins -- pausing, command queing, etc.

[Pauravi]

Pinely wrote...

Origins did not offer realistic looking combat. Greatswords looked completely absurd in Origins, as though your character were swinging a tree branch and not a bladed weapon. Sword and Shield was better, but regularly failed to look fluid. Mage staffs consisted of nothing but a repetitive "stabbing at air" motion as stuff shot out the end. Daggers worked rather well, as did dual swords, and I think Archery is hard to get wrong. Not to mention the absurdity of your characters lazily moving between enemies. No one was seemingly capable of running towards an enemy, it was more a slow hobble.


DA2 took an artistic license, but the result is combat that feels more like fighting and less like stage fighting. If they want to tone down some of the aspects of DA2's combat, that's fine. But, let's not pretend that Origins was some paragon of realistic combat. It wasn't and I don't want to return to that awkward and plodding combat simply because a couple malcontents instinctively hate everything DA2.

Endorsed.

[Ridwan]

Glad to see many others liked the faster paced combat system in DA 2.

[Harle Cerulean]

1) if you think DAO's combat was "realistic", you have no idea what you're talking about
2) If you ask for realistic combat in a game, you have no idea what you're talking about.

Real combat isn't fun or glorious. It's messy, painful, and traumatic. You don't want realistic combat. If you got it, you wouldn't enjoy it; instead you'd be making therapy appointments. Let's leave the word 'realistic' behind and use mroe appropriate terms, hmm?

That said, DA:O's combat was slow and tedious. DA2's combat may have been over the top, but at least it was fun, and not a time-consuming slog I started replacing with the "killallhostiles" command just to escape the monotony.

[Biotic Sage]

AlexJK wrote...

First three posts made the thread here really:
- I want DAO combat!
- I want DA2 combat!
- Can we have the best of both worlds please?

If only all topics were like this.

End thread.  Thread over in my opinion.  I stopped here.  Matter of taste.

Modifié par Biotic Sage, 24 octobre 2012 - 09:04 .

[Malsumis]

Harle Cerulean wrote...
DA2's combat may have been over the top, but at least it was fun, and not a time-consuming slog I started replacing with the "killallhostiles" command just to escape the monotony.

No it wasn't. It was MMO trash mobs to pad content, with rushed encounter design. I can think two encounters in the whole game that weren't this. The lyrium creature in the deep roads, and the dragon encounter at the mines. And the dragon was the only fight in the entire game, where my party was at risk of being wiped.

Either do the RtwP properly with interesting encounters and intelligent design, or go full asction like ME. The action hybrid speed style of DA2 was awful.

Or maybe do a complete reversal and go Turn based?

[Kidd]

DaringMoosejaw wrote...

As for the combat - I agree, DA:O's combat got excruciantingly slow at times - the SHUFFLING, sitting there as each second felt like an eternity while your character tried and failed to find your opponent's hitbox like a teenager with his first girlfriend.

I feel the biggest issue was the extreme respect your characters treated the enemies with. Finished DAO with a melee character just a few days ago. I certainly didn't even try to keep track of how many times I'd want to intercept an enemy who was trying to run past my character, put her in the enemy's path, clicked Attack, only to have my dear tank start tip toeing around the approaching enemy and not land a single blow as they run past. It's utter bullcrap >_<

Yeah I know it's technically related to the shuffling, but the general shuffling itself isn't as aggravating as that one instance imho =) Of course, since I was playing a tank, my short-term memory is biased to the problems that character found. Closing attacks were a very functional band-aid, methinks =)

[Peranor]

Harle Cerulean wrote...

1) if you think DAO's combat was "realistic", you have no idea what you're talking about
2) If you ask for realistic combat in a game, you have no idea what you're talking about.

Real combat isn't fun or glorious. It's messy, painful, and traumatic. You don't want realistic combat. If you got it, you wouldn't enjoy it; instead you'd be making therapy appointments. Let's leave the word 'realistic' behind and use mroe appropriate terms, hmm?

That said, DA:O's combat was slow and tedious. DA2's combat may have been over the top, but at least it was fun, and not a time-consuming slog I started replacing with the "killallhostiles" command just to escape the monotony.

I think that when people say "realistic looking" combat they are referring to the animations and general movement and speed of the battle. I'm pretty sure they don't mean that they want the protagonist to have a psychological breakdown in the middle of the battlefield if things get messy.

[Zubie]

Harle Cerulean wrote...


That said, DA:O's combat was slow and tedious. DA2's combat may have been over the top, but at least it was fun, and not a time-consuming slog I started replacing with the "killallhostiles" command just to escape the monotony.

How was DA2's combat not monotone? You just ran in an AoE'd the hell out of all the mobs and went on to the next fight, even on Nightmare. This worked for every single fight. Only a few bosses forced you to change your tactics a bit.

[AppealToReason]

DaringMoosejaw wrote...

As for the combat - I agree, DA:O's combat got excruciantingly slow at times - the SHUFFLING, sitting there as each second felt like an eternity while your character tried and failed to find your opponent's hitbox like a teenager with his first girlfriend. DA2, however, got repetitive - mindlessly smashing A got old pretty damn quick, especially when you had people rappelling off of rooftops every time you went to the store.

1) Did that ever remind me a of funny story from grade 11.

2) I set DA2 to auto attack and it functioned like a fast paced DAO that wasn't painfully slow and awkward, especially if you wanted to change targets.

[Todd23]

MillKill wrote...

Todd23 wrote...

MillKill wrote...

This is a world of magic, potions, demons, dragons, lyrium, and monsters. Any attempt to constrain combat animations due to realism at this point is arbitrary and inconsistent.

Flashy moves are at least interesting to look at and increased mobility keeps combat from dragging on longer than necessary.

... But, all those things you listed are real. 

Magic, potions, demons, dragons, lyrium, and monsters are real?

Yes.  ... Except lyrium.  That's just silly.

[Sandy]

Pauravi wrote...

Pinely wrote...

Origins did not offer realistic looking combat. Greatswords looked completely absurd in Origins, as though your character were swinging a tree branch and not a bladed weapon. Sword and Shield was better, but regularly failed to look fluid. Mage staffs consisted of nothing but a repetitive "stabbing at air" motion as stuff shot out the end. Daggers worked rather well, as did dual swords, and I think Archery is hard to get wrong. Not to mention the absurdity of your characters lazily moving between enemies. No one was seemingly capable of running towards an enemy, it was more a slow hobble.


DA2 took an artistic license, but the result is combat that feels more like fighting and less like stage fighting. If they want to tone down some of the aspects of DA2's combat, that's fine. But, let's not pretend that Origins was some paragon of realistic combat. It wasn't and I don't want to return to that awkward and plodding combat simply because a couple malcontents instinctively hate everything DA2.

Endorsed.

/Signed

[Plaintiff]

Hanz54321 wrote...
siezure inducing

DA2's combat was so bad that it literally almost killed me, you guys!

[Sylvius the Mad]

Pinely wrote...

DA2 took an artistic license, but the result is combat that feels more like fighting and less like stage fighting. If they want to tone down some of the aspects of DA2's combat, that's fine. But, let's not pretend that Origins was some paragon of realistic combat. It wasn't and I don't want to return to that awkward and plodding combat simply because a couple malcontents instinctively hate everything DA2.

I genuinely think DA2's combat is too fast to be enjoyable.  I would prefer to be able to take the time to watch my characters fight, rather than having everything happen so quickly that it's impossibel to follow the action of more than one character at a time.

And why was the Mage waving his staff around like a lunatic?  You deride the "stabbing at air" motion, but that's how guns work - the staff auto-attack was basically gunplay.

Modifié par Sylvius the Mad, 24 octobre 2012 - 09:45 .

[Sylvius the Mad]

Harle Cerulean wrote...

That said, DA:O's combat was slow and tedious. DA2's combat may have been over the top, but at least it was fun

It wasn't fun at all.  DA2's combat was hectic.  I don't want hectic.

Under no circumstances is frantic action pleasant.

[Icinix]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Harle Cerulean wrote...

That said, DA:O's combat was slow and tedious. DA2's combat may have been over the top, but at least it was fun

It wasn't fun at all.  DA2's combat was hectic.  I don't want hectic.

Under no circumstances is frantic action pleasant.

Indeed.

I did not find it fun or entertaining to watch.

DAO while slow - I was at least interested in the animation and enjoyed the combat far more. DA2 looked like a squillion other games I've played a thousand times with the same level of boredom on my face.

[Nerevar-as]

People who think DA:O combat is slow would fall asleep playing Drakensang.

I´m now playing First Templar, and special attacks look badass without usually looking stupid. The female character also does some pointless movements, but not the rogue cartwheels when taking a step gets the same result.

[Sidney]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...
It wasn't fun at all.  DA2's combat was hectic.  I don't want hectic.

Under no circumstances is frantic action pleasant.

Unless you are transfixed by shiny objects and are distracted by motion the combat played out mechcnically the same as DAO's.  Heck, it was mechcnically the same as BG2's which was also "faster" than DAO's but people don't whine about that.

DAO wasn't less hectic than DA2. In fact in general it was less hectic for the player because when you told your party to attack X you usually didn't have to reconsider that baseed on the 2 minutes it takes fort the attacks to actually begin. I spent a lot more time micromanging in DAO not out of some tactical considerations - this never existed a whit in DAO - but trying to fight the game engine to actually do what I asked it to do OR trying to correct for something it didn't do that I had asked it to do.

[Sidney]

Nerevar-as wrote...

People who think DA:O combat is slow would fall asleep playing Drakensang.

I´m now playing First Templar, and special attacks look badass without usually looking stupid. The female character also does some pointless movements, but not the rogue cartwheels when taking a step gets the same result.

I think DAO combat was slow and I play turn-based games all the time. The problem wasn't that you want instant gratification it is that the game bordered on on-responsive to your wishes in combat.