257 réponses à ce sujet

[Reth Shepherd]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Reth Shepherd wrote...

Yeah, Destroy isn't all that great either; though it's certainly better than becoming the next Saren. Think about it. What was the one biggest chance for peace between organic and synthetic life? The living example of two peoples who had done just that. Destroy the Geth and you not only murdered that entire race, you just got rid of the one example of peace and co-operation you had. Starboy wins again, because he just 'proved' that getting along was impossible.

Anyway, so far as I'm concerned, all three colors are cr*p, with green being by far the worst. (There's a reason my chosen ending is Marauder Shields/headcanon.) At the very least, you just brainwashed the galaxy. At the worst, you just handed everyone over to the Reapers. Do you remember this quote? "The relationship is symbiotic, organic and machine intertwined, a union of flesh and steel. The strength of both, the weaknesses of neither. I am a vision of the future, Shepard, the evolution of all organic life. This is our destiny. Join Sovereign, and experience a true rebirth." Saren Arterius. Shepard called him out for Synthesis. 'Listen to yourself! Sovereign's controlling you, you're Indoctrinated! The Reapers are LYING to you!' ...and we are supposed to believe Star-kid when he spouts the exact same cr*p to us? Never!

Catalyst is still following his programming(stated by Leviathan), hence he's a shacled AI which means he can't lie(stated by EDI), hence he's telling the truth about the options.

Following programming =/= shackled. It merely means that he is still following the original path, not that he is bound to it. Btw, if he's telling the truth about Synthesis, what was the point of stopping Saren, who wanted to bring about the exact same thing? He was given the exact same description of what would happen; why should we believe Starkid and not Saren/Sovereign?

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Reth Shepherd wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Reth Shepherd wrote...

Yeah, Destroy isn't all that great either; though it's certainly better than becoming the next Saren. Think about it. What was the one biggest chance for peace between organic and synthetic life? The living example of two peoples who had done just that. Destroy the Geth and you not only murdered that entire race, you just got rid of the one example of peace and co-operation you had. Starboy wins again, because he just 'proved' that getting along was impossible.

Anyway, so far as I'm concerned, all three colors are cr*p, with green being by far the worst. (There's a reason my chosen ending is Marauder Shields/headcanon.) At the very least, you just brainwashed the galaxy. At the worst, you just handed everyone over to the Reapers. Do you remember this quote? "The relationship is symbiotic, organic and machine intertwined, a union of flesh and steel. The strength of both, the weaknesses of neither. I am a vision of the future, Shepard, the evolution of all organic life. This is our destiny. Join Sovereign, and experience a true rebirth." Saren Arterius. Shepard called him out for Synthesis. 'Listen to yourself! Sovereign's controlling you, you're Indoctrinated! The Reapers are LYING to you!' ...and we are supposed to believe Star-kid when he spouts the exact same cr*p to us? Never!

Catalyst is still following his programming(stated by Leviathan), hence he's a shacled AI which means he can't lie(stated by EDI), hence he's telling the truth about the options.

Following programming =/= shackled. It merely means that he is still following the original path, not that he is bound to it. Btw, if he's telling the truth about Synthesis, what was the point of stopping Saren, who wanted to bring about the exact same thing? He was given the exact same description of what would happen; why should we believe Starkid and not Saren/Sovereign?

Perhaps Saren was telling the truth. Anyway, Catalyst states that the Catalyst has made the possibility valid and that this cycle is ready to achieve Synthesis.

[BerzerkGene]

Space magic with horrible implications.
Riddled with problems and wrongly described as "the final evolution."

[Hanako Ikezawa]

FlamingBoy wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Again, prove it to me by polling every single gamer who finished the game before claiming that it's so.

I think you are a tad confused how sampling works

I understand sampling, but sampling everyone provides the clearest picture. Meanwhile, using a couple hundred from the same source(BSN) to represent how all players feel isn't a good way to sample.

[FlamingBoy]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

FlamingBoy wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Again, prove it to me by polling every single gamer who finished the game before claiming that it's so.

I think you are a tad confused how sampling works

I understand sampling, but sampling everyone provides the clearest picture. Meanwhile, using a couple hundred from the same source(BSN) to represent how all players feel isn't a good way to sample.

then the onus is on you to provide a source or poll from a different "place" to refute or support the claim used in his poll

[clennon8]

"I understand how sampling works, but you should sample everybody. DERP."

Modifié par clennon8, 25 octobre 2012 - 08:12 .

[Hanako Ikezawa]

BerzerkGene wrote...

Space magic with horrible implications.
Riddled with problems and wrongly described as "the final evolution."

Destroy: Genocide wrapped up in the presence of achieving peace.
Control: Possible totalitarianism under pretence of peace.
Any ending can be described terribly, but that doesn't mean it is.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

FlamingBoy wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

FlamingBoy wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Again, prove it to me by polling every single gamer who finished the game before claiming that it's so.

I think you are a tad confused how sampling works

I understand sampling, but sampling everyone provides the clearest picture. Meanwhile, using a couple hundred from the same source(BSN) to represent how all players feel isn't a good way to sample.

then the onus is on you to provide a source or poll from a different "place" to refute or support the claim used in his poll

Sadly, people will just use the argument i used on clemmon on me, so it'll be a waste of time since people have their mind set in stone on this, even if I did give them a broader spectrum of samples than only BSN.

[Reth Shepherd]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

FlamingBoy wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Again, prove it to me by polling every single gamer who finished the game before claiming that it's so.

I think you are a tad confused how sampling works

I understand sampling, but sampling everyone provides the clearest picture. Meanwhile, using a couple hundred from the same source(BSN) to represent how all players feel isn't a good way to sample.

Name one single news or gaming site where the positive comments about Synthesis have outnumbered the negative.

[Asch Lavigne]

I might have liked it better if the ending gave some sort of explanation of how the whole galaxy went "Wtf, I'm green now and part robot? And the Reapers are our friends now? Okay!" I mean they must have been confused as all hell after the Crucible went off since they didn't find out the truth behind the Reapers.

Modifié par Asch Lavigne, 25 octobre 2012 - 08:17 .

[Reth Shepherd]

Actually, here. Here is a non-BSN source of numbers; a German survey. http://www.masseffec...se.de/feedback/  17,482 people took the survey. Synthesis did not come off very well. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Reth Shepherd wrote...

Actually, here. Here is a non-BSN source of numbers; a German survey. http://www.masseffec...se.de/feedback/  17,482 people took the survey. Synthesis did not come off very well. 

I'd like to point out that this survey was done before the EC, so the numbers may have shifted. Also, those numbers are scewed because the majority whio voted believe in the Indoctrination Hypothesis which involves choosing Destroy so Shepard can "wake up".

Modifié par LDS Darth Revan, 25 octobre 2012 - 08:38 .

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Asch Lavigne wrote...

I might have liked it better if the ending gave some sort of explanation of how the whole galaxy went "Wtf, I'm green now and part robot? And the Reapers are our friends now? Okay!" I mean they must have been confused as all hell after the Crucible went off since they didn't find out the truth behind the Reapers.

Mass Effect 4 with Synthesis as your choice may do that. Also, part of Synthesis is gaining understanding of each other so maybe it just happens.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

I hate synthesis.
---------------------
What do reapers consider the pinnacle of evolution? A reaper. -- Sovereign. What does the catalyst consider the end result of evolution? Synthesis. The reapers are controlled by the Catalyst. They believe what the Catalyst is doing is correct. Therefore the pinnacle of evolution is a reaper. However, Synthesis is galaxy-wide, or make everyone and every living thing into a reaper.

The reapers tried it before but it failed because it cannot be forced, but for some reason Shepard can magically do this.

So Shepard can jump into the green beam and make every present and future life form into a galactic wide reaper, thus solving the Catalyst's problem of order vs. chaos, synthetic vs. organic, and end the harvests.

Synthesis is the Reaper's ideal solution. If you choose this, you have been indoctrinated. Put down the soma. Step away from the beam, Shepard. Oh, and step away from the blue area over to the left as well. That's indoctrination territory as well.
--------------------
In the original ending you had three choices: Destroy, Control, and Synthesis. They added Refusal in the EC just to placate people who didn't want to choose, but it is what is called "critical mission failure." Everyone in the galaxy dies except for stone age cultures.

I will pick Destroy,

or full ass out renegade Control, because if you're going to command a force like that you might as well be a tyrant and enjoy the worship just for the LOLz, and reap a world every now and then if they decide to put up any kind of resistance.

The Crucible has never docked with the Citadel before, which is what makes Synthesis possible. Catalyst states this. Also, Shepard is a combination of both organic and synthetic, so added his quintessense to a device that is so advanced that we can't even comprehend, hence why it appears as "space magic" to us, is for all we know quite practical. Catalyst has had over a billion years to think on this, while using his Reaper soution to save those he can't becase he is incapable of it at the time, so it may be as simple as 2+2=4 to him. You're free to choose what ending you want, but you don't have to insult those who feel differently than you.

I really love how the Synthesis defenders always call those who disagree with them insulting when they present a plausible argument. Please explain how what I said was insulting? Just because it disagrees with ones views and head canon on the subject of synthesis doesn't mean one's post is insulting? Logic tears Synthesis to shreds. It's all in the four paragraphs above now in italics. The title of the thread asked for "Your Opinion On Synthesis". I gave mine.

I think the Catalyst is indoctrinating you to choose it. My views on this are as plausible as yours.

Magically -- I call it magic because it violates every single principle of molecular biology and quantum mechanics. No matter how you try to spin it, you cannot get around Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle. Synthesis as the writers tried to propose it is impossible. It would be extremely unstable. Would you have the Catalyst replace God, because that's the only way Synthesis could happen.

And yes I added a little humor at the end as to which endings I choose. I always choose Destroy.

[Asch Lavigne]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Asch Lavigne wrote...

I might have liked it better if the ending gave some sort of explanation of how the whole galaxy went "Wtf, I'm green now and part robot? And the Reapers are our friends now? Okay!" I mean they must have been confused as all hell after the Crucible went off since they didn't find out the truth behind the Reapers.

Mass Effect 4 with Synthesis as your choice may do that. Also, part of Synthesis is gaining understanding of each other so maybe it just happens.

Everyone automatically knows? Don't buy it. If the Crucible could create that sort of auto knowledge then the whole "the cycle will continue when your kids build synthetics" via the Destory option, could be altered accordingly.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Asch Lavigne wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Asch Lavigne wrote...

I might have liked it better if the ending gave some sort of explanation of how the whole galaxy went "Wtf, I'm green now and part robot? And the Reapers are our friends now? Okay!" I mean they must have been confused as all hell after the Crucible went off since they didn't find out the truth behind the Reapers.

Mass Effect 4 with Synthesis as your choice may do that. Also, part of Synthesis is gaining understanding of each other so maybe it just happens.

Everyone automatically knows? Don't buy it. If the Crucible could create that sort of auto knowledge then the whole "the cycle will continue when your kids build synthetics" via the Destory option, could be altered accordingly.

Except in Destroy, we do not all get enhanced and the Reapers aren't around to explain it.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

I hate synthesis.
---------------------
What do reapers consider the pinnacle of evolution? A reaper. -- Sovereign. What does the catalyst consider the end result of evolution? Synthesis. The reapers are controlled by the Catalyst. They believe what the Catalyst is doing is correct. Therefore the pinnacle of evolution is a reaper. However, Synthesis is galaxy-wide, or make everyone and every living thing into a reaper.

The reapers tried it before but it failed because it cannot be forced, but for some reason Shepard can magically do this.

So Shepard can jump into the green beam and make every present and future life form into a galactic wide reaper, thus solving the Catalyst's problem of order vs. chaos, synthetic vs. organic, and end the harvests.

Synthesis is the Reaper's ideal solution. If you choose this, you have been indoctrinated. Put down the soma. Step away from the beam, Shepard. Oh, and step away from the blue area over to the left as well. That's indoctrination territory as well.
--------------------
In the original ending you had three choices: Destroy, Control, and Synthesis. They added Refusal in the EC just to placate people who didn't want to choose, but it is what is called "critical mission failure." Everyone in the galaxy dies except for stone age cultures.

I will pick Destroy,

or full ass out renegade Control, because if you're going to command a force like that you might as well be a tyrant and enjoy the worship just for the LOLz, and reap a world every now and then if they decide to put up any kind of resistance.

The Crucible has never docked with the Citadel before, which is what makes Synthesis possible. Catalyst states this. Also, Shepard is a combination of both organic and synthetic, so added his quintessense to a device that is so advanced that we can't even comprehend, hence why it appears as "space magic" to us, is for all we know quite practical. Catalyst has had over a billion years to think on this, while using his Reaper soution to save those he can't becase he is incapable of it at the time, so it may be as simple as 2+2=4 to him. You're free to choose what ending you want, but you don't have to insult those who feel differently than you.

I really love how the Synthesis defenders always call those who disagree with them insulting when they present a plausible argument. Please explain how what I said was insulting? Just because it disagrees with ones views and head canon on the subject of synthesis doesn't mean one's post is insulting? Logic tears Synthesis to shreds. It's all in the four paragraphs above now in italics. The title of the thread asked for "Your Opinion On Synthesis". I gave mine.

I think the Catalyst is indoctrinating you to choose it. My views on this are as plausible as yours.

Magically -- I call it magic because it violates every single principle of molecular biology and quantum mechanics. No matter how you try to spin it, you cannot get around Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle. Synthesis as the writers tried to propose it is impossible. It would be extremely unstable. Would you have the Catalyst replace God, because that's the only way Synthesis could happen.

And yes I added a little humor at the end as to which endings I choose. I always choose Destroy.

This is what I found insulting: "Put down the soma." assuming all those who support Synthesis are intoxicated. Other than that, all I did was try to give an explanation and  state that you're free to believe what you want. That's everyone's right.

[FlamingBoy]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

FlamingBoy wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

FlamingBoy wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Again, prove it to me by polling every single gamer who finished the game before claiming that it's so.

I think you are a tad confused how sampling works

I understand sampling, but sampling everyone provides the clearest picture. Meanwhile, using a couple hundred from the same source(BSN) to represent how all players feel isn't a good way to sample.

then the onus is on you to provide a source or poll from a different "place" to refute or support the claim used in his poll

Sadly, people will just use the argument i used on clemmon on me, so it'll be a waste of time since people have their mind set in stone on this, even if I did give them a broader spectrum of samples than only BSN.

so you accept that your argument is worthless... hate to use such a negative word but objectively thats literally how it reads

Edit: it probably was not your intention though, but still!

Modifié par FlamingBoy, 25 octobre 2012 - 10:09 .

[Hanako Ikezawa]

FlamingBoy wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...
Sadly, people will just use the argument i used on clemmon on me, so it'll be a waste of time since people have their mind set in stone on this, even if I did give them a broader spectrum of samples than only BSN.

so you accept that your argument is worthless... hate to use such a negative word but objectively thats literally how it reads

Edit: it probably was not your intention though, but still!

People have their hearts and minds set to the point that nothing will change them, so sadly that's an appropriate word. I don't accept that my argument is worthless, just it is to those I'm proposing it to.

Modifié par LDS Darth Revan, 25 octobre 2012 - 10:11 .

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

This is what I found insulting: "Put down the soma." assuming all those who support Synthesis are intoxicated. Other than that, all I did was try to give an explanation and  state that you're free to believe what you want. That's everyone's right.

I did feel it was appropriate since Casey Hudson's notes in "The Final Hours" referenced Huxley's "Brave New World" for Synthesis as in "'Brave New World' ending." If you haven't read the book, I'd suggest reading it.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

This is what I found insulting: "Put down the soma." assuming all those who support Synthesis are intoxicated. Other than that, all I did was try to give an explanation and  state that you're free to believe what you want. That's everyone's right.

I did feel it was appropriate since Casey Hudson's notes in "The Final Hours" referenced Huxley's "Brave New World" for Synthesis as in "'Brave New World' ending." If you haven't read the book, I'd suggest reading it.

It's been a long time since I've read that book, and I should do so again because I agree, it was a good book. Were the people using soma? If so, sorry for misinterpreting a literary reference for an insult.

[FlamingBoy]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

People have their hearts and minds set to the point that nothing will change them, so sadly that's an appropriate word. I don't accept that my argument is worthless, just it is to those I'm proposing it to.

So you can dish out critiscism but when that critiscism is turned on you some how it still "there" fault, if your argument that bsn is not an accurate place to hold a pole then its your job to reasonably show (not prove, that would be to difficult) that some other community has a different view of synthesis.

Keep in mind if you are unwilling to do this and face the criticism you so viciously put against other people, you could always recant your argument

[Hanako Ikezawa]

FlamingBoy wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

People have their hearts and minds set to the point that nothing will change them, so sadly that's an appropriate word. I don't accept that my argument is worthless, just it is to those I'm proposing it to.

So you can dish out critiscism but when that critiscism is turned on you some how it still "there" fault, if your argument that bsn is not an accurate place to hold a pole then its your job to reasonably show (not prove, that would be to difficult) that some other community has a different view of synthesis.

Keep in mind if you are unwilling to do this and face the criticism you so viciously put against other people, you could always recant your argument

I never stated they were at fault, and I have never criticized, at least intentionally, anyone else's endings and if I have, I apologize for doing so. All I'm doing is defending the one I support and saying that taking a poll from a single source isn't always accurate. For example, if I was to poll a single state for who they want as President, that doesn't mean that represents the entire country's view. 

Modifié par LDS Darth Revan, 25 octobre 2012 - 10:22 .

[Storin]

Hate it. Makes no sense and just oozes creepy-factor. AND the game tries to make you feel like it's the "good" choice.

Modifié par Storin, 25 octobre 2012 - 10:29 .

[FlamingBoy]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

FlamingBoy wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

People have their hearts and minds set to the point that nothing will change them, so sadly that's an appropriate word. I don't accept that my argument is worthless, just it is to those I'm proposing it to.

So you can dish out critiscism but when that critiscism is turned on you some how it still "there" fault, if your argument that bsn is not an accurate place to hold a pole then its your job to reasonably show (not prove, that would be to difficult) that some other community has a different view of synthesis.

Keep in mind if you are unwilling to do this and face the criticism you so viciously put against other people, you could always recant your argument

I never stated they were at fault, and I have never criticized, at least intentionally, anyone else's endings. All I'm doing is defending the one I support and saying that taking a poll from a single source isn't always accurate. For example, if I was to poll a single state for who they want as President, that doesn't mean that represents the entire country's view. 

To "defend" or "defending" an argument you must have something to defend like the legitamacy of a poll, you do not have a poll that contradics or supports the current pole. Hence you attack the credibility of the current pole. Defending that poles are "not always" or "sometimes" accurate is not a defence its a direct attack on the integrity of the pole in question, which is fine, however you have no ammunition or evidence to suggest that the community at large has a different perception of synthesis

I agree with you assesment with the election example however there is no denying the pole legitamacy in that state when there is nothing to contradict it, also if I was to take a pole in a state no one in there right mind would say that it represented the entire country, hence the example is not exsactly fair

Modifié par FlamingBoy, 25 octobre 2012 - 10:30 .