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[AngryFrozenWater]

Schneidend wrote...

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

No. Her long range plan has more to do with the end game.

I've heard some snippets of what that is, but from what I have heard I think she simply made that her long-range plan post-Black Grimoire.

Let's just say that her long range plan can greatly benefit the player character.

Edit: If you know what that plan is play the game again and watch what Flemeth has to say. It seems like it is well planned from the start.

Modifié par AngryFrozenWater, 01 janvier 2010 - 08:14 .

[Schneidend]

Ethan009 wrote...


When?

When she tells you that saving the Circle is stupid, it's one of your dialogue choices for arguing against her.

And she'd have killed herself? Sure she would have. I love fake BA characters and honestly I loathe when people call her a strong female character she's not. Strong = Big Boss from MGS not some whiny emo doing everything she's told by someone who wants to harm her. >_>

Girl's got more issues than a psych ward.

It's not a question of her trying to badass. Personal freedom is one of her most passionate beliefs. And, The Boss (Big Boss is Naked Snake, The Boss is the ludicrously badass woman who taught him, and loved him) is indeed awesome, but I'd say Morrigan is right there with her in spirit, if not on the same level of unstoppable kickassness (Read: nobody is on that level, The Boss could punch out Chuck Norris' rib cage). Morrigan simply doesn't believe in "alliances." As we've been saying, she was raised by a crazy old hermit. Seeking attachments would be out of character for her, IMO.

[LyonVanguard]

Can you blame her? her childhood wasn't exactly a happy one was it.

[Schneidend]

If you're talking about what I think you're talking about, well, killing {Spoiler} would be pointless if it possessed {Spoiler} immediately afterward. She literally cannot do it on her own, and no amount of personal power on her part would change that.

[AsheraII]

If you're getting negative approval from Morri all the time, then you're doing something very wrong. Your actions matter, your words matter more. And it's honestly not hard to figure out how to sweet talk her into some things she might disapprove of at first.

[Maria Caliban]

JackFuzz wrote...

Wow morrigan is pretty dumb? Was this intended?

Yes, and yes.

AsheraII wrote...

And it's honestly not hard to figure out how to sweet talk her into some things she might disapprove of at first.

Oh? How do you convince her that saving the town of Redcliffe is fine or that the mages in the Circle don't deserve to die?

The Anvil is the only place where I've seen your words negate her disagreeing with you actions.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 01 janvier 2010 - 08:53 .

[KariTR]

AsheraII wrote...

If you're getting negative approval from Morri all the time, then you're doing something very wrong. Your actions matter, your words matter more. And it's honestly not hard to figure out how to sweet talk her into some things she might disapprove of at first.

It's role-play, there is no right or wrong way to interact with companions.

[AsheraII]

KariTR wrote...

AsheraII wrote...

If you're getting negative approval from Morri all the time, then you're doing something very wrong. Your actions matter, your words matter more. And it's honestly not hard to figure out how to sweet talk her into some things she might disapprove of at first.

It's role-play, there is no right or wrong way to interact with companions.

True, but what I was trying to point out, is that complaining about getting negative approval is a little silly. People do not always agree with you, and sometimes you just have to say things differently to get the results you want. Some of the funniest discussions I've seen in real life were from people fighting with each other because they agreed, but instead of focussing on them being agreeable with each other, they focus on the difference in reasoning or wording between each other and kept on fighting. With Morrigan, this is no different. Sorry, I can't put it much more clearly without it becoming a spoiler, lol, so no examples.

[Never]

phordicus wrote...

she's a paranoid megalomaniac. in fanboispek, that's read as "complex" or "interesting."

Lol.

[JJM152]

Ethan009 wrote...

The only thing I hate about her is that if you're honest (which she claims she WANTS you to be) you get like -16 and other huge disapproval. I mean honestly. No my character doesn't believe survival is everything and I wanted an option that sad she must be a sad, lonely person for believing such as it is I picked the closest and got a nice large approval drop >_>

The super annoying part of this games NPC interaction system is that the entire system is predicated upon the assumption that to "gain approval/influence" you need to tell people what they want to hear.

And while yes, in general this MAY make people like you better in real life (being a constant ass kisser), it's a real detriment to the game because unlike say, BG2, where you could actually influence your NPC's in meaningful ways, you end up sounding quite psychotic as you go from completely agreeing with Morrigan to completely agreeing with Wynne within 20 seconds just to push the "approval meter" upwards.

Oh well, it makes me want to go and play BG 2 again I suppose

[ervanol]

Morrigan suggests first to go to Lothering, that makes sense. Her next step is to go to Denerim to go right after Loghain. I didn't try that, because, I think it leads to nothing. To gather all the allies, you have to do all kinds of side quests (thank God, otherwise we wouldn't have much of a game), Morrigan disapproves we most of these actions and from an in-character point of view it makes sense.

When her approval rate is not high enough, you won't get her personal side quest (at least she is consequent). So now I am doing the Circle of Mages and have found the Grimoire, but she never spoke about it. For my character it is just some loot found on the way, for her it is something very important, no matter her views on my character as a person or his actions.

I am curious where this leads to. I am not going to give her the grimoire, neither am I going to work up her approval rate. I suppose I can forget about the whole kill my mother part too. Anybody that has been in the same boat may tell me.

[packardbell]

 I think she is unable to see the big scheme of things and only thinks of the immediatet. 

[skotie]

TheMadCat wrote...

She's not dumb, you have your objective and she feels that is what you should be focusing on instead of helping out petty squabbles which do nothing to aid you in your task nor does she like taking on unnecessary risks.

She also has the bright idea that you should go after Loghain immediately after you reach Lothering, yeah shes a real bright one that Morrigan. Why don't we go kill the Arch Demon after Loghain as well no need to waste time gathering allies or leveling up or anything.

Modifié par skotie, 01 janvier 2010 - 10:26 .

[Devilater]

She doesn't care about that stuff, she likes when you do bad stuff.

All party members have different opinions on what you do.

[Sabriana]

She gets to tend the fire with another NPC I really don't like, right after getting Wynne. My mage was not about to give in to her psychoses concerning the tower. She was raised there, and heartbroken to see so many dead friends and comrades.

Flemeth herself seems far more intelligent, because she seems to clearly see the the necessity of gathering support first. She encourages it even.

Sten's approval going down after agreeing to help the smith, who is vital in aiding the defense of Redcliffe I can understand. It seems based on making a promise that seems impossible to keep. Plus, his approval goes up every time my mage does something for the cause of Redcliffe (recruiting for example). But Morrigan seems to disagree just on principle, simply because there's nothing in it for Morrigan.

Going to Denerim and after Loghain with 3 people and a dog. Yeah, brilliant idea. I rather go with Flemeth there and try to build an army first. I don't know, it seems like the more intelligent and feasible plan to me. Morrigan might have ears, as Flemeth pointed out, but to my PC it seems there's nothing in between.

[Wisewulf]

deathwing200 wrote...

Keep morrigan in camp and shower her with gifts and pick "right" options in convos. Then do her quests, ggz easy 100 approval - I got it playing solo.

You are right, i did the same giving her gifts and sweet talked her into her bedroll. After that i just dumped her since she becomes all green eyed when i start paying attention to my bard. Rating with her when from +100 to -100. This is after she knows that you showing interest in the bard. You can get the ratings up again with pleasent talks and gifts.  

[Yrkoon]

Maria Caliban wrote...


Oh? How do you convince her that saving the town of Redcliffe is fine or that the mages in the Circle don't deserve to die? 

I can answer the last one about saving the circle  because I successfully  persuaded  it out of her just the other day.

You tell her that had she not been raised in seclusion in the wild, she'd probably BE in the circle right now, perhaps even against her will...  and would SHE want to die in that situation??

She responds by still disagreeing... but you lose  no points with her.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 01 janvier 2010 - 11:42 .

[RBCharger]

I am inclined to side with Morrigan in the first place just because I love the voice actor that plays her: Claudia Black from Farscape. After that, I side with her on her views of the Circle. It is nothing more than a prison for mages. You never see a legal mage walking the streets except for Wynne and I think she is just on parole or something. Even the other mages at Ostigar have guards (templars) watching them.



At Redcliff though, when she disagrees and says "what next? saving kittens in trees?" I just want to tell her to lighten up, I am trying to get help from the Arl here. Actually, I do say that out loud. I am sure I could convince her of that if we could talk it out for a while but could you imagine writing that dialog tree into a game? Instead, I give her a bracelet I picked up at the store for 20 silver pieces.



Personally, I play closer to Morrigan than Wynne or Leliana. I am not out to make everything right in the world - just quell the blight.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

She isn't dumb, but because of her upbringing, she fails to grasp that accomplishing seemingly unrelated goals is actually more practical and helpful in the long run, and that instant solutions simply are not plausible. In the wilds, if you wanted something, you simply went and took it. That's how animals live, and Morrigan really had no other examples to go by. Natural law simply doesn't function the same in civilization.



It can get quite annoying, the constant ****ing, but Morrigan isn't an idiot. She is simply ignorant of the bigger picture, and doing things the hard way, or attacking your enemy obliquely, can achieve better results than simply charging head on.

[Sabriana]

Indeed, but she doesn't learn. She also doesn't accept any view unless is correlates with hers.

Now, my mage hated being a prisoner in the tower, always watched, leashed by her blood. She never had a choice, once her magic became obvious, she was imprisoned, hated and feared by the chantry and the templars. She had no easy life, at least Morrigan had glimpses of freedom.

My mage also knows that many if not most of the other mages also feel constricted and imprisoned as well as mistreated. They were her only companions through childhood and adolesence, she will definitely not further their doom in any way, shape or form.

Jowan's story more or less confirmed this, just ask him about his family. Poor guy, what a bummer. And then the only prospect for him is to become a robot, or dead. Yes, he's a blood mage, but my PC doesn't know that until the end of his and Lily's quest.

Aside from that, in my opinion, using a mage's phylactery against her/him is blood magic. That's debatable and depends on a personal pov, but I think it is.

My mage knows far better than Morrigan what's going on, so her experiences are to be taken into account. Morrigan could've easily ended up in the circle as well, and I would like to see her start a revolt. The mages in the tower, with all their powers of magic still would get their butts handed to them.

It is said that the First Enchanter governs the mages, but I wouldn't like to see what would happen to him/her and all the mages if they tried to push something through that doesn't meet Chantry/Templar approval. That Rite of Annulment would be there in no time. So in my opinion, Morrigan is all wet, and shows great immaturity in regards to the circle.