278 réponses à ce sujet

[Asebstos]

Shakespeare212 wrote...

Ham411 wrote...

There's two sides to it really. One that bioware police it and what they say goes and the other being that they should just fix it once and for all if they don't want it used. Unintentional or not it is their fault that that glitch exists so they should make a proper attempt at fixing it, not some half ass change to a specific weapon every two weeks. And coming out and saying "oh, we're lazy" isn't what was suggested, more that when you have a problem that causes such a split in the community you should make fixing the problem your priority over other areas.

There are NOT two sides to the argument.  Cheating is cheating.  Anything else is a rationalization.  There is no split in the community.  There are players and there are cheaters who refuse to take responsibility for their griefing behavior that violates the terms of service.

I like this Geth, he understands.

[joe120184]

Bryan Johnson wrote...

ray12a wrote...

If you guys could code as well as you pass the buck, we, or rather you, wouldn't be having these problems.

It seems like you guys are just about incapable of implementing features without screwing up something else in the process. How much are you paying your QA testers? Do you guys even play the game? I cannot begin to comprehend the majority of blunders that get by a series of "qualified professionals". If he/ she/ they can't perform up to par, I'd be more than happy to take that job off of their hands.

My advice: Quit stalling. Quit lying. Enough with the mistakes, the rework and time squandering. Do your jobs. People are paying for your product, and these increasingly ridiculous shortcomings could end up costing you more than manhours.

Show me where I have lied. Show me a post where a programmer has passed the buck, please I am interested to talk to them.
Since you clear are after the QA testers we have, then tell me what in my job I could do better, and please be specific. 

You are attacking my personal integreity 

Here you go: http://www.bioware.com/careers

hey bryan dont listen to that whiney moob you have you have done an excellent job with Me3 hes probably just upset he got banned for being one of those that was a cheater so what if you mak mistakes everyone does and also this guy must lead avery misserable and boring life to go looking for mistakes in games also i bet if he did your job he would just have as many mistakes in his games. That is all

Modifié par joe120184, 27 octobre 2012 - 09:56 .

[Geimhreadh]

Bryan Johnson wrote...

Draining Dragon wrote...

Bryan is showing impressive restraint.

OP, this argument is ridiculous and you should feel ridiculous.

Restraint from what, if I would post some of the ways people post at me. I would probably make news for "flipping out at fans", get in trouble at work etc.

I am a very calm person, and I also have accountability to what I say.


There was a serenity quote I wanted to use here when Mal meets the agent for the first time, but cant remember it.

"Captain Reynolds.  I should tell you, so you don't waste your time: you can't make me angry."
"Please, spend an hour with him."

Or possibly "I am, of course, wearing full body armor.  I am not a moron!"

And to anyone that's wondering how these things can make it live: it's kinda shocking how many unintended consequences can show up in even a 200-line string manipulation program that nobody's really trying to break.  The number of man-hours it would take to get anywhere close to completely bug-fixing and exploit-proofing a project of this scale is... impressive.  Not to mention prohibitive.  And that's assuming that 200 people can catch every possible way the thousands of players can break the game (accidentally or otherwise).

[klokked]

They can't ban anyone for doing the missile glitch due to a lawsuit Bioware lost, I've heard.

[rmccowen]

klokked wrote...

They can't ban anyone for doing the missile glitch due to a lawsuit Bioware lost, I've heard.

Google doesn't know anything about that; I strongly suspect it's not true.

Oh, and @Bryan Johnson: I suspect you already know this, but the bitter haters are a tiny minority. Keep up the good work.

[Asebstos]

klokked wrote...

They can't ban anyone for doing the missile glitch due to a lawsuit Bioware lost, I've heard.

0/10, GTFO

[KiraTsukasa]

Shout out to Bryan Johnson for having the patience to deal with threads like this.

[lolerk53]

He has a point tho.
Why ban people for something that the game allows?
They need to fix it and warn the players not to do it.
Heck I know some people who don't ever take a second to look at the forums, they have no idea about these things.

[Bryan Johnson]

Geimhreadh wrote...

Bryan Johnson wrote...

Draining Dragon wrote...

Bryan is showing impressive restraint.

OP, this argument is ridiculous and you should feel ridiculous.

Restraint from what, if I would post some of the ways people post at me. I would probably make news for "flipping out at fans", get in trouble at work etc.

I am a very calm person, and I also have accountability to what I say.


There was a serenity quote I wanted to use here when Mal meets the agent for the first time, but cant remember it.

"Captain Reynolds.  I should tell you, so you don't waste your time: you can't make me angry."
"Please, spend an hour with him."

Or possibly "I am, of course, wearing full body armor.  I am not a moron!"

And to anyone that's wondering how these things can make it live: it's kinda shocking how many unintended consequences can show up in even a 200-line string manipulation program that nobody's really trying to break.  The number of man-hours it would take to get anywhere close to completely bug-fixing and exploit-proofing a project of this scale is... impressive.  Not to mention prohibitive.  And that's assuming that 200 people can catch every possible way the thousands of players can break the game (accidentally or otherwise).

It was actually this

Mal: No, no, you’re working this deal all crabbed. You got to open with payment. Make a flush offer and then we’ll see where this conversation goes.

The Operative: That’s a trap. I offer you money you’ll play the man of honor and take umbrage. I ask you to do what’s right, you’ll play the brigand. I’ve no stomach for games; I already know you’ll not see reason.

Modifié par Bryan Johnson, 27 octobre 2012 - 10:08 .

[Asebstos]

lolerk53 wrote...

He has a point tho.
Why ban people for something that the game allows?
They need to fix it and warn the players not to do it.
Heck I know some people who don't ever take a second to look at the forums, they have no idea about these things.

Can these people that don't visit the forums not recognize that they are getting some sort of unintended advantage by exploiting the glitch? Are they that ignorant?

[luciox]

klokked wrote...

They can't ban anyone for doing the missile glitch due to a lawsuit Bioware lost, I've heard.

From when lawsuit start to deal with this???
Please tell me. 
There is a term of use and that is a contract, in case you don't know, BW already stated missile thing is a glitch, therefore, anyone who use it already breach the contract. BW has all the right.
FYI, a contract is a contract, presented in ProCD, Inc. v. Zeidenberg, 86 F.3d 1447, term of use is a part of your purch contract.

[Mad Scientist]

Okay, OP, time for reality check. First, playing multiplayer is not a right but a privilege. Second, exploiting something you know to be a glitch is asking to be punished (having your privilege to play MP revoked). What exactly are you trying to prove here?

[jordie3000]

tntk252 wrote...

If this is in reference to the missile glitch, there's a huge difference between it and things like Reload cancelling.

Reload Cancelling actually takes a little time to get used to. I use a Javelin/Claymore, so I'm lucky enough to have 2 pretty similar weapons, but changing to another weapon can really mess with it.
As for the missile glitch...It gives you infinite freaking nukes.

The only type of person who sees infinite freaking nukes as totally ok is a spoiled child. 

[rmccowen]

lolerk53 wrote...

He has a point tho.

He really doesn't.

Why ban people for something that the game allows?

Because they're deliberately abusing something that is clearly unintended, and because...

They need to fix it and warn the players not to do it.

...fixing the game doesn't happen instantly--as Mr. Johnson has explained at length upthread.

Heck I know some people who don't ever take a second to look at the forums, they have no idea about these things.

They have no idea that glitches exist (okay, fine), or they have no idea that they shouldn't abuse glitches (in which case they're idiots)?

[inphex]

So people who used the missile glitch shouldn't be banned? oh please. I don't want to play a game that just a person do all the work and we just sit back and wait till the match ends. And I bet most of the people who own a PS3™ do own a computer or some device that can browse threw the internet. It's not BioWare ™ problem that they're not aware of what's bad and good, even thought when you go online you just skip the agreements and rules to play which clearly say not hacking/glitching etc. It's funny because when they get ban they know a forum exist and come complain on it and whine about being banned. And some people say that BioWare™ is not doing their job, come on they're giving us free DLC and few content we need to pay but for the most part I'm enjoying the game and hope the best for BioWare™.

Modifié par inphex, 27 octobre 2012 - 10:24 .

[Ziegrif]

Bryan Johnson wrote...

There is a video series that is on the top of my head that used to be on the escapist where the person talks about the industry. I would recommend you watch some of them to find out what it is like because I can assure you it is vastly different working with software then it is working with construction.

Sorry for being off topic for this but the series Bryan is talking about is called Extra Credits.
It migrated to PATV after some squabbles with the escapist.
If someone is interested in hearing about game design from the POV of 2 people inversed in it at an academic level then it's here: http://www.penny-arc...w/extra-credits

Sorry for the shameless plug but it's a good source of info into the gaming industry.

Sorries if somebody Ninjad me. o.O;
Edit: And I was ninjad... FAIL.

Modifié par Ziegrif, 27 octobre 2012 - 10:27 .

[cronshaw]

lolerk53 wrote...

He has a point tho.
Why ban people for something that the game allows?
.

The game can't "allow" anything, it isn't sentient. 
Bioware on the other hand has clearly said they do not allow cheating,
And they have said over and over again missle glitching is cheating.
And it is your responsibility as a player to know the rules.

[Sabbatine]

genocidal villain wrote...

Let's face it, banning people over any glitch and claiming it is an unfair advantage for other players is just not plausible. Why? If everyone can do it, then it is considered fair.

Everyone can read the terms of service and this thread too.  Your argument is incredibly flawed as you seem to be saying that a thing should be judged based on how many people can do the thing rather than the effect that thing might have on people.

Everyone is capable of killing another human being but that doesn't make murder fair.  Most people choose not to commit murder and because they are the majority they put in place policies and punishments to discourage the minority of people who think murder is great from acting on those feelings.

The majority of the people in this community, and more importantly, Bioware don't want people to cheat.  Maybe the only enjoyment you get out of the game is spending your credits and that's fine, but it is idiotic to assume that's what I enjoy.  You see, pulling the lever on a slot machine and having a couple weapons spit out at me every 99K credits isn't playing the game.  The act of opening a box isn't fun, the act of using what is inside the box is where the fun comes from and if you can't understand that why do you continue to "play"?  You'd get a lot more enjoyment out of playing virtual slots or just watching numbers on a spreadsheet.

[shova 01]

[quote]genocidal villain wrote...

Let's face it, banning people over any glitch and claiming it is an unfair advantage for other players is just not plausible. Why? If everyone can do it, then it is considered fair. If a player is using hacking the game from an outside source then it is an entirely different thing.



I stopped reading there. If all hack then we are all on the same playing field.. Sorry You dont hold ant weight. Ban them all

Modifié par shova 01, 27 octobre 2012 - 11:02 .

[lolerk53]

Asebstos wrote...

lolerk53 wrote...

He has a point tho.
Why ban people for something that the game allows?
They need to fix it and warn the players not to do it.
Heck I know some people who don't ever take a second to look at the forums, they have no idea about these things.

Can these people that don't visit the forums not recognize that they are getting some sort of unintended advantage by exploiting the glitch? Are they that ignorant?

Some glitches are not as obvious.
I wasn't talking specificly about the missile glitch.
If you never visited the forums, you might think reload cancelation is a glitch.

modok8 wrote...

lolerk53 wrote...

He has a point tho.
Why ban people for something that the game allows?
.

The game can't "allow" anything, it isn't sentient. 
Bioware on the other hand has clearly said they do not allow cheating,
And they have said over and over again missle glitching is cheating.
And it is your responsibility as a player to know the rules.

Again, not specificly the missile glitch.

To be frank, perma banning for glitches just seems wrong.
Give them a week ban with a warning or something.

Modifié par lolerk53, 28 octobre 2012 - 01:51 .

[Mendelevosa]

lolerk53 wrote...

Asebstos wrote...

lolerk53 wrote...

He has a point tho.
Why ban people for something that the game allows?
They need to fix it and warn the players not to do it.
Heck I know some people who don't ever take a second to look at the forums, they have no idea about these things.

Can these people that don't visit the forums not recognize that they are getting some sort of unintended advantage by exploiting the glitch? Are they that ignorant?

Some glitches are not as obvious.
I wasn't talking specificly about the missile glitch.
If you never visited the forums, you might think reload cancelation is a glitch.

modok8 wrote...

lolerk53 wrote...

He has a point tho.
Why ban people for something that the game allows?
.

The game can't "allow" anything, it isn't sentient. 
Bioware on the other hand has clearly said they do not allow cheating,
And they have said over and over again missle glitching is cheating.
And it is your responsibility as a player to know the rules.

Again, not specificly the missile glitch.

To be frank, perma banning for glitches just seems wrong.
Give them a week ban with a warning or something.

If multiple ban waves are not enough of a warning for exploiters, then they deserve a permanent ban.

[Eclispe]

To be honest i see were this is coming from you pay 40 for the game or even more for the collector's edition or what ever, you find a glitch your gonna do it because its fun its game nature to glitch and exploit in fact there doing a good job because they have found the glitch and Bioware can patch it is that not there job? to patch and advance in the patching of glitch's making the game better so the way i look at it there actually doing good because they found a glitch they use it bioware finds out ohh wait your doing a glitch to be honest which is not really effecting anybody, I think a perm ban is a bit much. Thats my opinion anyway

[lolerk53]

Mendelevosa wrote...

lolerk53 wrote...

Asebstos wrote...

lolerk53 wrote...

He has a point tho.
Why ban people for something that the game allows?
They need to fix it and warn the players not to do it.
Heck I know some people who don't ever take a second to look at the forums, they have no idea about these things.

Can these people that don't visit the forums not recognize that they are getting some sort of unintended advantage by exploiting the glitch? Are they that ignorant?

Some glitches are not as obvious.
I wasn't talking specificly about the missile glitch.
If you never visited the forums, you might think reload cancelation is a glitch.

modok8 wrote...

lolerk53 wrote...

He has a point tho.
Why ban people for something that the game allows?
.

The game can't "allow" anything, it isn't sentient. 
Bioware on the other hand has clearly said they do not allow cheating,
And they have said over and over again missle glitching is cheating.
And it is your responsibility as a player to know the rules.

Again, not specificly the missile glitch.

To be frank, perma banning for glitches just seems wrong.
Give them a week ban with a warning or something.

If multiple ban waves are not enough of a warning for exploiters, then they deserve a permanent ban.

Take a second of reading and see that the people who are activily on the forums are not everyone.
Heck we are the small minority.
They have no clue about the ban waves.
NONE

Modifié par lolerk53, 28 octobre 2012 - 02:08 .

[SavagelyEpic]

lolerk53 wrote...

Mendelevosa wrote...


If multiple ban waves are not enough of a warning for exploiters, then they deserve a permanent ban.

Take a second of reading and see that the people who are activily on the forums are not everyone.
Heck we are the small minority.
They have no clue about the ban waves.
NONE

Completely and utterly irrelevant. You don't need to visit the forums to have enough common sense to realize that cheating is cheating.

rmccowen wrote...

Shakespeare212 wrote...


There are NOT two sides to the argument.  Cheating is cheating.  Anything else is a rationalization.  There is no split in the community.  There are players and there are cheaters who refuse to take responsibility for their griefing behavior that violates the terms of service.

This is very well said.

+1

I don't like being didactic or using absolutes, but in this specific case you're an idiot if you can't see that, OP/lolerk/rest of you spoiled six year olds.

Modifié par SavagelyEpic, 28 octobre 2012 - 02:21 .

[cronshaw]

lolerk53 wrote...

modok8 wrote...

lolerk53 wrote...

He has a point tho.
Why ban people for something that the game allows?
.

The game can't "allow" anything, it isn't sentient. 
Bioware on the other hand has clearly said they do not allow cheating,
And they have said over and over again missle glitching is cheating.
And it is your responsibility as a player to know the rules.

Again, not specificly the missile glitch.

To be frank, perma banning for glitches just seems wrong.
Give them a week ban with a warning or something.

My point still stands no matter the glitch.
The game cannot "allow" anything.
Bioware is the arbiter of what is allowed and isn't and they have been quite clear about what they allow and don't. The have also been quite clear when they are still discussing, and don't have a stance on newly found glitches and exploits.