182 réponses à ce sujet

[Steelcan]

Arch1eviathan wrote...

I love the calm before and after the storm. It's a great time to got to the beach and just enjoy the nice weather.

[Hainkpe]

What happened in Queens, New York reminds me of what happened in Grand Forks, North Dakota in the spring of 1997. Seven severe blizzards primed the area for massive flooding. The entire area was under water but a electrical fire caused downtown Grand Forks to burn. Because of the amount of water, fire crews could not get to the fire to put it out. The whole downtown area burned. It was on CNN. I was a student at the time. I was evacuated and it took years for the area to recover.

I understand how people in the southern parts of the US see hurricane's often and think of them as nothing but its not the norm in the northeast. People see blizzards and bad storms but this was something that no on was able to predict because it was a situation where mutliple factors met. This was a new scenario.

The clean up will be long lasting and the effects will be long term. Putting politics aside, the region took a blow. Its easy to be away from the area and poke fun or talk big but these are people who are going through a natural disaster. If you cannot empathize, that's your business but its going to be difficult for those of us who live and work here. Its going to effect our lives. Some of us, will be tapped to help. I may.

So, poke fun if you want or need. Those of us who will be working to help those who need it can take it. I've seen it before. I went through it before. Just realize, the people who are seeing it and living with it, don't see it as funny or as connected to politics are others may.

Modifié par Belyn, 30 octobre 2012 - 05:24 .

[fiendishchicken]

32 people have been killed, with at least a hundred missing.

No one can say this hasn't been a "serious" storm.

To all affected, the New York National Guard should be mobilizing soon, as are the units of New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Virginia, Maryland, Delaware and Connecticut.

Several others are getting ready to mobilize since we have some flood equipment and extra heli's to lend a hand with.

[fiendishchicken]

IIDovahChiiefII wrote...

Well i have two buddies in the PA:NG if they didnt get shipped.theyd be there.
far as serious comment gos.ill let that one go

Well, we're on alert three for the moment. It's still in the individual governors hands atm. We might get federalized soon though.

[RedArmyShogun]

Its not that bad in terms of damage to need federal aid, nevermind where would the soldiers come from? We are overextended, and in the backyards of too many. As to why I say the military, they are the ones most of the heavy lift comes from. Most of the world however doesn't seem to see this as a huge event. Least I haven't seen any major aid being sent as was the case with Katrina.

[fiendishchicken]

RedArmyShogun wrote...

Its not that bad in terms of damage to need federal aid, nevermind where would the soldiers come from? We are overextended, and in the backyards of too many. As to why I say the military, they are the ones most of the heavy lift comes from. Most of the world however doesn't seem to see this as a huge event. Least I haven't seen any major aid being sent as was the case with Katrina.

The Soldiers come from the National Guard. We're citizens who have a part-time job in the military, and we get called up when we're needed. Active Duty (Federal) Soldiers won't be called in unless their is a massive catastrophe, and they're there to maintain civil order or for extreme reconstruction. We're specifically trained for Natural Disaster Relief, and I would call this a natural disaster, so we're doing exactly what we're supposed to be doing.

The storm still hasn't entirely died off yet, but it's done with the coasts for now. Now the remnants are pushing north up through Canada. Total damage and distruction still hasn't really been assessed yet. That's when you'll start seeing all the aid come in, over the next couple of days. 

As for us recieving foreign aid, look at Japan last year. It took a while before aid reached them, or was sent, since the consensus was "hey, they're a good, well off developed country with money, they can handle it themselves".

It doesn't matter how developed you are, you still got hit hard all the same, especially in a place where this is not a common occurence. People are going to be unprepared for it due to the lack of experience, and then they'll get clobbered.

[RedArmyShogun]

Minus two facts with your post. Actully three.


One The national Guard may be where the manpower comes, however the heavy units such as those in the aviation arms are currently deployed. Minus a few units who are off line atm for training and repairs. Plenty of hands and trucks, but at times you may need a chinook or an Ospry. We don't know yet on that score. Likely they won't. But as the cookie crumbles atm most of those all too needed heavy units are deployed.

Two Military units have been called in at times even when the powers that be in those states did not call them, as was the case with Katrina. When as rumor and wikileaks has it elements of the 82nd and Blackwater were used to put down the problems. And by put down I mean with gunfire. So the normal forces could be called in depending on factors.

Three. Its the US. Everytime something Major happens in the US every nation on the block (minus ironically US Allies) will send Aid, be it China, Russia, Venuzuala, and Iran. Mostly to stir the hornets nest as it were. However it is possible the US has used up all the good will the non European powers had toward it. And the European powers, as well as the US's Asian allies are for the most part economic basket cases atm.

Modifié par RedArmyShogun, 30 octobre 2012 - 09:43 .

[Hainkpe]

That's neither here nor there. The National Guard is for disaster relief at home. Guardsmen and reservists are a separate body than active duty. They can be mobilized quickly and deployed just the same.

This is a natural disaster. Politics has little to do with any of it. Stay on topic.

[RedArmyShogun]

As I said before on the world stage politics has everything to do with it. Help and millions arn't sent out of kindness.

And the Guardsmen are also not a soup kitcken on treads. If they were they would not have a clause where the President is the C&C as well as the notion they can be sent to combat zones. As they have for the last 10 years in large numbers (or technically whenever there is a war).The guards are a federal military force when the need is there.

Case and point

http://en.wikipedia...._(United_States)


The 29th Infantry Division ("'Blue and Grey"[1]) is an infantry division of the United States Army based in Fort Belvoir, Virginia. It is a formation of the United States Army National Guard and contains units from Maryland, Virginia, and North Carolina.

Modifié par RedArmyShogun, 30 octobre 2012 - 09:58 .

[Hainkpe]

Again. This is not the thread to be arguing this point. All aid, be it federal, state or local are being prepped and deployed. This also includes some international aid.

You want to mud sling on the use or breakdown of the Department of Defense structure then start a new thread but keep this on topic.

[fiendishchicken]

RedArmyShogun wrote...

Minus two facts with your post. Actully three.


One The national Guard may be where the manpower comes, however the heavy units such as those in the aviation arms are currently deployed. Minus a few units who are off line atm for training and repairs. Plenty of hands and trucks, but at times you may need a chinook or an Ospry. We don't know yet on that score. Likely they won't. But as the cookie crumbles atm most of those all too needed heavy units are deployed.

Two Military units have been called in at times even when the powers that be in those states did not call them, as was the case with Katrina. When as rumor and wikileaks has it elements of the 82nd and Blackwater were used to put down the problems. And by put down I mean with gunfire. So the normal forces could be called in depending on factors.

Three. Its the US. Everytime something Major happens in the US every nation on the block (minus ironically US Allies) will send Aid, be it China, Russia, Venuzuala, and Iran. Mostly to stir the hornets nest as it were. However it is possible the US has used up all the good will the non European powers had toward it. And the European powers, as well as the US's Asian allies are for the most part economic basket cases atm.

Actually, most of the necessary heavy lift capabilites are home for the time being, though not in the vicinity. AV units that aren't in Stan or Africa are home. The issue is drawing them up from places in the Northeast. Minus Ft. Drum, the aviation camps in the Northeast don't have many elements to call upon, even in peacetime. The Northeast Guard and Reserve units are under-equipped, for these sorts of problems. They're used to the Nor'easters that permeate that region. That is, they have plenty of tracked and heavy vehicles but are lacking in air assets. Projection to get the Aviation units in from the Midwestern and Southern states (where most of the Army National Guard's assets are; I have no knowledge on the other branches) should take at most 2 days to get up there. Again though, the problem is that it isn't necessarily a lack of assets, it's just the wrong assets for the job. I won't be sent, but I'll definitely be coordinating any assets coming in from IN, MI, and IL Guard/Reserve units, and we're already packed and loaded and waiting for the check to proceed.

Active Force being called up would be unusual and extreme; as I said, and as you pointed out, they would only be called in to maintain civil order and provide additional relief as necessary.

Modifié par fiendishchicken, 30 octobre 2012 - 10:00 .

[breakdown71289]

Hey guys, just finally got the power back on in my area yesterday evening. Man was that a depressing near 3-day experience without any electricity.....i just feel sorry for all the people that still have no power and are in areas that are still flooded.

[RedArmyShogun]

Ironically most of the deaths are after the storm. The supply situation there is of concern..more so given all the resources thrown at the issue. And the Fact the Lamestream media is being hush hush on the issues isn't helping.

For example if not for oversea's news sources I would not have known a little gem that NJ is turning away non-union Sandy volunteers because of threats from worker unions.

Modifié par RedArmyShogun, 02 novembre 2012 - 06:28 .

[Hainkpe]

Alright you two, stop with the conspiracies.

First, the situation has been reported on pretty much non-stop since it occurred. In regards to the non union utility workers being turned away by Power and Light, that was reported by 101.5 FM radio in Hoboken, NJ and was aired throughout the region. The utility company denied turning the workers away. Later it was reported the alleged crew that was turned away never went to New Jersey but returned home after they finished repairs in Maryland. The event didn't happen.

Second, air craft carriers were dispatched to the area to assist with medical and clean up activities.
That was reported on CNN.

Spreading paranoia about the whole event makes no sense.

Modifié par Belyn, 02 novembre 2012 - 07:03 .

[Inquisitor Recon]

New Jersey always looks like it does now, nothing new there.

And throwing things at utility workers? Stay classy Bridgeport Connecticut.

[Hainkpe]

@Dova Reporting an observation and making assumptions are two different things. I see a lot of the latter and little of the former.

Modifié par Belyn, 02 novembre 2012 - 07:12 .

[LuvPoison]

In my area, there's mugging, looting, and raping while there's still no power in the city and I can't go to work cause its not safe. I lost a week worth of work so far and Im running out of money for necessities... not like the stores have anything anymore anyway.

But other then that, THINGS ARE GREAT!

Modifié par LuvPoison, 02 novembre 2012 - 08:02 .

[LPPrince]

I just heard some jets flying overhead in South Jersey.

Definitely going out to help those affected by Sandy.

[Halfdan The Menace]

I love that some people see this as a business opportunity. I'd love to see them on TV justifying themselves. Then I'd like to see them lose their wares and get kicked in the nuts.

[Inquisitor Recon]

LuvPoison wrote...
mugging, looting, and rapping

Damn post-hurricane rappers.

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Anyway, those ships behind deployed off New York are actually LHAs/LHDs which often end up doing this sort of disaster relief. They're actually better equipped for it than the real carriers.