16 réponses à ce sujet

[Ophir147]

I know it may seem like a radical departure from how Bioware approaches romance, but frankly, the formula is getting stale at this point. When we find out a companion is a Love Interest, we already know what's going to happen:

-PC meets companion
-companion has baggage

The following points come after, obviously, but they are ticked off in different orders on a case by case basis.

-the PC chooses flirt options to signal interest
-the companion falls madly in love with the PC
-PC sorts out baggage
-PC gets laid

Hell yes, I'm over-simplifying, but I'm only trying to make a point. Romances have become gratuitous and fomulaic. I found it refreshing that Sebastian didn't actually sleep with Hawke because if his devotion to his religion, and that Hawke could actually be played as having an unrequited crush on Aveline. 

So title. Why not have a companion that expresses interest in the PC from the moment that they meet? If the PC returns their affections, then yay! we get a novel new romance in which we see how the romance pans out through the entire game instead of climaxing at the very end, and a character who doesn't need us to give them gifts and kill their mother in exchange for love, but we can still obviously have the admittedly awesome companion quests to learn more about their past and help them sort out their baggage. They could also have a very different way of speaking to the PC, or confide more about their past to someone they are in a stable relationship with.

And if the PC spurns their affection? Even better. I'm a real sucker for unrequited love, and it is ripe for dramatic potential. Of course, no one wants the companion to be "that guy" who refuses to take a hint. However, if they still harbor feelings for the PC, they could make it well known, even as the PC is trying to romance another LI, or better, a sort of Cyrano-like confidant for the PC who serves to offer romantic advice to the person that he/she loves, because they simply want the PC to be happy.

Obviously a character like this would be polarizing. Bioware has a long tradition of interesting and polarizing characters, but not necessarily interesting romances, which are mostly fanservice and chances to flesh out our characters at this point. Also there's a whole new can of worms opened up with Bioware's new "global bisexuality" policy, because if (for example) they have the a male companion pursue only female PC's, then some will cry foul, even if they are able to romance him the traditional way through the established norm for gay romances. 

I really think this is a can of worms worth opening for Bioware, however. No matter how they intend to implement it, it would an interesting shake-up to what we've grown to expect, while presenting new and interesting avenue for character development. 

By the way, no one is allowed to say "No, i prefer my companions to be strong, sane, and well adjusted individuals" as if there has been any interesting companions like that since KotOR. Take yer hate to the alligator pit.

Modifié par Ophir147, 02 novembre 2012 - 02:45 .

[Maria Caliban]

Ophir147 wrote...

I know it may seem like a radical departure from how Bioware approaches romance, but frankly, the formula is getting stale at this point. When we find out a companion is a Love Interest, we already know what's going to happen:

-PC meets companion
-companion has baggage

The following points come after, obviously, but they are ticked off in different orders on a case by case basis.

-the PC chooses flirt options to signal interest
-the companion falls madly in love with the PC
-PC sorts out baggage
-PC gets laid

Hell yes, I'm over-simplifying, but I'm only trying to make a point.

When did Hawke sort out Anders' baggage?

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 02 novembre 2012 - 02:22 .

[n7stormrunner]

can they act like rose from two and a half men?

[Ophir147]

Maria Caliban wrote...

When did Hawke sort out Anders' baggage?

Fair point, but I did admit to over-simplifying in order to set up my point. Cut me some slack! 

[TheJediSaint]

My Hawke did "cut" Anders some slack at the end of the game. 

Modifié par TheJediSaint, 02 novembre 2012 - 02:34 .

[snackrat]

I confess I do prefer it when said companions express some interest first. The previous Dragon Age games did well with that however: if you don't flirt with them, you still gets obvious flirts from Alis, Zevran, and Morrigan. Leliana CAN be a little more subtle.
For the sequel, you didn't get much from anyone (aside from Janders). Occasionally remarks in banter (Merril being 'kind of fond' of Hawke) but otherwise it felt like I was somehow intimidating them into a relationship they then felt obliged to accept because I was Tough Leader Man.

[Fast Jimmy]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Ophir147 wrote...

I know it may seem like a radical departure from how Bioware approaches romance, but frankly, the formula is getting stale at this point. When we find out a companion is a Love Interest, we already know what's going to happen:

-PC meets companion
-companion has baggage

The following points come after, obviously, but they are ticked off in different orders on a case by case basis.

-the PC chooses flirt options to signal interest
-the companion falls madly in love with the PC
-PC sorts out baggage
-PC gets laid

Hell yes, I'm over-simplifying, but I'm only trying to make a point.

When did Hawke sort out Anders' baggage?

When he murder knifed him and ended his inability to deal with demon possession?

[Direwolf0294]

I'd like to see it more often, but given how a single line from Anders was recieved I don't know if BioWare will be trying that again anyime soon.

Also, I would like to see a companion who's strong, sane, and well adjusted. It's admittedly getting a bit boring at this point having to help companions deal with all their emotionally scaring baggage. I think even BioWare realises this if Shepard's line to EDI in ME3 asking if she has any father issues or the like is any indication. For once I'd like a companion to help my character with thier emotionally scaring baggage, or at least mention it.

[ScarMK]

Direwolf0294 wrote...

I'd like to see it more often, but given how a single line from Anders was recieved I don't know if BioWare will be trying that again anyime soon.

Also, I would like to see a companion who's strong, sane, and well adjusted. It's admittedly getting a bit boring at this point having to help companions deal with all their emotionally scaring baggage. I think even BioWare realises this if Shepard's line to EDI in ME3 asking if she has any father issues or the like is any indication. For once I'd like a companion to help my character with thier emotionally scaring baggage, or at least mention it.

I think that the problem people had with Anders was that when Hawke turned him down, it was rather mean/blunt or something.  I think in Origins you could try to change the subject or bluntly/gingerly let them down.  Not 100% on that though.

[CuriousArtemis]

ScarMK wrote...

Direwolf0294 wrote...

I'd like to see it more often, but given how a single line from Anders was recieved I don't know if BioWare will be trying that again anyime soon.

I think that the problem people had with Anders was that when Hawke turned him down, it was rather mean/blunt or something.  I think in Origins you could try to change the subject or bluntly/gingerly let them down.  Not 100% on that though.

Sadly I think it really was initially about Anders hitting on their male Hawke. They didn't like it.

But that was a problem with Anders. There was no kind way to turn him down. The "broken heart" icon was kind of rude and insulting. Hawke even makes a somewhat disgusted face.

[Direwolf0294]

ScarMK wrote...

Direwolf0294 wrote...

I'd like to see it more often, but given how a single line from Anders was recieved I don't know if BioWare will be trying that again anyime soon.

Also, I would like to see a companion who's strong, sane, and well adjusted. It's admittedly getting a bit boring at this point having to help companions deal with all their emotionally scaring baggage. I think even BioWare realises this if Shepard's line to EDI in ME3 asking if she has any father issues or the like is any indication. For once I'd like a companion to help my character with thier emotionally scaring baggage, or at least mention it.

I think that the problem people had with Anders was that when Hawke turned him down, it was rather mean/blunt or something.  I think in Origins you could try to change the subject or bluntly/gingerly let them down.  Not 100% on that though.

That's the problem I had with it, but from what I've seen other posters say it looks like many people took issue with him even expressing those feelings in the first place. Those posts normally include them saying their Hawke isn't gay and neither are they so I can't help but wonder if it had been some hot woman saying those things whether they would have been fine with it or not.

[Masha Potato]

Direwolf0294 wrote...

I'd like to see it more often, but given how a single line from Anders was recieved I don't know if BioWare will be trying that again anyime soon.

our goddam society

[TJPags]

Direwolf0294 wrote...

ScarMK wrote...

Direwolf0294 wrote...

I'd like to see it more often, but given how a single line from Anders was recieved I don't know if BioWare will be trying that again anyime soon.

Also, I would like to see a companion who's strong, sane, and well adjusted. It's admittedly getting a bit boring at this point having to help companions deal with all their emotionally scaring baggage. I think even BioWare realises this if Shepard's line to EDI in ME3 asking if she has any father issues or the like is any indication. For once I'd like a companion to help my character with thier emotionally scaring baggage, or at least mention it.

I think that the problem people had with Anders was that when Hawke turned him down, it was rather mean/blunt or something.  I think in Origins you could try to change the subject or bluntly/gingerly let them down.  Not 100% on that though.

That's the problem I had with it, but from what I've seen other posters say it looks like many people took issue with him even expressing those feelings in the first place. Those posts normally include them saying their Hawke isn't gay and neither are they so I can't help but wonder if it had been some hot woman saying those things whether they would have been fine with it or not.

Actually, the problem I had with it was Anders reaction.

[frostajulie]

that would be interesting...

[Sylvanpyxie]

What ever happened to the natural progression of romances?

As you've said, a Player Character flirts and the Love Interest in question falls madly in love with him/her. It's a formula that can easily cause companions to become objectified by players.

Is it so wrong to start off a relationship of mutual dislike, distrust and borderline hatred? Is it so wrong to build that relationship into one of begrudging respect and admiration? Is it really so wrong to slowly build up a strong bound of friendship before diving into the shark infested waters of romance?

Forgive me, but I would much rather come across a companion that I dislike, only to find we've both fallen madly in love with each other as the game has progressed, than come across another Anders/Alistair who is throwing himself at my feet.

Why must everything be so direct? Why can't we be emotionally challenged by Love Interests? Why can't we, the Player, finally be the ones to invest ourselves so deeply into a romantic relationship that we alter our very behaviour to appease the one we're supposed to love?

Modifié par Sylvanpyxie, 02 novembre 2012 - 02:53 .

[Ophir147]

There was a bit of backlash about Ander's flirtation, but IIRC, Bioware didn't really care. I don't think the writers are trying to steer the series away from that in any case.

I also seem to recall a Gaider defending Anders' rivalry gain, stating that he's one of the easiest companions to gain friendship points with, and the rivalry gain was minimal enough that it's only a problem to min-max players.

I also seem to have heavily implied that the only option I'd be content with would be a male romance of this type. There could be a female companion of this type and I'd be just as happy, as I tend to do a lot of replays anyway.

The companion's gender could also vary with the character created, or one of them could die in the beginning a la Dragon Age II?

[Ophir147]

Sylvanpyxie wrote...

What ever happened to the natural progression of romances?

As you've said, a Player Character flirts and the Love Interest in question falls madly in love with him/her. It's a formula that can easily cause companions to become objectified by players.

Is it so wrong to start off a relationship of mutual dislike, distrust and borderline hatred? Is it so wrong to build that relationship into one of begrudging respect and admiration? Is it really so wrong to slowly build up a strong bound of friendship before diving into the shark infested waters of romance?

Forgive me, but I would much rather come across a companion that I dislike, only to find we've both fallen madly in love with each other as the game has progressed, than come across another Anders/Alistair who is throwing himself at my feet.

Why must everything be so direct? Why can't we be emotionally challenged by Love Interests? Why can't we, the Player, finally be the ones to invest ourselves so deeply into a romantic relationship that we alter our very behaviour to appease the one we're supposed to love?

While I would love to see something like this, I would never dare to hope for anything of this complexity in any DA game soon. The team has expressed at numerous times that while they believe that Love Interests are a staple of their games, they don't believe they are central enough to devote that many resources to in order to create something an order of magnitude what they've already attempted (aka, certain Rivalmances, and most DA:O romances if you strain your WSOD and have lots of gifts.)

So, baby steps!

Modifié par Ophir147, 02 novembre 2012 - 03:13 .