7348 réponses à ce sujet

[Dr_Extrem]

i was venting here - but it would harm the mod.

- edited -

Modifié par Dr_Extrem, 18 novembre 2012 - 12:46 .

[Chashan]

StarOfFlames wrote...

Well, if no more video games like Mass Effect 3 will be made, then I will quit video gaming. Before Mass Effect, I thought video games were shallow. It was truly ME3 that proved me wrong.

And quite long stretches of ME3 got things right: Tuchanka, grandeur, Rannoch, sublime as well. The creepiness of the Reap-hurr conduct was also satisfactory and maintained throughout - until...

StarOfFlames wrote...

Okay, please don't flame me, but I think removing the original, real ending of the game just kills the entire story. You don't like it? Fine. But , with the ending, everything fits into a pattern, the story has a meaning, and the player is left to think about the questions real science fiction is there to pose. This is how you tell a story. It's heartbreaking but elevating and beautiful. It's sad that so many people couldn't accept it. But still. This story is complete, this story is art, this story is science fiction and I stand by it. Please stop referring to the ending as a "problem that needs to be fixed". If you want a different closure, then go ahead and do it your way but why burn what you don't like? Real storytelling is not about Hollywoodian hapy endings, it's about values and meaning, drama and emotion. It's about the experience of the journey, it's about learning new things. It's about life, and life is not a fairy tale.

Tastes differ, and I did not see ME aspiring to be something intimidatingly artistic; ME1 had an uplifting ending, seeing the end of the big bad, ME2 had that, ME3 dangled the promise of just such a finish in front as well, for large stretches of the game - is it wrong to assume the final installment of this series would get that decisive thing right, as did its predecessors?
While ME3 proper was not without problems - fetch-quests that ought to have been real missions, if just of ME2 side-mission length; an EMS-system that, beyond increasing a number, does next to nothing for the outcome we see unfold at the end; questionable turns of the story (e.g. Kerberos being promoted/demoted to almighty SS-goon squad, not to mention Mr Kylee Leng) - one could have let slide those issues had the outcome been sufficiently satisfactory and fit with what came before.

Then, out of nowhere, when the story had basically run its course, this creature pops up and spouts one contradictory, bratty line after another. Had it been intimidating or eloquent in the way classy villains are, I could have let that slide. Yet, BW did not even attempt at such, nor succinctly forebode meeting this thing, and if it were meant to be an "exposition dump" as I have seen certain people call it, it even fails at that. Being at the mercy of such a contradictory, pathetic creature with no definite way to overcome it without taking down a race and person it indirectly holds hostage is anything but "heartbreaking", and I would certainly not call it "beautiful".

The only good thing about it is that it is right at the end, and disjointed and disconnected as this creature along with the scene it appears in is, having it cut out of my game-experience as it unfolds is very much welcome, and I thank MrFob and crew dearly for having made this possible, otherwise I would not have looked at ME3's SP again anytime in the near future, if ever.

YMMV, but ultimately, general opinion on the ending is a subjective matter - although there have been a number of people trying to tackle the issue on an objective, professional level, far as I am aware. As such, I repeat what others have already said: this mod is a non-mandatory download, and if you are fine with what BW served, you are welcome to it.

Modifié par Chashan, 18 novembre 2012 - 01:32 .

[CptData]

Backing you up, Chashan, MrFob:

The mod is for those guys only who dislike the original and/or the enhanced endings. A lot of people (depending on statistics, 80 - 90%) simply dislike the final choice "A-B-C" (and since EC: D too) since it felt out of place.
That plus none of those endings feel really good:
Do you really want to keep the Reapers around when your main objective for full three games was to destroy them?
Do you really want to play God and make every living being, every synthetic to a hybrid? Do you think the husks and cannibals would love their new existence as sentient beings? Seriously?
Do you really want to end the Geth and EDI to stop the Reapers permanently?
Do you really want to refuse the given options and allow the Reapers to complete another cycle?

See: MrFob simply tries to give a more fulfilling ending. The Reapers are gone. EDI and the Geth are still alive. Shepard survived. That's what a lot of people wished for, right from the beginning. Even if it was the damn hardest ending to achieve - people wanted this option. That's all.
Well, and most of those guys hated the starchild and the final decisions at all, therefore MrFob did the one and only logical thing: by removing those things.

Technically, Leonardo da Vinci painted Mona Lisa and when he was done with her, he added a moustache and called it "artistic vision" or something. That's what the original endings are for the entire series. The 'stache got smaller with the release of the EC, but MrFob removed it entirely, so we can enjoy Mona Lisa fully in all of her glory.

Well, for those who like the original endings / the EC, there's still the option to NOT install that mod.

[CommanderVyse]

This thread should remain a place for constructive feedback regarding MrFob's work. Please leave the ending bickering to the rest of the BSN.

[CommanderVyse]

CptData wrote...

Technically, Leonardo da Vinci painted Mona Lisa and when he was done with her, he added a moustache and called it "artistic vision" or something. That's what the original endings are for the entire series. The 'stache got smaller with the release of the EC, but MrFob removed it entirely, so we can enjoy Mona Lisa fully in all of her glory.

MEHEM = Mustache Eliminating Happy Ending Mod

[christrek1982]

wwinters99 wrote...

This thread should remain a place for constructive feedback regarding MrFob's work. Please leave the ending bickering to the rest of the BSN.

I agree

[BearlyHere]

wwinters99 wrote...

CptData wrote...

Technically, Leonardo da Vinci painted Mona Lisa and when he was done with her, he added a moustache and called it "artistic vision" or something. That's what the original endings are for the entire series. The 'stache got smaller with the release of the EC, but MrFob removed it entirely, so we can enjoy Mona Lisa fully in all of her glory.

MEHEM = Mustache Eliminating Happy Ending Mod

Nailed it! That's what's missing! It's like they got us all worked up, and then we don't get a happy ending! We're just left frustrated. Mr Fob came in and gave some of us release:O:P, but for us console players, it's still . 

[I_Jedi]

StarOfFlames wrote...
 Well, if no more video games like Mass Effect 3 will be made, then I will quit video gaming. Before Mass Effect, I thought video games were shallow. It was truly ME3 that proved me wrong.

You should play Spec Ops: The Line.

[darthnick427]

If only I could install this mod on my xbox......oh well....High EMS Destroy will have to do....

Well done on the mod though. I approve.

Modifié par darthnick427, 18 novembre 2012 - 05:40 .

[Sable Rhapsody]

I_Jedi wrote...

StarOfFlames wrote...
 Well, if no more video games like Mass Effect 3 will be made, then I will quit video gaming. Before Mass Effect, I thought video games were shallow. It was truly ME3 that proved me wrong.

You should play Spec Ops: The Line.

Add Journey and Planescape: Torment.  There are philosophical, interesting, genuinely morally challenging games out there, you just have to know where to look.  

"What can change the nature of a man?"  
"Does this unit have a soul?"  
"There is no great revelation, no great secret.  There is only you."

Modifié par Sable Rhapsody, 18 novembre 2012 - 08:50 .

[StarOfFlames]

I_Jedi, Sable Rhapsody Okay, guys, thanks for the advice on what to play next, I was already searching for new titles. This will help me a great deal. Also, PKchu yes, I should open a thread for the original endings (after checking for one in existence) and leave this to the technical feedbacking for the mod.

And all of you, thanks, for sharing your ideas and your intelligent arguments, now I see your point. I think I've exploited the topic of the original ending, now I leave your thread to your mod. I hope that you will all find closure by expanding the story with this clever addition. And maybe, someday, some of you may consider playing a new Shepard with the original story.

Good playing for you all. Kheelah se'lai!

P.S. I got some non-canon ideas about a ME4 sequel which are not affected by the ending. Maybe you should check them out. A new connection may be made between this alternate ending and my ideas.

[CptData]

Well, had a nice, constructive discussion about MEHEM and a different PoV, which is something, SoF.

And I had my chance to say my infamous "ME3 = Mona Lisa with moustache" line. MEHEM is just one optional mod trying to "remove that moustache", but a part in me hopes it doesn't remain the only one

[MrFob]

Hey guys, I wasn't around during the weeksend so unfortunately I missed out on the discussion on the last 2 pages but I am glad to see that even when the discussion comes to the endings, things do not get out of hand in this thread. Thanks for that. Also, I have no problem discussing the content of the mod and how it compares/fits into the original game in this thread (as long as it stays civil and does not lapse into an mere discussion of the original endings, which is what the S&C section is for).
@SOF: Your point is well noted. However, it seems that many people do misinterpret my intentions with this mod (and the others I have made). While I do dislike the original endings with a passion (especially after the EC) and while my first mod MEEM in particular was meant to provide an alternative that IMO makes more sense, it was never meant as a bash, an insult or even a fix for the original endings. I always was and still am happy for anyone who could get something out of these endings. I personally see too many inconsistencies and fallacies but that is just my perspective. If people like the originals, that is fine with me, more than fine, I think it's great.
These mods are supposed to be an addition, a further option. If I could implement them in a way, so that you could choose after install, what you want, I would do that. However,, I can't so you have to choose before the point of install. The idea here is to provide something that IMO was missing from the game's endings and that is true and meaningful variety. This is not supposed to be THE ending, on the contrary, that would be counter productive because we would loose variety. I still hope that, with the ME3Explorer evolving as a tool for us, we will actually see even more. More mods will not be diminishing the ME experience, it will (or at least it is supposed to) enrich it.
Anyway, at first I was surprised to find out that many seemed offended that (and I quote from a yt message, I got) "I had the audacity and the arrogance to presume that I could just change BW's story". Well, from my perspective, I didn't even do that. All I wanted to do was to offer a different interpretation, like others do in fan fiction, videos, images, etc. If my particular way of doing it offended the sensibilities of some who like the original ending, than I am truly sorry and all I can say is that this was not my intent.

Alright, enough babbling, back to modding. On Tali's face, I don't have a Tali save, so I can't tell how much better the clipping is with the uniform but I wouldn't expect too much. Unfortunately, for the characters I did try, it didn't make as much of a difference as I was hoping for. The good news is, that with v0.2, I will also provide some instructions on how to easily customise some things in the mod (e.g. choose your preferred casual outfit for the memorial scene, keep or loose the face injuries, etc.). I still have to work out some of the animation issues this week but I hope to have v0.2 ready around Friday.

[CptData]

@MrFob: currently extracting space ship models right from the game. I plan to create a very short demo battle movie with those ships to find out if they can be used for new footage for your mod. May take approx a week.

[MrFob]

Wow, sounds cool! Looking forward to seeing it. If we could eventually have an actual scene of, say the shuttle flying towards/away from the citadel-crucible complex or anything like that, it'd be marvellous!
I was actually thinking, since quite a few people want to help out with this, how about creating a discussion group within the MEHEM topic or something like that to help with the coordination? We are bound to run into trouble and have redundancies if we don't find some way to coordinate in an efficient manner.

EDIT: Created a discussion

Modifié par MrFob, 18 novembre 2012 - 12:42 .

[CommanderVyse]

Quick question MrFob,

Can you replace the scenes with the IGN watermark? I find them more jarring than any character clipping.

[Dr_Extrem]

mrfob ... you could just create a private group within the bsn. closed topics and discussion.

[MrFob]

wwinters99 wrote...

Quick question MrFob,

Can you replace the scenes with the IGN watermark? I find them more jarring than any character clipping.

Yeah, they'll be out in the next version. In fact, they were already out in the first version, I just used the wrong file, silly me.

@Dr_Extrem: I created a discussion in the topic for now (see here). I hope it won't get spammed or anything. If it will, I guess we have to move to a private place but I hope this will work out.

[StarOfFlames]

P.P.S.

MrFob,  thank you for your answer and believe me, I never meant anything like you change the original story or see it as a problem, I only addressed those who do think that way. I wish you good luck with your work of expanding the Mass Effect experience, I personally think that this universe is just amazing, and I would really love to spend more time in it. More on the matter, I'm not against modding, on the contrary, I am all open to new ways. For example, I would like to start a new female Shepard, and also, I have some female crewmates with whom my character would like to... spend more time.  So I will look around and search for mods to... widen the diversity.

If I you don't mind, here's an idea regarding the matter at hand... Have you considered expanding the Destroy ending of the original story someday, in which Shepard survived? Maybe a reunion with the crew, and even a party onboard the Normandy?

Other:
[OFF]Oh, as a final line, I'd like to advertise my own ideas here, if you don't mind, MrFob. They are a bit related to the topic. So many of us were left wondering, how could BioWare pick up the ball where Mass Effect 3 dropped it? Choosing a canon ending? Editing the story? Creating a prequel? Understandably, there are numerous counterarguments against each of these options. So I thought about it and I see some oportunities there that could let you "go around" the ME3 ending and I gathered some of my ideas about a new story in the future, a sequel, that could heal the scars that ME3 left in many fans.
So, if you like, you check them out  here. Maybe some things that, if implemented, could bring back the fanbase to the ME universe.[/OFF]

About the last two pages, excuse me for the poor English here and there, it was 2 am here and I was exhausted.

Modifié par StarOfFlames, 18 novembre 2012 - 01:28 .

[Dr_Extrem]

StarOfFlames wrote...

P.P.S.

MrFob,  thank you for your answer and believe me, I never meant anything like you change the original story or see it as a problem, I only addressed those who do think that way. I wish you good luck with your work of expanding the Mass Effect experience, I personally think that this universe is just amazing, and I would really love to spend more time in it. More on the matter, I'm not against modding, on the contrary, I am all open to new ways. For example, I would like to start a new female Shepard, and also, I have some female crewmates with whom my character would like to... spend more time.  So I will look around and search for mods to... widen the diversity.

If I you don't mind, here's an idea regarding the matter at hand... Have you considered expanding the Destroy ending of the original story someday, in which Shepard survived? Maybe a reunion with the crew, and even a party onboard the Normandy?

Other:
[OFF]Oh, as a final line, I'd like to advertise my own ideas here, if you don't mind, MrFob. They are a bit related to the topic. So many of us were left wondering, how could BioWare pick up the ball where Mass Effect 3 dropped it? Choosing a canon ending? Editing the story? Creating a prequel? Understandably, there are numerous counterarguments against each of these options. So I thought about it and I see some oportunities there that could let you "go around" the ME3 ending and I gathered some of my ideas about a new story in the future, a sequel, that could heal the scars that ME3 left in many fans.
So, if you like, you check them out  here. Maybe some things that, if implemented, could bring back the fanbase to the ME universe.[/OFF]

About the last two pages, excuse me for the poor English here and there, it was 2 am here and I was exhausted.

no harm done.

the mehem actually is an interpretation of the high ems destroy ending - just from another perspective and without the sacrifice.
it is entirely posible, that shepard met the starchild - its just not shown in this mod.

i dislike the endings - because i have to choose between 4 different ways to betray my shepards nature and the breathe scene at the end of the high ems destroy is pinnacle of trolling.

because of this, i prefer this mod. its my headcanon and i certainly do not force it on other players.


imo this mod is good as it is now .. a party would not be appropriate - everybody lost friends and family. joker lost his whole familiy on tiptree (another reason the original destroy is such pain), the homeworlds lie in ashes and shepard had to carry more than one good friend to his grave.

thats what i like about this mod - everybody is griefing over the loss of friends, family and comrades - but this ending still gives hope for the days to come and the rebuilding.

[CptData]

MrFob wrote...

Wow, sounds cool! Looking forward to seeing it. If we could eventually have an actual scene of, say the shuttle flying towards/away from the citadel-crucible complex or anything like that, it'd be marvellous!
I was actually thinking, since quite a few people want to help out with this, how about creating a discussion group within the MEHEM topic or something like that to help with the coordination? We are bound to run into trouble and have redundancies if we don't find some way to coordinate in an efficient manner.

EDIT: Created a discussion

It's not much - put it together within 3 hours or so, including time to find out how to make working gifs

Test animation of a random formation of Alliance cruisers with some WIP-lightning.
Still trying to find out how to add those glowing windows - I can't find the texture for that ...



Models are right from the game, means EA/BW owns them. I might try to get my hands on more advanced CGI models for 3DSMax, but in that case you might need to put the creator's name in the credits of your mod. I don't wanna steal something, so I hope there are some free models out there, but definitely can't create those models from scratch.

Modifié par CptData, 18 novembre 2012 - 02:39 .

[Dr_Extrem]

CptData wrote...

MrFob wrote...

Wow, sounds cool! Looking forward to seeing it. If we could eventually have an actual scene of, say the shuttle flying towards/away from the citadel-crucible complex or anything like that, it'd be marvellous!
I was actually thinking, since quite a few people want to help out with this, how about creating a discussion group within the MEHEM topic or something like that to help with the coordination? We are bound to run into trouble and have redundancies if we don't find some way to coordinate in an efficient manner.

EDIT: Created a discussion

It's not much - put it together within 3 hours or so, including time to find out how to make working gifs

Test animation of a random formation of Alliance cruisers with some WIP-lightning.
Still trying to find out how to add those glowing windows - I can't find the texture for that ...



Models are right from the game, means EA/BW owns them. I might try to get my hands on more advanced CGI models for 3DSMax, but in that case you might need to put the creator's name in the credits of your mod. I don't wanna steal something, so I hope there are some free models out there, but definitely can't create those models from scratch.

this is hardcore ... /salute.

this opens so many possibilities.

[CptData]

Just checked some pages where I got some of my stuff, but so far no cigar. Looks like as if there's not a single high poly Alliance cruiser out there I could use for totals. The ingame models are okay for mid- and distant shoots since their lower level of detail, but for anything that's really close I need a high poly model for the details. And I simply lack the skill creating the textures

[Kashola]

I'm super late to the party and the original link to the mod is closed due to high traffic (and with that, the install instructions). Before I go messing around with any files, can someone tell me where to put em? Thanks.

[AVPen]

CptData wrote...

It's not much - put it together within 3 hours or so, including time to find out how to make working gifs

Test animation of a random formation of Alliance cruisers with some WIP-lightning.
Still trying to find out how to add those glowing windows - I can't find the texture for that ...



Models are right from the game, means EA/BW owns them. I might try to get my hands on more advanced CGI models for 3DSMax, but in that case you might need to put the creator's name in the credits of your mod. I don't wanna steal something, so I hope there are some free models out there, but definitely can't create those models from scratch.

Pretty cool test, man - I myself have been working on converting a bunch of 3DSMax character models into Lightwave models for use in a potential "epilogue-reunion" scene/s of my own for my own current ME3 project that I'm doing (though the biggest challenge right now is actually modeling a true "face" for Tali, since BW is too damn cheap to do it themselves... lol)

Modifié par AVPen, 18 novembre 2012 - 05:14 .