194 réponses à ce sujet

[T0r0]

Hey guys,
 I'm close to completion on expanding my small rural override and have some questions...





1. Is there an easy way or tutorial to correct shadows? I'm a novice at 3dsmax so I really don't get all this repivot direction stuff. Perhaps a better explanation can help me.  I realize the concensous is to turn them off but since it's an override for the standard rural, I would love to have them working.

2. Anyone willing to give this a small test run? Advice on how to make it better is always welcome. I usually like to go on hakless PW's to test but my goto PW has limited their use of rural tileset.

3. (not important but curious) Edge tiles : is there a way to make the lighting (muteness) of it the same as regular tiles ? hope that makes sense.

I realize I tend to like sparse, muted, gritty tones. Few more screenshots on the vault:
nwvault.ign.com/View.php

Modifié par T0r0, 31 octobre 2013 - 10:21 .

[T0r0]

I've always been scared to death to use CM3. I've had bad experience with it due to my lack of knowledge of 3dsmax and terminology. I've read the readme but still don't know what alot of the settings do. Especially the snap to the move bad pivot section.
Good news is I tried it and it seems to work, so if I can just understand those settings better, I'll be golden. So anyone got a dummy's guide to CM3 ?

[OldTimeRadio]

I am not knowledgeable enough to help very much but I believe the general idea is that, for shadows, you want your pivot point in such a position that all face normals (i.e. the visible portion of the face) is facing away from that pivot.  Every single face of a mesh which has Shadow enabled appears to be be processed by the game in order to produce the final shadow.

If you don't get the answers you're looking for here, you might consider downloading and consulting the Omnibus but are you definitely having shadow problems to begin with?

Work looks really good, BTW.

[Just a ghost]

I'd like to test!

[Zwerkules]

I like the palisades and gates and the other changes you've made. Something I noticed is that your grassrim texture doesn't match the grass texture.
I don't like the old standard trees at all. They look so unnatural. Helvene's or Tom Banjo's trees look alot better.

[T0r0]

I made it different on purpose, to obscure that dried dirt from the ground. Also it doesn't look too bad when 3d grass is disabled.


You think it's a bad choice? I know it's probably possible but does it make sense to make grassrim be affected bt wind?

As far as the trees, I didn't touch them. Just added a texture to the tiles that I did touch for variety's sake. I know I'm not up to par with you guys.In a perfect world they'd all have branches that swayed in the wind also. I actually started this more than 3 years ago and just kept putting it off. oh well.

Modifié par T0r0, 04 novembre 2012 - 10:56 .

[dusty.lane]

Oh my! I know nothing about tiles really, but that is amazing work what you got there so far! I love it, I will so use it as soon as possible.

[henesua]

This is good work, TOrO. I think the criticism is constructive.

The first thing I noticed in your screenshots was the grass. I like the contrast. I didn't notice the "grassrim" until it was pointed out by Zwerkules. I think the contrast works. It could probably be improved with a little more variety in the appearance of the grassrim, but I don't know what options you have there.

[OldMansBeard]

I've posted this reply to a PM from T0r0.

The position and orientation of a mesh are defined in the mdl file by the position and orientation of its pivot point relative to (the pivot of) its parent. The vertices of the mesh are defined by their position relative the pivot. If the mesh is rotated in-game (by orentationkeys in an animation), that is the point around which it turns. That's why it's called the pivot.

NWN uses a simplistic way of computing shadows. It uses the orientations of the faces of a mesh relative to that meshes' pivot to compute how the shadows fall. It assumes that the faces of the mesh point outwards, away from their pivot. In other words, it assumes that the mesh is convex and the pivot lies inside it. If that isn't true, if some faces are the "wrong side" of the pivot, you get broken or missing shadows for those faces.

It is possible, in a static model, to slide the pivot around in space while keeping the faces and vertices fixed in world space. It still looks the same shape in-game but it may affect shadows. If the shape is convex, sliding the pivot from outside the shape to somewhere inside, while keeping everything else fixed, can repair broken shadows. If the shape is not convex and there is no "inside" to place the pivot within, chopping the mesh up into convex pieces, each with their own pivot, will allow each piece to generate correct shadows.

You can slide pivots around by hand inside Max and do the slicing up by hand but it gets tedious if you are fixing an entire tileset with thousands of meshes. So I wrote CM3 to do it automatically on large numbers of models quickly. It automatically detects pivots that lie outside their meshes and slides them inside if it can. If it can't, it decides how best to slice up the mesh until the parts can be pivoted satisfactorily.

[NWN_baba yaga]

this looks very very good, amazing textures:)

[Zwerkules]

I didn't notice the grassrim in any of the screenshots you've got here, but you provided a link to the vault page which has more screenshots. There's a screenshot with palisades next to a river. That's where I noticed that the grassrim is dark green while your grass is mostly yellow.
This doesn't mean that I didn't like your work. It was meant as constructive criticism.
I also didn't mean that the grassrim should be affected by wind. It often is so near to vertical meshes that the wind would probably only blow it into those meshes anyway, which wouldn't look good.
It's the colour of the grassrim that makes it stand out and I've only seen that in the screenshot with the river.

Edit: The grassrim in the last screenshot you posted here looks fine near the palisades. Either you're using two different grassrim textures, or you already fixed it.

By the way, that moss you used is the best I've ever seen.

As for the trees, they are the original ones made by Bioware, so I wasn't criticising your work at all.
I just don't like those trees one bit and if I were to use a tileset which had those trees because it looked fine otherwise, I would remove those trees from the tiles and replace them by better ones.
There are still a few of them left in my forest override, but that one isn't quite finished yet and if I get to work on it again, I'll replace them, too.

Modifié par Zwerkules, 05 novembre 2012 - 04:10 .

[T0r0]

No worries, let' s put this puppy to bed right now, I'm not offended in any way,shape or form. I appreciate the criticism because it makes me look at things with a new perspective.

Its still the same grassrim (its actually hay). Its only along the palisades (better word than wood fort wall). The bioware grassrim still is there for everything else.

Yes, as noted on that screenshot on the vault, I like the moss too. I'm trying to find a way to incorporate it a little more without overkill. It makes sense next to the river. Where else?

The only tile I'm not too happy with is where the palisades meet the forest wall. I used as a base for this the tile from Helvene's rural override. So it has his tree. I really don't like the whole forest wall set at all but I understand it's function.

I'm on my way to correcting shadows so that's a good thing.

[T0r0]

grrrr,, it's late and I can't seem to post screenshots right now.


http://imageshack.us...edtoro0000.jpg/

Modifié par T0r0, 08 novembre 2012 - 05:55 .

[T0r0]

So shadow problems mostly solved in large part thanks to OMB's CM3. I went back and redid the grass to a much cleaner texture that is less obscuring.

http://nwvault.ign.c...php?id=1683291. ok, what am I doing wrong, screenshots are not coming out. ??
2. Is a cep compat  version useless to players? Since haks get the final say in a mod with haks. It would only be beneficial to builders ?

Unless you inject the modified mdl's into the hak but this is undesirable for a multitude of reasons I think.

Screenies on the vault at:
http://nwvault.ign.c...s.Detail&id=114

Modifié par T0r0, 09 novembre 2012 - 01:16 .

[T0r0]

Things to come.

Modifié par T0r0, 03 janvier 2013 - 05:15 .

[Master Jax]

Amazing! And just when I thought you were done with rural! I love it! Simply love it! Please, please, do rural buildings next! T____________T

[OldTimeRadio]

Looks beautiful!

[The Amethyst Dragon]

T0r0, that looks incredibly promising.

[Zwerkules]

I'm playing the OC with the three tileset overrides I've made (caves, interior and forest) and from all the tilesets I haven't got overrides for the rural one is the one that looks worst. So I'm eagerly waiting for you to finish your override tileset.
I've already closed all the gaps in the rural buildings (those which appear if the camera angle is low).
If you don't plan to remodel the whole buildings, I could send you those fixed tiles so you can retexture them and don't have to close all those gaps yourself. Just tell me if you need them.

I also use Cervantes's creature override with all those nice creatures made by Six and Lord of Worms and many others and so for most creatures I've encountered in the OC have already been changed to look better, except for the pixies and wererats.
If someone doesn't know what to do, there are those pixies which could really use better models ...
Okay, this is slightly off topic and doesn't have anything to do with your tileset, Toro, I just thought I'd mention it.

[Master Jax]

There was actually a different model of pixie released in various colors in some CCC I believe. I use it as override and kept the original pixie as a grigg.

[Rolo Kipp]

<missing the queen...>

Those would be Rubies.

She made herself an avatar for the Rogues challenge (something I wish all Makers would attempt ;-) and then several reskins for Folktales.

But they really do need better wings (*cough*) and a remodel wouldn't be completely unwelcome ;-)

<...terribly>

[T0r0]

I need a door guy !!
Ideally I'd like a working porticullus here with the blue transition plane, I have no idea how to do this.

Point me in the right direction please.............

[Rolo Kipp]

<sighing...>

There's an excellent section on doors in the Bioware Tileset tutorial... which is broken on the Vault :-(

Give me a minute...

Ok, grab the PDF and read what Rob Bartel says about doors and the SAM :-)

Edit: A portcullis? Swiveling like a garage door, I assume, since a vertically lowered one would need a much higher hill... ;-)

<...at the loss>

Modifié par Rolo Kipp, 06 janvier 2013 - 05:47 .

[T0r0]

Or would adding a door make it not work as an override?

Yep, thought about it over lunch and I think modifying this to have a door would be more in line with an expansion (additional option for that specific tile)  rather than override. Sound right?

Modifié par T0r0, 06 janvier 2013 - 06:21 .

[Zwerkules]

If the new door replaces the old area transition you could have a problem there, but it also could work. You'd have to open the door first, but than clicking on the SAM should still work as before and trigger the area transition. Even if you don't add a door, you should still replace the old cave entrance with your new one. It looks far better.
By the way, are you planning to replace the water texture? The old one looks a bit too blue and not transparent enough. It worked with the old textures but I think with your new textures it stands out a bit.