126 réponses à ce sujet

[Deerber]

Xaijin wrote...

What part of enough damage and debuff to one-mag a platinum banshee while taking no damage to health during Bansee pulse needs explaining.

A Fury is going to do that never.

I'm fairly sure that's an hyperbole.

[landylan]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

OP, short story shorter, you're doing it wrong. You seem to want to play her as a Fury, when you already have a Fury to play as.

I play both to the best of their abilities, yet I fail to see how the valkyrie is superior. With their speed, tech armor is unnecessary. Fury dodge is amazing. 

With the fury I can DC and detonate bosses as fast as throw can recharge for dps that rivals the valkyrie, and I can use heavier weapons with less penalty.

[Methew]

landylan wrote...

theonlycoletrain wrote...

Road Wulf wrote...
You can't compare the two because of one Power, because the two classes should not be played the same.

This

I'm comparing all powers. Tech armor doesn't synergize as well as dark channel imo, and warp doesn't have a fast enough recharge rate for when I actually need it.

It becomes a weapons class when I play, but I hate to lower warp's CD even further with heavy weapons and tech armor.

You're comparing the Valkyrie directly to the Fury like you're comparing two Adepts. The Valkyrie isn't an Adept. It's a Sentinel.

And further more, stop playing the Valkyrie like you're playing the Fury. They are similar but different. It's less about chain BEs on trash and more about getting 30% damage taken buffs on big meaty units while you melt them with high DPS guns.

[OblivionDawn]

landylan wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

OP, short story shorter, you're doing it wrong. You seem to want to play her as a Fury, when you already have a Fury to play as.

I play both to the best of their abilities, yet I fail to see how the valkyrie is superior. With their speed, tech armor is unnecessary. Fury dodge is amazing. 

With the fury I can DC and detonate bosses as fast as throw can recharge for dps that rivals the valkyrie, and I can use heavier weapons with less penalty.

If you're taking as long to kill bosses with the Valkyrie as you are with the Fury, you aren't playing the Valkyrie to the best of her ability.

Get close and use warp for massive debuff on the boss, then start blasting away with a high DPS weapon. Incindiary Rounds for bonus points.

Going for BEs on bosses with the Valkyrie is definitely doing it wrong.

[Black Phantom]

Deerber wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

What part of enough damage and debuff to one-mag a platinum banshee while taking no damage to health during Bansee pulse needs explaining.

A Fury is going to do that never.

I'm fairly sure that's an hyperbole.

Probably not.

[Deerber]

landylan wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

OP, short story shorter, you're doing it wrong. You seem to want to play her as a Fury, when you already have a Fury to play as.

I play both to the best of their abilities, yet I fail to see how the valkyrie is superior. With their speed, tech armor is unnecessary. Fury dodge is amazing. 

With the fury I can DC and detonate bosses as fast as throw can recharge for dps that rivals the valkyrie, and I can use heavier weapons with less penalty.

No you can't. Not after the boss' shields/barriers go down. And even if you could, your dps would never rival the Valkyrie's one.

Nothing is necessary in this game, but Tech Armor is definitely a good survival tool. If you're good enough never to need it, then good for you. But there are players out there who like to be able to take a few hits now and then 

Edit:

Ashen Earth wrote...

Deerber wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

What part of enough damage and debuff to one-mag a platinum banshee while taking no damage to health during Bansee pulse needs explaining.

A Fury is going to do that never.

I'm fairly sure that's an hyperbole.

Probably not.

One mag? How many other debuffs were on that banshee? 

Modifié par Deerber, 05 novembre 2012 - 05:48 .

[Mozts]

Descy_ wrote...

You seem to be confused, they are two different classes, with two different purposes.

[landylan]

OblivionDawn wrote...

landylan wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

OP, short story shorter, you're doing it wrong. You seem to want to play her as a Fury, when you already have a Fury to play as.

I play both to the best of their abilities, yet I fail to see how the valkyrie is superior. With their speed, tech armor is unnecessary. Fury dodge is amazing. 

With the fury I can DC and detonate bosses as fast as throw can recharge for dps that rivals the valkyrie, and I can use heavier weapons with less penalty.

If you're taking as long to kill bosses with the Valkyrie as you are with the Fury, you aren't playing the Valkyrie to the best of her ability.

Get close and use warp for massive debuff on the boss, then start blasting away with a high DPS weapon. Incindiary Rounds for bonus points.

Going for BEs on bosses with the Valkyrie is definitely doing it wrong.

I'm not focusing boss killing around BE's. I'm just saying that a fury with a better weapon than the valkyrie because the fury can afford to have a lower cooldown mixed with the fury's BE's makes her dps rival the valkyrie's with more AoE damage and occasional boss stunning and less exposure.

[Xaijin]

landylan wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

What part of enough damage and debuff to one-mag a platinum banshee while taking no damage to health during Bansee pulse needs explaining.

A Fury is going to do that never.

What gun only used one magazine??? And no damage at all? Please elaborate.

Reegar. The krogan Shaman and Valkyrie can both kill the banshee on one reegar mag by staying close enough to trigger the AoE pulse scream, which prevents the banshee from using her DR stance. Since they both have unilateral biotic AND explosion boosting powers, it's pretty much a no brainer. The Shaman can do it with the Banshee still having half her life left. Never going to happen with a Fury, ever. While you can certainly make a case for "multi explosions will kill the banshee and peepee dudes around her gg Fury no re", in a clutch the fury is going to die, the other two chars can stare down a geth prime, a possessed scion or banshee and walk away, and when they fix the atlas, it might be the same there too, except you'll probably need two mags, unless you blow up the atlas panels and keep it in "stunlock".


courtesy of ashen earth



The only direct advantage a Fury has is the ability to cheese maps by teleporting into other areas. The Asari is fast and has a redonkulous dodge, and can deal with peepee dudes and bosses with equal alacrity. The Fury can do more explosions over time, but they aren't even close to the same amount of damage per explosion if you've specced correctly.

Their roles are distinct, but the damage from hell and walking away untouched with cool explosions in the background award belongs to the valkyrie, and the fury is no where near the same even with full damage spec.

The scaling on the Valkyrie never changes with difficulty. The Fury played on platinum is nothing like a Fury played on bronze, and that's pretty much the clinching aspect.

Modifié par Xaijin, 05 novembre 2012 - 09:51 .

[CitizenThom]

Tallgeese_VII wrote...

I find dark channel most useful especially when I go against unknown faction. I have not met really good Valkyrie boss killer in pug but looking forward to it

When I play Fury, I tend to forget Dark Channel unless I'm doing a Hack Objective, or if there's a killzone filled with enemy troops...at which point I start playing the Fury like an Asari Adept. Otherwise, Annihilation Field, Throw, and Heavy Melee are about 95% of my gameplay as a Fury.

p.s. You must not have played with very many Valkyries. She's a good boss killer even without 5a on AF, and with 5a... bwa ha ha ha.

[DJ Airsurfer]

You're clearly doing it wrong.

[Deerber]

Xaijin wrote...

landylan wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

What part of enough damage and debuff to one-mag a platinum banshee while taking no damage to health during Bansee pulse needs explaining.

A Fury is going to do that never.

What gun only used one magazine??? And no damage at all? Please elaborate.

Reegar. The krogan Shaman and Valkyrie can both kill the banshee on one reegar mag by staying close enough to trigger the AoE pulse scream, which prevents the banshee from using her DR stance. Since they both have unilateral biotic AND explosion boosting powers, it's pretty much a no brainer.


courtesy of ashen earth



The only direct advantage a Fury has is the ability to cheese maps by teleporting into other areas. The Asari is fast and has a redonkulous dodge, and can deal with peepee dudes and bosses with equal alacrity. The Fury can do more explosions over time, but they aren't even close to the same amount of damage per explosion if you've specced correctly.

Maybe it's just me, but when I first saw that it seemed like they were 2 mags. Isn't there a recharge time?

[Black Phantom]

Deerber wrote...


One mag? How many other debuffs were on that banshee? 

It would probably work if a player exploited the warp/incendiary ammo bug...

But in most real game situations, Banshees are focus fired on so they would die long before that. I've actually seen entire spawns wiped out including two Banshees in roughly 6 seconds with all biotic teams when I play the Valkyrie.

Although to be fair, all of the players in those games were far better than the average random.

[N7-PurpleHaze]

Valkyrie is better at debuffs and survivability (generally), fury is much better at direct damage. It's a personal preference thing IMO, I like the fury a lot more

Modifié par N7-PurpleHaze, 05 novembre 2012 - 05:54 .

[Arppis]

Isn't Valkyrie kinda like debuff machine?

[landylan]

Xaijin wrote...


Reegar. The krogan Shaman and Valkyrie can both kill the banshee on one reegar mag by staying close enough to trigger the AoE pulse scream, which prevents the banshee from using her DR stance. Since they both have unilateral biotic AND explosion boosting powers, it's pretty much a no brainer. The shaman can do it with the banshee still having half her life left. Never going to happen with a Fury, ever. While you can certainly make a case for "multi explosions will kill the banshee and peepee dudes around her gg Fury no re", in a clutch the fury is going to die, the other two char can stare down a geth prime, a possessed scion or banshee and walk away, and when they fix the atlas, it might be the same there too, except you'll probably need two mags.


courtesy of ashen earth



The only direct advantage a Fury has is the ability to cheese maps by teleporting into other areas. The Asari is fast and has a redonkulous dodge, and can deal with peepee dudes and bosses with equal alacrity. The Fury can do more explosions over time, but they aren't even close to the same amount of damage per explosion if you've specced correctly.

He reloads in the video, so he used more than one magazine.... It's still impressive though, but I'm guessing that you have to use the stair exploit thing to do that which is just kind of cheesey. The reegar can melt bosses on pretty much any class though.

Doesn't the reegar have an optimal damage range? Is that further than AF's radius.... 

Is that valkyrie specced full fitness and tech armor DR?

[Black Phantom]

Deerber wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

landylan wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

What part of enough damage and debuff to one-mag a platinum banshee while taking no damage to health during Bansee pulse needs explaining.

A Fury is going to do that never.

What gun only used one magazine??? And no damage at all? Please elaborate.

Reegar. The krogan Shaman and Valkyrie can both kill the banshee on one reegar mag by staying close enough to trigger the AoE pulse scream, which prevents the banshee from using her DR stance. Since they both have unilateral biotic AND explosion boosting powers, it's pretty much a no brainer.


courtesy of ashen earth



The only direct advantage a Fury has is the ability to cheese maps by teleporting into other areas. The Asari is fast and has a redonkulous dodge, and can deal with peepee dudes and bosses with equal alacrity. The Fury can do more explosions over time, but they aren't even close to the same amount of damage per explosion if you've specced correctly.

Maybe it's just me, but when I first saw that it seemed like they were 2 mags. Isn't there a recharge time?

It took slightly over 1 and a half clips, but the build I used there was not optimized for weapon damage and I used Warp ammo instead of Incendiary ammo.

I really should update that thread with the current build I'm using, and clips of other weapons so people will quit herping and derping about the fact that I used the Reegar Carbine in an example while completely missing the point.

Modifié par Ashen Earth, 05 novembre 2012 - 06:02 .

[whateverman7]

she's not better...they're even...they both excel at doing different things

[Xaijin]

Yeah and I've done the same on Solo platinum with one reegar on the Shaman, with exactly one clip, over and over and over again. If Ashen had waited for the banshee to hit three squares before the last spike, the result would have been the same.

It's not really up for speculation, the stats are in stone.

[Deerber]

Ashen Earth wrote...

Deerber wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

landylan wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

What part of enough damage and debuff to one-mag a platinum banshee while taking no damage to health during Bansee pulse needs explaining.

A Fury is going to do that never.

What gun only used one magazine??? And no damage at all? Please elaborate.

Reegar. The krogan Shaman and Valkyrie can both kill the banshee on one reegar mag by staying close enough to trigger the AoE pulse scream, which prevents the banshee from using her DR stance. Since they both have unilateral biotic AND explosion boosting powers, it's pretty much a no brainer.


courtesy of ashen earth



The only direct advantage a Fury has is the ability to cheese maps by teleporting into other areas. The Asari is fast and has a redonkulous dodge, and can deal with peepee dudes and bosses with equal alacrity. The Fury can do more explosions over time, but they aren't even close to the same amount of damage per explosion if you've specced correctly.

Maybe it's just me, but when I first saw that it seemed like they were 2 mags. Isn't there a recharge time?

It took slightly over 1 and a half clips, but the build I used there was not optimized for weapon damage and I used Warp ammo instead of Incendiary ammo.

I see, so basically if you're exploiting the incendiary bug you could do it, otherwise you'd need slightly more than 1 clip. Which is still impressive, of course.

Edit: by the way Ashen, after knowing that the radius evo of AF isn't bugged, did you respec your Valkyrie? Or you still think going for damage is a better choice?

Modifié par Deerber, 05 novembre 2012 - 06:02 .

[landylan]

I'll have to try the reegar incendiary ammo out with her, but I don't want to waste my shotgun amps in case I'm in the mood for speedruns.

I've heard of the weird bonus incendiary ammo gets, but could someone please explain the math to me? It'd be pretty freaking awesome if it was actually better than warp ammo on a biotic.

[Cloaking_Thane]

Incendiary ammo bug?

[Xaijin]

You don't need the incendiary ammo to do it, and warp ammo is supposed to have a warp bonus, so that pretty much throws omg hax out the window with the same result, dead banshee. Both ammo types will provide the same result, though Incend can be downgraded a level and still work due to DoT stack.

explain

Stacking incend ammo and warp will cause the incend DoT to override and replace warp, but the DoT value will be warp's damage value, not the weapon's.

Modifié par Xaijin, 05 novembre 2012 - 09:54 .

[Deerber]

Xaijin wrote...

Yeah and I've done the same on Solo platinum with one reegar on the Shaman, with exactly one clip, over and over and over again. If Ashen had waited for the banshee to hit three squares before the last spike, the result would have been the same.

It's not really up for speculation, the stats are in stone.

Were you using incendiary?

Also, would you care to explain the DR thing of the banshee? I didn't know they have DR, thought they just ignore powers. :happy:

Edited cause I didn't read the post above.

Modifié par Deerber, 05 novembre 2012 - 06:07 .

[IcarusAloft]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

AF Damage taken + Warp Expose + Warp Ammo = up to 180% extra damage, plus tankyness and very fast dodges. She's amazing.

Indeed.  Played a Pirahna Valkyrie with this set up on gold reapers this weekend.  CQC beast.