256 réponses à ce sujet

[CosmicGnosis]

And if I pick Synthesis, then I'm a really bad guy.

[KieranW]

 I chose Destroy as it obliterated the Reapers and the Catalyst didn't like it. He deliberately tried to sway me towards one of the other two options. Hell naw! I blew his pipe and his cuttlefish cronies to kingdom come!
If there was anyway I could have killed the Reapers without losing the Geth and EDI, I would have taken it in a heartbeat. But when it came down to it, my Shepard made an impossible decision in an impossible situation. 

Plus, It really irks me how Destroy 'kills all Synthetics with Reaper code' but Control doesn't allow you to control all Synthetics with Reaper code. The only reason they put in Destroy killing the Geth and EDI was because they knew everyone and their Mum would go for it otherwise. And that annoys me. I mean, surely if Destroy obliterates the Synthetics due to their Reaper code, Control would have... The same... Effect? 

:wizard:Space Magic:wizard:

Modifié par KieranW, 07 novembre 2012 - 01:07 .

[ghost9191]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

And if I pick Synthesis, then I'm a really bad guy.

well yeah , but that is a given. you don't need bsn to tell you that

[His Name was HYR!!]

ghost9191 wrote...

what i am saying. would be the same with the geth . gotta do what you have to to beat the reapers. but the rachni were not indoctrinated, they were forced, prettty much as the geth were. well geth joined out of free will . which then the reapers gained control over them

you say strength over security , you contradict yourself

No I don't. Freeing the rachni does not qualify for "strength" if she's indoctrinated. Then it's just sabotage.

Virtually everybody who's indoctrinated was forced into it. Unfortunately, they need to be put down. Innocence/guilt doesn't matter.

"Virmire" ring a bell? Think back to that room with the salarians that beg you to release them from confinement.

[Ryzaki]

...? I thought it was her brats that were indoctrinated. She was just tortured.

[AdmiralCheez]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

But if I pick anything other than Destroy, I'm a bad guy. Just ask most of BSN.

You're a horrible monster regardless of your decision.  Scratch that, the Catalyst is a horrible monster, and you are forced to either accept its logic and play by its rules or step aside and let the Cycle continue.  It's an ugly no-win scenario masquerading as philosophical depth.

If you are not comfortable with your choice by now, you never will be.  And you know what?  That's a good thing, because it means you are a decent human being.

Also, if you like one decision better than all the others, just go with it and screw what everybody else things.  Even this post is just MY feelings and MY interpretation.

[Xilizhra]

If you are not comfortable with your choice by now, you never will be. And you know what? That's a good thing, because it means you are a decent human being.

*sighs*
Must you resort to ad hominems? Truly, I expected better of you. I am quite happy with my own decision.

And if you didn't see it before, my other post on the subject:
It took some time to decide. However, at this point, I feel no guilt. I was given a set of options and chose the best one, and to the best of my knowledge, it worked out. I won the war. The Reapers are mine. I will protect the galaxy, and release the Reapers when it's safe to do so. As a matter of fact, everything went better than I expected, and the only substantial thing I had to sacrifice was Liara's happiness... emotionally wrenching, but not that relevant in the grand scheme of things. Moreover, without the galaxy itself pulling together for this move, I never could have gotten that far. When the Crucible deploys, I know it was my work that enabled it to be built, and when it fires, I know that it was my own choice to make. What I did, in the end, very definitely mattered. And if I have to die to bring that about, so be it. It was a better sacrifice than I thought I'd get.

Modifié par Xilizhra, 07 novembre 2012 - 02:30 .

[ghost9191]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

ghost9191 wrote...

what i am saying. would be the same with the geth . gotta do what you have to to beat the reapers. but the rachni were not indoctrinated, they were forced, prettty much as the geth were. well geth joined out of free will . which then the reapers gained control over them

you say strength over security , you contradict yourself

No I don't. Freeing the rachni does not qualify for "strength" if she's indoctrinated. Then it's just sabotage.

Virtually everybody who's indoctrinated was forced into it. Unfortunately, they need to be put down. Innocence/guilt doesn't matter.

"Virmire" ring a bell? Think back to that room with the salarians that beg you to release them from confinement.

the rachni weren't indoctrinated. they were forced into slavery. geth willingly went to the reapers and joined them . they were enslaved but chose that

without needing to be indoctrinated. the geth sided with the reapers. that seems to be a bigger threat .  geth could have easily came under the control of the reapers. could sabotage , or take out the some of the fleet before they knew what was happening

the point is you said strength over security . but you wouldn't take the rachni , but you would take the geth . whereas the geth chose to side with the reapers when the rachni were forced

so you will take one for the strength but not the other .


the geth and rachni are in the same situation. in the past they attacked and caused war. now they are under reaper control , one by choice other forced. you can't give the ones that sided with the reapers because they thought it was a good idea a chance because it is strength and then deny that to the rachni saying it is sabotage beacuse they were forced into it.   

and that brings me to the part about strength over security , geth you choose strength , rachni you chooose security . a contridiction for your statement that you prefer strength

[AdmiralCheez]

Xilizhra wrote...

*sighs*
Must you resort to ad hominems? Truly, I expected better of you. I am quite happy with my own decision.

Go back in your corner, Xil.

[Xilizhra]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

*sighs*
Must you resort to ad hominems? Truly, I expected better of you. I am quite happy with my own decision.

Go back in your corner, Xil.

No. I will not. I will not be bullied by your insistence that no one could be a good person who finds peace with the endings. If you wish to contest me on this point, do so. Otherwise... well, just throwing these around is hardly productive.

[Ryzaki]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

CosmicGnosis wrote...

But if I pick anything other than Destroy, I'm a bad guy. Just ask most of BSN.

You're a horrible monster regardless of your decision.  Scratch that, the Catalyst is a horrible monster, and you are forced to either accept its logic and play by its rules or step aside and let the Cycle continue.  It's an ugly no-win scenario masquerading as philosophical depth.

If you are not comfortable with your choice by now, you never will be.  And you know what?  That's a good thing, because it means you are a decent human being.

Also, if you like one decision better than all the others, just go with it and screw what everybody else things.  Even this post is just MY feelings and MY interpretation.

I really agree with this Cheez and it sucks. Because I felt comfortable with both ME1 and ME2 endings despite them not being perfect.

In ME3 I either tell the starbrat to shove off and get everyone killed or play his game and ruin others lives. (not even going into Synthesis). It's just a lose lose scenario and it blows.

[ghost9191]

yeah why i find it easier to just blow up the tube. thinking that is a way to shut it up . considering that well destroys it . and ignore the whole synthetics will rebel

oh and i worked around the geth going boom , though am a bit iffy on that. they could be a threat. they proved that . yeah they had a change of , heart i guess lol , but that was when it was join us or die . and without the reapers , they will be probably the most powerful race . so you know what f*ck it , the geth die for what they will possibly do in the future

[AdmiralCheez]

Xilizhra wrote...

No. I will not. I will not be bullied by your insistence that no one could be a good person who finds peace with the endings. If you wish to contest me on this point, do so. Otherwise... well, just throwing these around is hardly productive.

Look.  Sorry if I got all up in your feelings, but honestly?  The fact that you're totally and seriously okay with becoming a galactic dictator, removing people's (or Reapers') free will, and committing suicide in hopes that a computer program will properly conform to your moral standards makes me worry about you.  You have a great deal of compassion and honestly want to make things better for people, but your penchant for borderline megalomania and grapsing for the moral high ground is probably not that healthy.  Yes, it can be argued that Control is the best solution since it has the lowest overall death toll (at least as far as we can tell) and doesn't fundamentally alter the minds and bodies of trillions of people without their consent (a la Synthesis), but such a willingness to play god, such a deep conviction that your personal morals are the solution to everyone's problems?  That's where compassion and empathy start to die.  That's what turns the noble idealist into a ruthless villain.  It's a dangerous path to walk, Xil.  Be careful.

I understand it's not fair of me to make a judgment call on your character, especially since who you are in real life is probably different from your internet persona.  Plus, odds are my moral compass is no better than yours, and this whole thing is a game of pot-and-kettle.  But I like you and I like your input on the forums, and I respect your intelligence and emotional mettle enough to really get into it when it comes to the ethical and philosophical stuff.

It was never my intention to "bully" you.  Callin' you cray-cray and putting you on time-out are both cheap attempts at humor (at your expense, which is douchey of me and merits an apology).  But seriously, sometimes I worry about you.  Like, damn gurl wtf.

[CosmicGnosis]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

No. I will not. I will not be bullied by your insistence that no one could be a good person who finds peace with the endings. If you wish to contest me on this point, do so. Otherwise... well, just throwing these around is hardly productive.

Look.  Sorry if I got all up in your feelings, but honestly?  The fact that you're totally and seriously okay with becoming a galactic dictator, removing people's (or Reapers') free will, and committing suicide in hopes that a computer program will properly conform to your moral standards makes me worry about you.  You have a great deal of compassion and honestly want to make things better for people, but your penchant for borderline megalomania and grapsing for the moral high ground is probably not that healthy.  Yes, it can be argued that Control is the best solution since it has the lowest overall death toll (at least as far as we can tell) and doesn't fundamentally alter the minds and bodies of trillions of people without their consent (a la Synthesis), but such a willingness to play god, such a deep conviction that your personal morals are the solution to everyone's problems?  That's where compassion and empathy start to die.  That's what turns the noble idealist into a ruthless villain.  It's a dangerous path to walk, Xil.  Be careful.

I understand it's not fair of me to make a judgment call on your character, especially since who you are in real life is probably different from your internet persona.  Plus, odds are my moral compass is no better than yours, and this whole thing is a game of pot-and-kettle.  But I like you and I like your input on the forums, and I respect your intelligence and emotional mettle enough to really get into it when it comes to the ethical and philosophical stuff.

It was never my intention to "bully" you.  Callin' you cray-cray and putting you on time-out are both cheap attempts at humor (at your expense, which is douchey of me and merits an apology).  But seriously, sometimes I worry about you.  Like, damn gurl wtf.

Only a cold and empty person could hate AdmiralCheez.

[Xilizhra]

Look. Sorry if I got all up in your feelings, but honestly? The fact that you're totally and seriously okay with becoming a galactic dictator, removing people's (or Reapers') free will, and committing suicide in hopes that a computer program will properly conform to your moral standards makes me worry about you. You have a great deal of compassion and honestly want to make things better for people, but your penchant for borderline megalomania and grapsing for the moral high ground is probably not that healthy. Yes, it can be argued that Control is the best solution since it has the lowest overall death toll (at least as far as we can tell) and doesn't fundamentally alter the minds and bodies of trillions of people without their consent (a la Synthesis), but such a willingness to play god, such a deep conviction that your personal morals are the solution to everyone's problems? That's where compassion and empathy start to die. That's what turns the noble idealist into a ruthless villain. It's a dangerous path to walk, Xil. Be careful.

My morality is all that can make this decision. I can only share this decision with one other person, and it doesn't seem to have a moral compass; I don't even know if the Catalyst has free will. Bereft of anyone else's input from the rather stunning revelation I just got, I only have my own judgment to use. I can certainly try to think of what other people would have wanted... but I don't, and never have, made decisions by consensus alone. I've taken unilateral risks before, after all, in my time as a Paragon; many of them. What's one more?

[ghost9191]

www.youtube.com/watch

morals are a funny thing

easy road is not always the right one . and nothing like playing paragon ., dismissing TIMs idea of controll to turn around and say ., hmm he couldn't but i am clearly arrogant enough to:D

Modifié par ghost9191, 07 novembre 2012 - 03:30 .

[Xilizhra]

ghost9191 wrote...

www.youtube.com/watch

morals are a funny thing

easy road is not always the right one . and nothing like playing paragon ., dismissing TIMs idea of controll to turn around and say ., hmm he couldn't but i am clearly arrogant enough to:D

I dismissed TIM's idea because he was indoctrinated and he'd have done no good whatsoever if he took control. I, however, am not.

[AdmiralCheez]

Xilizhra wrote...

My morality is all that can make this decision. I can only share this decision with one other person, and it doesn't seem to have a moral compass; I don't even know if the Catalyst has free will. Bereft of anyone else's input from the rather stunning revelation I just got, I only have my own judgment to use. I can certainly try to think of what other people would have wanted... but I don't, and never have, made decisions by consensus alone. I've taken unilateral risks before, after all, in my time as a Paragon; many of them. What's one more?

This is what absolutely everyone was stuck with when they made the call.  It was an informational vacuum, and nobody really knew what the full implications were of each choice.  We still don't know, thanks to LOLSPECULATION4EVERYONE (damn it, Mac).  But still, this has nothing to do with my criticisms; what I'm getting at is your willingness to become Supreme Galactic Overlord (or rather, to reformat the current Supreme Galactic Overlord in your image) without the slightest hint of doubt, guilt, or suspicion.

Also the fact that you think the Catalyst was a good narrative idea makes me want to punch you in the face.  Your tastes are bad and you should feel bad.

PS: I am still very upset over the synthetic holocaust I initiated, thankyouverymuch.

PPS: No, I don't actually want to punch you in the face.

[Eckswhyzed]

AdmiralCheez wrote...
......what I'm getting at is your willingness to become Supreme Galactic Overlord (or rather, to reformat the current Supreme Galactic Overlord in your image) without the slightest hint of doubt, guilt, or suspicion.

I know I tend of think of 'consequences' more than 'rules'.

Anyway, I don't really think it's too concerning. Unless Xilizhra is building a Crucible in their basement.

[Xilizhra]

This is what absolutely everyone was stuck with when they made the call. It was an informational vacuum, and nobody really knew what the full implications were of each choice. We still don't know, thanks to LOLSPECULATION4EVERYONE (damn it, Mac). But still, this has nothing to do with my criticisms; what I'm getting at is your willingness to become Supreme Galactic Overlord (or rather, to reformat the current Supreme Galactic Overlord in your image) without the slightest hint of doubt, guilt, or suspicion.

There's plenty of doubt, but if the Catalyst is lying, I'm dead and so is the galaxy, so it doesn't matter what I do. Hence, I remove it from that decision. I'm not guilty because I haven't seen anything to convince me that it was the wrong decision; it's not ideal, but I didn't make a poor choice. I can lament the circumstances, but I won't lament my own choice. And suspicion, I brush aside for the same reason as doubt.

I'm willing because I'd much rather have myself be supreme galactic overlord than the current Catalyst, and because I believe myself capable of managing the power without going crazy. Mostly because I don't plan to actually run the galaxy.

[ghost9191]

Xilizhra wrote...

I dismissed TIM's idea because he was indoctrinated and he'd have done no good whatsoever if he took control. I, however, am not.

you know TIM thought the same thing

just mean personally , i wouldn't trust anyone with that power. prefer control over synthesis though , somewhat. still a bit iffy for me though hell wouldn't trust myself lol. too much power for one person

my other post was mostly joking though. choice is yours . none are right , all wrong in their own way .  at least with control it matters if you were paragon or renegade .    still wrong though

arrogants though . i prefer to just blow them up, end the catalyst that way, give hope to the galaxy that kinda thing. sucks for the geth, which is what makes destroy suck

Modifié par ghost9191, 07 novembre 2012 - 04:00 .

[BatmanTurian]

Xilizhra wrote...

ghost9191 wrote...

www.youtube.com/watch

morals are a funny thing

easy road is not always the right one . and nothing like playing paragon ., dismissing TIMs idea of controll to turn around and say ., hmm he couldn't but i am clearly arrogant enough to:D

I dismissed TIM's idea because he was indoctrinated and he'd have done no good whatsoever if he took control. I, however, am not.

BUT, Starkid says he controlled TIM who controlled you and he couldn't choose control, ergo, through TIM they already controlled you therefore there is no reason to think you are any different than TIM.

[Icinix]

Javik validates everything Javik.

[Xilizhra]

ghost9191 wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

I dismissed TIM's idea because he was indoctrinated and he'd have done no good whatsoever if he took control. I, however, am not.

you know TIM thought the same thing

just mean personally , i wouldn't trust anyone with that power. prefer control over synthesis though , somewhat. still a bit iffy for me though hell wouldn't trust myself lol. too much power for one person

my other post was mostly joking though. choice is yours . none are right , all wrong in their own way .  at least with control it matters if you were paragon or renegade .    still wrong though

arrogants though . i prefer to just blow them up, end the catalyst that way, give hope to the galaxy that kinda thing. sucks for the geth, which is what makes destroy suck

TIM had husk parts growing out of his face. And I'd say the galaxy has plenty of hope.

BUT, Starkid says he controlled TIM who controlled you and he couldn't
choose control, ergo, through TIM they already controlled you therefore
there is no reason to think you are any different than TIM.

TIM was controlled by the Reapers when he was trying to reach the Crucible, which is why it wouldn't work. I am not under control at this point in time, and hence that statement doesn't apply to me.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

The problem I had with the Control ending was that the thing was behaving like I perceived a shackled AI would behave. EDI kept looking for other solutions and granted in her short time, she had lots of questions. But this thing kept doing the same thing over and over again.

It makes me think that if it was shackled, that the Shepard AI would also be shackled.

I hated the Destroy ending.

My feelings at 3:20 a.m.? on Mar 22? Un********believable! I die. The mass relays are destroyed. The Normandy crashes on this jungle planet, and all that's left is Joker, Liara, and Javik. Everyone else was either dead or starved to death. 5 years!!!! I saved Mordin from needlessly sacrificing himself because Wreav was going to unleash the horde on the galaxy. I held Tali when she found her father dead. I promised she would have a house on her homeworld. I made peace between the Geth and the Quarians. 5 years I trusted them! I stayed faithful to Liara. All I wanted was to see Liara again when it was over. Was that asking too much? All I get is this stupid gasp of air. And all I had now was questions. Why? 1200 hours making the perfect Julia Shepard wasted.

I went online and found all the endings were the same.

But now we have the MEHEM and I can replay the game and bypass this stupid ending altogether, and I can finally have closure.