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[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
Yeah, it was kind of nice to take a break from fighting ultimate evil and do battle with an antagonist who is allowed to have his virtues. A bit like Loghain, actually.

Though I'd love to know how Oleg and his men avoided indoctrination.

I think he refused the implants for himself and his troops, and TIM wouldn't force the issue because Petrovsky is too important for him.

[Ieldra]

dreman9999 wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

@Nimrodell:
I'm a man and I'm just as mystified by the demand for "moar Aria" that occasionally flares up here. As I've repeatedly said, I respect her but I don't like her.

Don't take this the wrong way but the writing on the wall for this story has been there for a while.

You mean ever since the leaked script? I'm not saying I didn't expect this story to happen eventually, only that some people's fascination with Aria escapes me.

[Rodia Driftwood]

jtav wrote...

Yeah, it was kind of nice to take a break from fighting ultimate evil and do battle with an antagonist who is allowed to have his virtues. A bit like Loghain, actually.

Though I'd love to know how Oleg and his men avoided indoctrination.

Loghain is no different than TIM. He was only looking after his own to the point where he got his own king killed to further his own ambitions. He was power mad and drive by hatred.

[jtav]

Though finally not being her toadie--and in defense of a character who's a personal favorite, no less--was delightful.

[Steelcan]

jtav wrote...

Though finally not being her toadie--and in defense of a character who's a personal favorite, no less--was delightful.

. Renegade play through with saving Petrovsky, so satisfying

[Barquiel]

dreman9999 wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

Barquiel wrote...
After hearing the logs in the lab I wouldn't have stopped Aria from killing him. But since my Shep "paragonized" Aria, he was lucky.

I see experimenting on Adjutants as akin to experimenting on mindless zombies. Perhaps a bit tasteless, but not nearly on the same level as experimenting on humans.

Of course the story suggests that it's just as bad, and even worse, it leaves the player who doesn't know Invasion to assume he was responsible for their creation in the first place. Nothing new here. I'm taking Miranda's stance from ME2 instead.

The scientists said they tested the "adjutant" virus on various species. They implanted Omega's citizens with control devices, then infect them with the Adjutant virus to create an army of obedient Adjutants. That's more than a bit tasteless, imo.

Did they say they used Omega's citizens? I don't think so. All I heard was them experimenting on adjutants, not creating new ones.

Hm, they said they can control how and where the adjutants convert their victims, and that they tested it on various species. And with the civilian population contained, they wanted to initiate the "next phase of the project".

2:50...

But under who's orders?

Most likely TIMs. But Petrovsky knowingly tolerated it (-> his Afterlife Dialogue). Of course it's quite possible that they used the "worst scum" for their initial testing phase, but "next phase of the project" doesn't sound very good.

[Mr.House]

Rodia Driftwood wrote...

jtav wrote...

Yeah, it was kind of nice to take a break from fighting ultimate evil and do battle with an antagonist who is allowed to have his virtues. A bit like Loghain, actually.

Though I'd love to know how Oleg and his men avoided indoctrination.

Loghain is no different than TIM. He was only looking after his own to the point where he got his own king killed to further his own ambitions. He was power mad and drive by hatred.

No, just no. But isnce this is not a Loghain thread I will not argue but you are so wrong about Loghain it's sad.

[Mr.House]

Barquiel wrote...

Most likely TIMs. But Petrovsky knowingly tolerated it (-> his Afterlife Dialogue). Of course it's quite possible that they used the "worst scum" for their initial testing phase, but "next phase of the project" doesn't sound very good.

People that are a threat to Cerberus ala Miranda, jack(well before they had the phantom idea maybe) ect. That's how I would picture the next process. Turn the people who are fighting hardest against you and turn them into a monster that obeys you.

[Taboo]

MisterJB wrote...


They could have written the story so Oleg had gained great support from the population due to his attacks against the gangs; much like what happened with Archangel; and, if convinced by Shepard, he would use them to houst Omega from TIM's indocrinated soldiers. The Alliance could provide further support because they have an interest in keeping Omega in the hands of a human.

And that right there is your issue. Could have written it. If I might be frank this sounds really really ridiculous, like rousing Hollywood speech ridiculous. He took over the station. People are dead and dying. Are you honestly suggesting they'd switch sides? The only thing your scenario needs is mood music with a swirling camera.

I can imagine it now:

A lone Batarian stands up and claps. Then the entire station begins to clap.

Prokofiev's Dance of the Knights begins to play...

And I didn't like Oleg's "defection". In the comic, it was obvious he placed the goal of Cerberus; protecting humanity; above his own life so, it doesn't make sense for him to be willing to provide information on Cerberus just to save his life. It would have been better if Shepard could convince TIM no longer served humanity's best interests at which point he gives the information.

Ain't it hard when you discover that he really wasn't where it's at?

And then what? He just goes free? Is recruited? If was as intelligent as he appears to be he would have defected a long time ago. Instead he's chosen to follow the Illusive Man down the rabbit hole with the idiot ball. 

You're needlessly nitpicking because you don't like how things turned out.

Are you aware that the writers, producers (these are of the comics as well) list Petrovsky as an evil mastermind? That this has been planned for a long time? No one spends millions upon millions of dollars in the West to cater to minority preferences.

You're so entrenched with certain aesthetics you've forgotten that others have always taken precedence in Mass Effect. They did not make Omega with minority opinions in mind. They did not create Miranda with minority opinions in mind. It's always incredibly straight forward. Good and Bad, Happy and Sad.



Entendes?

[Ieldra]

Taboo-XX wrote...
You're needlessly nitpicking because you don't like how things turned out.

Are you aware that the writers, producers (these are of the comics as well) list Petrovsky as an evil mastermind? That this has been planned for a long time? No one spends millions upon millions of dollars in the West to cater to minority preferences.

I don't care how they list him. BTW, how do *you* know? His presentation leaves enough room for interpretation that *I* can list him as occasionally harsh but basically honorable, and in the end I can spare him. 

I am content. It's not ideal but well enough.

Oh...and you sounding as if they had written him as a moustache-twirling evil overlord is rather amusing. Wishful thinking, perhaps?

[Costin_Razvan]

The writers and producers are catering the wrong audience, hell even bloody Black Ops 2 featured a fairly interesting, well written and sympathetic antagonist despite the marketing referring to him as a terrorist..because he is one.

A good RPG is one which allows you to make the choices you want to make as a player, not forcing you down one path or another or making one be better in every way then the other. To help achieve this the portrayal of characters should be neutral. With antagonists have good and bad qualities. Ultimately they have to be believable.

Witcher series, Alpha Protocol, Black Ops 2 and Dragon Age: Origins with Loghain ( and just Loghain ) do this beautifally 

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 30 novembre 2012 - 01:16 .

[Steelcan]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

The writers and producers are catering the wrong audience, hell even bloody Black Ops 2 featured a fairly interesting, well written and sympathetic antagonist despite the marketing referring to him as a terrorist..because he is one.

A good RPG is one which allows you to make the choices you want to make as a player, not forcing you down one path or another or making one be better in every way then the other. To help achieve this the portrayal of characters should be neutral. With antagonists have good and bad qualities. Ultimately they have to be believable.

Witcher series, Alpha Protocol, Black Ops 2 and Dragon Age: Origins with Loghain ( and just Loghain ) do this beautifally 

TIM in ME2, before he became Space Hitler

[fiendishchicken]

I'm more concerned with the technical quality of Omega above all else. Audio in particular. Missing sound bites, VA just plain sounding uninspired and tired, etc.

[MattFini]

Knowing nothing about whatever comic featured this character before this DLC, I came away from Omega somewhat disappointed by the presentation.

I liked how Petrovsky wasn't a one-dimensional villain. At the start of it, he implores you to break off your siege and leave, rather than gleefully blast you from the sky.

The idea that he *let* Aria leave Omega was an interesting reinforcement of my initial impression and the way he surrenders to Shepard (rather than go out guns blazing) was another.

I just wish we had more time to talk with him.

Interesting potential, but it wasn't fully realized.

[Nimrodell]

Ieldra2 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

@Nimrodell:
I'm a man and I'm just as mystified by the demand for "moar Aria" that occasionally flares up here. As I've repeatedly said, I respect her but I don't like her.

Don't take this the wrong way but the writing on the wall for this story has been there for a while.

You mean ever since the leaked script? I'm not saying I didn't expect this story to happen eventually, only that some people's fascination with Aria escapes me.

Same here but the best explanation will give you Eddie Izzard on 1:15 on this topic - just beats me lol.

Modifié par Nimrodell, 30 novembre 2012 - 06:40 .

[Ieldra]

MattFini wrote...

Knowing nothing about whatever comic featured this character before this DLC, I came away from Omega somewhat disappointed by the presentation.

I liked how Petrovsky wasn't a one-dimensional villain. At the start of it, he implores you to break off your siege and leave, rather than gleefully blast you from the sky.

The idea that he *let* Aria leave Omega was an interesting reinforcement of my initial impression and the way he surrenders to Shepard (rather than go out guns blazing) was another.

I just wish we had more time to talk with him.

Interesting potential, but it wasn't fully realized.

I agree with this - there should have been. It's rather noticeable how the writers avoid touching the matter of Cerberus and having an actual debate about their stated goals, their methods and so on. This hurts characters with former and present affiliation with them who're not one-dimensional. Miranda and Petrovsky, in this case. "They're the bad guys now" is not sufficient.

Still, it's quite a bit better than what I feared, so I won't complain too loudly.

[MattFini]

^ And not to beat a dead horse, but imagine how much more interesting the Omega mission would've been with Miranda and Jack in it.

Getting their take on the Adjutants, experiments with Omega's residents, etc. and then a final confrontation / dialogue with Petrovsky.

Just feels like a total missed opportunity.

Replaying it again today reinforced my initial assessment. I think ME3 Omega is decent, but it fails to leave much of an impression.

[Ieldra]

MattFini wrote...
^ And not to beat a dead horse, but imagine how much more interesting the Omega mission would've been with Miranda and Jack in it.

Getting their take on the Adjutants, experiments with Omega's residents, etc. and then a final confrontation / dialogue with Petrovsky.

Just feels like a total missed opportunity.

Replaying it again today reinforced my initial assessment. I think ME3 Omega is decent, but it fails to leave much of an impression.

I agree that Miranda and Jack should've been there, but cannot but observe that the writers would've refused to put any discussion of Cerberus and its goals and methods into their conversations, just as they did with the rest of the Miranda and Jack content. That hurt Miranda's characterization specifically.

They did the same with Petrovsky. Apart from his assertion that he's doing this for humanity, we have basically nothing from him.

[AlexMBrennan]

jtav wrote...
Yeah, it was kind of nice to take a break from fighting ultimate evil and do battle with an antagonist who is allowed to have his virtues. A bit like Loghain, actually.

Yes, let's send our best assets to help a random gang take out a rival whilst Godzilla is on a rampage in the city centre...

Once again, I do not believe that Shepard would actually do that. There are more pressing matters.
It worked in ME2 where Shepard's mostly waiting for the Collectors to make a move, but it doesn't work when Reapers are on Earth killing millions every day.

Modifié par AlexMBrennan, 04 décembre 2012 - 10:17 .