261 réponses à ce sujet

[PSY850]

Cool story bro.....

[GordianKnot42]

aimimia wrote...

GordianKnot42 wrote...

Me, I always try to stay in the hack circle.

Wait... am I in the right forum?...

Well... at least in doing so, you won't have any one screaming at you for not being in the GOD DAMN CIRCLE

[kipac]

Waz iz dis thrad, Im scared.

[Shepard VI]

AkuIaTubShark wrote...

So, don't leave the hack circle on Gold/Plat when your getting overrun, got it >.>

Not a problem if you kill all the things BEFORE you get overrun.

[BridgeBurner]

Wynne wrote...

To flesh out what you (and steve) were saying in a later post, even aside from the physical differences you mentioned, that's as unsurprising as the discrepancy in salaries between women and men. Boys these days start playing shooters when they're young because it's accepted, and are pushed to be competitive, never mind any innate drives they may have which are only compounded by the gender schematics applied by adults who have already formed their own unconscious prejudices about what boys do and are like vs. what girls do and are like. So female gamers on the whole are still catching up. I was raised on adventure games and RPGs, myself. Shooters have been few and far between for me, and they started with Thief: the Dark Project, not exactly a typical shooter in the first place. (In addition, I had a six-month break from the game due to Lyme disease, and I still have joint pain from it, so I'm even farther behind than some. Individual life experiences also play a role. Thanks for that tip you gave me about the Harrier, by the way. I hadn't had mine for very long.)

So that's one thing, but don't forget the unconscious social pressures involved. I've had discussions with other women about this. When we play with guys, most of us feel a pressure to perform, to overcome some perceived common assumption that having breasts makes us automatically inferior at playing the game. This comes from experiences of being mocked by male players, for the most part, but even women perpetuate it--"What? You play games? Aren't those for boys?" It's harsh on the psyche no matter how mature you try to be about it. There's also the fact that some of us have had male friends and lost them because they couldn't take being outscored at other games, so scoring too well becomes as bad as scoring poorly. Also a potential subconscious hindrance/handicap.

Studies have shown that merely wearing a lab coat in fact makes people smarter (they score better on tests than when they are not wearing the lab coat.) In the same way, it's certain that doubting your own ability to do something makes you worse at it. (The yips, if you will.) Whenever a girl is playing with you, Sirian, even if it weren't for your name being masculine, you talk on the mic so she knows that you're male, which is already a psychological obstacle as opposed to playing with randoms with gender-neutral names. I'm not saying you should go out there and get a new account and call yourself Lady_Sirian and mute your mic and play with a million randoms and quiz them on their gender after the matches, but if you did, you might at some point in time have a different experience with female players. 
 
The physical differences are there, but they might in fact be trivial if not for other factors. In a perfect world which never suffered any form of inequality, it might be that half the people who could outscore you would in fact be female. (A small group, admittedly.) 

So yeah. SuperJet's not the only one who's taken psych classes.  There are physical differences, but I think that society and psychology play far more compelling roles in players' skill (both male and female, and the effects are both positive and negative.) The environment a person grew up in plays a tremendous role that science is indeed still working to understand.

No disrespect to Shia and Holy Avenger, though. Many of us get overzealous in defending the female gender, just because there are so many ignorant people in the world who "blame" women for things we have no control over. The side I see, however, is that you understand that you have a physical advantage which could at least partially explain the discrepancy you perceived, not that you were being offensive. 

It's actually sort of humble.  Well, maybe we shouldn't go that far... 

Nissun wrote...

People say that it's good leaving a player out of the circle to drive enemies away and keep pressure off the hack circle.

I've never seen it work. Sure, that lonely player may be distracting a banshee and some marauders. But we're still getting overrun by a kajillion brutes, a second banshee, and ravager fire. I say their firepower is more useful in the circle than outside.

Damn straight. And if it gets too hot, at least we've lured everything into a small, rocketable/grenadeable area. On Silver, that Vanguard can field the aggro and everyone else can go make a cup of coffee... but unless you're the type that can pull 140k on Gold even with decent teammates (generally scoring around half that), get back in the damned hack circle. 

But even if you are that person, you're a score wh*re and everyone knows it. As long as you can live with that, go to town, son. Go to town. Headbutt that praetorian just to show us you can!  

It's more impressive when a person can score that much while staying in the hack circle, though. Kill everything right in front of me--I'll be miffed that my shots are hitting 0.2 seconds after the thing dies because we always seem to target the same stuff, but I have to hand it to you, you're good. Especially if our teammates are outside it luring everything away and you are still kicking their asses.

If you were the lowest scoring person, on the other hand... are you just trying to act as a decoy to be in some way useful? Because otherwise, nobody's fooled, man. And you're not going to recover those points. That's just sad.

UWxMaserati wrote...

Last time I was in a hack on London and all 4 players are in the zone but I am an Asari Vanguard so every time my shields would go offline I would Biotic Charge someone and if I ever hit someone outside the circle a girl would come on the mic and angrily yell at me to get back in the circle.

Oh, that's just not cool. If you're a vanguard, and you're jumping in and out of the circle whenever you need to in order to stay up, there's not a damned thing wrong with that. Staying alive is more important than staying in the hack circle. Getting the mission credits takes priority, the bonus is just nice to have. That goes for Ms. Speedrun that you were talking about as well. Moving intelligently to the next objective is more important than just running like your ass is on fire, except maybe on Bronze.

Women score higher on average on the personality trait of conscientiousness, which probably affects our attitude towards missions, and that's certainly not a bad thing, but there's no reason to be unpleasant and aggressive about it. Most people respond better to polite requests anyway, as Jay pointed out.

rubynorman wrote...

You have made something so beautiful, I... I don't even...

I LOVE YOU.  *saves image*

DJCS wrote...

mpfl wrote...

But... but... I AM KROGAN!

Best response to anything.

Indeed. That one's a classic. 

Nice essay Wynne.

[DragonRacer]

Wynne wrote...

To flesh out what you (and steve) were saying in a later post, even aside from the physical differences you mentioned, that's as unsurprising as the discrepancy in salaries between women and men. Boys these days start playing shooters when they're young because it's accepted, and are pushed to be competitive, never mind any innate drives they may have which are only compounded by the gender schematics applied by adults who have already formed their own unconscious prejudices about what boys do and are like vs. what girls do and are like. So female gamers on the whole are still catching up. I was raised on adventure games and RPGs, myself. Shooters have been few and far between for me, and they started with Thief: the Dark Project, not exactly a typical shooter in the first place. (In addition, I had a six-month break from the game due to Lyme disease, and I still have joint pain from it, so I'm even farther behind than some. Individual life experiences also play a role. Thanks for that tip you gave me about the Harrier, by the way. I hadn't had mine for very long.)

So that's one thing, but don't forget the unconscious social pressures involved. I've had discussions with other women about this. When we play with guys, most of us feel a pressure to perform, to overcome some perceived common assumption that having breasts makes us automatically inferior at playing the game. This comes from experiences of being mocked by male players, for the most part, but even women perpetuate it--"What? You play games? Aren't those for boys?" It's harsh on the psyche no matter how mature you try to be about it. There's also the fact that some of us have had male friends and lost them because they couldn't take being outscored at other games, so scoring too well becomes as bad as scoring poorly. Also a potential subconscious hindrance/handicap.

Wynne,

Very nice post, I thoroughly enjoyed reading it!

I bolded a portion that caught my eye because I can somewhat relate. There are instances where I feel a need to perform above average to both impress the guys and show that I am not a stereotypically crappy girl gamer. I think some of that even goes waaaaay back to childhood when lots of boys typically didn't want to play with a girl for a variety of reasons, and by play I don't mean just video games, but anything else... sports, a schoolyard game of war/cowboys and Indians/what-have-you. I think for some of us that definitely breeds a mentality of "I'll show you" that can then evolve into rampant feminism, among other things.

However, I would be curious to dig deeper and find out if a lot of the women who feel this way (pressure to perform around the boys) are also just competitive by nature? Especially given that the nature of video games is often competitive, even in co-op (hence our scoreboard system in ME3 MP). I certainly know that's a factor in my own experiences: while I game to have fun (and have been doing so ever since I was a child playing video games with my father), I am also competitive about it. Not in a I-want-to-shove-it-in-your-face sense, but more in a I-proved-myself sort of way. Whenever I can top the scoreboard in a room of men, it's an internal ego-stroke... just like it was if I managed to beat out my Dad on Atari games.

But then again, I would not consider myself a normal, average woman. I've always been a tomboy who liked the boys' toys and games, and I never outgrew that. Heck, I am even more passionate about video games and (American) football than my husband is, so I recognize I'm a very extreme outlier.

[aimimia]

Women should just chilled and spread peace and love. Playing on the Internet you meet some very... Immature people as well as some great people. If you consider everything thou are told by others on the Internet, you wouldnt leave the kitchen. Just chillex and have some funand ignore all the female haters. I personally have a female friend that just stomps me every time and tops my score. But I also have friends like jay and sirian that destroy all feelings of confidence when I play with them

[Dunvi]

aimimia wrote...

My god what have I created

Agreed. I go to bed and come back and instead of a giant thread of people insulting me and telling me I'm a bad player, I come back to this?

What is this, the real world? THIS IS THE INTERNET GUYS. YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG.

[aimimia]

^exactly, I never realized... that the BSN can have such philosophical escalation. Appearntly Women are also a part of this gaming world too

[Miclotov]

Have to leave for grenades.

[78stonewobble]

chipsandwich wrote...

78stonewobble wrote...

Annomander wrote...
BARB is the British Armed Forces Recruitment Battery Test, you might be able to find a practice test online, but you might need to be actively enlisted in the British Armed Forces phase 1 training to access it.

I was, but then I was denied entry to the Royal Marines because of my medical history. Convulsion as a 7 month old baby makes you ineligible for military service.

Oh ... Top of google search:
http://www.army.mod.uk/join/20281.aspx

There's a practice version.

And uhm... You still beat me for draft related stuff. Apparently the danish army wont hand out rifles to people with mental problems (a depression at the time). Or maybe thank god for that...

I wtf'd on the instructions for the number distance one. Maybe I was a bit slow on exactly how I should click it, but all the other ones were pretty clear. Didn't try too hard to figure anything out, just went through as fast as possible.

Alright, read it more carefully, blasted through this puppy in about 20s


Wish it had the actual time limit in there though. Hopefully it's something harsh like 1 second for each question.

I was pretty surprised by the low difficulty of those tests.  Had to get out the door so I had only time to try a few tests. Being pretty sucky at doing math in my head I was a little bit slow (1 to 6 secs per question) to take the number distance test but still had all correct. Had to rush the figures test and ended with 11 out of 12 correct.

 ... I'm not that smart...



Back to the other off-topic.

There are certainly physical differences between the sexes but I do not believe there are any fundamental physical difference regarding reflexes/muscle memory.

I am guessing that the average male gamer have an experience advantage over the average female gamer (eg. 6 years to 3 years) and that could explain any subjective experience of difference between the sexes.

If there were 2 identical people of different sexes but with similar upbringing and experience I believe they would perform close to identical.

Thats my guess though ... And I think Lord Sirian should have said his p.o.v. was a guess as well considering all the things that have allready been said here about any scientific basis for these things.

Modifié par 78stonewobble, 10 novembre 2012 - 01:01 .

[Deerber]

What the... **** has this thread become? C'mon guys, live and let die! 

Modifié par Deerber, 10 novembre 2012 - 01:47 .