827 réponses à ce sujet

[mackfactor]

megabeast37215 wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...
I don't know about you but if I was running a business and a customer was complaining about 1/4 of the business being horribly designed and broken, I'd have a word to him.

Even if it was a brief one...

As a former small business owner... I can say you are absolutely right. Sometimes I think Bioware forgets the rule about the customer always being right (mostly)... but when the overwhelming majortiy of customers are complaining about the same issue, then they are damn sure right.

I think being affiliated with EA is rubbing off on them...

Therein lies the difference between a small business and a big business. A big business can't be attentive to every little quibble from their customers, they have to address issues at a larger level. The OP presented a gripe that in the scope of the game and more so in the scope of Bioware's business is really quite small. Bioware's deve team doesn't only handle Mass Effect 3, after all. They have to filter out what is worth addressing and what is not.

Obviously some of these are legitimate complaints about a single issue or two with a couple of the enemies in one faction of the multiplayer component of one game. It's NOT, when it comes right down to it, a huge issue or a game breaker. I personally don't think that Bioware owes every complainer on this site anything. 

Modifié par mackfactor, 11 novembre 2012 - 08:40 .

[Xetto]

Crimson Vanguard wrote...

Tecco wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Tecco wrote...

I just dont get this constant geth whine, we basically only do geth gold nowadays, we never use missiles, we almost never need medigel.
If a slomo-hunter shooting at you staggered or not, you already failed big time for letting it get that close.
We do this 3 people,
Asari Justicar
Human Adept
Kroguard Pure mele for mopping up loose mooks and tanking primes.
And we never ever fail.

I cant really speak for platinium since we dont really do those, but for gold, with our setup it just seems redicilous to call geth cheap/hard/stunlocker. They are way more easy for us than any of the other factions.

 

I never said Geth were hard. Cheap and frustrating =/= hard.

But for all the factions i find them least frustrating and least cheap.

Using Destroyer, Kroguard and Demolisher camp behind cover don't count

Really? So using cover is not intended in the game? And those classes are put in by mistake and should not be played? I must be REALLY Retarded to not realizing this. Why havent Bioware fixed theese OBVIOUS exploits!? Using Kroguard, demolisher, destroyer and cover should be banneble on par with missile glitchers and other exploits. Shame on me joining up against geth with a kroguard.

[mackfactor]

Tecco wrote...

Really? So using cover is not intended in the game? And those classes are put in by mistake and should not be played? I must be REALLY Retarded to not realizing this. Why havent Bioware fixed theese OBVIOUS exploits!? Using Kroguard, demolisher, destroyer and cover should be banneble on par with missile glitchers and other exploits. Shame on me joining up against geth with a kroguard.

The way some people in the game play, you'd think these is no cover system. My goodness.

[Fortack]

mackfactor wrote...

megabeast37215 wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...
I don't know about you but if I was running a business and a customer was complaining about 1/4 of the business being horribly designed and broken, I'd have a word to him.

Even if it was a brief one...

As a former small business owner... I can say you are absolutely right. Sometimes I think Bioware forgets the rule about the customer always being right (mostly)... but when the overwhelming majortiy of customers are complaining about the same issue, then they are damn sure right.

I think being affiliated with EA is rubbing off on them...

Therein lies the difference between a small business and a big business. A big business can't be attentive to every little quibble from their customers, they have to address issues at a larger level. The OP presented a gripe that in the scope of the game and more so in the scope of Bioware's business is really quite small. Bioware's deve team doesn't only handle Mass Effect 3, after all. They have to filter out what is worth addressing and what is not.

Obviously some of these are legitimate complaints about a single issue or two with a couple of the enemies in one faction of the multiplayer component of one game. It's NOT, when it comes right down to it, a huge issue or a game breaker. I personally don't think that Bioware owes every complainer on this site anything. 

There's a significant number of customers who are displeased by a feature that hardly require resources to address and have been complaining / asking the devs to change it. Any business, big or small, is going to create a lot of goodwill solving small and easy to fix issues. We ain't asking for a huge overhaul or anything, just a little less stunlock BS.

[Xetto]

mackfactor wrote...

Tecco wrote...

Really? So using cover is not intended in the game? And those classes are put in by mistake and should not be played? I must be REALLY Retarded to not realizing this. Why havent Bioware fixed theese OBVIOUS exploits!? Using Kroguard, demolisher, destroyer and cover should be banneble on par with missile glitchers and other exploits. Shame on me joining up against geth with a kroguard.

The way some people in the game play, you'd think these is no cover system. My goodness.

Its up to people how they want to play, but in exchange i want to be able to play as i will aswell, OP states that the drone is a joke. The biggest joke in this  is that it is 1million times lesser joke than it was before where it did absoluteley NOTHING. Now i actually use the 0,5sec it takes to aim and shoot it down with a single shot. Before i just ignored it.
While i can agree its bad with hunters shooting out of stasis and other not intended ****, i dont find it gamebreaking in any way, i have never been killed by a hunter shooting from stasis or while staggered wheres i wasnt already boned in the first place. Actually i never even thought of this before i read of it here on BSN, that is how big a frustration theese things have been for me.

What i find cheap and lame is giving extreemeley tough units the possibility to shoot clustregrenades at with unholy precision from acros the map with no way of countering it.
Or extreemeley tough units with the ability to teleport directly at you and kill you from full hp shields.

[Xetto]

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Tecco wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...

It doesn't matter though. We all know the Devs (even the "good" players among them) would come dead last by a long way if put in a lobby with 3 of the elite players.

Which makes it bizarre that they never seek to open a dialogue with any of the best players on ANY platform.

It would be a mistake to balance the game around the 1% that is the elite, That is if they wanna keep the game playable for the last 99%.

 

I never said that they should balance the game around the elite.

But the elite are likely to be the ones who play the game most. Thus they could tell the devs what's good/not good about it. Point out most commonly encountered bugs, things they find most frustrating, etc.

I somewat agree and somewhat not.
Elitis players are often masters in finding bugs and and exploits, but they are also good at setting the difficulty too high, and have often little emphaty on people who will never have the same skill they have.
They might also have a prefered playstyle not everyone can do(like not using cover and owning everything with headshots and so on).
Im pretty sure the game would be totally lame if just 10% of the (mostly lame) ideas given by players, was implemented to the game.

[Disciple888]

Combat drone makes me raaaage

[121210Olivia]

My two pennies worth...

What makes the OPs original concern alarmingly relevant maybe summarised, imho, as follows;

(1) How difficult they (the Geth faction) are is, by and large, dependent on the size of the map they appear on (leading to inconsistency).

(2) A team can, actually, go through an entire 6 medi-gels per squad member in a singular stun-locked sequence (obviously, potentially a game-breaker, as skill is irrelevant).

(3) The farming anti-strategies negatively affect the non-farming community more than they do the actual farmers (i.e., the newly added combat drone does little to address the requests of addressing the inherent deficiencies of the Geth faction).

Moreover, while some player-opinion is, perhaps, welcome on these issues, only the devs have the ability to rectify (and thereby effectuate) a seemingly-much-needed positive change.

Re-evaluating some of the views regarding the above, in a sense, goes some way towards explaining some of the discrepencies that seem to have plagued the not-so-apparent-yet omnipresent logical concensus that the Geth's stunlock abilities are in dire need of toning down.

[CitizenThom]

Captain J. Sunshine wrote...

megabeast37215 wrote...

Kenadian wrote...

enigmamarine wrote...

24 pages and 3 days later and still no response from the dev, hmmm i wonder why?

Probably because he insulted the devs?

After a few medi-gels because of Geth Prime stunlock... I feel like insulting Devs too sometimes.

Next time they do a "Gaming Night with the Devs" I would love for someone to ask the Devs to play Geth Gold with them... and then see how the Devs handle the 3 Geth Primes on wave 10. I'd be willing to bet they get shot to pieces and end up dead on the floor...

The funny thing is... I don't think alot of the Devs can play above Silver... and as such, they don't really understand what we are going through.

I've met Bryan Johnson a few times ingame and it has always been on gold. He also always tops the score board.

Does he play against Geth?

[IllusiveManJr]

So that's what it was. I was running towards the hack zone when suddenly my Turian Ghost looked like he got hit by the Mako from behind. I thought he tripped on something.

[mackfactor]

Tecco wrote...

mackfactor wrote...

Tecco wrote...

Really? So using cover is not intended in the game? And those classes are put in by mistake and should not be played? I must be REALLY Retarded to not realizing this. Why havent Bioware fixed theese OBVIOUS exploits!? Using Kroguard, demolisher, destroyer and cover should be banneble on par with missile glitchers and other exploits. Shame on me joining up against geth with a kroguard.

The way some people in the game play, you'd think these is no cover system. My goodness.

Its up to people how they want to play, but in exchange i want to be able to play as i will aswell, OP states that the drone is a joke. The biggest joke in this  is that it is 1million times lesser joke than it was before where it did absoluteley NOTHING. Now i actually use the 0,5sec it takes to aim and shoot it down with a single shot. Before i just ignored it.
While i can agree its bad with hunters shooting out of stasis and other not intended ****, i dont find it gamebreaking in any way, i have never been killed by a hunter shooting from stasis or while staggered wheres i wasnt already boned in the first place. Actually i never even thought of this before i read of it here on BSN, that is how big a frustration theese things have been for me.

What i find cheap and lame is giving extreemeley tough units the possibility to shoot clustregrenades at with unholy precision from acros the map with no way of countering it.
Or extreemeley tough units with the ability to teleport directly at you and kill you from full hp shields.

All fair points. I wasn't disagreeing with anything you said, I've just been noticing recently how many people stand out in the open shooting when they could easily use nearby cover.

[Kenadian]

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Kenadian wrote...

megabeast37215 wrote...

Kenadian wrote...

enigmamarine wrote...

24 pages and 3 days later and still no response from the dev, hmmm i wonder why?

Probably because he insulted the devs?

After a few medi-gels because of Geth Prime stunlock... I feel like insulting Devs too sometimes.

Next time they do a "Gaming Night with the Devs" I would love for someone to ask the Devs to play Geth Gold with them... and then see how the Devs handle the 3 Geth Primes on wave 10. I'd be willing to bet they get shot to pieces and end up dead on the floor...

The funny thing is... I don't think alot of the Devs can play above Silver... and as such, they don't really understand what we are going through.

I can't say I disagree with the frustration and I certainly cus about it more than a few times myself. But to essentially call the dev(s) who put that design into the Geth idiots and then say "can we get a dev response?" You really shouldn't be surprised by silence.

 

I don't know about you but if I was running a business and a customer was complaining about 1/4 of the business being horribly designed and broken, I'd have a word to him.

Even if it was a brief one...

Just saying.

[mackfactor]

Fortack wrote...

mackfactor wrote...

megabeast37215 wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...
I don't know about you but if I was running a business and a customer was complaining about 1/4 of the business being horribly designed and broken, I'd have a word to him.

Even if it was a brief one...

As a former small business owner... I can say you are absolutely right. Sometimes I think Bioware forgets the rule about the customer always being right (mostly)... but when the overwhelming majortiy of customers are complaining about the same issue, then they are damn sure right.

I think being affiliated with EA is rubbing off on them...

Therein lies the difference between a small business and a big business. A big business can't be attentive to every little quibble from their customers, they have to address issues at a larger level. The OP presented a gripe that in the scope of the game and more so in the scope of Bioware's business is really quite small. Bioware's deve team doesn't only handle Mass Effect 3, after all. They have to filter out what is worth addressing and what is not.

Obviously some of these are legitimate complaints about a single issue or two with a couple of the enemies in one faction of the multiplayer component of one game. It's NOT, when it comes right down to it, a huge issue or a game breaker. I personally don't think that Bioware owes every complainer on this site anything. 

There's a significant number of customers who are displeased by a feature that hardly require resources to address and have been complaining / asking the devs to change it. Any business, big or small, is going to create a lot of goodwill solving small and easy to fix issues. We ain't asking for a huge overhaul or anything, just a little less stunlock BS.

Unless you're a developer and are intimately familiar with the game code, you can't say that it's an easy fix. I'm sure many of the game mechanics are buried deep in the code, and are not as easily fixable and you may choose to believe that they are, especially something as fundamental as stagger.

Again, it's a question of cost benefit. Of course the stunlock could also be an intentional effect by Bioware. Who says it isn't. There are plenty on the board that would have all the weapons buffed in to the stratosphere so that they can win every Gold match they play. Should the devs also address this issue?

[Xetto]

Jiovanie- wrote...

Geth: Silver 

anthill.thessianhaze.com/index.php

Does anyone see anything wrong with this? You know how the Hunters and Rocket Troopers do more damage than Primes? There's something wrong with that.

EDIT: I couldn't get it to post the stat table as it was on the link, so you'll just have to go to the link.

You have to add the drone and prime turret to the prime dmg, and the fact that hunters basically only shoots in mele unless you decloak them(remove their shields) and then leave them alone after that.
Rocket troopers go down pretty easy. But can agree that you dont wanna get hit by a barrage from 3 shooting at the same time unless you are really good at dodging.

[UnknownMercenary]

That little drone is a huge annoyance when I play my Human Soldier.

Modifié par UnknownMercenary, 11 novembre 2012 - 10:21 .

[Toxophilus]

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Tecco wrote...

It would be a mistake to balance the game around the 1% that is the elite, That is if they wanna keep the game playable for the last 99%.

 

I never said that they should balance the game around the elite.

But the elite are likely to be the ones who play the game most. Thus they could tell the devs what's good/not good about it. Point out most commonly encountered bugs, things they find most frustrating, etc.

Also, due to note, it is the "elite" that have brough this to our attention.  

You know the elite.  Those people who don't have to worry about things such as stunlock, because they play amazingly that the Geth simply do not stand a chance.
...
Wait.  <_<  Could it be he's doing this because the Geth are actually cheap and have so many glitches that make them nigh incombatible at times?  Is he doing this for the betterment of the community?  *Le Gasp*

Okay, without the sarcasm, after reading through the entire thread, I still agree with Lord_Sirian.  Not getting stunlocked is simply not an option when fighting the Geth.  Those of you who claim not to all the time I direct you to this.  Please skip to 1:28.

[LandoCalrisian]

I think this is a case of guys who maybe play the game a bit too much get worked up into a rage when they have a bad game or two and then turn a simple game mechanic into the end of the world.

Playing against the geth requires smart use of cover, target prioritizing, and good situational awareness. Against the other factions, if you let a mook get behind you, you take a bit of damage before reacting, while with the Geth, if you let a hunter or bomber get behind you, you're stunned and will be killed if you already had some aggro.

Getting stunned frequently from the front is just the sign of a bad player or lag. Cover is there for a reason. Getting stunned from behind is bad situational awareness - most players seem to forget that every time you kill an enemy, another spawns somewhere else on the map. If you don't see a new enemy appear within 5-10 seconds in front of you, it (and some friends) are approaching from behind - react accordingly. Spending 90% of the time zoomed in with a sniper rifle or assault rifle further wrecks situational awareness. I've gotten into the habit of taking a look towards the opposite spawn direction after every clip (2 if it's a weapon that empties quickly), and rarely have issues with stunlock, unless I'm on a team that doesn't stick together.

I don't find the stun mechanic any worse than phantom/banshee sync kills, dragoon/praetorian rushes or hack objectives in difficult areas - they're all wrinkles in the game that require skill and strategy to succeed against. Just because you suck against the geth doesn't mean they're "cheap". Be happy that enemy geth can't cast chain overload with guaranteed stunlock on 3 players at a time and total incapacitation of unshielded players, among other "cheap" powers that players get.

[megabeast37215]

Lord_Sirian wrote...
Ah, another clueless poster who has never played with me, casting aspersions about my skill in-game.

You people are amusing. 

It's rapidly become their most used argument. If you get stunlocked by Geth you must suck... you don't use cover, you have poor situational awareness, etc.

Sometimes I think they forget who they are talking to...

[aimimia]

I love the fact that people think if you are a "good" player you wouldn't ever get stunned, because you someone have space magic jumbo against enemies like geth. Hell these days, even if you cloak out of LoS of a combat drone or such you would still get stagger fest.

[OMGsideboob]

I had fun with the combat drone today... Its stun made me miss a shot with my Incisor. Man was I mad... I had to reload to kill the trooper in front of him.

[Mgamerz]

It should just shoot cain missiles at you.