112 réponses à ce sujet

[Grunt_Platform]

megabeast37215 wrote...

I was having a conversation with Invaderone a few days ago, and he said something I thought was really profound about the mindset of your average PUG.

Invader says he spends a couple days a week just playing PUGs... and what he has discovered is that PUG/Gold players don't really expect to win. Just imagine that for a minute... going into battle with a bunch of people who think they're going to lose before wave 1 even starts. How can they be a competent team member with this mindset!?!?

Truth is... they are looking to be carried probably 2/3 of the time.

I've definitely run into those players, but it seems to depend on the hours.  5pm-12am PST seems to be alright.

I've never understood teams that just crumple and die on wave 5.

[jlee375]

My PUG success is probably around 95%, all UUG. I never kick anyone unless they literally did nothing the prior match. Ill PUG with anyone, Im easy that way. I like bringing along new players and getting them some credits. I really only use serious equipment (Cyclonic Mod IV, Ammo IV, Lvl III Rail Amps) if its clear that I am going to have to go into beast mode and carry some waves, otherwise If I know everyone is capable, Ill just do Lvl I amps or none at all. Also If I have to carry a wave, Ill use every last gel/missile/ops pack/ammo pack if that's what it takes to get us to the next round.

[RedJohn]

zorinho20 wrote...

RedJohn wrote...

Almost never actually

I saw you fail,but then in next match you were excellent with Volus,so I guess lag was the cause of poor performance.

Indeed

[HolyAvenger]

Tupari wrote...

The biggest thing about most PUG games I've been in is not that they wipe all the time, but they do tend to be long. The average gold PUG is about 30-35 minutes, whereas 20-24 minutes is par the course for most of the non-random games I've played. It's usually because the average PUG team just doesn't seem to have as many high level rares or URs, may not use powers as effectively, and just doesn't kill enemies as quickly.

Hmm gold PUGs longer than 27 mins are pretty rare for me. Most finish inside 25mins for me. 30+ means a bad PUG where I (or someone else) has had to solo a wave or 2. 

[FlowCytometry]

0.3%

Srsly? I dunno, these days prob more of a ~25-30% wipe chance w/ Gold pugs.. though that's not counting wiping after the wave 10 objective, and I don't often leave lobbies due to bad loadouts (so that inflates the failure rate).

[Bolo Xia]

not many wipes here either, unless im last alive and get sucked around by cover at the wrong time.

i had progressed skill wise kinda slowly compared to some people from bronze up to platinum.
but i stuck with the difficulties i could handle till it was time to move up.

seems like some people ignore when its time to move up and are more worried about the credits rather than devoloping their own skill.

[oO Stryfe Oo]

Almost never, actually. If we fail, it'll be because of some stupid, easily preventable mistake. I don't think I've ever lost a match against the Geth within the past 2 or 3 weeks. They're still annoying as hell, though.

The only faction that gives me any sort of difficulty are the Collectors. I don't get them often, but when I do, I'm normally caught using a character I'd rather not use (against them) or with a Silver-level team. They're the only ones I've wiped against recently, actually. Damn Scions...

[silencekills]

 To be honest, haven't failed one yet that wasn't because of unavoidable stuff, like back before they fixed that weird thing where every night at the exact same time the game lagged to hell for me. I'm sure when I first started gold  I had a few games that ended in wipes, but I haven't a failed one recently that I can remember.

I might get an incredibly bad team that looked capable, but dag nabit, we are going to extraction!

Modifié par silencekills, 09 novembre 2012 - 01:47 .

[bclagge]

I almost exclusively play PUG U/U/G. My team will generally wipe one out of every ten or so games. It has to be a pretty defective team, although Collectors tend to lower that bar a bit. I can carry most below average teams to victory.

I do not care what class or load out a player brings. I do not care how low their N7 level is. I do not care if they use equipment. As long as my team mates TRY, I will stay no matter how many times we wipe. I will use all my consumables as long as it will at least get us past wave 6.

Modifié par bclagge, 09 novembre 2012 - 01:49 .

[Ashen One]

SeanThen1 wrote...

If you do wipe, on which wave/objective, and against which foe?

Usually it's during an escort or hack that moves along at 1/4 of the normal speed because everyone else died.

SeanThen1 wrote...

Will you blindly put on equipment when looking to join a lobby, or will you only wait until you find a room with a few decent people in it?

I always use equipment, although not too long ago I would refuse to do so if it was fairly obvious that I would have to carry a team. I have a complete manifest, so it's not like I need the credits for winning, but then again, it's not like I'm losing anything for using equipment because equipment is all I can actually unlock at this point.

SeanThen1 wrote...

Will you kick and/or leave lobby if you see certain builds or low N7 builds? What level do you typically have your character when you play? 17-20? Any information people care to share regarding their PUG gold experiences would be appreciated.

It's rare for me to actually put a kick vote on someone, although people tend to assume that it was me when they are voted against because I'm usually the player in the lobby with the highest challenge rank and best equipment.

Low N7 doesn't bother me, but lack of equipment and consumable use does. I wouldn't care if a N7 15 adept dropped into my Gold lobby, as long as he used equipment. Players that use equipment get revive priority, and I might actually feel inclined to watch that player's back as opposed to using strictly solo tactics.

SeanThen1 wrote...

Edited to add: If you rarely wipe, is it due to the fact that you are willing/able to solo rounds when you find yourself in a weak lobby?

This is usually why, but I'm not always willing to do so. If I'm going to play a 40 minute game with a bad team, I'd ask myself if they really even deserve the wave 10 credits. I have no problem clutching a wave when people actually try, but when people bleed out on objective waves and refuse to use equipment, I'll be anything but a "team player".

SeanThen1 wrote...

Edited to add: Is it common to need to use nearly all of your consumables to get through a gold PUG? Phrased differently, do you go in expecting to use most of your consumables when playing Gold PUGs?

No.

[Commander NT13]

I have about 50-70% percent success rate.

30-50% if it's Collectors though. I like them the least.

[Zero132132]

The problem is that I still make choices based on what I can see of the randoms in the lobby. Weapon levels, N7 ranking (only to see if it's above or below 120), what class they're taking, etc.. If I can tell that the lobby's going to suck, then I have three options.

1. Use a class/setup that I know I can carry with (generally includes a lot of gear).
2. Use something else and expect failure.
3. Leave.

Who in their right mind would choose 2? I can't give you real numbers on the extraction rate vs. failure rate, but I'd say it's above 90% for extractions. If I never took option 3 from above, though, there'd probably be more fail involved.

EDIT: Regarding consumable use, I never start putting stuff on until I'm in a lobby. I'll throw on gear, because sometimes I'll stick to a match in progress, but I won't put on anything that I won't still have after a match. Part of it's that I don't want to waste ****, but I also don't want to dedicate myself to any one build until I see the lobby. If they're all running biotics, I don't want to pop in with Disruptor Ammo and mess things up.

EDIT 2: Regarding gels and ops packs... just look at my inventory. I'm a persistent rage-geller, and I'm often pretty incautious unless I'm the last one up. That's true in PUGs or with friends. I'm pretty good at dying, so if you need them revive medals, hit me up.

Modifié par Zero132132, 09 novembre 2012 - 02:14 .

[landylan]

I wipe quite frequently. I hardly ever get any good players. The last time I played I was tripling second places score... They're that bad. I use exactly 5 or 6 medigels a match because I'm aggressive and want to finish fast. If it's wave 4,7, 8, or 10 after the objective, I won't solo.

[ToaOrka]

The only time I wipe is when I let myself bleed out, thinking "Oh, it's okay, these guys can handle it..."

[Fnord Lightbringer II]

I don't seek out Gold games anymore, since for some reason Silver has become almost as difficult as I remember gold to have been. I'm not here to prove anything to anyone, but to have fun, and the new gold is not fun to me unless I pick a lucky pug. If I have one of those, I will stay with them for as long as they continue playing.

I have accidentally stumbled into a few and those were pretty awesome. In a L4D kind of way -- people stay together and keep reviving each other and it kinda creates a rapport between the players.

I can't carry a team on Gold. In fact with the ongoing buffing of the enemies I can't even reliably carry a team on Silver anymore. To be honest, I think Bioware is making a huge mistake if they make the game ever more difficult. When I got here, it was actually fun to fight Geth even on gold, and there was no platinum. Then a few juvenile crybabies with e-peen compensation issues demanded more difficult challenges and now see how it went. People are wiping left and right even on silver, you get people jumping ship when a unknown enemy turns out to be Collectors. I don't think the majority of players is having much fun with the game anymore. And the rest has just not realized it yet because they are still grinding challenges. Eventually you notice that you spent your life time to change some pixels on some web site somewhere, and you weren't even having fun on the way there. And then everybody leaves. I think this is already happening, you can see it by how long it takes to find a match. It used to be instantaneous and every time you'd get a different PUG. Now it takes longer and you get laggy lobbies on another continent, because the local player base left for Halo 4 or whatever.

All this added difficulty is pushing casual players away and you can never please the juvenile crybabies with e-peen issues anyway. Just today some dude started asking for a platinum+ mode because platinum is too easy. If you keep listening to these kind of morons, then you ruin the game for everybody.

[parico]

I stopped doing pug gold since it was either a carry or a wipe and I was getting to the point where I hated playing since most teams were either just bad or looking for a carry. With friends extract 99% of time if we wipe its usually collectors that are the faction.  I wait until level 14-16 before gold depending on class.  

Modifié par parico, 09 novembre 2012 - 02:21 .

[Jamesui]

I'm thinking my wipe rate would be between 10% and 15% with pugs. When I do wipe, it's almost always wave 6 objective or wave 8, which I feel to be the hardest for some reason.

As for the worst objectives, it's almost always hacks that get my lobbies. Everything else is pretty easily managed.

My success rate against each faction depends on the kit I'm using, though Collectors and Cerberus more often than not indicates a match is going to be more stressful than othrwise. 

I never go into a lobby without full equipment. Gotta put the rare consumables to use, right?

I will not kick for low N7, but I might leave the lobby if I see more than one person I'll obviously have to help carry. If I feel someone hasn't both tried hard enough and played smartly enough, I'll kick after the match.

Barring extreme extenuating circumstances, I will kick anyone who lets himself bleed out on an objective wave before things have calmed down or who lets himself bleed out to leave only one or two people handling a later wave. It's a pet peeve of mine, because it tends to be the case that a player's failure to spend a medigel costs the remaining players two or more medigel and other consumables to clean things up. 

I will kick for idiotic loadouts, but only if the player does not heed a verbal warning or explain well how his loadout makes sense. 

I play gold from L14 up depending on kit and familiarity. Some kits guarantee a much smoother ride (Human Adept for example) and others a much rougher experience (Sniper infiltrators).

I go into a gold match fully expecting to use most of my consumables to complete a match or make it shorter, largely because most pugs are miserly with theirs. For example, I typically blow a missile each on waves five and eight to nuke the first double boss spawn I see to speed things along, as well as the first target of a wave 3 assassination objective. 

If I'm not "practicing" with a kit or still levelling it, I can fairly reliably solo late non-objective waves from maybe their midpoint on at the expense of a lot of time, but I'd have to admit that if things are bad enough for me to be soloing, we're not likely to survive the final objective or extraction, so I wouldn't chalk any success rate to solo capability.  

I have a group of about a half dozen friends I play gold with. If we have two or three of us and one or two randoms, we're almost guaranteed to extract. 

Edit: I hate to sound boastful but I don't deny the tone of what I'm about to note: I've noticed a trend where my being sync-killed or instant-ninja-stomped will often precipitate a wipe. 

Modifié par Jamesui, 09 novembre 2012 - 02:28 .

[Tallgeese_VII]

If I play every game I drop it, the failure rate would be about 40%.
But I screen & filter things myself.. so 5~10%

[Zero132132]

megabeast37215 wrote...

I was having a conversation with Invaderone a few days ago, and he said something I thought was really profound about the mindset of your average PUG.

Invader says he spends a couple days a week just playing PUGs... and what he has discovered is that PUG/Gold players don't really expect to win. Just imagine that for a minute... going into battle with a bunch of people who think they're going to lose before wave 1 even starts. How can they be a competent team member with this mindset!?!?

Truth is... they are looking to be carried probably 2/3 of the time.

It's absolutely true. The not-expecting-to-win part, not the carried bit. One day, I stumbled into an Unknown/Unknown/Gold lobby hosted by someone who's N718, rocking a level 18 human soldier with ****ty weapons and a lack of weapon mods to attach to them. I asked him if he understood the difficulty system, and what he said still strikes me as very strange.

"Sure, but the last match, we made it to wave 7, so I'm definitely holding my own."

Obviously, he was very, very, very new, but no one left the lobby, and I did end up carrying pretty hard, especially the last 3 waves. I think a lot of randoms don't think that not making extraction (or even just wave 10 credits) is really a failure. I can sort of get that, too; it's how I felt during the demo. It also explains why they don't use gels and ops packs on gold; to them, dying is a perfectly acceptable outcome.

Less sure about wanting to get carried. One night, me and some people were trying U/U/P, and we got one obvious missile glitcher, and then the same level 16 FQE with an Avenger VII came through time after time. I don't even see loadouts that horrible on gold, so I think some people PuG Platinum hoping for missile glitchers. Eventually we just started a match and hoped a competent 4th showed up, but the same obvious leach ended up joining just as wave 1 cleared. They weren't a COMPLETE leach, because they used their turret to draw aggro, and they seemed to make a genuine, active effort, but I still think that some join random platinum matches because they're hoping a missile glitcher carries them.

Modifié par Zero132132, 09 novembre 2012 - 02:31 .

[ToLazy4Name]

Hardly at all. If I have any doubts on my group, then i'll slap on my better played with classes and use level IV equipment. And even if I don't, i'm fortunate enough to be skilled enough to carry PUGs/Get them to cooperate with me once they're convinced I know what i'm talking about.

[Constant Motion]

From someone who's had a terrible couple of days on Gold...

megabeast37215 wrote...

I was having a conversation with Invaderone a few days ago, and he said something I thought was really profound about the mindset of your average PUG.

Invader says he spends a couple days a week just playing PUGs... and what he has discovered is that PUG/Gold players don't really expect to win. Just imagine that for a minute... going into battle with a bunch of people who think they're going to lose before wave 1 even starts. How can they be a competent team member with this mindset!?!?

Truth is... they are looking to be carried probably 2/3 of the time.

There is a huge, huge distinction between not expecting to win, and expecting to lose. If you're not expecting to win, it probably means you're on the right difficulty. If you're expecting to lose, it probably means you're on the wrong one.

I'm a good Gold player. I'm friendly, team-conscious, good DPS, strategic, I frequently top the scoreboard... but I extract maybe 70% of the time? Some days 100%, some days 25%. I never expect to win - I earn a gold win! Silver for fun, Gold for a challenge. I am never expecting to be carried - not least because that'd be a bloody mental plan. Like that'd be the most efficient way of earning credits! The entire lobby's been playing random matches in the hopes they might bump into an appropriately talented stranger?! Don't flatter yourself, invented stranger! They signed on to play the game, and like you, they generally go in presuming their teammates to be somewhere around their own ability. They're not expecting to be carried, they're expecting a gold match - who can blame them if they can't keep pace with a platinum-soloing wunderkind like InvaderOne when one turns up?

Expect a win and you'll be angry if you don't get one. Which is possible, with strangers, and that difficulty - so most people are more realistic. Aim for a win and you're probably on the kind of engaging, nailbiting difficulty you'll get a good fight out of. Who knows! It might feel almost like an actual game type thing.

Oh well. Just thought I'd drop in. You can carry on marvelling at the peasants, now. Some of us haven't even maxed our gold weapons.

Modifié par Constant Motion, 09 novembre 2012 - 02:32 .

[Locutus_of_BORG]

I'm not able to carry bad teams for more than a few waves, so I'll admit that with PUGs I might be wiping maybe as much as 25-30% of the time. But I can usually tell by wave 3 or so if my team is made of griefers / idiots or not... Basically, if I'm carrying by wave 3, I know I'll likely run out of consumables before the end of wave 10.

Maybe I just have really bad luck, as I've played with ppl with N7s in the thousands who'd wipe en masse on wave 1 or two.

[k1ngl1ves]

Gold pugs... about 90% success rate. I end up using about 4-5 medigel and rockets though...